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Joined: Nov 2007
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47,153 |
Not going to lie when we were teens we use to road hunt, and go into the king ranch and poach, pretty much a right of passage back then. Then if you got caught it was a 250 dollar fine, defiantly not worth it now that they can hit you with a felony. We even had a police scanner in my buddy's truck and would listen to the game wardens. Once in a while, we'd go out spotlighting but not take any guns and let them catch us just to mess with them. It was like a war zone at night near my dad's ranch in North Central Texas about 90 miles west of Fort Worth. We lived about 15 miles from the nearest town and it was just a spot in the road. Rarely saw a game warden, but plenty of poachers and spotlighters... My dad drug a big post oak log across a blind curve in a road one night where he knew some poachers were getting a deer. Only way they had to get out of the place was on this road. They came around that curve hauling arse and phugged up there daddy's new truck really bad on that log...They had a long walk back to the highway... lol one time we were running from the game warden and we were coming up on a curve that you had to slow down to about 30 to make the curve. we were running with the lights off Allan downshifted to slow down as not to hit the brake lights, and we made the curve. game warden didn't and went out into a plowed field. the whole time we were listening on the scanner. Allen did get caught years later on George Strait's ranch, He never gave up outlaw hunting after we grew up and it cost him big time. he lost his guns for that and 6 months locked up.
God bless Texas-----------------------
Old 300
I will remain what i am until the day I die- A HUNTER......Sitting Bull
Its not how you pick the booger..
but where you put it !!
Roger V Hunter
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Not going to lie when we were teens we use to road hunt, and go into the king ranch and poach, pretty much a right of passage back then. Then if you got caught it was a 250 dollar fine, defiantly not worth it now that they can hit you with a felony. We even had a police scanner in my buddy's truck and would listen to the game wardens. Once in a while, we'd go out spotlighting but not take any guns and let them catch us just to mess with them. It was like a war zone at night near my dad's ranch in North Central Texas about 90 miles west of Fort Worth. We lived about 15 miles from the nearest town and it was just a spot in the road. Rarely saw a game warden, but plenty of poachers and spotlighters... My dad drug a big post oak log across a blind curve in a road one night where he knew some poachers were getting a deer. Only way they had to get out of the place was on this road. They came around that curve hauling arse and phugged up there daddy's new truck really bad on that log...They had a long walk back to the highway... lol one time we were running from the game warden and we were coming up on a curve that you had to slow down to about 30 to make the curve. we were running with the lights off Allan downshifted to slow down as not to hit the brake lights, and we made the curve. game warden didn't and went out into a plowed field. the whole time we were listening on the scanner. Allen did get caught years later on George Strait's ranch, He never gave up outlaw hunting after we grew up and it cost him big time. he lost his guns for that and 6 months locked up. Dang, yeah, that cost him....I can honestly say I never poached a deer growing up, but grew up around plenty of dudes in High School that most likely did...It is kind of like a right of passage as you said in Texas in the small town areas. Not much else to do for entertainment, and usually tons of alcohol involved...LOL! I loved spotlighting for yotes and coon hunting with hounds growing up...We shot tons of deer in season too with no problems..I think my dad knew everyone in the whole dang county, or was related to them so I had free rein to hunt tons of land.....Good ole days!...
