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Campfire Ranger
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At the very beginning of his Gospel, Luke said that “many” have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among them. What he’s about to tell us, he's not the first person to try to get this documentation of historical events out saint people. He says tgat “many” people have endeavored to draw up an account of the things that have literally happened or been fulfilled right here among them.
How many will undertake to draw up an account of our lives…? NOT many. That’s how many. Luke tells us that he, and “many” others, have endeavored to write this all down in such a way that people can understand and experience , through what's being written by them, what has actually happened right here among them all.
But not many people even undertook to draw up the accounts of the lives of famous people from ancient times, especially during the first century. Tiberius Caesar was Caesar during the life of Jesus. The emperor of the Roman Empire. But there’s hardly anything about him, especially from the first century. You gotta piece it together to come up with much information about him at all. Same can be said for Pilate, there's practically nothing. Josephus does give us a storyline of the life of Herod the Great. But other than Josephus, that's it. And Herod the Great did extraordinary things, but there's just one account. One, not “many.”
And how many detailed narrative accounts do we have of the lives of ancient peasants who were crucified as criminals…? And how many detailed narrative accounts do we have of the lives of famous first century rabbis…? That’d be NONE. Other than Jesus, who “many” endeavored to document His history, that’d be a big fat NONE. There is nothing that even comes close to what we find in just Luke's presentation of the life of Jesus. I think one could safely assume. It is not a matter of how many histories were written of other important historical figures, but rather how many of those writings survived 2200 years including the dark ages and active purges of historical documentation not in perfect alignment with the Papacy.
People who choose to brew up their own storms bitch loudest about the rain.
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Hastings makes a good point that goes unanswered - before Jesus came along was the default condition that people went to hell automatically when they died? Was this an oversight of god, and did he only realise when he was no longer recieving fresh imports into heaven? In fact it would've lasted for centuries AD while canonisation took place.
Another rather untidy loose end in the Christian story I'd say.
More homework for Raspy.
(Sorry Hastings, I took the liberty to expand with my thoughts onto your concerns.) I've already answered that weeks ago...look it up.... Can you repost it please, I'm not sure that we've all seen it. Luke 16:19–31 shows that, prior to Christ's resurrection, Hades was divided into two realms: a place of comfort where Lazarus was (Abraham's bosom or Abraham's side) and a place of torment where the rich man was. Before the cross, the spirits of those who died in faith of a coming redeemer, went to a place that came to be known as Paradise. The Jews also called it Abraham’s Bosom. It was located in Sheol, which is Hebrew for “the abode of the dead. ” Its Greek name is Hades. Story of the Rich Man and Lazarus (Luke 16:19-31) above....They did not go directly to Heaven because Heaven was only opened to believers after the cross. When Jesus rose from the dead, these spirits were taken to Heaven (Ephesians 4:8). Sucks being a hard working rich person who died before Luke spilled his guts. Fortunatly there's no reason to believe that any of this is true. It is called faith, you obviously do not have, but I digress... You need to understand the context...... Lazarus’ condition is exactly opposite that of the rich man. He is sick—covered with sores. He is hungry—longing for the scraps from the rich man’s table. At banquets, people wipe grease from their hands onto a piece of bread and then throw the bread on the floor. To long for such soiled bread is the height of misery—of degradation. We are reminded of the prodigal son, who longed to eat the slop that he was feeding the pigs. I see the rich man as being selfish....can you remember being on the outside looking in—needing a bite to eat—or warm shelter—or a tank of gas—or a kind word—and nobody gave you anything? Many of us, like the rich man in this parable, have never had such an experience. However, millions, like Lazarus, daily suffer intense want. Doesn't sound very well thought out. A rich man goes to hell for being a bit of an as shole, Jesus comes along and then the worst murderer has the ability to go to heaven if he plays his cards right.
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk. That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied. Well?
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OP
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Idaho_Shooter: Copies of the New Testament can be found in more ancient manuscripts than any other work of ancient literature. There are an estimated 5,800 ancient Greek manuscripts alone of the New Testament, as well as thousands of others in languages like Aramaic and Latin. And some of these manuscripts were written in the first century on parchment, and they remain intact to this day. And many thousands of them predate the time periods that you mention above.
