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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,940 Likes: 1
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,940 Likes: 1 |
I'd never even consider dialing for a shot on colony varmints. So quick to hold and once I've got ranges figured for each mound they're hanging out on, holds are simply a matter of how much wind to hold.
Things would have to be very slow to range and dial each shot unless I was specifically targeting dogs way out.
A mixture of both dialing and holding works well, depending on the situation. Once you've got the range of each mound figured, dialing elevation is very quick as well and allows more accurate wind holds with anything short of a HORUS-style reticle. This is my point. You're not going to shoot a slow twist .223 1K yards. Our longest hit was 686 yds (with a 12 twist) .223. That was with dialing. You run out of comeups unless running a 20MOA base. Most of our shots were 150-450 yards. A BDC style reticle is quicker for this range as opposed to turrets. Use the Zeiss ballistic app, correlate known velocity via LabRadar to determine magnification (hence drop). With that, I'm bowing out. Stick, you feel free to continue on with your vernacular. I'm done on this thread. I'm hope you find inner peace.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,666 Likes: 34
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,666 Likes: 34 |
DumbFhuqk,
You were NEVER "in". Hint.
"I simply stated for you to: "Simply cite the magnification and "explain" how "well" it "works",at both the beginning and ending range. Hint. Fhuqking LAUGHING!
Yet again,be VERY fhuqking careful. Hint."
Feel FREE to choose any cartridge/projectile combo,that "swoons" your "heralded" SFP Zeiss Zoom Ratio "MAGIC" and rest assured,I'll be here to rub your nose,in your very own Fhuqking STUPIDITY. Hint. Laughing!
Bless your crossed-eyes,Retardation,Palsy and Parking permit.
Hint.
Fhuqking LAUGHING!......................''
You REALLY came close!
Hint.
LAUGHING!............
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,666 Likes: 34
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,666 Likes: 34 |
I'd never even consider dialing for a shot on colony varmints. So quick to hold and once I've got ranges figured for each mound they're hanging out on, holds are simply a matter of how much wind to hold.
Things would have to be very slow to range and dial each shot unless I was specifically targeting dogs way out.
A mixture of both dialing and holding works well, depending on the situation. Once you've got the range of each mound figured, dialing elevation is very quick as well and allows more accurate wind holds with anything short of a HORUS-style reticle. This is my point. You're not going to shoot a slow twist .223 1K yards. Our longest hit was 686 yds (with a 12 twist) .223. That was with dialing. You run out of comeups unless running a 20MOA base. Most of our shots were 150-450 yards. A BDC style reticle is quicker for this range as opposed to turrets. Use the Zeiss ballistic app, correlate known velocity via LabRadar to determine magnification (hence drop). With that, I'm bowing out. Stick, you feel free to continue on with your vernacular. I'm done on this thread. I'm hope you find inner peace. DUMB Fhuqk, "Tell"me "more". Hint. LAUGHING! 1-12" 223AI DOPE. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1280x1024q90/923/99AbTI.png) It just "happens" to correlate nicely,less even touching a turret. Less than 25% of the erector is incorporated,to get to 1000yds,despite the Transonic Slip being less than. At (5) Mi's per erector revolution,it's sub (2) revolutions to 1000yards(10 Mil's),which is but a TINY portion of the mechanics available(40 Mil's/8 revolutions). 10MPH wind factored along the way and only 4.4 Mil's at 1K. Google same. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1280x1024q90/922/GvBSDV.png) Rest assured,you were DONE,long before you "started". Hint. Fhuqking LAUGHING!...............
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,874
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,874 |
Most of our shots were 150-450 yards. A BDC style reticle is quicker for this range as opposed to turrets. Use the Zeiss ballistic app, correlate known velocity via LabRadar to determine magnification (hence drop).
With that, I'm bowing out. Sounds like Dev has signed out of this thread, but are others shooting 'varmints' at medium range with a BDC? Is so, what size targets and how far? I know that a BDC can work for big game out to 500 to 600 yards, but when I think about 'varmints' I am thinking much smaller targets. That seems problematic, for the reasons that Jordan mentioned. When targets get small, at longer distance, I like to dial and hold wind with the horizontal wire. But I shoot sage rats with a 22LR, and many shots are standing and offhand so benched varmint shooting with high magnification ain't my thing. A 4x can do all I need when paired with a 22LR, at closerange.
Last edited by 4th_point; 06/08/21.
