|
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286 |
The upside to a well-designed FFP reticle is that there is no downside. Specific examples please Discussing the merits of the FFP design can be made into a rather long conversation. A list of scope models is an even longer conversation. Of what specifically are you asking for examples? A list of ffp scopes with well designed reticle
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5 |
The upside to a well-designed FFP reticle is that there is no downside. Specific examples please Discussing the merits of the FFP design can be made into a rather long conversation. A list of scope models is an even longer conversation. Of what specifically are you asking for examples? A list of ffp scopes with well designed reticle What is your definition of "Well designed"
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5 |
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286 |
I do not know. Was asking Jordan as he said there was no downside to a well designed ffp. I am asking for specific examples. All the ffp scopes I have seen are full of dots and dashes making them distracting and seem overly complicated to me.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,906 Likes: 69
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,906 Likes: 69 |
I do not know. Was asking Jordan as he said there was no downside to a well designed ffp. I am asking for specific examples. All the ffp scopes I have seen are full of dots and dashes making them distracting and seem overly complicated to me. ๐๐๐
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,286 |
and on lower magnification reticle look awful small !
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,906 Likes: 69
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,906 Likes: 69 |
I see. Just remember when you hold for anything to make sure youโre on the highest power!
Iโve screwed that up a time or two with my second focal plane scopes
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5 |
I do not know. Was asking Jordan as he said there was no downside to a well designed ffp. I am asking for specific examples. All the ffp scopes I have seen are full of dots and dashes making them distracting and seem overly complicated to me. A mil reticle or MOA will have the same marks in both FFP or SFP FFP plane reticle are the same size in relation to the target at all powers. SEP reticle are not
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5 |
I see. Just remember when you hold for anything to make sure youโre on the highest power!
Iโve screwed that up a time or two with my second focal plane scopes Exactly.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,546 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,546 Likes: 6 |
All it takes is a clay bird thrower and a video camera. Let's see the video. Iโve made lots of running shots on game that were more difficult than shooting a floating clay at 25 yards. One of the reasons Iโve essentially stopped posting photos and videos on this site is that they are used and demanded by the loudmouths to somehow prove legitimacy or validity of oneโs comments, although we saw with roundoak that even pics arenโt enough to prove much. I donโt own an automatic clay thrower at the moment, but even if I did, and while it does look like a good time, I certainly wouldnโt post video of it here just to satisfy your insecurity.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,546 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,546 Likes: 6 |
The upside to a well-designed FFP reticle is that there is no downside. Specific examples please Discussing the merits of the FFP design can be made into a rather long conversation. A list of scope models is an even longer conversation. Of what specifically are you asking for examples? A list of ffp scopes with well designed reticle I do not know. Was asking Jordan as he said there was no downside to a well designed ffp. I am asking for specific examples. All the ffp scopes I have seen are full of dots and dashes making them distracting and seem overly complicated to me. I listed a few examples above. Three of them offer the capability of using markings as an angular ruler, and for those that donโt need or want that functionality, the fourth is a simple S&B A7.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,777 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,777 Likes: 6 |
....... A list of ffp scopes with well designed reticle Short list of a few I use: SWFA Milquad - 3-9x42 - won't count the 6x and 10x since they're fixed S&B P3L - 3-12x42 Klassic - won't count the P3 since it's a fixed 6x42 S&B A8 - 1.5-6x42 Klassic Nightforce FC-Mil and FC-MOA - NX8 1-8x24 Tangent Theta LRH MRAD - LRH 3-15x50 Bushnell LRHS - LRHS 3-12x44 All of these are well designed FFP reticles that I use on rifles that get used for hunting. I may wish to tweak things about any of them for my preference but they are well designed FFP reticles.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,906 Likes: 69
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,906 Likes: 69 |
Well-designed reticle?
Some are simple and some are complex. What qualifies as โwell-designedโ will be different for everyone depending on their needs and level of skill.
Whatโs funny is that some here will point to a reticle and say itโs โwell-designedโ and have absolutely zero clue as to the accuracy of the subtensions They just take the manufacturerโs word that a MIL is a MIL or an MOA is an MOA whether it be first or second plane and they have no way to confirm it.
For a second focal plane reticle, are the subtensions accurate on max power or something close? At what power are the subtensions double their value?
There are scopes with reticles that the subtensions are completely meaningless. Itโs like producing a tape measure where all of the marks are meaningless; the 1/8โ lines arenโt 1/8โs, the 1โ lines arenโt actually 1โ and so on.
If you donโt realize how important that is when holding over for drop or off for wind while trying to put an impact on a small target at range, think about it.
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,970 Likes: 5 |
Well-designed reticle?
Some are simple and some are complex. What qualifies as โwell-designedโ will be different for everyone depending on their needs and level of skill.
Whatโs funny is that some here will point to a reticle and say itโs โwell-designedโ and have absolutely zero clue as to the accuracy of the subtensions They just take the manufacturerโs word that a MIL is a MIL or an MOA is an MOA whether it be first or second plane and they have no way to confirm it.