World renowned New Testament scholar Bart Ehrman is proficient in Greek and Aramaic and he has personally read thousands and thousands of historical New Testament texts…in the original languages…and he concludes that we can have a high degree of confidence that we can reconstruct the original text of the New Testament, the text that is in the Bibles that we use today, because of the abundance of textual evidence we have to compare. He says that any variations are largely minor and don’t obscure our ability to construct an accurate original text. And he’s not only an expert in biblical textual criticism, he’s also an atheist.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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The snippets you pointed out are OT...and NT...but you do not include the context....for example, the one you despise the most....
“Happy is the one who seizes your infants / and dashes them against the rocks.” To “imprecate” means to “pray evil against,” and the imprecatory prayers in the Bible strike people today as strange or wrong. It is important to understand the context of this verse and others like it. The background is the Jewish people calling upon God to exact revenge upon their military enemies. Context doesn't alter what is said. When the bible tells us that God is responsible for the existence of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended, When the bible tells us that God creates evil and the evildoer for the day of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended. When the bible tells us that God as the 'Potter' creates vessels 'fitted for destruction,' that is precisely what is meant and intended. Context does not alter what is written, meant and intended. Context does not transform what is written, meant and intended into something more palatable for the believer. . Yes, God created evil. ... A truly loving god. Messing about with his creations for the heck of it.
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk. That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied. Well?
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Campfire Greenhorn
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The snippets you pointed out are OT...and NT...but you do not include the context....for example, the one you despise the most....
“Happy is the one who seizes your infants / and dashes them against the rocks.” To “imprecate” means to “pray evil against,” and the imprecatory prayers in the Bible strike people today as strange or wrong. It is important to understand the context of this verse and others like it. The background is the Jewish people calling upon God to exact revenge upon their military enemies. Context doesn't alter what is said. When the bible tells us that God is responsible for the existence of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended, When the bible tells us that God creates evil and the evildoer for the day of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended. When the bible tells us that God as the 'Potter' creates vessels 'fitted for destruction,' that is precisely what is meant and intended. Context does not alter what is written, meant and intended. Context does not transform what is written, meant and intended into something more palatable for the believer. . Yes, God created evil. However, it is important to understand that God did not create evil directly, but indirectly. God created angels and men with the potential and capability of committing evil by sinning because it was an important part of God’s Plan for them that they would experience both good and evil. Two beings who represent the pinnacle of evil are Satan and Hitler. One is a fallen angel and the other is a fallen man. God created a holy angel called Lucifer who became Satan when he sinned by rebelling against God. Also, God created Adam and Eve who were holy people before they sinned by eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. As a result of their sin, Adam and Eve became sinners and all of their descendants are born with an unrighteous sinful fallen nature. God has complete foreknowledge of everything that happens in His creation. Therefore, the sins of fallen angels and the sins of fallen men do not take Him by surprise you are just a bit ignorant. no God did not created evil. thats something developed by a spirit /angel that went against God's arrangement. that one was not named Lucifer we in fact dont know what his name really is
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The snippets you pointed out are OT...and NT...but you do not include the context....for example, the one you despise the most....
“Happy is the one who seizes your infants / and dashes them against the rocks.” To “imprecate” means to “pray evil against,” and the imprecatory prayers in the Bible strike people today as strange or wrong. It is important to understand the context of this verse and others like it. The background is the Jewish people calling upon God to exact revenge upon their military enemies. Context doesn't alter what is said. When the bible tells us that God is responsible for the existence of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended, When the bible tells us that God creates evil and the evildoer for the day of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended. When the bible tells us that God as the 'Potter' creates vessels 'fitted for destruction,' that is precisely what is meant and intended. Context does not alter what is written, meant and intended. Context does not transform what is written, meant and intended into something more palatable for the believer. . Yes, God created evil. However, it is important to understand that God did not create evil directly, but indirectly. God created angels and men with the potential and capability of committing evil by sinning because it was an important part of God’s Plan for them that they would experience both good and evil. Two beings who represent the pinnacle of evil are Satan and Hitler. One is a fallen angel and the other is a fallen man. God created a holy angel called Lucifer who became Satan when he sinned by rebelling against God. Also, God created Adam and Eve who were holy people before they sinned by eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. As a result of their sin, Adam and Eve became sinners and all of their descendants are born with an unrighteous sinful fallen nature. God has complete foreknowledge of everything that happens in His creation. Therefore, the sins of fallen angels and the sins of fallen men do not take Him by surprise you are just a bit ignorant. no God did not created evil. thats something developed by a spirit /angel that went against God's arrangement. that one was not named Lucifer we in fact dont know what his name really is I see the confusion, my bad.....I should not have said "Yes, God Created Evil"...God did not create evil directly, but indirectly. God created angels and men with the potential and capability of committing evil by sinning because it was an important part of God’s Plan for them that they would experience both good and evil....God “created all things that they might exist, and the generative forces of the world are wholesome” (Wis. 1:14). God only “creates” evil in the way that a donut maker “creates” a hole—not by giving a non-existing thing existence, but by creating a substance whose absence is named. In the metaphysical sense, evil does not exist in itself, so it is not accurate to claim that God created it. But don't call me ignorant....call me sleepy.