Last edited by Ramdiesel; 11/25/21.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47,153 |
Not going to lie when we were teens we use to road hunt, and go into the king ranch and poach, pretty much a right of passage back then. Then if you got caught it was a 250 dollar fine, defiantly not worth it now that they can hit you with a felony. We even had a police scanner in my buddy's truck and would listen to the game wardens. Once in a while, we'd go out spotlighting but not take any guns and let them catch us just to mess with them. It was like a war zone at night near my dad's ranch in North Central Texas about 90 miles west of Fort Worth. We lived about 15 miles from the nearest town and it was just a spot in the road. Rarely saw a game warden, but plenty of poachers and spotlighters... My dad drug a big post oak log across a blind curve in a road one night where he knew some poachers were getting a deer. Only way they had to get out of the place was on this road. They came around that curve hauling arse and phugged up there daddy's new truck really bad on that log...They had a long walk back to the highway... lol one time we were running from the game warden and we were coming up on a curve that you had to slow down to about 30 to make the curve. we were running with the lights off Allan downshifted to slow down as not to hit the brake lights, and we made the curve. game warden didn't and went out into a plowed field. the whole time we were listening on the scanner. Allen did get caught years later on George Strait's ranch, He never gave up outlaw hunting after we grew up and it cost him big time. he lost his guns for that and 6 months locked up. Dang, yeah, that cost him....I can honestly say I never poached a deer growing up, but grew up around plenty of dudes in High School that most likely did...It is kind of like a right of passage as you said in Texas in the small town areas. Not much else to do for entertainment, and usually tons of alcohol involved...LOL! I loved spotlighting for yotes and coon hunting with hounds growing up...We shot tons of deer in season too with no problems...Good ole days!... yeah usually a case of bud or LoneStar and a bottle of jack.
God bless Texas-----------------------
Old 300
I will remain what i am until the day I die- A HUNTER......Sitting Bull
Its not how you pick the booger..
but where you put it !!
Roger V Hunter
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,231 Likes: 5
Campfire Ranger
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I sure would not pay $20,000 to shoot a whitetail. If I had that kind of dough laying around I would put it down on an elk hunt on the Tejon Ranch or on a Tule Elk hunt on a private ranch. And fyi California does not have any high fence game ranches. They are illegal here. I care not how other people spend their money as all conservatives should. More liberal regulation. What difference does make if a rancher wants to sell his livestock to some rich guy to be shot? It's his livestock and the government shouldn't have any say in how he sells it. High fence shooting doesn't appeal to me in the least but if a rancher can make a $$ with it, it's his right. It’s not that simple. When you factor in diseases and escaped livestock for example. That’s not new ground. BillyGoatGruff; Good evening to you my cyber friend, I hope Thanksgiving Day is treating you and your fine family well. Since I've got family who are still in the agriculture business, this is one topic among a few that we've agreed to disagree on. They've had issues with disease on elk farms in Saskatchewan in the past and now I read that some of the FN reserves up there have canned deer hunts too. In BC - so far - game farming of any natural big game is unlawful, though we do allow salmon farming on the coast which is another fine kettle of fish. Anyways I'm with you in that it's not new ground - it's pretty much proven to be a bad thing for the wild herd. All the best to you all and Happy Thanksgiving. Dwayne I won't disagree with this Dwayne, but I think it is important to mention that the argument could be made that domestic sheep shouldn't be allowed anywhere near wild sheep, due to the pneumonia scare. There are plenty of wild sheep on private ranches, so should domestic sheep ranching be outlawed where wild sheep exist and those ranchers be required to only run cattle on their private land? Most range permits on BLM and FS lands in the lower 48 come with mitigation measures to minimize the pneumonia risk, but they do at times come into contact on the range allotments so there's that angle to consider too. I am unsure if sheep need any sort of pneumonia test before they can be brought into a new state, though I guess a guy could buy sheep from Plentywood, MT and haul them several hundred miles to The Bitterroot Valley, MT without crossing a state line. Managing public resources such as wildlife and trying to balance it all with private rights is one of the most challenging things there is IMO. Protecting one person's rights without stomping on another's...
