Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only The great 458 Winchester. Everyone should own one at least once

Can't disagree with any of that.

I am stuck on the 400-grainer for everything, but always willing to give any .458 bullet a go in the .458 WinMag.
No doubt the most versatile rifle in the world if judged by greatest range of useful bullets from 250-gr monometal to 750-gr cast,
and many many in between.
405-grainer is where we started with the .45-70 Gov't. 150 years ago.
In 400-ish-grainers alone I can now find one for most uses of the .458 WinMag.
A sample of 400-grainers along the way to the 404-gr Shock Hammer and 400-gr CEB Safari Solid:



Scorned by Hammer for an FN Solid, so far ... Had to shorten a Barnes Banded down to 400-grains with my bastard file.







CEB Safari Solids are the choice.

I will add the 404 Shock Hammer has my vote for the best on the market, one-and-done expanding bullet choice. It pretty much covers beaver through buffalo exceptionally well.

I've been both satisfied and impressed with the performance of the CEB BBW #13 SS FP in the 0.458" cartridges. For the 458 WM, especially when magazine constrained to 3.340", the 450 grain SS retains all the practical penetration of the 500 gn SS and yields 2400 FPS.

The relationship of the exposed nose length and meplat, as Sir Ron has already discussed, is key to straight line penetration. It is especially so when tough bones must be either perforated or shattered on the way to the vital target organ.

For the larger 0.458" caliber DGR cases I have experience with - 460 G&A, 450 Rigby Rimless - and by extrapolation 450 Dakota, 460 Wby, etc. - the 500 gn BBW #13 SS FP, yields 2400 fps or greater, with the attendant additional straight line penetration. Splitting hairs, but for bull elephants I prefer the 500 gn in the larger cases and for the tuskless, the 450 gn in the 458 WM or WM+, as they seem the optimally efficient choices. No need to resort to undue powder compression or overly high chamber pressures with these bullet to achieve stellar results in the field.

No aspersions on the 458 WM/WM+ for bull elephants, but if a loony has a bigger hammer, why not nail bigger eles with it? After all, it's about fun and games, even when up close and in among them!!

...Referring to the ,458WM. Quiz question: Who made the following statement in print? "Several improved versions have appeared which are made by firing factory loads in the improved chamber. These versions make it possible to increase the velocity slightly, but it is doubtful if more power is necessary until safaris are possible on Mars or some other planet."

Why would more power be needed on Mars or some other planet?

Sir Khulu,
Yep, it is all good, as long as it is not a SAAMI .458 Lott.
Even the original wildcat .458 Lott "Like Jack Built" is a good one.
I shot my first "buffalo" with a 460 WbyMag and factory ammo, 500-grain RNSP.
What fun !
Now I prefer the .458 WinMag above all else,
even if restricted to 3.4" mag box length instead of 3.6" or 3.8".
It's all good there too.


Sir Ele Hunter, nice trivia:

P.O. Ackley in the comments blurb with the load data in his 2-volume book, when he got to the .458 Winchester Magnum listing.
Page 500, Vol. I of his HANDBOOK FOR SHOOTERS & RELOADERS.
A favorite passage.

(Sir John, it was a joke. P.O. Ackley had a sense of humor.)

On page 501, next in the listings is the .450 Watts Magnum.
P.O. Ackley states that the .450 Watts Magnum was the forerunner of the .450 Ackley Magnum.
Cheers!

Toughest animal to encounter a 404-gr Shock Hammer on Sir Jerry's .458 WinMag Safari,
one of the 3 (out of 9) that ran a few yards, not DRT on impact:

Sable, shot at 88 yards, had the longest run after impact: 33 yards.



Grazing until turning broadside:



Bullet impact:



Hunches:



Jump start of the 33-yard run:



We have some better images coming up, related to Sir Jerry's next safari battery,
the two FN Brownings (7mm RemMag and .458 WinMag)
and maybe he or his Wife will take a third rifle, something really special.
A 1949 vintage Winchester M70 Super Grade in .22 Hornet !!!
Perfect set of training wheels for the M70 African .458 WinMag.

Bullets:
175-gr Speer Grand Slam for the 7mmRemMag.
450-gr CEB Safari Solid for the .458 WinMag.
45-gr Barnes TSX for the .22 Hornet.
To be continued

My question was tongue in cheek

Sir John,
You made me bite my tongue.

Bear with me, we will eventually get back to the .458 WinMag.
Yesterday in OK:



Sir Jerry has a .458 WinMag FN Browning, yep the one like Ron "Mahohboh" Thomson used to cull 5000 or 6000 elephant,
and carried in backup on thousands more.
"Anyway ... what does it matter? What's a few thousand elephant between friends!"
(Mahohboh quote.)

But yesterday Sir Jerry was getting his light rifle ready for the safari with two FN Brownings,
a 7mm RemMag and a .458 WinMag.
I suspect his wife might be using the 7mm.









