Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Howa Mini Stainless

I would rather have stainless and wished that I had purchased one in 7.62x39. If someone has an extra one, let me know.

When I uses to do product development we'd try to figure out how much value the market would place on certain attributes and features so we could come up with the most perceived value for the money.

I was thinking about this in relation to these rifles and the ironic part is that many of the things that would make a rifle much more appealing wouldn't cost the manufacturer any more to produce than the compromises they're trying to push on us. It shouldn't cost manufacturers any extra to get barrel twists right and barrel lengths right for example.

Although length is more subjective sometimes they're off enough you know they missed most of the market. Like I was looking at a cz alpha 223 because they gave them a 7 twist. But they only come in 24" barrel lengths in the alpha. The lux has a 20" barrel but it's a 9 twist. Would make more sense the other way around because I'd more likely hunt bigger game with the lighter 20" wanting 7 twist there and varmints with a heavier 24" so 9 would be ok as a compromise but they should just do it 7 too.

I asked the guy at legacy if it would have been cheaper to just use stainless instead of material and labor cost for cerekote. He said cerekote was better for corrosion resistance and I said except you don't coat the bore and bore corrosion resistance is the main reason we want stainless in the first place. I told him nitriding was more appealing to me than cerekote.

To get some things right frome the start wouldn't cost any more. Like the twists, the mag box length, the stocks not being shaped like a hogue, a stiff forend, a soft recoil pad, a decent trigger, barrel lengths and contours that balance. Howa did ok on some of the twists on the minis. The 8 twist 223 is better than a 9 at least but they should have just went 7. All the companies still doing 9.5 twist 7 mags and 10 twist 243s just drive me nuts.

And why can everyone figure out how to make their short actions fit a 6.5 prc at 2.96 and not do that for all their other short actions. Many of them leave all their other short actions at 2.83 or so. And those that do 223 on their standard shorts block the mag box to limit length to about the same 2.26" you get from an AR mag. Not usually tough to fix but why not just block them a little looser giving you at least 2.5" or so.

One company told me their boxes are long enough for factory ammo and they see no reason to accommodate hand loaders. I said there's one reason, so hardliners will buy your rifles and be happy with them. I said your customers are not your enemies it wouldn't hurt to do them a solid once in a while especially when it costs you nothing extra.

It's like all the years I fought optic companies trying to get mil turrets with mil reticles instead of moa with mil. At some point you just realize that many in the industry don't know what they're doing enough to even know how to ask the right questions.

Does anyone here know steel material costs well enough to estimate about the difference between a block of blued steel vs a block of stainless large enough to machine an action out of? Or the difference in material cost between say 4150 bar stock and 416r stainless bar stock for making barrels?

I wonder what data legacy would get if they called barrel manufacturers like brux, bartlien, pacnor, hart, krieger, rock etc and asked them if their customers preferred stainless or blued steel barrels. I'm pretty convinced that most shooters that are into it more than just a weekend deer hunt every few years would all prefer stainless.

And the guys that just hunt once in a while but don't know much about guns wouldn't stop from buying a stainless rifle if the price wasn't much different and that's what was available. Some genuinely prefer the old blued walnut look but that's not the cheaper end of the market anyways. I wouldn't see a guy turning down say a stainless 700 sps because he really wanted the matte black unless he was a mall ninja going tacticool.

Bb

Not to derail the bashing of Legacy, but I contacted John1187 about making stainless thread adapters from 1/2-20 to 5/8-24, said it would be easy if folks would be interested in him doing a run. I've asked for 2, hit him up if you would be interested...

SC, hopefully someone at Legacy takes your post to heart.

lol I am slow learner and have many thousands into several builds thinking I'd get the warm and fuzzies...and I still have one of these abominations in my safe....so I'm allowed, I was in the game early on these things

but once I have it figured out...you'll know about it

end of day when you get in the howa mini game...you will be left wanting, doesn't matter how much you spend, because 'right' is out there and as soon as you put hands on right it's game over, you mind won't let it go lol, and for those that think they are great and accept that's great, maybe you haven't held or had 'right' so don't know the difference...my base ruger American grendel feels way better and of much higher quality and puts a smile on my face when I pick it up....my custom ultralight howa build in the stocky's p1sses me off when I pick it up, feels cheap, I wanna throw it out a window

If someone has an action, about any gunsmith can put a stainless barrel from an aftermarket source... do people forget that option?

not at all, at some point one gives up on the costs, that was where I finally drew the line, not another cent goes into a howa, my kids can pound this last one into oblivion

I've got two Howa minis, with sequential serial numbers. I bought them when Whitakers Guns was selling them for $300.00
Actually bought 3 of them, with one intended for a handicapped Marine Corps buddy, which I gave to him as a present, as he doesn't have a lot of money, and desired a 223 to hunt with.

I really haven't put any more money into them, than what I paid for them.. except for a scope and a set of rings for each one. Not the most accurate 223s I have, but they still get the job done on what I bought them for.

