Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire A though on the religious threads

The most important "Thing", is The Cross.

Nothing "in it", for Jesus, except to pay for the sins of all of us.

Pondering may be a choice. If your pondering leads you to a place where you are convinced that you have found the truth, you will beleive. On the other hand, if you find it all sounds absurd to you, and doesn't ring true, you won't beleive.

I could probably read and study Scientology for as long as I could bear it and not become a believer. Its simply too absurd and nonsensical for my mind to accept, I have no choice in that matter. Others, obviously, have a very different experience, and I have to assume its the same for them.

Bingo. Very well written.

I mostly agree..... but if “if it all sounds absurd.... you won’t believe.” Would it not be a “choice” to deem the “study” to be insufficient?

If the fruits of one’s “study” are deemed “insufficient” ....or leads to something being deemed “absurd”..... is that consequence the fault of what is studied..... or that the “student” somehow failed in his pursuit?

Could be something to it.

If only we knew what actually happened.

No one has infinite time, energy or interest to study things we find to be absurd. If I study the greek Gods or maybe the gods of Hinduism, I'm sure I could probably dedicate years trying to learn all there is to know. At the end of it all, I'd know alot about those religions but I still doubt I'd believe in an elephant god or Zeuss. If something seems nonsensical to you, I don't think you find yourself inclined to make a more serious study of it.

As DBT said "If we only knew what actually happened". I would love to be able to see a real time video of what all went on in Jerusalem that week. Jesus rode in a hero on a borrowed donkey and was greeted befitting a hero. He went to the temple to clear out the franchise holders who were shaking down the pilgrims and you can be sure that was a bloody battle with tables turned over stiff resistance from the "merchants" and their temple official sponsors. I am thinking the very short redacted version in the gospels didn't portray what may well have been a full scale riot type of rebellion causing Pilate to brutally put it down with the army. Then we have the strange trial of Jesus where he pleads basically no contest and the judge initially gives a directed verdict of acquittal but then allows the prisoner executed. Pilate desperately wanted to get those Passover Jews out of town and resume normalcy. Pilate obviously understood the motives of the Jewish leadership in wanting Jesus dead. Maybe in the next life we will get to watch the replay of their secret meetings and plotting. I would like to see what went on with Judas' meetings where he first ratted out Jesus and then repented and at the next meeting threw the money down and went out so distraught that he hanged himself.

We have a leg up, when we love/respect one another.


To passphrase tinny Tim, "May God Bless us one, and all."

Sure, I could give consideration to the idea that Haile Selassie was God Incarnate. It would take me a very short period of time to discard that idea as "absurd." But, the point is..... a choice was indeed made.... I discarded the Haile Selassie notion.

It is also absurd to propose that one study every crackpot idea that comes down the pike. Choices are made and absurdities are discarded.

However, the question of ...God? Would remain.....


God promises that those who seek Him .... honest seekers.........will find Him.

Do not be misled by blind guides..... truth matters and choices are being made.


“All men need to remain clearheaded, ponder eternity and be aware that there is true truth: God.”

^^^^^^^TRUTH. ^^^^^^^

The temple courts holding the merchants are not
a small area , to think a Jesus could enter and widely
disrupt the place in such manner for such length
of time without temple guards intervening sounds
like a bullch*t story.



Blasphemy as put forward by the Sanhedrin council
was not recognized in Roman law , so how can one
be put on trial for such in the Roman system?

Pilate could find no cause to prosecute Jesus under
Roman law. but as governor had the discretionary
power to permit the Jews to decide what to do
with him...ultimately Sanhedrin required Romans
to carry out execution for only Rome had authority
to conduct capital punishment in the province.

TF49, you are not biting on anything unfamiliar to normal human experience. The "choices" you note are most real and common to most of humankind, and have been occurring all day, every day. for a long, long time. It simply does not become conversational currency because most folks do it internally - infrequently through interaction with others. The "choices" seem to become conversational primarily under certain circumstances.

Some persons feel called to create such circumstances - to preach, to call out, to post provocative messages or chunks of Scripture, to challenge or advise others, etc. Others simply look for opportunities to be supportive and helpful for folks who may be searching toward, or researching, such choices. Others will share or express their thoughts and recommendations only if directly asked. Some good people will never engage such issues with another.

Then too, some people seem to disdain the very existence, or at least the idea, of any such choices. They may act as if supremely knowledgeable, challenge the choices and beliefs of others, create diversions, you name it. Humans are diverse - thus the differences.

However, we do seem to have some important commonalities in the core. And, with some, the reaching and making of such a monumental choice will prompt significant changes of belief and behavior - changes that can be huge.

This is just a tiny slice of singular human experience.

We can't just switch belief on or off at will. Conviction is a process by which we come to accept or reject propositions, teachings, claims or whatever.

One exercise I saw named by Eric Weinstein (I could be wrong and am open to correction on that) is “steel-manning” as a verb.

We all know what a straw man argument is; one poses the weakest available case for an opponents’ position and tears it to shreds. The steel man exercise is just the opposite; one attempts to verbalize the best argument his opponent has... and keeps attempting until his opponent admits he has characterized the position in a satisfactory light.

Whatever neuroscientists may hypothesize about the mechanics of decision making, the exercise described above seems to me to offer a way to intelligently converse with people of differing opinions.

Of course to do so one must set aside the prevailing sentiment of deconstructionism so rife in our society which tears every “old” idea down as a mere power grab by those who seek to manipulate the masses and embrace the possibility that there is ultimate truth somewhere. Additionally one must have the courage of intellect to recognize the old adage that it is possible to engage in and consider an idea seriously without subscribing to it.

Again, sorry to the OP for the “off topic” post.

Hmm.... three good and relevant posts in a row..... good sign!

There’s been a big migration away from from Christianity in this country...especially the organized/institutional aspect of it. And it’s not because they find atheism so appealing, it’s because they find Christianity so unappealing. And certainly much of it ‘is’ the church’s fault. The reason that many people have disengaged from it, as I see it, is not because of the message...it’s because of the messengers. At the end of the day, the reason that many find it so unappealing, and so unscientific, and so irrational...is because of the messengers. The general public that Jesus interacted with...who were nothing like Him, liked Him, and He liked them back. If Christianity isn’t compelling or attractive nowadays, is it possible that much of it is because we don’t practice the same ‘version’ of it nowadays that He practiced Himself...?

Narrow is the gate........

I like the disengenuous posts from guys who are turned from believing in GOD because a believer posted some scripture on the Fire saying believers cram their beliefs on them, as if they had been planning on getting out of bed some Sunday AM, getting cleaned up, dressing up, warming the truck and driving to some Church somewhere to hear the words from a preacher.

Hahaha. TFF.

As if they had no choice in deciding to click on the thread in the first place. Man, i hate having to carry that guilt trip.

HE was right. There is power in the Word. It convicts. I feel soory for the misery they have when driving by a church. Of course, they can do that without having to look at it, and i will guarantee you many look away when they drive by one.