Last edited by Raspy; 11/01/22. Reason: spelling
Illegitimi non carborundum
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The snippets you pointed out are OT...and NT...but you do not include the context....for example, the one you despise the most....
“Happy is the one who seizes your infants / and dashes them against the rocks.” To “imprecate” means to “pray evil against,” and the imprecatory prayers in the Bible strike people today as strange or wrong. It is important to understand the context of this verse and others like it. The background is the Jewish people calling upon God to exact revenge upon their military enemies. Context doesn't alter what is said. When the bible tells us that God is responsible for the existence of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended, When the bible tells us that God creates evil and the evildoer for the day of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended. When the bible tells us that God as the 'Potter' creates vessels 'fitted for destruction,' that is precisely what is meant and intended. Context does not alter what is written, meant and intended. Context does not transform what is written, meant and intended into something more palatable for the believer. . Yes, God created evil. However, it is important to understand that God did not create evil directly, but indirectly. God created angels and men with the potential and capability of committing evil by sinning because it was an important part of God’s Plan for them that they would experience both good and evil. Two beings who represent the pinnacle of evil are Satan and Hitler. One is a fallen angel and the other is a fallen man. God created a holy angel called Lucifer who became Satan when he sinned by rebelling against God. Also, God created Adam and Eve who were holy people before they sinned by eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. As a result of their sin, Adam and Eve became sinners and all of their descendants are born with an unrighteous sinful fallen nature. God has complete foreknowledge of everything that happens in His creation. Therefore, the sins of fallen angels and the sins of fallen men do not take Him by surprise you are just a bit ignorant. no God did not created evil. thats something developed by a spirit /angel that went against God's arrangement. that one was not named Lucifer we in fact dont know what his name really is I see the confusion, my bad.....I should not have said "Yes, God Created Evil"...God did not create evil directly, but indirectly. God created angels and men with the potential and capability of committing evil by sinning because it was an important part of God’s Plan for them that they would experience both good and evil....God “created all things that they might exist, and the generative forces of the world are wholesome” (Wis. 1:14). God only “creates” evil in the way that a donut maker “creates” a hole—not by giving a non-existing thing existence, but by creating a substance whose absence is named. In the metaphysical sense, evil does not exist in itself, so it is not accurate to claim that God created it. But don't call me ignorant....call me sleepy. Oopsy... Isaiah 45:7 ....I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things. Doughnut makers make them with or without holes BTW.
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk. That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied. Well?
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The snippets you pointed out are OT...and NT...but you do not include the context....for example, the one you despise the most....
“Happy is the one who seizes your infants / and dashes them against the rocks.” To “imprecate” means to “pray evil against,” and the imprecatory prayers in the Bible strike people today as strange or wrong. It is important to understand the context of this verse and others like it. The background is the Jewish people calling upon God to exact revenge upon their military enemies. Context doesn't alter what is said. When the bible tells us that God is responsible for the existence of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended, When the bible tells us that God creates evil and the evildoer for the day of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended. When the bible tells us that God as the 'Potter' creates vessels 'fitted for destruction,' that is precisely what is meant and intended. Context does not alter what is written, meant and intended. Context does not transform what is written, meant and intended into something more palatable for the believer. . Yes, God created evil. However, it is important to understand that God did not create evil directly, but indirectly. God created angels and men with the potential and capability of committing evil by sinning because it was an important part of God’s Plan for them that they would experience both good and evil. Two beings who represent the pinnacle of evil are Satan and Hitler. One is a fallen angel and the other is a fallen man. God created a holy angel called Lucifer who became Satan when he sinned by rebelling against God. Also, God created Adam and Eve who were holy people before they sinned by eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. As a result of their sin, Adam and Eve became sinners and all of their descendants are born with an unrighteous sinful fallen nature. God has complete foreknowledge of everything that happens in His creation. Therefore, the sins of fallen angels and the sins of fallen men do not take Him by surprise you are just a bit ignorant. no God did not created evil. thats something developed by a spirit /angel that went against God's arrangement. that one was not named Lucifer we in fact dont know what his name really is The bible itself states that God creates evil. It states that God creates the evildoer for the day of evil, that God creates the dumb, the blind, the deaf, etc....that God is responsible for all these things, good and evil: "And the LORD said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? Or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? Have not I the Lord?" Exodus 4:11 "Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good? " (Lamentations 3:38) "The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.'' Proverbs 16:4 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?" (Amos 3:6, KJV) ''Whatever the Lord pleases, He does, In heaven and in earth, in the seas and in all deeps.'' (Psalm 135:6) "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." (Isaiah 45:7, KJV) This is your bible telling you this, not me.
