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Let's see how it's going in 7 or 8 years.


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Originally Posted by reivertom
Let's see how it's going in 7 or 8 years.

How long on average do diesel busses stay in the fleet?


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Originally Posted by Bob_mt
Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Backroads
It seems like Woody is forgetting to use the actual cost of the buses in his math.
Otherwise school buses seem like a good match for EV tech, short routes and back to charge.

Propane or NG would work about as well, cost less. EV has its’ place, but not a cure all.

we should be using all forms of energy, it doesn't need to be one way or no way....bob

No.

I only want my energy to come at the expense of thousands of American servicemen.

There isn't enough war in electric to suit Americans yet.


That will probably change though...


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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by reivertom
Let's see how it's going in 7 or 8 years.

How long on average do diesel busses stay in the fleet?

Jim, from what I've read the average life on a diesel bus is 12-15 years

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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by Bob_mt
Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Backroads
It seems like Woody is forgetting to use the actual cost of the buses in his math.
Otherwise school buses seem like a good match for EV tech, short routes and back to charge.

Propane or NG would work about as well, cost less. EV has its’ place, but not a cure all.

we should be using all forms of energy, it doesn't need to be one way or no way....bob

No.

I only want my energy to come at the expense of thousands of American servicemen.

There isn't enough war in electric to suit Americans yet.


That will probably change though...

Who controls many of these materials currently going into batteries?? Hint: It ain’t us.

How much LP and NG are we importing??

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I know that they tried NG and LPG busses in Montana in a couple places.


They went back to diesel for some reason.


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lets see. VW pays billions in fines. fines used to subsidize EV busses.
VW has to get those billions somehow.
VW raises per unit cost by 10k
and some don't think its all coming out of our pockets.


the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee
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Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by Bob_mt
Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Backroads
It seems like Woody is forgetting to use the actual cost of the buses in his math.
Otherwise school buses seem like a good match for EV tech, short routes and back to charge.

Propane or NG would work about as well, cost less. EV has its’ place, but not a cure all.

we should be using all forms of energy, it doesn't need to be one way or no way....bob

No.

I only want my energy to come at the expense of thousands of American servicemen.

There isn't enough war in electric to suit Americans yet.


That will probably change though...

Who controls many of these materials currently going into batteries?? Hint: It ain’t us.

How much LP and NG are we importing??



I know! It's exciting.


Soon we can start bombing and shooting people over lithium!


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Originally Posted by AKislander

A real brain trust running Juneau`s transportation system.


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Stupidity left unattended will run rampant
Don't argue with stupid people, They will drag you down to their level and then win by experience
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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by Bob_mt
Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Backroads
It seems like Woody is forgetting to use the actual cost of the buses in his math.
Otherwise school buses seem like a good match for EV tech, short routes and back to charge.

Propane or NG would work about as well, cost less. EV has its’ place, but not a cure all.

we should be using all forms of energy, it doesn't need to be one way or no way....bob

No.

I only want my energy to come at the expense of thousands of American servicemen.

There isn't enough war in electric to suit Americans yet.


That will probably change though...

Who controls many of these materials currently going into batteries?? Hint: It ain’t us.

How much LP and NG are we importing??



I know! It's exciting.


Soon we can start bombing and shooting people over lithium!



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Originally Posted by AKislander
Originally Posted by simonkenton7
The Asheville fleet isn't doing too well:


https://wlos.com/news/alexa/5-milli...ntenance-director-john-mcdaniel-proterra



$5 million loss for Asheville as flawed electric buses sit idle
by Kimberly KingThu, January 18th 2024

JAN. 18, 2024 - Asheville spent about $1 million each for five electric buses in 2018, but software and/or mechanical issues have made them an expensive and disappointing purchase, city staff say. (Photo credit: WLOS staff)

ASHEVILLE, N.C. (WLOS) — The city of Asheville's purchase of five electric buses in 2018 has turned into a multi-million-dollar loss. The buses have been broken or unable to run because of software and/or mechanical issues, making them an expensive and disappointing purchase, according to city maintenance and transportation staff.


Currently, three of the five buses are idled, with one that has had a broken double door since July.

“We haven’t been able to get new doors,” Asheville's interim transportation director Jessica Morriss said. “There's no third party that makes a door. We'd have to get custom-made doors.”

Each of the buses cost the city $616,796-plus. Morriss said additional costs included more than $200,000 for the infrastructure for each charger, $118,000 annually for the contract to lease batteries for the buses and $45,481 for annual electric charges.

“I think if you added that altogether, I think, probably $900,000 to $1 million is what each one cost. And, since then, we've had to invest additional money into maintaining them and fixing them," Morriss said.

