Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Christianity…

Isn’t it documented that Christians met in the synagogues and in homes before persecution drove the church underground?

I believe Christianity is a sect of Judaism. The first Christians were Jewish and a few Gentile followers of Jesus who was the observant Jew/prophet/messenger from God.

Aren’t you the same moron who praised the fake covid closures of schools and churches and thought Australian gun control was good?

Typical facist

as she lay grasping for breath, a priest came in and asked her if she wanted the Last Rights, and she shook her head yes...after the priest finished, I saw tears from the corner of her eyes and a smile on her face...to this day, I am absolutely sure she was saved and is in Heaven.

Scripture does not back up your views

Yes, one of my favorites...(Matthew 22:1-14).....There is a general call that goes out to all people. Some who hear the call and respond, want to attend the feast on their terms and not on the King’s terms. In comparison, those who are called with the effectual calling come to the feast on the King’s terms. They are provided with the garment for the feast, the garment of righteousness.

If someone gave up on Christianity because of something in the Bible or something about the Bible, they gave up on Christianity unnecessarily. Even if someone is leaning towards the door and is about to leave Christianity because of something in the Bible or something about the Bible, they don’t have to leave. And if someone is choosing not to embrace Christianity because of something in the Bible or something about the Bible, they can go ahead and embrace it.

And here’s why that is: Unbelievers in the first century were never asked to become Christians through blind faith in an authoritative Christian Bible that didn’t even exist yet, but on the reality of God and the historical fact of the Resurrection. The New Testament writers did not create the Resurrection; the Resurrection created the New Testament writers. So Christianity would still be true even if every Christian Bible in the world were non-existent.

The foundation of Christianity is not a collection of 66 ancient writings we call the Christian Bible. The foundation of Christianity is the reality of God and the historicity of Jesus, His life and teachings, and His resurrection. The Christian Bible wouldn’t even exist unless the Resurrection occurred.

It’s a false assumption to think that the Bible is the foundation of Christianity. And those skeptics with an agenda exploit this false assumption to preach their Gospel of disbelief to undermine the credibility of Christianity.

How has the church…and most Christians…responded to the exploitation of this false assumption…? They haven’t done anything…! They carry on with their preaching and their teaching just as they’ve always preached and just as they’ve always taught. They keep preaching and teaching the same way old way...“Here’s the Bible, it’s all true, believe it. Period”. The culture that we live in is an increasingly post-Christian culture, and when people have real academic questions about the faith, they’re often given Sunday School answers ~ so no wonder the church is hemorrhaging members and Christianity is on the decline in America.

So these skeptics with an agenda try to dismantle the Bible…and consequently, in their mind…they’re dismantling Christianity. I think that only vehemently defending the Bible is the wrong approach to this; the Bible can be defended, but the better approach is to address the false assumption…that the Bible is the foundation of Christianity…that’s driving all of this in the first place. I can change my approach without having to change what I believe. And I don’t have to change my view of and respect for the Christian Bible either. In fact it’s the opposite; I’m more convinced now than ever. I simply adjusted my approach, my apologetic. I’m not gonna lend any fuel to this false assumption that the Bible is the foundation of Christianity.

So what was the foundation of Peter’s faith…? Where did Peter get his hope…? Where did Peter get his boldness…? Where did he get his confidence…? How is it he’s out walking around in the open…proclaiming Jesus to the very people who had Him killed…whereas before he was afraid and ran for his life…? It sure as heck wasn’t because of something he read in the old testament ~ the one that he’d been reading and studying his entire life…!

The foundation of the faith of Jesus original followers in the first century wasn’t something they read or had read to them. The foundation of their faith was what they’d seen. So for Christians nowadays, what should be the foundation of their faith…? What should be the epicenter of their confidence…?

Peter would say “that’s easy…the resurrection”…!

This is how the message of Jesus survived the Jewish Temple and the Roman Empire.