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Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 864
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 864 |
In true CF fashion, the OP’s question has been derailed. He gave very detailed parameters:
17FB
25gr bullets
“Shots out to 300”
I am all for using quality components to dial for long-range accuracy; but within these specifications, it is simply not needed. PDs (especially wary ones) move a lot and give small windows for opportunity. The 17FB is crazy flat shooting for the first 3-400 yards, though the wind plays hell with it. For shots “out to 300,” the corrections are minimal. Within the OPs parameters, a BDC-style reticle is effective, though you probably won’t even be using the first sub-tension.
I am not a Leupold fan… I’m down to owning a couple. But I have one on my 17FB that I use on PDs, and it works great within the given parameters.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,666 Likes: 34
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,666 Likes: 34 |
Facts were supplied upon a Silver Platter and Day Dreaming Drooling Dumbfhuqks,still can't connect a single fhuqking dot. Hint. It is HILARIOUS,that you Fhuqktards have a SFP BDC Fascination,in non-lineal/archaeic "values". Read that again. Now one more time. Hint. A simplistic MQ reticle if FAST like no other and will correct a .177" 25gr V-Max at a 3750fps Launch, to 1000yds plus,in a full value 10 MPH wind. If only for starters. Or 40 MPH at the 400yd line. Pardon the effectiveness of lineal angular graduations. Not only drop/drift,but of course movers,amongst other "tid bits".Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1280x1024q90/922/sZECUx.png) ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1280x1024q90/633/BZwKO2.jpg) ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1280x1024q90/903/kJ5TNS.jpg) Not that I don't enjoy the humor,of you gals doing your absolute very best! Hint. Fhuqking LAUGHING!................
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,472
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,472 |
I have several dialing rigs on my varmint rifles and have never seen the need to dial on prairie dogs. Many times I don't even bring a RF. I would be surprised if most guys in this thread shoot more PD's than I.
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,228 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,228 Likes: 1 |
Facts were supplied upon a Silver Platter and Day Dreaming Drooling Dumbfhuqks,still can't connect a single fhuqking dot. Hint. It is HILARIOUS,that you Fhuqktards have a SFP BDC Fascination,in non-lineal/archaeic "values". Read that again. Now one more time. Hint. A simplistic MQ reticle if FAST like no other and will correct a .177" 25gr V-Max at a 3750fps Launch, to 1000yds plus,in a full value 10 MPH wind. If only for starters. Or 40 MPH at the 400yd line. Pardon the effectiveness of lineal angular graduations. Not only drop/drift,but of course movers,amongst other "tid bits".Hint. Not that I don't enjoy the humor,of you gals doing your absolute very best! Hint. Fhuqking LAUGHING!................ LarryO, aka bacon throat!!! Nice forked horn!!! 😂😂😂
Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 15,932 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 15,932 Likes: 1 |
In true CF fashion, the OP’s question has been derailed. He gave very detailed parameters:
17FB
25gr bullets
“Shots out to 300”
I am all for using quality components to dial for long-range accuracy; but within these specifications, it is simply not needed. PDs (especially wary ones) move a lot and give small windows for opportunity. The 17FB is crazy flat shooting for the first 3-400 yards, though the wind plays hell with it. For shots “out to 300,” the corrections are minimal. Within the OPs parameters, a BDC-style reticle is effective, though you probably won’t even be using the first sub-tension.
I am not a Leupold fan… I’m down to owning a couple. But I have one on my 17FB that I use on PDs, and it works great within the given parameters. Thanks for that, ckat. Let me further define things. It will be VERY unusual for me to dial shooting a 17 Fireball due to the distance limitations of the caliber. I prefer to use a holdover reticle and have done so in the past. For those who prefer to dial on distances at 300 yards mol, carry on.
There are 2 rules to success:
1. Never tell everything that you know.
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 17,344 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 17,344 Likes: 3 |
The MilQuad reticle is simply awesome for what you are going to be doing.
Screw you! I'm voting for Trump again!
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the 24HCF.
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Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 90
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 90 |
As far as a good 1” scope for your 17FB, I have a lot of trigger time with the 10X tactical Bushnell. I’m shooting a 17FB with 20gr. Vmaxes at 4000 fps(Benchmark). Mount your scope as low as possible so you don’t miss the close ones. The 17FB is like killing dogs with a laser out to 300. Don’t expect dramatic gore factor, out past 200 they just kinda decide to take a nap - a dirt nap. Mounting 20 moa bases or 56 mm bells just flat out make the 17 FB make the frustrating because of the size of the target and the flatness of the cartridge.
