Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only The great 458 Winchester. Everyone should own one at least once

Sir Michael (aka "Doc M" Man of Science) is the latest Knight of The Square Table.
Sir Larry has sent him some Shock Hammers.
What with his indoor range/laboratory at McCourry Institute of Ballistics (MIB) in South Carolina,
he may be the first to shoot the bullet, into his test media.

I am back to recommending the CEB 450-gr Safari Solid
(brass FN, with flat base and BBW#13 nose profile with 67% meplat)
as a magazine-filling backup to the 400-gr Shock Hammer loaded however you like
in any standard .458 WinMag or .458 WM+:

A load that is tops in any factory .458 WinMag:

CEB Safari Solid 450-gr (BOL = 1.415")
Hornady case 2.490" trim to
COL 3.360″ (front two bands crimped ahead of case mouth, bottom two bands seated inside case)
Seat depth = 0.545"
F-215 primer
77.0 grains AA-2230 (minimal compression, locks bullet in place)
at 55 degrees F in a 24-7/8" CZ take-off barrel installed on a Pre-’64 M70 .30-06 action
(25" factory barrel set back 1/8" and re-threaded to smaller threads of M70):

5-shot average of 5-yard chrono: 2343 fps with std. dev. of 4 fps
That is +2350 fps MV.
3-shots into 0.53 MOA (0.278" on centers for 3 shots at 50 yards)

Yep, that is my solid load to back up the 400-gr Shock Hammer,
until there is a proper 400-gr FN solid available.
That Woodleigh HYDRO sure would be nice, out of what has been available in past.
Maybe they will make it available here again someday.
Any word on Woodleigh Bullets ?
"Sumbuddy who know ?"

Sir Ron,
Looking forward with eager anticipation of the MIB laboratory testing results of the Hammer 400’s.

I think for solids, I am going to try the 380 grain Lehigh copper flats. These were originally bought for 45-70 use.
I am guessing they should be plenty good for anything in Alaska at about any angle when fired from a 458 Winchester also. I have never given much thought to the solids’ use except for the 45-70. But, I will have a few to play around with it 458.

I do like the idea of the North Fork Cup Point expanding solids for closer ranges. If the Hammer 400’s / 403’s pan out, it is most likely going to be the one and done bullet for me.

I hope I'll be still around for Sir Ron's "self published" book on the great .458 WinMag. I'll be first in line for a copy. Mark me down for that, Ron!

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

Bob,
You also have an impressive collection of data.

Sir Larry,
That 380-gr copper Lehigh copper FN is nice ... and out of stock ...
The forerunner 402-gr/.458-cal Shock Hammer would work a lot like a cup point with the 0.25"-wide and shallow HP.
Then there is the Barnes Buster that would mushroom some if velocity high enough.
Hey it has a pinhole in the FN copper meplat and lead core.
Buy a donkey for cajoling Sir Michael to test the new Shock Hammer whenever his schedule allows.

Sir Bob,
You can be co-author.
I have a lot of your data, been printing out your blog for years.
It is filed in an Oxford binder entitled OOM BOB'S BLOG.
"Oom" is Afrikaans for "Uncle."
Buy a donkey for that.

So I flicked the oil out of 450 more of the bullets and wiped them with paper towels.
Used a digital scale that agrees within 0.1 grain of both of my balance beam scales.
I have weighed each and every one of 500 bullets.
Some had as much as 0.6 grains of oil in their hollow points
The weight of any residual oil on them will surely be "a wash" regarding uniformity checking.

I washed only 50 of them, as previously detailed.
The rest will be left in ziplock bags until washed and returned to little plastic boxes from Hammer factory packaging,
as needed for handloading.
I got 10 little plastic boxes of 25 and one bulk cardboard box of 250.



Sometime this week they will be fired at range.
Weather is getting good tomorrow but my 86-year-old mother needs some care-taking,
not to mention my other Old Lady.
Not all 86-year-olds are in as good shape as Sir Bob.

the book needs needs to be hard cover so it will last . please😁😃😁👍

Nice job Sir Ron.
Midway shows Lehigh 380 grain copper flat points in stock.

Lehigh themselves has stopped selling directly to the customer, since Wilson bought the company.

OK, will check Midway USA , Sir Larry.

Sir Allen, will do.