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The snippets you pointed out are OT...and NT...but you do not include the context....for example, the one you despise the most....
“Happy is the one who seizes your infants / and dashes them against the rocks.” To “imprecate” means to “pray evil against,” and the imprecatory prayers in the Bible strike people today as strange or wrong. It is important to understand the context of this verse and others like it. The background is the Jewish people calling upon God to exact revenge upon their military enemies. Context doesn't alter what is said. When the bible tells us that God is responsible for the existence of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended, When the bible tells us that God creates evil and the evildoer for the day of evil, that is precisely what is meant and intended. When the bible tells us that God as the 'Potter' creates vessels 'fitted for destruction,' that is precisely what is meant and intended. Context does not alter what is written, meant and intended. Context does not transform what is written, meant and intended into something more palatable for the believer. . Yes, God created evil. However, it is important to understand that God did not create evil directly, but indirectly. God created angels and men with the potential and capability of committing evil by sinning because it was an important part of God’s Plan for them that they would experience both good and evil. Two beings who represent the pinnacle of evil are Satan and Hitler. One is a fallen angel and the other is a fallen man. God created a holy angel called Lucifer who became Satan when he sinned by rebelling against God. Also, God created Adam and Eve who were holy people before they sinned by eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. As a result of their sin, Adam and Eve became sinners and all of their descendants are born with an unrighteous sinful fallen nature. God has complete foreknowledge of everything that happens in His creation. Therefore, the sins of fallen angels and the sins of fallen men do not take Him by surprise you are just a bit ignorant. no God did not created evil. thats something developed by a spirit /angel that went against God's arrangement. that one was not named Lucifer we in fact dont know what his name really is The bible itself states that God creates evil. It states that God creates the evildoer for the day of evil, that God creates the dumb, the blind, the deaf, etc....that God is responsible for all these things, good and evil: "And the LORD said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? Or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? Have not I the Lord?" Exodus 4:11 "Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good? " (Lamentations 3:38) "The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.'' Proverbs 16:4 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?" (Amos 3:6, KJV) ''Whatever the Lord pleases, He does, In heaven and in earth, in the seas and in all deeps.'' (Psalm 135:6) "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." (Isaiah 45:7, KJV) This is your bible telling you this, not me. As usual, you don’t understand…..,probably because you don’t want to. Be that as it may… God does bring judgment for sin and disobedience. If one were to look at these verses in context this is clear. However, you cannot..blinded? For example, I have previously explained the “Happy is the one who…..” set of verses. As I recall the verses describe the enemies of the Jews after a Jewish defeat.
Last edited by TF49; 11/02/22.
The tax collector said: “Lord Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.” Jesus said he went home “justified.”
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Whoever or whomever is running these accounts has never studied the Bible beyond light reading. They have no appearance of having studied Christianity or the Bible outside books and articles that attempt to destroy Christianity.
One of the accounts began to cut and paste long quotes which, when searched, are taken directly from anti Christian anti Bible writers.
Everything points back to the account owners personally having a bug up their ass concerning Christianity. My bet is that the bug that is rectally impacted is not the Christianity did x,y and x arguments offered but something much more personal and damaging.
There is too much anger and vitriol.