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 42,912 Likes: 13
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 42,912 Likes: 13 |
Looking for ideas for scoping a 17 Fireball. Shots out to 300 yards with 25 grain V-MAX and HP pills. I want plenty of power and it can be a 1" or 30MM. Give me some ideas. I've got a Cabelas house brand, the Covenant on top of my Ruger 77/17.. 30mm tube and real clear glass... it has an MOA reticle on it... for killing sage rats in the yard, 1.5 acres, it sure does a job on them.. thinned the herd of them by killing 70 plus last summer.... scrambled up real well, and the hawks, crows and turkey buzzards took off with the dead ones real quick. with a 100 yds, the bullet was pretty much hitting exactly where that target dot was pointed at. $200 & under scope... 4 x 16, and they make a 6 x 25 also...
"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC
“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,367
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,367 |
2 summers ago before my eye issues I shot 5650 rds. of centerfire at P-dogs with s high 70;s hit ratio. I don't stay home if the wind is blowing. I didn't keep track of the HMR rds. Last year I had to change to left handed, I shot just over 2000 rds. My hit percentage dropped 20+ points, I was also way slower finding the target in the scope. I use all 6.4x20's or 6x24's except on the HMR. All have hold over reticles. Shots to 450 yds. I do have a 6mm creed that I'm working on dialing with, longest kill 550. It wears a 4.5x30 bushnell tactical with mil dots.
Leica Geovids as I have them in my hands I range almost every shot. I have no interest in dialing for my average shots.
I shoot in the wind and enjoy the challenge
Last edited by boatammo; 06/14/21.
MOLON LABE
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Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 1,078
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 1,078 |
As others have stated the 17FB shoots pretty flat out to 300. I’ve shot p dogs with a couple of 17 Remingtons. One had a4-12leuplod and the other a 6.5-20. Neither had turrets as those rifles were shorter range rigs. I’ve been buying more zeiss scopes lately. I’d look at one of theirs with a 12-16x top end. I would also like a “side focus” if available and a pretty thin reticle (plex). Good luck and happy shooting.
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,493 Likes: 14
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,493 Likes: 14 |
I have several PD rifles. 12x is the highest power scope I have on any. It is not like you are going to have to find something half hidden by foliage. A 6x will do pretty well. A 17 fireball will shoot pretty flat I imagine, but windage you might want is extra vertical lines / crosshairs / bars.
I really like is windage and elevation bars. Especially at long ranges or robust wind. When the wind is crossways you will be able to hit pretty well if you use a line or two from center. Same with elevation If you're shooting at 500 yards give or take 75 yards. you'll want to have extra lines or bars to adjust your pint of aim.
I prefer classic.
Semper Fi
I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479 |
It’s not a fireball, but my 17 Remington has a 4-20x50 sightron on it. I prefer to have more power available because like others have said, you can always turn it down. Every time we have gone p-dog hunting it was pretty cool outside (Memorial Day weekend) so mirage wasn’t terrible.
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 872
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 872 |
Any 3 to 12, 4 to 16x scope will do the job.
I shoot thousands of pdogs a year, my main scope is a Nikon 4 to 16x50 black, 30mm, moa reticle
95 % of all shots are at 12x and out to 500 yards.
Another is a Bushnell forge at 3 to 12x 50x, moa reticle.
Both have dial turrets and side focus.
Both track perfectly and I do tons if dialing up/ down shooting pdogs.
Did I make you cry......boooo hooo, life goes on.
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 15,932 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 15,932 Likes: 1 |
Thanks to all. There's a ton of good information here.
There are 2 rules to success:
1. Never tell everything that you know.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,385 Likes: 5
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,385 Likes: 5 |
While power is a consideration an even larger one IMO is the quality of the optics. Spending hours behind a scope with inferior optics can cause eye strain and quickly turn what should be a fun time into a very tiring day. I do most of my PD/gopher shooting inside the 100-300 range and I use a Leupold VX-2, 6-18x40 and it is rare that I have it above 12x.
drover
223 Rem, my favorite cartridge - you can't argue with truckloads of dead PD's and gophers.
24hourcampfire.com - The site where there is a problem for every solution.
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,470 Likes: 15
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,470 Likes: 15 |
Thanks to all. There's a ton of good information here. I've shot 'dogs over a few decades and with lots of scopes......straight 12X, 15X and 16X plus variables from 4-12, 4-16, 6-18, 6.5-20, 6-24, 8-32 and 12-42. It goes w/o being said that optical quality always comes before power. If you like to dial, that's a major factor also. I would take a hard look at the Sightron S-Tac 4-20×50 with the MOA2 reticle. The reticle is perfect for both dialing and holding off, the tracking is dead reliable and the optics are very good. I love mine. Good shootin' -Al
Forbidden Zoner
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