Guess I should count myself Lucky for not being one of those, that starts to throw a lot of money into something, that in the long run never really gets better. Ya solve one issue and another pops up always. The few rifles I've had, that I figured were basket cases, I sold them to a few gunsmith friends, with them wanting the action for a build for another customer.
I pretty much purchase firearms when the price is good, so each time I sold one, that could have been a money pit, I sold it for what I paid for it. Selling it to a gunsmith, was what I did instead of just dumping the gun to some other unsuspecting guy, to be a basket case for him. Guess few of us think that way... I just don't sell my problems to someone else and take the money and run... can't find any honor in that at all. but that is just me.

yup, cheap guns that shoot good, it's a segment

a lot of us see that barrel and action, true to size for cartridge length class, and we see much more potential, we keep asking for more, we keep trying to build it into it's potential...so for those of us that aren't looking for the cheap guns that shoot well....we will always be left wanting when it comes to these howa's, legacy and howa has been told repeatedly that they have a great piece of metal and they are surrounding it with complete garbage and that there's a market for a real rifle on that piece of steel....crickets, they have only put more lipstick on the pig and tried to pass it off as giving us what we want....it's not

potential is all you can get from them and for those of us who wish they could rise to that potential will be left wanting in the end

if they actually try again hopefully they bring in a couple key people who've handled all the proper manufactured rifles we talk about and use/prefer, tikka, Kimber, x-bolts, Hawkeye's, fieldcrafts, 700's even...spend sometime with the rifles that qualify as real rifles and then make your goals list and execute, the hard part is done, they have the action, even the barrel....just stop with carbon steel and give stainless, get your threads right and everything else, call it the signature line, raise the price, but build a real stock, real magazines, bottom metals, trigger/safety etc. Quit playing bottom of the barrel, sitting on a gem with potential and zero clue. Does it need to say vanguard on it? Well then facking do it! But don't forget to fix that 2-stage trigger and safety knob...don't miss any of the things I listed or you won't have done it right the first time.

ultimately the better option is one of the other manufacturers who knows how to build rifles recognize the x39 case and give us scaled actions in the materials we want and rifles built around them in the materials we want, it's a worthy case that is going nowhere but up, get on it boys...we want quality lightweight scaled stainless hunting rifles built around the x39 case...not just a bunch of budget rigs which is all we get now or larger actions blocked down to the stubby case...build true AR length actions scaled accordingly, no fat...we don't want the fat, we don't want the cheap materials, we don't want the bottom of barrel budget

not a chance legacy/howa understands any of that lol so why even bother trying to explain to them any of it, they can stick with 'their data' and stepping on their own d1cks as they have from day 1

Nope, but I don’t want to spend $600 or more and wait who knows how long if there’s another way.

Keep in mind this is from the geniuses who brought us such great decisions as plastic bottom metal and dangly magazines on a mini action. It's almost like Remington's marketing people went over to Legacy Sports - maybe we'll see an Etronx Mini for their next trick.

To be fair, the dangly mags date back to at least 1889, and even the much-loved CZ527 had them, excepting only the M3 version, .223 only. The plastic does suck, and has no place on an otherwise solid rifle. I’ve read that newer shooters prefer DMs over other options, and maybe that’s true, but they could’ve come up with something more robust. The guard really does look like something off a toy.

I was able to score a new stock for my recently liberated blued 6.5, and after assembling it tested it for function with some dummies. That plastic mag is noisy, not just cheesy.

So Brownells got a bunch of them; sold out quickly; and there is no demand?

Makes sense.

🤔

Crazy. Seems like they’d sell everyone they’d make.

This old Boomer suspects that if they offered a SS Mini with a standard Howa hinged floorplate, they’d sell like hotcakes at $600 to maybe even $700.

Anyway, like my Fieldcraft, I’m glad I jumped right on this one. Now I just need some needy sort to answer my ad for the blued one……

I would buy another if available. I do wish Legacy/Howa would offer a decent hinged floor plate or better yet a blind magazine version.

As much as I like stainless rifles, I passed on the new stainless Mini's from Brownells. My blued Grendel and 223 both shoot very good, and I'm keeping them for that reason. The Grendel has been fancied up with OG bottom metal and a Stockys carbon fiber stock. The 223 is just like it came from the factory. If Howa would market the Mini in a stainless with the hinged floorplate like the full size 1500's have, I'd be in the market for several different chamberings, even if I had to the replace that chunky stock.

I just moved my aftermarket stuff over and at the same time swapped scopes and went to a rail for flexibility. Lost some weight along the way too. Once I sell the old one, the cost will be minimal. Who knows, maybe these SS one will command a premium someday if Legacy continues to insist no one wants SS.

About four or so years ago I bought a new stainless Howa 1500 6.5 Creedmoor for less than $600. If Howa can manufacture the full size version for that price, they can most certainly make a Mini exactly as they do the regular size rifle, in the same price range. I believe in Howa's mind, they view the Mini as a rifle that the people using AR's want in a bolt action, and that means with a detachable magazine, and in calibers that are most seen in the AR's. If Howa would wake up and see the light, I believe they would see that what most people want in the Mini has nothing to do with a detachable plastic magazine. Of course, I also have little doubt that Howa will continue to make decisions that make little sense.

Legacy makes decisions based on selling rifles which they do very well. Everyone would like to armchair QB what legacy should bring to market, but they have been in the business for a minute and they know the gun business is a fickle bitch. Gun companies come and go like the wind. I like the guns I have bought from them and they are affordable enough that I can run them stock or modify as I see fit. Stainless is cool, but I probably represent a majority of hunters / shooters who won't pay a premium for it as it has no practical advantage for my uses. I don't like the look and if I were concerned with rust I would rattle can it, which I would probably do to a stainless rifle anyway.