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Campfire Ranger
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I sure would not pay $20,000 to shoot a whitetail. If I had that kind of dough laying around I would put it down on an elk hunt on the Tejon Ranch or on a Tule Elk hunt on a private ranch. And fyi California does not have any high fence game ranches. They are illegal here. I care not how other people spend their money as all conservatives should. More liberal regulation. What difference does make if a rancher wants to sell his livestock to some rich guy to be shot? It's his livestock and the government shouldn't have any say in how he sells it. High fence shooting doesn't appeal to me in the least but if a rancher can make a $$ with it, it's his right. It’s not that simple. When you factor in diseases and escaped livestock for example. That’s not new ground. BillyGoatGruff; Good evening to you my cyber friend, I hope Thanksgiving Day is treating you and your fine family well. Since I've got family who are still in the agriculture business, this is one topic among a few that we've agreed to disagree on. They've had issues with disease on elk farms in Saskatchewan in the past and now I read that some of the FN reserves up there have canned deer hunts too. In BC - so far - game farming of any natural big game is unlawful, though we do allow salmon farming on the coast which is another fine kettle of fish. Anyways I'm with you in that it's not new ground - it's pretty much proven to be a bad thing for the wild herd. All the best to you all and Happy Thanksgiving. Dwayne I won't disagree with this Dwayne, but I think it is important to mention that the argument could be made that domestic sheep shouldn't be allowed anywhere near wild sheep, due to the pneumonia scare. There are plenty of wild sheep on private ranches, so should domestic sheep ranching be outlawed where wild sheep exist and those ranchers be required to only run cattle on their private land? Most range permits on BLM and FS lands in the lower 48 come with mitigation measures to minimize the pneumonia risk, but they do at times come into contact on the range allotments so there's that angle to consider too. I am unsure if sheep need any sort of pneumonia test before they can be brought into a new state, though I guess a guy could buy sheep from Plentywood, MT and haul them several hundred miles to The Bitterroot Valley, MT without crossing a state line. Managing public resources such as wildlife and trying to balance it all with private rights is one of the most challenging things there is IMO. Protecting one person's rights without stomping on another's... Can’t move livestock across county lines without a brand inspection. Classify high fence and/or farm raised cervids as livestock. Require brand inspections and proof of applicable vaccinations. Seems simple enough. Won’t fix it but would mitigate it at least.
MAGA
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Not going to lie when we were teens we use to road hunt, and go into the king ranch and poach, pretty much a right of passage back then. Then if you got caught it was a 250 dollar fine, defiantly not worth it now that they can hit you with a felony. We even had a police scanner in my buddy's truck and would listen to the game wardens. Once in a while, we'd go out spotlighting but not take any guns and let them catch us just to mess with them. It was like a war zone at night near my dad's ranch in North Central Texas about 90 miles west of Fort Worth. We lived about 15 miles from the nearest town and it was just a spot in the road. Rarely saw a game warden, but plenty of poachers and spotlighters... My dad drug a big post oak log across a blind curve in a road one night where he knew some poachers were getting a deer. Only way they had to get out of the place was on this road. They came around that curve hauling arse and phugged up there daddy's new truck really bad on that log...They had a long walk back to the highway... lol one time we were running from the game warden and we were coming up on a curve that you had to slow down to about 30 to make the curve. we were running with the lights off Allan downshifted to slow down as not to hit the brake lights, and we made the curve. game warden didn't and went out into a plowed field. the whole time we were listening on the scanner. Allen did get caught years later on George Strait's ranch, He never gave up outlaw hunting after we grew up and it cost him big time. he lost his guns for that and 6 months locked up. Dang, yeah, that cost him....I can honestly say I never poached a deer growing up, but grew up around plenty of dudes in High School that most likely did...It is kind of like a right of passage as you said in Texas in the small town areas. Not much else to do for entertainment, and usually tons of alcohol involved...LOL! I loved spotlighting for yotes and coon hunting with hounds growing up...We shot tons of deer in season too with no problems...Good ole days!... yeah usually a case of bud or LoneStar and a bottle of jack. LOL! Had a buddy in High School that I also roomed with in college, and he always had a case of Lonestar Light or Schaefer's Light iced down in the truck. Could always hear a bottle rolling around behind his seat too. We used to call his truck the travelling bar...There was a honky tonk way out in the middle of nowhere that had no problem selling to us minors, contributing to our delinquency...HA!
Last edited by Ramdiesel; 11/25/21.
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Campfire Outfitter
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T Inman;
Good evening and Happy Thanksgiving to you my cyber friend.
