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Teal Offline OP
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First - yes, I know "shoot them all and see what your gun likes" - that's not the answer to my question. It's not about what my gun likes.

Question - what's the actual difference between the different offerings from premium 22LR ammo companies?

Eley Tenex, Match, Team, Club for example
Lapua Center-X, Midas+, Pistol King for example

The top 2 (from what I can tell) seem to have a lot of variations available to shooters but I can't tell what that variation actually is - one to another.

Are there actual structural differences in the rounds (powder/bullet) or is it simply a cascading level of acceptable deviation in headspace/priming compound(case weight) across the offerings?


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Hi Teal

I can't find it now, but years ago Eley (I'm pretty sure it was) had an explanation on their website, more (perhaps way more!) than a decade ago (I think!).

With the way many factories have been increasingly automated with lots of robots, this info may no longer apply.

I can't remember all of the difference between the many kinds of ammo they offer, but I think I remember one because it surprised me a bit.

Apparently spreading the primer compound (subsequently spun into the rims?) is a major contributor to accuracy, and Eley monitors the workers who do this.

The most consistent employees are assigned to the highest quality ammo lines --> most uniform ammo.

/John

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Teal Offline OP
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Originally Posted by jpb
Hi Teal

I can't find it now, but years ago Eley (I'm pretty sure it was) had an explanation on their website, more (perhaps way more!) than a decade ago (I think!).

With the way many factories have been increasingly automated with lots of robots, this info may no longer apply.

I can't remember all of the difference between the many kinds of ammo they offer, but I think I remember one because it surprised me a bit.

Apparently spreading the primer compound (subsequently spun into the rims?) is a major contributor to accuracy, and Eley monitors the workers who do this.

The most consistent employees are assigned to the highest quality ammo lines --> most uniform ammo.

/John

That's interesting - I can see that. Wonder how they empirically measure those differences, just from a curiosity perspective. Especially at volume they must put out. I'll go bang around Eley's site to see if I can find what you mention. Thank you.


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hi again Teal

I hope I'm not sending you on a wild goose chase!

I am certain that it was an ammo manufacturer that offered MANY lines of ammo, but I'm only moderately sure that it was Eley.

I'm getting old and forgetful, ya' know! :-)

/John
PS: I just visited Eley's website LINK to ELEY UK (the UK site, there may be others) , and they have been making ammo since 1828! LINK to ELEY History
With that long history, maybe they have a historian or archivist employed who could answer this question...

Last edited by jpb; 01/19/23. Reason: fingers faster than brain without enough caffeine
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I could be completely wrong about this, but I recall hearing that among the grades of match ammo of a particular manufacturer, e.g. Eley, it is all basically the same, but it is graded into different labels/types based on statistical testing of production lots. Less variation = higher grades, etc.


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Teal Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Paul39
I could be completely wrong about this, but I recall hearing that among the grades of match ammo of a particular manufacturer, e.g. Eley, it is all basically the same, but it is graded into different labels/types based on statistical testing of production lots. Less variation = higher grades, etc.

Given the volume produced - I think it would almost have to be this.

You make a pile and sort vs making specific runs.


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Originally Posted by Paul39
I could be completely wrong about this, but I recall hearing that among the grades of match ammo of a particular manufacturer, e.g. Eley, it is all basically the same, but it is graded into different labels/types based on statistical testing of production lots. Less variation = higher grades, etc.

That would be lapua. From my understanding…

Lapua takes a particular lot of ammo and shoots the lot through a bunch of different rifles of different makes, let’s say 10. In order for the ammo to be called x act, it needs to meet their accuracy standard in every rifle. In order for it to go into a midas + box it needs to meet their accuracy standards in 7/10 rifles. Center X needs to meet their standard in 5/10… and so on.

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The Tenex bullet is different than the rest of their line. It was carefully engineered/profiled to precisely fit what we now have come to call match chambers, which differ from standard chambers having sloppier tolerances meant to accommodate any and all cartridges made anywhere in the world. The bullet also has a special nose profile to help with stability in flight, or so they say.

Premo ammo is certainly no guarantee for best accuracy out of any random rifle. What it does offer though is a much much better chance at best accuracy.

You gotta bear in mind that the fella who seeks vindication on the paper target against fellow competitors is willing to spend a lot more money to squeeze those few extra thousandths of an inch smaller group sizes or a couple extra points on a score target because that often means the difference between 1st place and also-ran. Whether that's also justified in the squirrel woods is open to debate.


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Originally Posted by jpb
hi again Teal

I hope I'm not sending you on a wild goose chase!

I am certain that it was an ammo manufacturer that offered MANY lines of ammo, but I'm only moderately sure that it was Eley.

I'm getting old and forgetful, ya' know! :-)

/John
PS: I just visited Eley's website LINK to ELEY UK (the UK site, there may be others) , and they have been making ammo since 1828! LINK to ELEY History
With that long history, maybe they have a historian or archivist employed who could answer this question...

Didn't Remington buy out Eley? Could definitely be a "wild goose chase".. Good info from all of you guys. I have not shot any of my 22lr Rifles in over a year. I need to get out and make some holes with them. Hopefully ragged ones... I still need to test some Wolf match and old Federal gold medal match ammo..


