Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Muzzleloaders Choosing the correct lead bullet size

I posted in another thread the ordeal I recently had loading a Hornady Great Plains .50 385 gr bullet into my Pedersoli Hawken Hunter with a 1:24 twist. That rifle is advertised as being .500 land-to-land and .510 groove to grove. I've tried to measure it myself but the inside diameter part of my calipers won't go down far enough to give me an accurate reading, so I need a longer tool. In the meantime, I want to get some advice.

So far, I've been shooting sabot rounds with great accuracy. But I want to develope a lead bullet load. The Hornady Great Plains .50 is measuring .510-.511 across the top driving band. No problem. The bore is .510 groove to groove. I literally had to use a solid aluminum ram rod capped by a spent .45 ACP shell and a ball peen hammer to seat that bullet. It fired fine, but I didn't attempt a second. It is simply not a viable hunting load given the effort it take to seat the bullet.

I've been refered to No Excuses bullets. .50 calibers run from .500 to .504. Pedersoli chart recommends a .500 bullet.



I notice for some of their other front loading .50s, they recommend a .504. So I guess when they are recommending a .500, they mean .500.

I'm wondering if anyone else has run into a situation where they need to use a .500 in a .50? How does it fill the grooves? Did you have to use a felt wad? If I use a soild base bullet, will I need to go up in size?

Just want to know some other perspectives.

Thanks.

Have you thought about trying a bullet sizing pack?

Yes, I spoke to David at No Excuses bullets. I'll order a sizing pack. He says a solid base lead bullet will expand to fill the rifling even if the diamater of the bullet is .500, same as the land-to-land measure of the bore. He said a jacketed bullet will not, but lead will. So the Pedersoli recommendation for a .500 might make sense. He said the main goal is to have a bullet that won't move off the powder. So the smallest size lead bullet that won't do that is the one to go with. He said he would guess I would settle on a .501 or .502, but a .500 might work. Depends on my gun. I also want an accurate bullet so I may order several sizing packs. Ultimately I want one that's easier to load, doesn't move off the powder, and gives me good accuracy.

So that's how I'll go. I'll order sizing packs then decide.

Never been aound anything but round balls. Do they still use a patch when using the bullets?

Have a older .54 Lyman hawken kit gun. That gun was a absolute PITA to load , until we tried .526 round balls, and the thinnest patches we could get ahold of. It made a big difference...wonder if you dont just have a slightly undersized barrel?

No, you do not have to patch when using a bullet. A felt wad may be wise if there is gas leakage due to not quite filling the grooves.

Learned something new

The only gun I have used a 0.504 on was my white. Got those from bullshop. NE wasn’t offering different ones at that point.

https://bullshop.weebly.com/bullets.html

Both places make quality bullets

I checked out Bullshop but their website is pretty much unusable and links to a dead Gunbroker page.

I orderd two sizing packs. Got them today. Hope to get out this weekend and see what my gun likes.

Went to the range today and tried No Excuses bullets sizing pack. Shot the .500. It started with thumb pressure and was fairly easy to push down. I bounced the rifle, muzzle down, a couple of times to see if the bullet would come off the powder. Took a pretty good whack, in excess of anything I've accidentally done in the field, to get the bullet off the powder 1/4" or so. Light bounces and the bullet stayed seated. The second .500 (I ordered two sizing packs) went down the dirty barrel tighter, but still only had to use the rod, no starter. So a followup shot with a .500 is not going to require a spit patch first.

Cleaned the rifle Then moved up to .501. Started it in and came to a hard stop at the lands. Tried to push in into the lands with my thumbs with great force, couldn't and pulled out the starter and push it in about half way. I knew I was going to have a helluva time getting it down the pipe. So I used my bullet puller to get it out.

Never dreamed .001" would make that much difference.

So .500 it will be. I ordered two boxes of .500 460 grain.

Here's the .501 I had to extract with the puller.

I was about to suggest the same thing.

Couple of thoughts come to mind. Did you wipe the bore with a wet patch before trying to seat the .501" bullet? It's a common routine.

Do you know the hardness of the alloy those bullets are made of?

This

I was the one who suggested No Excuses. I don’t get too torqued up about them being a tight fit going down. They will bump up to the correct diameter easily when fired. But I do wipe the bore between shots for shot to shot consistency

I’ve been plinking with muzzle loaders for hunting for near 40 years, and have learned a thing or two. My flinter is good for 4-5 shots before a damp patch wipe is required. Bullet guns might be ok for a couple of shots, but seldom more than that, be they lead or paper patched. One other item is bullet alloy. Pure lead works, and a tiny bit of tin won’t hurt, say 60:1. Don’t go any harder than that.

No. I started with a clean bore. After shooting the first and second .500, I used Hoppes muzzle loading bore cleaner, scrubbed the bore with a brush, ran more bore cleaner, more brush, more Hoppes, and tehn several dry patches. When going from one size to the next, I wanted to start with a completely clean bore. That was the direction David at No Excuses gave and it makes sense. I didn't want to start a .501 with any residue left in the barrel.

The bore is just tight. I have a jag that calipers at .457 and with a cotton patch it takes a bit of effort to get that down the bore. So as much with my Knight or Traditions .50. David said it very well may need a .500. He said some rifles just need that. And it appears that's what Pedersoli recommends. A straight up .500. Other .50s Pedersoli makes they recommend .504s and so on, but not this rifle. .500 on the nose.


This is from the No Excuses website:

They are cast from pure lead and because of that, they obturate (belly out) when fired engaging the riflings on the way out.

He also suggests a felt wad may be helpful. So I have 100 bullets, .500 460 grain coming. And I am going to order some felt wads and come up with a load it likes. Though I will say both .500s hit at point of aim at 25 yards.

Man, Dave at No Excuses sure does send out orders quickly. Got these in the mail yesterday.

After 24 shots, I have my new heavy lead load.

I settled on a No Excuses .500 diameter 460 grain on a Muzzleloading Originals .54 caliber treated felt wad on top of 90 grains of Schuetzen 2Fg and a CCI #11 cap.

I can get off two shots with great accuracy. Then I have to spit patch to seat the third bullet and wad.

Here it is at 25 yards. The low shot was before adjusting elevation one last time.



And at 50 yards. Not too bad for a rifle having a big ole ghost ring rear sight.