Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Israel and their current place in God’s economy.

God is working with everyone not just one nation, and not in the manner of the old testament.

Kent

I don't think God is working with everyone. He allows those who ignore his presence to go their own way.

Lots of people ignore him. Hence, lot's of decadence.

Romans 1.

God hasn't given up on anybody.

Kent

One contributor to this thread posted this earlier:
It appears to be a pretty accurate observation:

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/latest-population-statistics-for-israel

There hasn't been a Noah, Moses, David, Abraham type some years before Jesus or after.

Kent

Maybe. But God will give people over to a reprobate mind. I'd say that the path back is difficult once that happens.

And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind

You don't have to look around very much these days to see people who have been given over to a reprobate mind.

And in the past roughly 2,400 years the Jewish people…Gods “covenant people”…have had zero prophets — much less a Messiah. They flat-out reject Jesus. Judaism does not consider Jesus to be a prophet, Judaism does not consider Jesus to be the messiah, nor does Judaism consider Jesus to be a divine being. Yet the assertion is still made by modern-day Judaizers that “Judaism is where it’s at.”

Exactly. The Muslims are closer to the truth on Yeshua than the Jews....without a doubt.

"And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are improper and repulsive." - Romans 1:28

The end of the aeon (age, as in the Old Covenant....jews spoke of two ages, the age they were living in and the age of Messiah), the end of the Levitical Priesthood and Temple sacrifice.

This allowed for the new and everlasting Covenant, the one sealed by the blood of Yeshua, to be fully brought in.

Recall what Paul said about the old waning and making ready to pass away.

Ok brother...how about when Yeshua says it?

Verily, verily.....

"These are the days of vengeance, that all that is written might be fulfilled".

Not all who are Israel, are Israel.

Who is a Jew? Not him who is circumcised of the flesh, but he who is circumcised of the heart, from above.

If none of this makes sense to you, you need to study the Word.

Sorry to be so blunt, but there you go.

If you choose to deny/ignore the teaching of the Apostles, then I guess you start your own system?

While I believe that to be true, HE has moved on from a particular 'way'....

We are no longer under 'the Law' - we have a new a better 'way', better sacrifice, High Priest, priesthood, forgiveness, and grace...... 'ALL things have been made new.'

Peter was looking for 'a new Heaven and a new Earth, wherein righteousness dwells'......... they are here.....

The Old one has been done away with and the new one is here....

The Hebrew writer speaks of the old way 'growing old and ready to disappear'....... by 70 AD it was gone and replaced with the new, which began in earnest on Pentecost Acts 2.............. it took 40 years.

Much like the Israelites being freed from Egyptian bondage, crossing the Red Sea, and 'getting home', crossing the Jordan, 40 years later!!! Coincidence!?!?!?!?

But if you reject Peter and Paul you can't get that..........




ISA 65:
17 “For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth;
And the former things will not be remembered or come to [n]mind.
18 “But be glad and rejoice forever in what I create;
For behold, I create Jerusalem for rejoicing
And her people for gladness.
19 “I will also rejoice in Jerusalem and be glad in My people;
And there will no longer be heard in her
The voice of weeping and the sound of crying.
20 “No longer will there be [o]in it an infant who lives but a few days,
Or an old man who does not [p]live out his days;
For the youth will die at the age of one hundred
And the [q]one who does not reach the age of one hundred
Will be thought accursed.
21 “They will build houses and inhabit them;
They will also plant vineyards and eat their fruit.
22 “They will not build and another inhabit,
They will not plant and another eat;
For as the [r]lifetime of a tree, so will be the days of My people,
And My chosen ones will wear out the work of their hands.
23 “They will not labor in vain,
Or bear children for calamity;
For they are the [s]offspring of those blessed by the Lord,
And their descendants with them.

24 It will also come to pass that before they call, I will answer; and while they are still speaking, I will hear. 25 The wolf and the lamb will graze together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox; and dust will be the serpent’s food. They will do no evil or harm in all My holy mountain,” says the Lord.

I was waiting for that. Continually saying "I don't lie/I am not lying" is a whole lot different that saying "to tell you the truth" or "Verily, Verily I say unto you". And Paul was constantly coming up with stuff Jesus never said, claimed to have met Jesus out on the desert road, travelled to 3rd heaven, along with other hallucinations. And he was disowned by the original Christians.

Think about it. You may have been duped.

If you can find anyone who has done missionary work in Israel and surrounding areas it’s well worth listening to their experiences. Enlightening to say the least.

The disciples asked Jesus why he spoke to Israel in parables. His answer is pretty shocking. So that hearing they will not understand or believe.

We also have the offensive account of God hardening hearts. Pharaoh being a prominent example.

God certainly does “give up” on people.

Yep. After Jesus was crucified, religious Israel wrestled for the next 40 years with the internal tension created by Jesus’ New Covenant. Religious Israel tried hard to stamp it out, but it kept growing. Due to the tireless efforts of Apostle Peter, and James (the brother of Jesus and the leader of the church in Jerusalem), and Apostle Paul and others, real Jewish Christians throughout the Roman Empire began abandoning their strict adherence to the Mosaic Law and started following the resurrected Jesus instead.

Then the transition came to a quick end, on August 6th in AD 70. The four-year war between Rome and the Jewish rebels came to a violent conclusion. The Jewish temple (the very heart of ancient Judaism) was looted and burned and razed to the ground. Its complete destruction signaled the end of ancient Judaism ~ just as Jesus Himself predicted. The words of the Old Covenant were preserved, but Israel’s ability to live in accordance with those words disappeared in a single day.

Ancient Judaism...as prescribed by Moses at Mount Sinai...ceased to exist. To use Jesus’ term, it “disappeared.” Not a single person…including real Jews or pretend Jews…has practiced ancient Judaism in nearly 2,000 years. And for someone to cherry-pick 2% of the Law of Moses that they’re gonna abide by, while completely ignoring the other 98% of the Law of Moses, and then claim that they’re ‘walking in obedience to Torah’ is comical to the Nth degree. Saying that you abide by the “Big 10” and the Saturday sabbath and not eating frog legs or pork chops is a far cry from ‘keeping Torah’ and following the Mosaic Law. Clearly.

God does not give up on people or harden them against him. I have studied the translations extensively. Read all the scriptures about Pharaoh' heart and you will find that they also say Pharoah hardened his own heart.

The scripture that says God did it doesn't exactly mean that God made him choose wrongly. It means that God made the situation in which Pharoah would choose. The Hebrew brings it out plainly that God takes responsibility only in creating the situation and in that way only did God harden his heart, not by causing him to make the damning decision.

It would be like saying "24hourcampfire hardened my heart against Pit Bulls." You may have read some stuff that caused you to harden your heart, but it's not like the decision was forced on you as if you had no control over it.

I’ve studied it pretty extensively. That’s only one example. This is awesomeness of God and not something that we can understand. Not do we need to defend God and what He declares of Himself.

This is the awesomeness and awfulness of God and why we should rightfully respect and fear him. Crocodile Dundee said that God and me, we be mates. In modernity we may have too cavalier an attitude. As C S Lewis said in the Chronicle of Narnia. He is not a tame Lion. As such, He does what he will, even preaching to Israel in such a way as to keep them from understanding.