Indeed the somewhat famous Vaseux California Bighorn herd was dealt a staggering blow by exposure to tame sheep from which they got some kind of Pasteurella lung infection. In the old days it was a herd that was used to restock California Bighorn into at least 3 states that I can recall off the top of my head.
Same with the Grand Forks herd too, it was infected by tame sheep or that's where the evidence points in my view.
I'm with you 100% that there should not be tame sheep within a fair number of miles from any known wild sheep population. The wild sheep are way too susceptible to disease and we have a choice to have one or the other - not both.
That's likely a bit of a hard line to take considering my contacts in the ranching community as well as an agricultural background and I get that, nonetheless that's where I'm at today.
Happy Thanksgiving and all the best to you.
Dwayne
The most important stuff in life isn't "stuff"
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Posts: 43,884 Likes: 6 |
A high fence, game farm, owned by white people on a rez?
Wowza.
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Campfire Tracker
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The buck was already “spoken for” by a client who paid $20,000K to shoot the deer. The ranch managers “brought in” the whitetail on October 18.
lol
The Timber Lake Lodge is like no other “hunt” on earth.
lol some more this...... lol
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 45,159 Likes: 12 |
A high fence, game farm, owned by white people on a rez?
Wowza. Would seem that's the case. An inholding perhaps?
The desert is a true treasure for him who seeks refuge from men and the evil of men.
In it is contentment
In it is death and all you seek
(Quoted from "The Bleeding of the Stone" Ibrahim Al-Koni)
member of the cabal of dysfunctional squirrels?
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 43,884 Likes: 6
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 43,884 Likes: 6 |
Geno, just sounds like a crazy idea.
Half the acres of our local rez is privately owned but no way in hell would I attempt to run a game farm here.
(or anywhere...)
I bet they have guys patrolling and fixing fence 24/7.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
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I sure would not pay $20,000 to shoot a whitetail. If I had that kind of dough laying around I would put it down on an elk hunt on the Tejon Ranch or on a Tule Elk hunt on a private ranch. And fyi California does not have any high fence game ranches. They are illegal here. I care not how other people spend their money as all conservatives should. More liberal regulation. What difference does make if a rancher wants to sell his livestock to some rich guy to be shot? It's his livestock and the government shouldn't have any say in how he sells it. High fence shooting doesn't appeal to me in the least but if a rancher can make a $$ with it, it's his right. It’s not that simple. When you factor in diseases and escaped livestock for example. That’s not new ground. BillyGoatGruff; Good evening to you my cyber friend, I hope Thanksgiving Day is treating you and your fine family well. Since I've got family who are still in the agriculture business, this is one topic among a few that we've agreed to disagree on. They've had issues with disease on elk farms in Saskatchewan in the past and now I read that some of the FN reserves up there have canned deer hunts too. In BC - so far - game farming of any natural big game is unlawful, though we do allow salmon farming on the coast which is another fine kettle of fish. Anyways I'm with you in that it's not new ground - it's pretty much proven to be a bad thing for the wild herd. All the best to you all and Happy Thanksgiving. Dwayne I won't disagree with this Dwayne, but I think it is important to mention that the argument could be made that domestic sheep shouldn't be allowed anywhere near wild sheep, due to the pneumonia scare. There are plenty of wild sheep on private ranches, so should domestic sheep ranching be outlawed where wild sheep exist and those ranchers be required to only run cattle on their private land? Most range permits on BLM and FS lands in the lower 48 come with mitigation measures to minimize the pneumonia risk, but they do at times come into contact on the range allotments so there's that angle to consider too. I am unsure if sheep need any sort of pneumonia test before they can be brought into a new state, though I guess a guy could buy sheep from Plentywood, MT and haul them several hundred miles to The Bitterroot Valley, MT without crossing a state line. Managing public resources such as wildlife and trying to balance it all with private rights is one of the most challenging things there is IMO. Protecting one person's rights without stomping on another's... Can’t move livestock across county lines without a brand inspection. Classify high fence and/or farm raised cervids as livestock. Require brand inspections and proof of applicable vaccinations. Seems simple enough. Won’t fix it but would mitigate it at least. More laws and regulations are not the answer in my opinion...especially not if they just "mitigate at least". Why not stop ALL sheep ranching in the west to protect wild sheep? I don't have the answer but it is thought provoking.