Even though Jesus showed up in a ‘religious’ community, and all of the ‘religious’ experts on God and theology had their views of “orthodox belief and practice,” they were offended by Jesus and His teachings. He came to reveal and explain what God is actually like, and He was so clear about it that it was offensive to the ‘religious’ God and theology experts who seemed overly concerned with “orthodox belief and practice.”

Jesus said “if you wanna know what God is like, watch me, if you wanna know what God is like, listen to me, if you wanna know what God is like, follow me.” And that was all extremely offensive to the ‘religious’ God and theology experts who thrived on pointing out “orthodox belief and practice.”

After all, they’d also been studying their ‘religion’ and theology for years and years, and considered themselves learned and educated in their ‘religion’ and theology more than others. And they also considered themselves better and holier than others because of it, and because they believed they adhered strictly to the “orthodox belief and practice” better than others.

And Jesus put them in their place. Every. Single. Time.

That is beautiful! Just think how much more treasure she would have built up in Heaven if she had converted sooner.

I can see why the Atheists dropped out....youse Christians are doing a swell job beating each other up.

I think you can find the righteous acts in Revelation 19. It says the white line is the righteous acts.

Well, this is interesting.... you note that there is "God Time" and there is time "... in human terms." I like that distinction and your characterization may be pretty much correct.

"God Time" and "Human Time" .... "Humans are made of "matter".... atoms and what not and we live in a physical world. God is "Spirit" and is "not matter."

Given that brief introduction, what follows, while lengthy, is the most interesting point of view I have ever seen regarding "time."

Lifted....

So you have to think of a time when the earth didn't exist if you go back far enough. So in your mind go back just as far as you can possibly think back. Now as you go back in your mind, as far as you can go back, there comes a point, it's sort of a vanishing point. In other words, you just can't think of anything before that. It sort of fades out into a vanishing point. That's this Hebrew word everlasting, from this vanishing point.

Now in your mind think forward as far as you can think on into eternity. Now they say that if a little bird will go down here to Huntington Beach and take a drop of water in its beak out of the surf there, and every morning as the sun would rise, would take one hop towards New York. And when the little bird arrived in New York, it would drop that water in New York harbor. And then start back a hop a day towards Huntington Beach again. By the time that little bird emptied the Pacific Ocean into the Atlantic Ocean, the first day of eternity would just be getting its start. So think of out in the future to the vanishing point, you know. You think out so far and then it just vanishes. So the Hebrew word has that as its meaning. Actually, literally from the vanishing point as far as I can think until my mind just hits the vanishing point, to as far out as I can think this way, till my mind hits the vanishing point, you're God. You've existed. You will exist.

There is even a Hebrew word that is stronger than that. It is beyond the vanishing point. You know, when I get to the vanishing point, and then out beyond that. And that's the strongest word in Hebrew for the eternity. It's beyond the vanishing point. But vanishing point is far enough for me. From everlasting to everlasting God has existed.

You turn man to destruction; and you say, Return, ye children of men. For a thousand years in your sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night ( Psalms 90:3-4 ).

So the relativity of time. A thousand years is just like a day as far as the Lord is concerned. Now Peter tells this in talking to us about the coming again of Jesus Christ. He said, "In the last days, there will be scoffers that will come saying, 'Oh, where is the promise of His coming? Since our fathers have fallen asleep, everything continues as they were from the beginning.'" ( 2 Peter 3:3 , 2 Peter 3:4 ) God's not going to come. You know, where is it? Where is the promise? He is not here. And Peter said you've got to realize that a thousand years is as a day unto the Lord and a day is as a thousand years. So time is only relative to us. We think in the terms of time. We always think in terms of linear time. Here's the beginning; here's the end. Here's my birth; here's my death. Time in a linear way.