And just for old times sake, inspired by the "Projectile Dysfunction" video from CEB at B&M Forum:



The 500-gr/.458 TSX suffers from Projectile Dysfunction (PD).
It may be an accurate target bullet in the .458 WinMag with 1:14" twist,
but it is too long for stability after impact in some targets.
With current economic conditions (let's go Brandon),
it is smart to convert those 500-grainers to a more functional 480-grainer.
Old picture below, bullet is now called the 480-gr/.458-cal eX-TSX.
The .458 WIN-V 3.6" is now called the .458 WM+:









If you want a tougher "semi-soft" bullet, make it shorter and do not ream the hollowpoint,
but put a chamfer on outside edge of meplat to reduce meplat to about 67% of caliber:



Since you are messing with the nose, not the base of the bullet, accuracy is easy:



Can't find an inkpad right now, but calipers and eyeball previously suggested this 480-grainer had close to a 70% FN meplat diameter.
I must have done that on purpose, being familiar with the BBW research.
The chamfer on the edge might get it closer to 65% to 67%.

That 480 grain 1.470 grain has looks appeal. Most interesting.
Almost curious about a 450 grain with a similar treatment for a 420-430 grain bullet.
Nice job on that 480 grain version.

Bubba has game, to coop a phrase. He has turned a pretty sorry bullet, the 500 grain tsx, into some pretty amazing projectiles.

Ron, did you see where the Hammer 400 is now the Hammer 404 ?
Obviously they took action on your communication with them.

Buy a donkey for the flowers, Sir Larry and Sir Dennis.

The 450-gr/.458-cal TSX is too nice a bullet to bubba-metamorphose.
But shortening the nose of one of those by the same amount as was done to the 500-gr TSX
would sure make a nice 430-gr semi-soft or semi-solid.

If Hammer was listening to me, they would have called it a "403" based on my sample.
But, "404" does have a nice ring to it, close enough for "nominal" call of the bullet.
Or maybe the new QC on the copper bar stock has tweaked it into a true 404-grainer, +/- 0.4 grains.

Anyway, kudos to Hammer Bullets on re-naming the 3mm HP .458 bullet to "404-g."
Numerologically the "404" nominal has cachet in the DGR field.
It is going to be outstanding in its field.

.458 Cal-404g Shock Hammer



https://hammerbullets.com/product/458-cal-400g-shock-hammer/

I have Larry Potterfield's Vol. 2 of "Short Stories" on the way
and that 380-gr Lehigh copper WFN also to be studied firsthand.
Sure looks like a great bullet for the .45-70 Gov't. rifles with .458" or .459" grooved barrel.
There are some of those rifles needing feeding too, same as .458 WinMags.

Curious about the 404 hammer. What is your view of loading it up 5% from your 458 Win Mag load for my 348-450 Ackley improved? Five of those and I would guess either a bear or a moose would cry uncle and it probably would load well.

The 380 grain Lehigh Copper Flat Point was originally for my 45-70’s. It got my attention in Buffalo Bore’s factory loads. They are advertised at 2075 fps. Velocity only equaled by price. I bought a couple of boxes of the factory loads. Then ordered the bullets. WAG going by looks, it looks like it should penetrate well and cause a good trail of destruction along the way.
I am eventually going to load some in the 458.
2300 fps should not be out of reason, maybe more.
I am hoping for no issues with feeding in the bolt rifles.

I am not familiar with the Potterfield short stories. I assume a collection of his gun tips ?

It's amazing, I feel great in comparison to last winter when I could barely lift a cup of coffee without shaking! That was the arthritis. Now I work out almost every day with nary a pain! I was on the phone yesterday with a member of our congregation who is the age of our oldest son, and we discussed the health issues from Covid - which both he and wife are recovering from - she was vaxxed 2x and he not at all. Anyway, I said the nurse who tended me after the fifth stent, said I had the heart of a 20-yr old, so would live a long time if I take care of myself - even into my nineties! I told him I didn't think I'd make a hundred, and he replied "Don't count it out, you're in good shape!" So I'm planning a bear hunt this spring.

But my wife is 85 and I ask prayer for her as she goes into the hospital for breast surgery on Monday due to cancer. She's very quiet about it and sombre, since she's nursed patients who've had the same surgery.

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

Bob, Prayer sent.

🙏🙏🙏

Prayers for Bob's Wife and her loving family.
Amen.
A good friend's wife had it in her 50's and they are still love birds in their late sixties.