For a second focal plane reticle, are the subtensions accurate on max power or something close? At what power are the subtensions double their value?
There are scopes with reticles that the subtensions are completely meaningless. Itโs like producing a tape measure where all of the marks are meaningless; the 1/8โ lines arenโt 1/8โs, the 1โ lines arenโt actually 1โ and so on.
If you donโt realize how important that is when holding over for drop or off for wind while trying to put an impact on a small target at range, think about it. Agree ๐ฏ%
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,546 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,546 Likes: 6 |
Well-designed reticle?
Some are simple and some are complex. What qualifies as โwell-designedโ will be different for everyone depending on their needs and level of skill. Very true, as I mentioned above. To me, โwell-designedโ means that functionality for a given intended application isnโt sacrificed because of design oversights. That looks different for scopes with different intended applications. Whatโs funny is that some here will point to a reticle and say itโs โwell-designedโ and have absolutely zero clue as to the accuracy of the subtensions They just take the manufacturerโs word that a MIL is a MIL or an MOA is an MOA whether it be first or second plane and they have no way to confirm it.
For a second focal plane reticle, are the subtensions accurate on max power or something close? At what power are the subtensions double their value?
There are scopes with reticles that the subtensions are completely meaningless. Itโs like producing a tape measure where all of the marks are meaningless; the 1/8โ lines arenโt 1/8โs, the 1โ lines arenโt actually 1โ and so on.
If you donโt realize how important that is when holding over for drop or off for wind while trying to put an impact on a small target at range, think about it. Good point. Though itโs not difficult to confirm reticle subtensions with a few common items and a working knowledge of trigonometry.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,607 Likes: 10
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,607 Likes: 10 |
Well-designed reticle?
Some are simple and some are complex. What qualifies as โwell-designedโ will be different for everyone depending on their needs and level of skill.
Whatโs funny is that some here will point to a reticle and say itโs โwell-designedโ and have absolutely zero clue as to the accuracy of the subtensions They just take the manufacturerโs word that a MIL is a MIL or an MOA is an MOA whether it be first or second plane and they have no way to confirm it.
For a second focal plane reticle, are the subtensions accurate on max power or something close? At what power are the subtensions double their value?
There are scopes with reticles that the subtensions are completely meaningless. Itโs like producing a tape measure where all of the marks are meaningless; the 1/8โ lines arenโt 1/8โs, the 1โ lines arenโt actually 1โ and so on.
If you donโt realize how important that is when holding over for drop or off for wind while trying to put an impact on a small target at range, think about it. That sums up Reupold succinctly. Hint..................
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,936
Campfire Tracker
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,936 |
Hi all, I recently was the high bid for an auction at an RMEF banquet for a Quigley-Ford scope. They are asking if I want to upgrade from 2nd to 1st focal for $200. Basically go from a 4-16x 50 1โ to a 5-20x 50 30mm. It is going on my 700 BDL 7SAUM with a 24โ barrel. I doubt I will ever take a 500 yard shot while hunting. Is it worth the upgrade for me? I have never had a scope like this so thought I should get some opinions. My usual scopes are VX-3โs and such. Never had an opportunity to purchase a $2000 scope for a reasonable price before.
Thanks for any help you can be. Have a great day!! I would not spend the money on the upgrade for what you are going to use it for. I prefer SFP, but I am a normal range hunter. If I stretch it out, a rangefinder and a good dialing scope suffices. Just can't get used to the small, fine reticle on low power, and the clutter, thickness on high power of FFP. Just me, and my personal preference.
Arcus Venator
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16 |
All it takes is a clay bird thrower and a video camera. Let's see the video. Iโve made lots of running shots on game that were more difficult than shooting a floating clay at 25 yards. One of the reasons Iโve essentially stopped posting photos and videos on this site is that they are used and demanded by the loudmouths to somehow prove legitimacy or validity of oneโs comments, although we saw with roundoak that even pics arenโt enough to prove much. I donโt own an automatic clay thrower at the moment, but even if I did, and while it does look like a good time, I certainly wouldnโt post video of it here just to satisfy your insecurity. How would you know the difficulty of the clay show when you admit you it is a shot you have never done? Your failing to post pictures is telling as 'Pictures or it never happened" is a pretty common theme here on 24hrCF. The reason so many laugh at LiL Fish is his failling to produce field pictures. If you want to be taken more seriously in these discussion by those that know it might behove you to post some actual field pictures and/or video and less appeals to authority with "Ma PHD". Until then you are just another poster talking about things you have never done.
Last edited by JohnBurns; 12/05/22.
John Burns
I have all the sources. They can't stop the signal.
|
|
|
|
134 members (300_savage, 2500HD, 24HourCampFireGuy50, 673, 338reddog, 204guy, 17 invisible),
1,673
guests, and
880
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,193,449
Posts18,507,912
Members74,002
|
Most Online11,491 Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|