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I'm still pissed at Federal for discontinuing their old Gold Medal match ammo many years ago now, especially the the Olympic GMM stuff. It always shot right along with Tenex and R-50 (I don't think really high grade Lapua stuff was around back then, I don't remember). I have a few bricks of that old Federal stuff on the shelf, saved for "special occasions", and even though the old lube on them is getting a bit funky it still shoots as well as it ever did.


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Teal Offline OP
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I'm sitting on 100 bucks worth of Eley - 3 boxes match, 3 boxes tenex to test out the Bergara.

Couldn't find Lapua anywhere - except Pistol stuff but I'm going to see if this Eley is all that and a bag of chips.


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Originally Posted by robertham1
Originally Posted by Paul39
I could be completely wrong about this, but I recall hearing that among the grades of match ammo of a particular manufacturer, e.g. Eley, it is all basically the same, but it is graded into different labels/types based on statistical testing of production lots. Less variation = higher grades, etc.

That would be lapua. From my understanding…

Lapua takes a particular lot of ammo and shoots the lot through a bunch of different rifles of different makes, let’s say 10. In order for the ammo to be called x act, it needs to meet their accuracy standard in every rifle. In order for it to go into a midas + box it needs to meet their accuracy standards in 7/10 rifles. Center X needs to meet their standard in 5/10… and so on.

I wonder - how many rounds are produced in each "lot".


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Not to hijack the thread, but on a (sort of) related note: recently I had my 617 S&W (10 shot) at the range while doing some other stuff. I had 3 types of CCI .22 LR with me. I first shot a rested group of 10 at 25 yards from the box of "Standard Velocity .22 LR Lead Round Nose Target 40 grain 1070 fps" on the front of the box and on the side indicated "same Velocity as Green Tag" and "Consistent Performance." They shot into about an inch and a half with me not taking a great deal of care. Next up, I shot 10 rounds of Mini-Mag 36 grain HP's with about the same amount of care and the group was about 3 inches. Finally, I shot a 10 shot group of Stingers (32 grain HP promising 1640 fps, no doubt from a rifle) and the Stingers shot as well as the Standard Velocity stuff.


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Killough Shooting Sports (a major supplier, if not the major supplier, of Tenex) offers a service whereby they'll sell you ammo from specific lot numbers, and update the lots and quantities thereof on their website. (Small wonder, as I think Eley took them over and use them as their springboard into the American market.) Coincidentally they offer the best prices for Tenex bar none. In the past I've grabbed a couple boxes from a lot which they had a ton of, tested it quick and when it performed to my expectations real quick-like-a-bunny I went back and ordered quantities of that same lot. I'll continue to do so.

Yeah, I'm a Tenex guy. Other brands turn in great performance in my target rifles too, but I've had the most consistent luck with Tenex so that's my go-to. (The guys I shoot against in ASSRA competition are a tough bunch, and unless I can squeeze out 1/2" groups at 100 yards on both group and score targets, off the bench, I'm a runner-up. Tenex and a BSA Martini International with 20x scope, and a bunch of wind flags helps me do it.)

Of course, at $19/50 (pretty much KSS's current rate) I sure as hell don't fritter it away on casual shooting.

Last edited by gnoahhh; 01/19/23.

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Teal Offline OP
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Yeah - I paid 18.40/50 from Creedmoor Sports for Tenex.

I'll look at Killough tho - I got these as the first rounds down the barrel - just to see and if they're good, then I'll get after laying in a quantity.


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Originally Posted by Teal
Yeah - I paid 18.40/50 from Creedmoor Sports for Tenex.

I'll look at Killough tho - I got these as the first rounds down the barrel - just to see and if they're good, then I'll get after laying in a quantity.

Anecdotally, I was in a LGS last weekend and wandered through their rimfire ammo aisle. Holy crap! Their shelves were sagging from all the .22 ammo. Everything from the cheapest el-cheapo to the most expensive premo stuff. But prices were astonishing too - and maybe that's why it was all still on the shelves. Example: Tenex at $32.50/50. Nope, ain't happening.


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Originally Posted by gnoahhh
I'm still pissed at Federal for discontinuing their old Gold Medal match ammo many years ago now, especially the the Olympic GMM stuff. It always shot right along with Tenex and R-50 (I don't think really high grade Lapua stuff was around back then, I don't remember). I have a few bricks of that old Federal stuff on the shelf, saved for "special occasions", and even though the old lube on them is getting a bit funky it still shoots as well as it ever did.

Yeah, I paid $50 for the brick last summer. I really hate to open the box. It looks like good stuff though.. Made in '92, if I remember right..


Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
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The owner of Accurate Reloading did an extensive test and review of virtually every brand of 22 ammo, in both rifles and handguns , and you can find it there.

However the takeaway I noticed was that while the most expensive ammo may be the most consistent, it may not shoot any better than cheap ammo in your rifle


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I had about a brick of the old Federal Gold Medal Match also and didn't realize what a treasure I had.. I guess I assumed I could just go down and buy some more when it was gone so I shot it up at targets, squirrels, etc... until it was gone and it was very, very good ammo. This is about the time I started to get into decent target rifles and my 52s really liked the stuff a lot. It wasn't until it was almost gone that I realized it wasn't available any more... I was really disappointed as I haven't found anything that shot as well in a couple rifles since then...


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Ain't the fickle world of .22's great?!


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