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Campfire Ranger
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Joined: Mar 2007
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Geno, just sounds like a crazy idea.
Half the acres of our local rez is privately owned but no way in hell would I attempt to run a game farm here.
(or anywhere...)
I bet they have guys patrolling and fixing fence 24/7. Ya.....I have been on a lot of Reservations.....the Northern Cheyenne, Rocky Boy, Wind River, Blackfeet. Not a deer to be seen other than the Flathead. I couldn't imagine Fort Peck being ANY better.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,231 Likes: 5 |
T Inman;
Good evening and Happy Thanksgiving to you my cyber friend.
Indeed the somewhat famous Vaseux California Bighorn herd was dealt a staggering blow by exposure to tame sheep from which they got some kind of Pasteurella lung infection. In the old days it was a herd that was used to restock California Bighorn into at least 3 states that I can recall off the top of my head.
Same with the Grand Forks herd too, it was infected by tame sheep or that's where the evidence points in my view.
I'm with you 100% that there should not be tame sheep within a fair number of miles from any known wild sheep population. The wild sheep are way too susceptible to disease and we have a choice to have one or the other - not both.
That's likely a bit of a hard line to take considering my contacts in the ranching community as well as an agricultural background and I get that, nonetheless that's where I'm at today.
Happy Thanksgiving and all the best to you.
Dwayne I come from a long agricultural background, but am a hunter at heart. I see both sides and honestly have no idea where the answer lies. All the best to you too...
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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T Inman;
Good evening again sir, I still hope you're well and having a good Thanksgiving.
From what I've read on the subject and based upon where we have wild sheep herds here in southern BC, there's a lot more places where they could run tame sheep as there are no wild sheep anywhere close.
I do agree however that more laws and regulations typically aren't the answer.
That all said though, I'd still like the next generation to have the opportunity to at least go see a wild sheep - still in wild places - if they have a mind to, you know?
Indeed it's thought provoking.
All the best.
Dwayne
The most important stuff in life isn't "stuff"
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 43,884 Likes: 6 |
We actually have too many whitetail on the river bottom.
Locals rarely shoot does.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,231 Likes: 5 |
We actually have too many whitetail on the river bottom.
Locals rarely shoot does.
River bottom---on the Res? That is surprising to me. Maybe (hopefully) things are changing?
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 45,159 Likes: 12 |
Does are tasty too.
What's wrong with them folks.
The desert is a true treasure for him who seeks refuge from men and the evil of men.
In it is contentment
In it is death and all you seek
(Quoted from "The Bleeding of the Stone" Ibrahim Al-Koni)
member of the cabal of dysfunctional squirrels?
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47,153
Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47,153 |
We actually have too many whitetail on the river bottom.
Locals rarely shoot does.
buy them, high school boys, some beer, and lend them a spotlight.
God bless Texas-----------------------
Old 300
I will remain what i am until the day I die- A HUNTER......Sitting Bull
Its not how you pick the booger..
but where you put it !!
Roger V Hunter
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 12,132
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 12,132 |
Sam;
Happy Thanksgiving and good evening to you my cyber friend, I hope it's been going well so far.
It's interesting what the different FN groups will and won't hunt as a matter of practice or tradition.
Where I grew up in Saskatchewan the Plains Cree would shoot and eat all the black bears they could, but the Okanagan FN folks here who are Interior Salish will not shoot a bear as far as I know of.
Now they've no such restrictions on either sex moose, elk or deer, but interestingly enough don't shoot Bighorn ewes that often, if ever.
Anyways sir more or less I just wanted to say hello and wish you all a Happy Thanksgiving.
Dwayne
The most important stuff in life isn't "stuff"
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