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I've read all of Paul's writings and have found them some of the most enlightening portions of the NT and in perfect sync with the whole. If you don't understand Paul's writings you missed it, not him. I wouldn't say you can't reject his writings and be saved but I can't understand why any saved person would want to.

Amen, RH.

Since his writings are considered a thesis in the Gospel I’d say that it’s extremely important for a believer to understand what’s going on there. Prerequisite for salvation? No. Realistic expectation for someone maturing in the faith? Definitely.

Study to show yourself approved, a workman that need not be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.


As you exemplify, the Holy Spirit doesn’t shove knowledge into the brain just because you exist and make claims. The mind, engaging with the word, is how God ordained growth. It is based and rooted in the truth of the word, the actual promises of God. The Holy Spirit teaches us throughout our lives through exposure to the word.

Additionally, as I previously stated, knowledge of scripture, church history, cults, cult and denominational doctrine makes it easy to identify such heretical and blasphemous teaching. An example would be Oneness/modalism.

Your Paul-bashing proclivity is quite baffling. The Word of God says Paul was chosen by God to become the light of the Gentiles after the Jews rejected Jesus, Acts 13:47-48. Before Paul, both faith and works were required for salvation. Paul taught that only faith was necessary in believing that Jesus died for our sins and rose from the dead. To reject Paul is rejecting what Jesus did for us.

Paul’s gospel is the only valid gospel, Acts 15:11 and decreed by Peter. Apparently, you have also rejected Peter as well. So you really think you can pick and choose which parts of God’s Holy Word to believe and which are false in your opinion?

There is no salvation for one rejecting Paul. Paul was commissioned directly by the Risen Lord to be an apostle to the Gentiles to found the Church, the Body of Christ, 1 Corinthians 3:10. Paul’s gospel has been valid for 2,000 years.

Thanks to Paul, we know about God’s plan of blessing for the Gentiles apart from Israel, including by faith alone. Paul was the God-appointed minister to the Gentiles. Before Paul, Jews held the privileged position above Gentiles. Jewish rejection of Jesus changed that. Jews and Gentiles are now equal.

You seem to relish the fact that Paul lost Asia, as you have sarcastically mentioned several times. Paul lost Asia to the Judaizers who practiced the law and stubbornly refused to do otherwise.

As RH said, you missed it.

And Jesus told His followers, “But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper (Comforter, Advocate, Intercessor, Counselor, Strengthener) will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him (the Holy Spirit) to you (to be in close fellowship with you).” Jesus seems to be telling His followers that having His Spirit inside of them is even better than having Him physically by their side.

The modern-day Judaizers contradict and undermine the accomplishments of Jesus through His life, death, and resurrection, just as the Judaizers did back in the days of Peter and James and Paul.

Paul’s rejection in Asia was a result of Jewish opposition. Paul was a threat to their legalism, tradition, and religio licita. The Christianity preached by Paul also offered them no protection under Roman law.

Paul’s ministry clearly demonstrated Christianity was different from Judaism, and they couldn’t understand or accept that the law was no longer necessary for salvation. Christianity set the long entrenched Judaism aside. Thus, there was great opposition and rejection which continues 2,000 years later.

Actually, the law was never necessary for salvation. It was only there to prove the need for the sacrifice, Jesus being the fulfillment by having perfectly kept the law and suffering the penalty of disobeying it, all on our behalf. We only understand this however through Paul's writings.

Jews in Jerusalem said one had to be circumcised and keep the Mosaic law to be saved

“And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.” Acts 15:1

“But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.” Acts 15:5

The Jews did not believe that faith alone was sufficient for salvation. They believed to be saved, one had to be circumcised and keep the law.

Circumcision was one of the 613 laws, Leviticus 12:3

Sacrifices were also required and were included in the 613 laws, Deut. 12:11, and another law was to salt all sacrifices, Leviticus 2:13.

Keeping the law was in effect until Paul’s gospel of grace, which Peter confirmed, Acts 15:11. Peter’s declaration ended the gospel of the kingdom.

You’re right though about the law condemning, and it couldn’t be kept anyway.

So you have perverted your mind with heretical theology, and feel it gives you insight to challenge another's salvation.

How many different theologies have you now projected on me?

I'm not looking that chit up, could care less what it means.

I'll give you a clue... you can't claim to study different forms of pornography so you can judge another's involvement of same... you're just a pervert.

Blasphemous teachings are worse than pornography, your mind is perverted... your rabbit hole is full of chit.

Kent

I don't think we are disagreeing. The law was certainly in practice and considered by them as part of salvation which is why they tried to incorporate it into Christianity. The real purpose of the law however was to reveal sin and prove the necessity for the sacrifice.

I have no words for your logic. There is a sad irony in your reasoning.

To avoid the martyr complex please read sentences that end with a question mark as questions.

Because sentences that end with question mark are questions.

I don't know if you are a modalist or a oneness Pentecostal.