But that's because we are involved in matter. But if we weren't matter, then time wouldn't matter. Time only matters to matter. According to Einstein's theory of relativity, actually, time doesn't exist. Only except in matter. And so time can be stretched if you're going fast enough. So, in according to his theory, that if you can accelerate yourself to the speed of light, time would stand still. So if you could accelerate yourself to the speed of light and head out for the Andromeda galaxy, about... oh, let's not go to the Adromeda galaxy, that's too far. Let's go to Proxima, or Alpha Centauri. They're our closest solar neighbors. Traveling on this ray of light you could get to Centauri, Alpha Centauri, you could get there in four-and-a-half years. You could make the round-trip in nine years. But when you got back though, you would be the same age. Time would have stood still for you because of the speed at which you were traveling. When you got back, the earth would be nine years older. Your wife would be nine years older than you are at this point. Now, if you went further, if you did go to Andromeda galaxy, one million five hundred thousand light years out there, you'd come back in three million years. Now the whole earth would be different by that time. You'd look around you wouldn't find any of your friends. But you would only be, you know, a matter of hours older, because time would have stood still because of the speed you were traveling. Because if you travel that fast, you're going to turn into energy, and because you have no materials, you're just energy at that point, then time ceases to exist. This is the idea of the relativity, Einstein's theory of relativity. And so there's no way that we can really prove it. So you just have to accept it because he was a smart man.

But it is interesting that the Bible does hint to relativity of time as far as God is concerned. "A thousand years in Your sight is like yesterday when it's past." And, as Peter said, "A day is as a thousand years to the Lord, a thousand years is as a day."

Now that is interesting in the light of in the book of Hosea, he speaks of Israel sort of being out of the land, dispersed for two years. And he said, "And in the third year, I will raise her up and she will dwell in the land." Or, "for two days," rather, "and in the third day... " "After two days He will revive us, and in the third day He will raise us up, and we shall live in His sight" ( Hosea 6:2 ). And so Israel was destroyed and dispersed from the land for about two thousand years. And now they've been raised up again. And so, a thousand years is as a thousand years to the Lord... a day is as a thousand years.

So you say, "Oh, but the Lord's waiting so long to come back." Yeah, a couple days. Relativity of time.

You carry them away as with a flood; they are as a sleep: in the morning they are like grass which grows up. In the morning it flourishes, it grows up; in the evening and it cuts down, and withers ( Psalms 90:5-6 )

So life is just so temporal.

We are consumed by your anger, and by your wrath we are troubled. You have set our iniquities before thee, our secret sins are in the light of your countenance. For all of our days are passed away in thy wrath: we spend our years as a tale that is told ( Psalms 90:7-9 ).

Now, not only is time relative, and this is where we really come into trouble understanding this, because it really begins to get weird at this point. When you are released from this linear timeframe that we are existing in, and you can enter into the timelessness of eternity, there is then no past and or no future, but everything is present, because now you're released from time. And in time, we know past, present, future. But released from the linear time zone, then the past or the future do not exist; everything is now in the present. Now the writer of Eccleciastes tried to describe that and he only made it more confusing. But, of course, our minds can't grasp it anyhow, so it would just boggle our minds to try to conceive it.

But that which is past, he said, is now. And that which shall be has already been. And God requires that which is past. So figure that one out and you've got eternity wired. Everything happening now, so that in this relativity of time, in reality, our lives are spent like a story that's already been told. We're like a re-run as far as God is concerned, because God living outside of the time dimension can see the whole picture at once.


So, yes, I suppose the creation days could be six literal days... but perhaps there is more to it than that.....

...when my atheist friend lay dying in Hospice, she told me that atheists are told to never ever give Christians the last word when discussing religion...

Also, a side note...as she lay grasping for breath, a priest came in and asked her if she wanted the Last Rights, and she shook her head....

Everything has a creator, architect, engineer...the phone you are on, your pc, your house, car, etc, etc. Why would you think this planet, galaxy, universe would be any different...

The devil can always count on Christians to undo Jesus' work.

Do you hold the belief that “keeping Torah” is a matter of salvation…?

Or do you hold the belief that salvation comes only through grace by faith in Jesus…?

…the answer to both your questions is a qualified yes.