Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics So Leupold are Junk anymore. Now what

Only thing I didn't like about the older Burris scopes was their eye relief was more critical than a Leupold.

The current consensus is that Leupold is not what they used to be and haven’t been for several years. So my question is what is a good alternative? I am not a long ranges knob twister in any way . All I need is good optics, reliability, decent adjustments without breaking the bank. 2-7, or 3-9, do anything I want. Will spend 500 to 600 bucks for a scope. Not going to put out thousands of dollars for something I don’t need. The wife is really screwed as she was a Nikon freak. One of her old scopes needed repair and she got a voucher toward binoculars. Harder than hell to mount and impossible to sight in.

Sounds like you are in a pickle and so is your wife... A great low cost alternative is the Burris FFII 3-9x40 with the ballistic plex reticle. That is all anyone really needs for most hunting applications. I have several and most of my "go to" hunting rifles have them. Just used one on top of a Tikka T3x 7MM08 a couple months ago on my elk hunt. Worked great, just as per usual.. These scopes are a simple approach for getting the job done and can be had for less than $200. Get one with the ballistic plex reticle, since you aren't a turret twister.

During a particularly rough patch at one place I was working overseas, I took an older and very reliable American made Burris 2-7 compact and mounted it on my M4. It got used a more there in 6 months than most scopes would see in lifetimes. It never failed in any way.




I later switched to a Leupold 1.5-5 illuminated LPVO and used that for years in the M.E.




The punchline is though, I have nothing bad to say about the older American made Burris scopes. I also have an older American made set of Burris 12x signature series binoculars that I have been using for 20 years now and have never felt the need to upgrade glass.

Congratulations in your experience, but apparently you did NOT have experience with "two or three Burris scopes," and actually never even used the second one you acquired.

Right now I own dozens of rifle scopes, from 16 different companies. I own 17 Leupolds, more than any other brand, with Burris in second place at 11. The others include some European brands including Hensoldt, Schmidt & Bender, Swarovski and Zeiss. Probably have owned more Swarovskis and Zeisses than any other Euro brands. Among the newer brands are Nightforce, SWFA and Tract Toric.

Also right now, I have had 20 different brands of scopes fail in one way or another when on my rifles. That is BRANDS, not individual scopes, often multiples in one brand, including some noted European scopes, plus Nightforce. Any scope can malfunction after enough use, though some arrive from the factory "broken." I know this partly because for 30 years now I have been paid to test scopes, and one of the tests is to put them on rifles that recoil at least as much as a .300 magnum, and shoot the rifle considerably.

But the subject here is Leupold scopes--along with Burris. I still own quite a few Leupolds because they suit my purposes on many rifles, especially older Leupolds, some with friction adjustments. The M8 fixed-powers, for instance, are not only light and hold zero once you get them adjusted, but almost never break. Though that has happened a few times, usually by the wire reticle snapping.

Starting about a decade ago I had more Leupolds start to malfunction than ever before--including the FX fixed-powers, which replaced the M8s. At first I welcomed them, because of more consistent click adjustments, but too many didn't hold zero--and I'm not talking about 2-3 inches of shift, but sometimes a foot or more. Sent them back, and at least two were returned by Leupold with a note saying they'd "examined" them and could find nothing wrong. I tried them on the same rifles and they malfunctioned the same way.

So many Leupold scopes started malfunctioning that I eventually was photocopying the repair forms several at a time. Eventually I realized that was ridiculous, so started buying more Burris scopes, especially Fullfield IIs, as "affordable" but reliable scopes for general use. Got my first around 2003, a 30mm model that they then offered as what were then often called "tactical" scopes by many companies, which had very repeatable adjustments. Still have it, and its been on several rifles and the adjustments are still very repeatable. In fact, shot my last big game animal with it a couple weeks ago, using my custom 6.5 PRC.

But also soon tried a basic 1"-tube 3-9x40 Fullfield II, and it also worked well, with far less erratic adjustments than Leupolds in the same price range. When Burris started having them made in the Philippines I got one of those, and compared it to the American-made scope, and the "Asian" model was at least as good in every respect, and in some ways a little better. This was because Burris didn't just ask an overseas company to make a copy of the American FFII, but shipped the machinery to them, and provided instruction in how to use it.

Since then have acquired several more Philippine-made FFIIs, partly because the guys at a local sporting goods store (which sells a LOT of scopes) told me Burris was probably the most reliable brand they carry. In all that time--and a lot of shooting--have only had ONE 3-9x40 FFII malfunction--and that was my first 1" model, made in the USA, which had been on dozens of rifles, often when testing a new rifle, BECAUSE it had been so reliable. Isent it back to Burris and they had it repaired and back to me within two weeks.

I have used more expensive scopes for the same purpose, and some didn't last as long. Others did well--though one Nightforce did eventually need repair, after being used hard as a test-scope on quite a few hard-kicking rifles over 4-5 years. During the same time-frame I had to return several Leupolds for repair, and at least two malfunctioned in the same way when they showed up again.

All of which is why quit buying new Leupolds for a few years, and only used my older, proven ones. Lately they seem to be improving, and in fact have a 2-10x42 5HD that I need to "test-fire," because have heard so many good reports from trusted friends that I have high hopes. In the meantime I'll keep using my older Leupolds (used one of those, a small variable, to take my first big game animal this fall) and Burrises, and other trustworthy scopes to hunt with.

I have one on the way. We'll see what it's all about and will report.

ER is short; we'll see how much of an issue that really is.

Leupolds are good scopes, I have a number.

No problem until there is one....

If they would just admit they have erector issues and fix them, then all would be well, IMO.

But those clowns they rolled out for their PR video were a joke. I was embarrassed for them. They danced around like politicians, never got down to any real issues.

DF

It's true that the eye relief on the Burris FF II scopes is slightly less than comparable Leupolds, but so far I haven't found it a problem on rifles up to 30-06. I haven't used Burris scopes on any really hard kickers though.

Sent them back, and at least two were returned by Leupold with a note saying they'd "examined" them and could find nothing wrong. I tried them on the same rifles and they malfunctioned the same way.

I used to call it the “Leupold shuffle”.... step to the left, step to the the right... used to drive me nucking futs. Then you’d get it zeroed and be afraid to ever touch anything again!

The first-gen Conquests were a revelation; at that same price point, things more or less moved as they should when adjusting, and then stayed there.

Then you buy a Nightforce.... grin... and you see how that stuff is supposed to work!

The new Jap-built Conquests are awesome mechanically FWIW, in the same realm as my NF’s, and of course, brilliant optically. 👍

I used to call it the “Leupold shuffle”.... step to the left, step to the the right... used to drive me nucking futs. Then you’d get it zeroed and be afraid to ever touch anything again!

The first-gen Conquests were a revelation; at that same price point, things more or less moved as they should when adjusting, and then stayed there.

Then you buy a Nightforce.... grin... and you see how that stuff is supposed to work!

The new Jap-built Conquests are awesome mechanically FWIW, in the same realm as my NF’s, and of course, brilliant optically. 👍

Did you vote for Biden?

Did you vote for Biden?

Not the eye relief distance so much what I didn't like was that if you shifted your head a little they tended to black out.

Did you vote for Biden?