Morriss said maintenance costs have been an additional $251,000, which includes replacing the traction drive controls, or electric motors, for all of the buses.


Maintenance director John McDaniel said several of the buses also had to have their power inverters replaced at $14,000 each.

“The last couple of years have been particularly difficult,” Morriss said. “We don’t see an end in sight. Proterra, the manufacturer, has since filed for bankruptcy.”

She said it’s impossible to get parts for the idled buses.

“Since June 2023, we have had numerous issues with vehicles out of service for weeks and months," Morriss said.

Of the two buses that are running, the other big issue is the limited distance they can go, which in winter is about 78 miles. McDaniel said that’s about three trips to the airport. Then, the bus has to come back and charge at the garage on West Haywood Street for hours, he said.

Another issue is the buses get cold overnight and it eats into a large part of the charge to heat them before they leave the garage.

Morris said the downed electric buses have also put a strain on the city's operating fleet of 32 buses. She said those buses -- a combination of biodiesel and hybrids -- are being run more because the electric buses have been down so often.

“There's some lessons here for sure. We're pressing pause on investing in any electric technology until we can assure the products we get are going to be able to work," Morris said.


NOTE TO SELF:

Never, ever, ever buy a Proterra electric bus...

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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
I know! It's exciting.


Soon we can start bombing and shooting people over lithium!

Australia has a lot of lithium, they'd be easy to kill they ain't got no guns.

It's kinda way over yonder though.

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Originally Posted by JeffA
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
I know! It's exciting.


Soon we can start bombing and shooting people over lithium!

Australia has a lot of lithium, they'd be easy to kill they ain't got no guns.

It's kinda way over yonder though.

We better blow em away before we sell them these nuclear subs we promised.


The dummies think it's to protect them from the Chinese!


Haha! It's to protect them from US! And they are gonna pay for it!


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They all wanna be extremists, it's either or in their eyes.

They have zero knowledge of how little alternative energy is needed to free us from the dependency of foreign oil.

And nobody ever said it'd be cheaper than fossil fuels.

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Originally Posted by Timbermaster
Originally Posted by 264mag
So it's "cheaper" because they only paid for 15% of it? Meaning the rest of us paid for the other 85%.
It's no wonder our .gov educational system is an international joke.
Bidenomics. A near perfect example.




Hah. Yeah. Bidenomics. Everything's fwee! Fwee!


Slaves get what they need. Free men get what they want.

Rehabilitation is way overrated.

Orwell wasn't wrong.

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Some of you seem to believe that if a vehicle can't tow a four-horse trailer at 80 mph for 400 miles, it's worthless.

It is true that for now at least, no electric vehicle can do that. But it doesn't mean that there's no place for electric vehicles.

Some of you also can't seem to read. The purchase of these two buses did save tax money, because the bulk of the funds didn't come from taxes. If you doubt the economy statements, can you offer any proof to the contrary other than "everybody knows..."?


Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult.

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Originally Posted by RockyRaab
Some of you seem to believe that if a vehicle can't tow a four-horse trailer at 80 mph for 400 miles, it's worthless.

It is true that for now at least, no electric vehicle can do that. But it doesn't mean that there's no place for electric vehicles.

Some of you also can't seem to read. The purchase of these two buses did save tax money, because the bulk of the funds didn't come from taxes. If you doubt the economy statements, can you offer any proof to the contrary other than "everybody knows..."?

I would be personally offended if I weren't forced to buy tens of thousands of dollars worth of oil and grease and fuel every year.

Offended.


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Just how cheap is oil when you factor in the tax dollars spent on foreign wars that keep it flowing?

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Originally Posted by JeffA
The short of it is Volkswagen paid billions in EPA fines for violations of the Clean Air Act and that is the money Havre used to buy their cost saving electric buses.

Because Volkswagen was polluting the air in Havre, MT. Or something like that.

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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by Bob_mt
Originally Posted by fburgtx
Originally Posted by Backroads
It seems like Woody is forgetting to use the actual cost of the buses in his math.
Otherwise school buses seem like a good match for EV tech, short routes and back to charge.

Propane or NG would work about as well, cost less. EV has its’ place, but not a cure all.

we should be using all forms of energy, it doesn't need to be one way or no way....bob

No.

I only want my energy to come at the expense of thousands of American servicemen.

There isn't enough war in electric to suit Americans yet.


That will probably change though...

Who controls many of these materials currently going into batteries?? Hint: It ain’t us.

How much LP and NG are we importing??



I know! It's exciting.


Soon we can start bombing and shooting people over lithium!

Right????!!!??!!😜

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