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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2005
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The NR “battle” will never end with everybody being happy.
I am not anti NR and agree they have an economic impact to the small gateway towns, but here’s some perspective.
We know the owners of a store/station in a small gateway town and have had this discussion numerous times. A NR will usually pull in a day or two before the hunt, fill up, buy a few last minute needs and maybe fill up 2/3 times during the hunt and possibly replace a few necessities.
A resident hunting near the same town will visit the same town 2, 5, 10 times before the hunt and spend the same money a NR does during the hunt. This is not to say a NR doesn’t add to the economy, but at the end of the year, the residents brings in substantially more money to these gateway towns.
The numbers may be different in a state with OTC licenses like Colorado?
Eta; it is typically the outfitters that make the argument that NR hunters keep the lights on in the small gateway towns. SLM, I pretty much agree with you, but......in the 1980's when the interior, rural west experienced the biggest recession since the Great Depression, the second biggest shopping week of the year occurred prior to the combined deer and elk season here in Colorado for the small towns on the West Slope. Obviously both Resident and NR's contribute, but NR's do pay for a big part of the western states wildlife management revenues, and they also contribute in large part to conservation groups who in turn help fund various wildlife projects. Twenty five yeas ago I helped argue for the quotas on NR's for draw hunts, and to have NR license fees here in Colorado align with other Rocky Mtn states NR fees, and I still support that.
Casey
Not being married to any particular political party sure makes it a lot easier to look at the world more objectively...
Having said that, MAGA.
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Joined: Dec 2012
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2012
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I'm a NR hunter as a Montana resident and will continue to probably be a NR hunter in other states, that being said ive never come close to spending the money in another state than I do in property taxs and state income taxs here in Montana so how does the NR arguement claim they pay more than a resident. Theres no sales tax other than hotels theres no way NR pay more than residents even with the NR license fees.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,128 Likes: 1 |
It would also seem pretty clear that the Federal Gov had a reason for giving the RRs their land in checkerboard. It wasn't to give them total control of the public ground.
Fed Gov could have just given the RRs all of the ground but specifically chose the checkerboard grants for reasons.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Joined: Aug 2003
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2003
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I'm a NR hunter as a Montana resident and will continue to probably be a NR hunter in other states, that being said ive never come close to spending the money in another state than I do in property taxs and state income taxs here in Montana so how does the NR arguement claim they pay more than a resident. Theres no sales tax other than hotels theres no way NR pay more than residents even with the NR license fees. Just total up what NRs pay for a license vs what the total for residents pay for licenses. That is where g&f gets revenue.
Decades of voting for the lesser of two evils has gotten us just that.....
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,982
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I'm a NR hunter as a Montana resident and will continue to probably be a NR hunter in other states, that being said ive never come close to spending the money in another state than I do in property taxs and state income taxs here in Montana so how does the NR arguement claim they pay more than a resident. Theres no sales tax other than hotels theres no way NR pay more than residents even with the NR license fees. Just total up what NRs pay for a license vs what the total for residents pay for licenses. That is where g&f gets revenue. I did, its true NR pay more in licenses. MT basic F  G budget is 58.5 million NR licenses total about 26 million who picks up the 32 million shortfall, residents with there licenses and property and state income taxs
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Joined: Apr 2006
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I understand the property and income taxes are not part of MT F&G budget. Can you show where it is?
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Joined: Dec 2012
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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O.k smart ass the other 32 million comes from licenses and out of the general fund 58.5 - 26= 32.5 when I went to school.
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Joined: Dec 2012
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I understand the property and income taxes are not part of MT F&G budget. Can you show where it is? General fund money, which is taxs
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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O.k smart ass the other 32 million comes from licenses and out of the general fund 58.5 - 26= 32.5 when I went to school. Do you know how to read?
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I understand the property and income taxes are not part of MT F&G budget. Can you show where it is? General fund money, which is taxs no
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,452 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I'm a NR hunter as a Montana resident and will continue to probably be a NR hunter in other states, that being said ive never come close to spending the money in another state than I do in property taxs and state income taxs here in Montana so how does the NR arguement claim they pay more than a resident. Theres no sales tax other than hotels theres no way NR pay more than residents even with the NR license fees. Just total up what NRs pay for a license vs what the total for residents pay for licenses. That is where g&f gets revenue. I did, its true NR pay more in licenses. MT basic F@G budget is 58.5 million NR licenses total about 26 million who picks up the 32 million shortfall, residents with there licenses and property and state income taxs Link to your figures? Latest Wyoming figures (2020) on license sales NR $43,593,085 Res $9,599,458 https://wgfd.wyo.gov/WGFD/media/content/PDF/About%20Us/Commission/WGFD-Revenue-Fact-Sheet_FINAL.pdf
Decades of voting for the lesser of two evils has gotten us just that.....
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Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 10
New Member
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New Member
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Eminent domain has been used in so many instances that it doesn’t even necessitate conversation in my examples. It would be so simple to go in and use ED to create an easement for the public to use this. The private land owners who are pissed are primary mad if they bought the property specifically so they could have sole claim to access to that part of the public lands.
I’m probably not saying anything new but I’m not readying all the pages of convo again
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One of the legal guys may have to explain the defendant’s legal argument.
The claim is the federal law that says you can’t block access, trumps the state law that says you can’t trespass.
But if the landowner had not put up signs, then the federal would not apply and the state law would apply?
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Campfire Tracker
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I don’t think that is the defense’s argument at all. I don’t believe the signs have anything to do with the trespassing . In Wyoming the landowner doesn’t need to post property, hunters are responsible to know where they are.
This boils down to corner crossing and wether or not your leg going over private property “air space “ constitutes trespassing. It really does have huge implications for checkerboard public lands and access to them.
Decades of voting for the lesser of two evils has gotten us just that.....
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Joined: Dec 2012
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O.k smart ass the other 32 million comes from licenses and out of the general fund 58.5 - 26= 32.5 when I went to school. Do you know how to read? DO YOU KNOW HOW TO READ go to the Legislature budget meetings and read were the legislature appropriates money from the general fund TO FUND F G. There total budget for 2023 is 102,000,000 and were told to come up with a plan to cut it by 5 million. Pitman Robertson money has to be spent 50% on parks including game Warden time dont fugging believe ask Capt Lee Anderson. What is vehicle registration? a tax. What fuggin difference does it make what tax it is residents pay it.
Last edited by sherm_61; 02/04/22.
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Joined: Oct 2009
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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“Federal law prohibits any person or group of persons from preventing Mr. Yeomans, his friends, or others from freely passing through public lands,” the motion for dismissal states. “Consequently, private landowners cannot prevent or obstruct free passage from one section of public land to another by claiming that the common corner where two private sections of land and two public sections of land meet is their exclusive property, land, or premises.“ from article.
The federal law referenced is the 1880’s law that says you can’t interfere. But the law does not grant access?
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,611
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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PR money is not generated by the general fund. And it is Federal money.
Correct answer is Sherm can’t read.
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Joined: Dec 2008
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Hey dumbass, a motion for dismissal comes from the defense attorney, an acquittal comes from the court.
I was thinking the other day how much I used to hate Bill Clinton. He was freaking George Washington compared to what they are now.
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Campfire Tracker
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Hey dumbass, a motion for dismissal comes from the defense attorney, an acquittal comes from the court. Glad you weren't confused by the title " defendants move for dismissal of trespassing charges" The 66 page dismissal motion is a good read... Going to be more articles being released soon, spoke with Angus on Friday....stay tuned.
Last edited by BuzzH; 02/13/22.
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