That 7mmRemMag load is the maximum load in the Speer Handloading Manual Number 15.
Speer ballisticians used COL of 3.220" with the 175-gr Grand Slam, same as Sir Jerry, apparently he was influenced by the Speer manual.
They got 2954 fps from a 24" barrel.
Sir Jerry got 2948 fps.
G1 BC of the bullet is 0.436.
That would add about 10 fps to get his MV if he did not correct chrono to MV.
Close enough.
H870 too, bless its heart !

I suspect Sir Jerry used this .22 Hornet as his training wheels for the M70 .458 WM+,
which he shot just as accurately.





Nice pairs. Two excellent combos of an elephant rifle and a pest rifle.
FN Brownings and M70 Winchesters.
The man has great taste.

Favorite quote from Richard Harland,
another culler of five or six thousand elephant in his long career as game ranger,
also favoring an FN M98 Mauser .458 Winchester Magnum, a custom one-off:

"If a WattLottAckleyWeatherbyRigbyDakotaWhatsitWildcat is what you cannot live without, get it and be happy.
If you own a .458 WM rifle though, rest assured you already have one of the best elephant calibres ever designed."

Oh yes, almost forgot. Sir Jerry said he was planning to use the
CEB 450-gr Safari Solid in his FN Browning .458 WinMag on his next safari,
ready for elephant:

A review:













If I find any specifics on Sir Jerry's load (believed to be about 2300 fps with 450-grainer),
i will post it here if he doesn't mind.

Sir Khulu has already proved the bullet at 2400 fps from a 24"-barreled .458 WinMag, IIRC.
Kills elephant, no problems.

I wish they made a 400 grain with the same nose profile as the 450 grain. 1 plant, 1 sold and 1 expander of 400 grains.

Hello Sir Ron, many thanks for posting the pics of a couple pairs of rifles for use in future safari's, the two FN Browning's will go together, the mighty 458 will handle the heavy lifting, 7mm for plains game up to and including Eland, maybe even a big 450lb kitty cat.

The little 22 Hornet was took out and checked so it can go with the 458 WM+ i used on last safari, i only have two of the tiny ten, the Hornet can handlle the other eight species with ease out to 200 yards with 45gr TSX's at 2922 fps, again, the 458 WM+ will easily handle the rest.

Those Browning FN's long extractors are beautiful. For my eye appeal they are near or at the top of the list. I was star struck with them as a kid.
I was able to acquire a very good condition Safari Grade in 30-06 a few to several years ago. One in 458 Winchester would be top dog.

My pleasure, Sir Jerry.
I wonder if one could find a bullet and MV in the .22 Hornet to mimic the trajectory of the 404-gr Shock Hammer at about 2518 fps ?
Training wheels load for practice on the field course.
Might not tear up the rest of the Tiny Ten on the ticket.
Think of taxidermy charges for repairing the hides.
Sort of like playing putt-putt golf to keep your putt accurate.
Heh-heh-heh.

Speaking of your great photography over the years, here is a killer still life,
includes your Bagwell Bowie:



Also the .458 WM+ loads in your Winchester M70 Classic, rebore by JES:



That 500-gr/.458 Trophy Bonded Sledgehammer is only 1.400" long,
about 0.015" shorter than the CEB 450-gr/.458 Safari Solid.



That Lab Radar data came from the 24"-barreled Ruger No. 1, a SAAMI .458 WinMag rifle, at 80*F, GM215M primer.

It is still a tough choice between the CEB 450-grainer at 2300 to 2400 fps (3.360" COL)
versus the TBSS 500-grainer at 2300 to 2400 fps (3.550" COL)
from a .458 WM+ handload
in a 24"-barreled rifle chambered with the SAAMI .458 Winchester Magnum reamer.

I used to laugh when a Lottite claimed to be getting 2400 fps with a 500-gr bullet in his SAAMI .458 Lott with 24" barrel.
The SAAMI .458 WinMag with .458 WM+ handload can certainly do that at lower pressure than a SAAMI .458 Lott.

I am wishing upon a star tonight
for a CEB 400-gr/.458 Safari Solid with 0.750" nose projection including that first band.
That will likely decide me for the 400-grain/.458 FN solid at 2500 fps and 3.360" COL in a 24"-barreled .458 WinMag.

Hala Loua, I want some of those

Amen.
COLs possible with those CEB bands (belts) and 0.750" nose projection from a 2.500" case length:
3.250" two belts in one belt out
3.350" two belts out and one belt in
3.450" all three belts forward of case mouth and suspenders crimp on 0.449" minor diameter below that third belt.
Belted only or belted and suspendered.

Maybe we could persuade CEB to make the 400 grain with a group buy

I never get tired of reading these great informative posts and viewing the great eye candy. Especially the Bagwell Bowie Sir Jerry kindly displayed for us to view.

Sir Ron your work is exemplary of a constant Love for a very rewarding Hobby for many.

Keep up the Good work Men!

HS 58