I am asking a question. ARE you a oneness Pentecostal?

Were the sentences to end with a period or exclamation point I would be making a statement about you.

No detraction. You have stated that the teaching of Christ was directed at that Jewish people. You have said that the OT scripture was only used for that purpose.
Yet.

The witness of scripture demonstrates that Jesus preached about Himself from the OT text.

The witness of scripture demonstrates that the Apostles preached about Him from the OT text.

The story of Jonah and Nineveh demonstrates that the message of the Gospel, faith in the coming (Christ), was preached to non Israelites in the OT.

Jesus' ministry is filled with examples of non-Jews being brought to faith in Christ having heard Him and the disciples preach Christ from the OT.

I gave you two examples of many from the NT of The Apostles and early post ascension church preaching the Gospel from OT text. The two specific accounts: Phillip and the Ethiopian Eunuch, Paul and Barnabas preaching in Antioch. I'm more than willing to go through the text and post more of the many accounts of the OT scripture, speaking specifically about Christ and the Gospel, being used throughout the history of time to preach Christ crucified for the forgiveness of sins.

The whole of your version of history seems to hinge on this one point. This point is a house of cardsand is fully out of line with Scriptural teaching and the history of the church. Yet, you say that the Holy Spirit is leading you into truth while the "truth" that you offer us is untenable.

So the detraction is not mine.

Jeepers

I need to stop voice to text on these threads. In wealth should have been indwelt in my statement.

I appreciate the verses that you reference. Paul does a great job of bringing it all together to a climax.

I see a contrast in the ideas that are being discussed throughout this and it's sister threads. I think that a distinction has to be made in the work of the Holy Spirit and the work of Christ.

You have mentioned a few times that the Law convicts and compounds sin. I agree and believe that truth to be present in both the OT and NT. Paul makes it clear concerning OT scripture in the book of Romans and then Reams the Galatians a new one for going back to the law as a means of righteousness. Recently while I recently came across a description of the law that I'd never seen or thought of, the Law as a voice. The idea is that the Law is a voice that is never silent. It is never silent in the world and never silent to the individual. The law, even in the life of the believer, is always there, accusing, condemning, ridiculing. It's voice will finally be put to death when Christ returns to resurrect us and put an end to the curse once and for all. The law is death.

That thought is the basis for the distinction that I see. Jesus said of Himself that He is the way, the truth and the life. Jesus, as life, put an end to the curse of the law by dying our death for us so that we could then die as we are baptized into His death. Rather than bring a system of payment, Christ became the antidote of death, life. This is accomplished only by going through the cross and what happened there. The cross and the resurrection is the way. (I am making a reference as some of these statements are not my own but incorporated into the reasoning). Paul talks about dying daily. I believe that what he meant is that each day, through confession and repentance, we die in the death of Christ, not reliving or relying on what happened yesterday or even using that as a template for what we anticipate for ourselves today. We live in a body of flesh and are sinful. The law is still a voice which constantly accuses us.

This is why I make a distinction between what I was taught and believed for most of my life and what I read in many of the posts here. I seldom see people talking about Christ and a constant need for and reliance upon Him. Many, a majority?, speak of the Holy Spirit. I believe that we are indwelt by the Holy Spirit. However, I don't believe that the purpose and work of the Holy Spirit is as personal "medium" Who channels us to God the Father.

For me this is best understood by considering that Christ does place Himself squarely in the Law and Prophets. I see this as evidence that He does so in order to display Himself throughout all time as the Physical presentation of God to mankind. While the Holy Spirit is present as comforter and all of the other attributes that we are given, we can understand the role in a different way than the "medium" role that is so prevalent in modern Christian thinking. It is widely accepted that it is the primary work of the Holy Spirit to always point us back to Christ rather than our being pointed to the Holy Spirit.

I believe that when we emphasize the Holy Spirit over Christ we end up going down a rabbit trail. I've been down that trail more than a few times but the centrality of Christ and the Cross is what I keep being drawn back to, not as a pivotal event in history, but as the actual life of Christ in me, the antidote to the continual voice and accusation of the Law.

The Holy Spirit relates to Jesus’ followers individually and personally, that’s why Jesus used words like Advocate and Guide and Counselor and Helper, because the Holy Spirit is those things directly to Jesus’ followers individually and personally. There’s something to be said for the peace that transcends all understanding (it was experientially referred to earlier in this thread by another poster); for example, you feel financial peace, relational peace, and spiritual peace. Paul listed the fruit of the Spirit that Jesus’ followers get because the Spirit of God lives in them. Jesus’ followers are literally a walking, breathing temple of the Holy Spirit that dwells in them. The same Spirit that brought Jesus back to life is alive in His followers.

Some choose to confine the Spirit of God to the space between the covers of a book, and they assert that God ‘only’ reveals Himself through the Bible.

I’m not one of em’.

Stewart Hamblen,"It is no secret what God can do."