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I hope y’all will forgive me for jumping in and out of this thread. I have been AFK for a few days and am again catching up a bit. So just pick one and go for it. Why Christianity though? What don't you like about all the others? You have had this answered several times. You either lack the intelligence to remember what was posted several pages back, or you are being deliberately obtuse by not directly refuting it. Please, no one give him any hints. Let's see if he can, or will, figure it out and address it. Your purpose is not to inform, because, according to you, there is nothing to be informed about. No, your purpose is to agitate, aggravate, and disrupt. No, it was ever answered. Just faith in one with justification from a flawed Pascals wager. I never got a rational answer to why that particular god. Theists have difficulty answering simple questions about their faith but they bank their eternal afterlife on it - you'd think there would be a compelling argument, to convince themselves at least if not others. Yes, it has been answered. You can’t be bothered to look back through the thread for the answer and you can’t be bothered to learn enough about the faith that you are so eager to denounce to know the answer; or, you are deliberately being obtuse (again/still). That’s because you are not interested in answers. You are interested in agitation, aggravation, and disruption. The answer is, of course, the resurrection. This is how and why I choose to be a Christian. Since I was not born into the Jewish faith, if not for the resurrection of Christ I would be a free agent, spiritually speaking. Who knows what faith, if any, I might have chosen? I might have joined you in your atheistic faith. It is easy to win arguments when you simply dismiss evidence that doesn’t fit your narrative, the way you dismiss the eyewitness accounts of Jesus’ resurrection. Those eyewitnesses suffered for their testimony. They were persecuted, and often tortured and killed; and you want us to think that this was just to perpetrate a hoax, a practical joke? What about Jesus’ body? What became of it? You can bet that if it were still around, the Romans and the Pharisees would have gone full-blown Mogadishu with it. They certainly enjoyed mocking Him while He was on the cross, they would have had a field day dispelling the claims that He had returned to life after being killed by them. But they didn’t because He was not there to be found. You seem not to be able to get past the fact that God did all He has done without you being present from the Creation to the Resurrection; or that some of the things God has done don’t meet with your approval. Boo hoo. All of your criticisms of Christianity mean nothing if you can’t disprove the resurrection. Yes, there have been a lot of bad things done under the guise of Christianity and The Church, and still are. Humans are sinful creatures, all of us. If it were not so, we would have no need of a savior. Whether the atheists on this thread realize it or not, they have benefitted greatly by living in a world that has been so heavily influenced by Christianity. The world the atheists would have would be a world without morals; after all, we humans are just another form of animal, right? So, why would we not behave as animals; that is, as either predator or prey? And most importantly, it would be a world largely devoid of love where people saw each other as only useful or not useful towards fulfilling their own selfish desires. I expect that much of human progress would not exist, since the United States, which has been the economic engine of the world for a while now, was founded by men who were for the most part believers. You and untold numbers of others have derived great benefit from the social, economic, and judicial norms that a Christianized world has established. We Americans say we are “endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights...” Well, no Creator, no rights. You only are left with the “privileges” that the tyrants you are enslaved by decide you can have. But take heart, atheists: the world now seems to be seeing things more and more the way you would have it to, according to the link in the OP. How’s that working out? Are things getting more and more tranquil and stable, as an accidental, evolving planet ought to? Or are people acting more and more like the mere animals you claim we are? In the vacuum of a world without God, every man does what is right in his own sight; the strong and aggressive live, and the weak and the passive are killed. I say again that Christianity is not the problem, it is the solution. The world did not get into the fix it is in by being too Christian. Still doesn't answer the question though, people lived and died before the alledged resurrection. You need to provide evidence of your claims otherwise there is no reason to believe them We're doing fine, a more secular society does great. Even the USA has a secular government and is constituted to be that way. We advanced despite the prevalence of religious control. Anything that didn't fit the religious narrative was subject to dire consequences for heresy. Glad we had those bold brave souls that advanced society at personal risk and gave us the medical, agricultural, scientific and technological benefits that we have today. With god out of the equation the truth was able to be discovered. I'm sure the internet intellectuals will have some clever (to them) responses to what's been posted since they last checked; all in the spirit of honest inquiry, doncha know. As WMR said, minds are not likely to be changed; but we can hope that seeds have been planted. If not, well...
The biggest problem our country has is not systemic racism, it's systemic stupidity.
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There is too much anger and vitriol. I am not so angry or vitriolic as suspicious. Suspicious that very early on the Jewish hierarchy in collusion with Roman government infiltrated the nascent Jewish Christianity and once they got headquarters to Rome it left Jesus behind except for his name. Various councils and codifications solidified the partnership of church and state after which the combined state and religion ruled with an iron fist. True enough that the catholic church somewhat broke up but Martin Luther and the Anglican variations were pretty well true to their mother. Most nominally Christian churches today are lineal descendants of the Catholic church. But there has always been a remnant.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Jesus: "Take heed that no man deceive you."
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What do you think? You seem open minded.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Jesus: "Take heed that no man deceive you."
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I don’t know what you mean. I try to ask you direct question because your views are drastically different from mine and you define things very differently.
However, my direct questions, an attempt to understand what you believe, are met with what appear to be deflections like the answer you just gave.
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Christianity didn’t become the state religion of Rome until the fourth century. But James, the brother of Jesus, and the Apostle Peter both clearly detached Christianity from the old covenant in 50 AD at the First Jerusalem Council.
The very reason for that council was because the Judaizers were still insisting that Christians must follow the old covenant. So the leaders of the church at that time, James and Peter, clearly put that issue to rest.
It was made crystal clear by James and Peter…both in agreement with the Apostle Paul...that salvation comes for both Jews and Gentiles through the grace of Jesus, and not through the old covenant.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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Joined: Dec 2005
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Christianity didn’t become the state religion of Rome until the fourth century. But James, the brother of Jesus, and the Apostle Peter both clearly detached Christianity from the old covenant in 50 AD at the First Jerusalem Council.
The very reason for that council was because the Judaizers were still insisting that Christians must follow the old covenant. So the leaders of the church at that time, James and Peter, clearly put that issue to rest.
It was made crystal clear by James and Peter…both in agreement with the Apostle Paul...that salvation comes for both Jews and Gentiles through the grace of Jesus, and not through the old covenant. And, you would need to accept Pauls' writings though, you could make the case that there are no more Jews and/or Gentiles, for he says both groups have been made into ONE....................
Last edited by Muffin; 11/02/22.
"...A man's rights rest in three boxes: the ballot box, the jury box and the cartridge box..." Frederick Douglass, 1867
( . Y . )
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Joined: Jan 2015
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Campfire Regular
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The most recent posts above are what honest inquiry looks like. Good discussion.
The biggest problem our country has is not systemic racism, it's systemic stupidity.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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The most recent posts above are what honest inquiry looks like. Good discussion. You have added greatly to this discussion yourself There-Ya-Go and your excellent contributions are appreciated. Despite the disruption from the 2 immature children that are seemingly compelled to interrupt and denigrate I appreciate the contributions of everyone else. Ignoring the ignorant children in order to get to the “marrow” of the matter is worth it when it results in the responses like you’ve contributed here. Antlers knows how much I appreciate his contributions here and how very much I respect him and his opinions and you Sir (TYG) have added much to this discussion as well….thank you! Thanks to all (except the 2 disruptive cucks) for your contributions here. I believe many many people derive benefits from these discussions but most of them we’d never even know were lurking.
�Politicians are the lowest form of life on earth. Liberal Democrats are the lowest form of politician.� �General George S. Patton, Jr.
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~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 25,953 Likes: 7 |
Idaho_Shooter: Copies of the New Testament can be found in more ancient manuscripts than any other work of ancient literature. There are an estimated 5,800 ancient Greek manuscripts alone of the New Testament, as well as thousands of others in languages like Aramaic and Latin. And some of these manuscripts were written in the first century on parchment, and they remain intact to this day. And many thousands of them predate the time periods that you mention above.
World renowned New Testament scholar Bart Ehrman is proficient in Greek and Aramaic and he has personally read thousands and thousands of historical New Testament texts…in the original languages…and he concludes that we can have a high degree of confidence that we can reconstruct the original text of the New Testament, the text that is in the Bibles that we use today, because of the abundance of textual evidence we have to compare. He says that any variations are largely minor and don’t obscure our ability to construct an accurate original text. And he’s not only an expert in biblical textual criticism, he’s also an atheist. I have no doubt of the accuracy of the history recorded in all of the texts you mention. I will be the first to admit the early Christian Church had the most successful PR campaign known to Man. My comment is more directed at the dearth of remaining history for other important figures. While it had nothing to do with papists, imagine what was lost with the burning of the Library of Alexandria. We have many instances recorded of priests burning texts and records in attempts to obliterate a culture deemed to be heathen.
People who choose to brew up their own storms bitch loudest about the rain.
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