Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Anyone Else Have Pre 64 "itis"??

The new M-70s are fine and I have several, but the quality of workmanship in the pre '64s considerably outweighs the minor design improvements in the new models. I would expect a new rifle built to the quality of a mid 50s M-70 would cost $2000 - $3000 today. I guess a Dakota 76 comes the closest to replicating the quailty of a pre 64.

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Hopefully D'Arcy Echols, Brian Bingham, David Miller, Lon Paul or some of our other talented and gifted builders will weigh in here - as in their opinion the classics are much more consistent to build into custom rifles than the pre-64's.

Kimber does it better than Winchester ever has,or likely will...though I'd get giddy over something that trumped a Montana................

Those guys may believe that but, if so, I would like to hear their reasoning. I often see guys talking about the design improvements in the new models but don't know what they might be
I don't think the pre-64 action is the pinnacle of action design but I do think it is better in most areas than the classics. This is especially true of the pre-war models.
The bolt sleeve threads almost always fit better. The bolt body is one piece. The receiver threads are complete with no gaps like on the classics. The bolt stop on the pre-war models actually transfers force to the receiver rather than just to the pin like the new one's. The cocking cam isn't split by a silver solder joint and is harder and smoother.
The advantage the Classic does have is action length. That about wraps it up. It's no better dimensionally and all design changes were made to ease manufacturing and not to improve function in any way.
From what I have seen so far, the FN Model 70s may have the best receiver of all Model 70's and the bolt and bolt sleeve are better than the classic's. Unfortunately, they stopped short of making a one piece bolt or changing the breeching system.
None of my pre-64 rifles are anything like original though I can put them back if I wish. I do really like them. When I build a rifle on a Winchester action, I'm usually pretty happy with the result. They look right and they shoot right. I like working with them. GD

Don't have it yet?

Kimber? Maybe in an alternate universe! GD

A spanking good line-up there!!
That's what a collection looks like !!

I don't think Kimber's round action with washer recoil lug and screwed on bolt handle is even in the running.

I'm certainly no expert when it comes to gunsmithing,but I spoke with Gene Simmillion once about building a rifle in a magnum chambering,and he said we would both be happier if we used a Classic; Phil is right as these "top end" smiths seem to prefer the Classic action......

....but I think that's the point...by the time guys like Penrod,Ecols, Simmillion, etc., get done with a Classic with a full blown metal job,it is hardly the same action that came out of the factory...

I took delivery yesterday of a Classic Stainless in 375H&H.With two pre 64's in that caliber it was hard to justify.....but the rifle was bedded in an Echols Legend by Simmillion,and gone over for function,etc...has been to Africa and Alaska...if Simmillion worked it over,that's good enough for me...

Another great one IMHO....loved the Riiamiki(sp?)short action jobs and those I've had have been tackdrivers.....ditto the 222's..................as a platform for a 7/08,an old one converted from 243 would be tough to beat IMHO.....Sako perfected the "short action" long before many even cared.

Bob, I'd like to see a pic and details of that...

I have a mild case of the itis. So far I have the following: .243 FW, .270, .06, 300 H&H (x2), & .338.

Petr: I am taking it to the range in about an hour for a maiden voyage...I'll take the camera,and shoot a few photo's for you. If you drop me a PM with email, I can get the photos to you quicker....I don't know how to post pics here.

I've had it, lost it, got it back, lost it, became infected again. I think it may be a chronic condition. There are worse "itis's" to have.

Currently have "LRI". aka: Light Rifle Itis

I am a avid pre 64 and Mauser fan, or rather a control feed fanatic, having seen too many foopaws with push feed rifles over the years on dangerous game hunts, and I've seen a few big'un get away because of push feeds, now I don't intend to start that age old arguement, this is only my opinnion as to what I use, not what someone else chooses, as what others use is of no concern to me...

My old 300 H&H is a pre 64, looks like stainless steel but that is from too many hours in a saddle scabbard, the stock is exhibition drift wood, the action is worn slicker n snot, and it still shoots right at a half inch with most loads and most loads hit the same POI..My sons got the .270 and the 300 Win. Mag. and they are much nicer but not any better. The rest are custom 98 Mausers and I have one Ruger 77 but I had it fixed! it has a control feed and a 3 pos. M-70 safety, it is the 30-06 and its pretty rough looking also, but again it shoots littlel tiny groups, 3 or 10 shots no matter...

I do like the pre 64s, they are truly the rifle mans rifle. wood and blued steel has a warmth about it that I cannot feel with platic and SS that reminds me of my wifes can opener!

"platic and SS that reminds me of my wifes can opener!"

great line!

Ah, you got it! What are you going to make brass out of?

There are a couple of pre 64 70's at the Armoury in New Preston, CT. One is a 243 Featherweight shooter. It has a like new bore and the action has not been worked much. Its stock is marked up enough and also the bottom metal is scarred so I would not call it a collector unless you don't have one. If you don't have a pre 64 70 then I would buy it just like that. As I recall its about $1250.

They also have a 257 Roberts Standard there for about $2200. I did not look at that one close.

They are open Thursday thru Saturday only.

Since they were never made in left hand I have less than zero interest in them.

I have owned probably a dozen plus pre-64 Model 70's and (6) newer USRAC and Winchester versions. These ranged from a 1936 Mod 70 Carbine to a couple each of Alaskan (.338 WM's, .300 H&H's) versions. I still own a Super Grade (1949), .270 Winchester. This in no way makes me an expert, just familiar with the breed.

Most of these pre-64's of mine were magnums or Super Grade rifles which I wish that I still had. A divorce ended most of this relationship. I am just thankful that I still own a couple of Model 70's and look forward to buying one of the new models soon. Winchester Model 70, Made in America, it has a good ring to it.

I have 150 pieces of new Remmy 300 H&H. I could also neck down 416 Rem, 375 H&H, and 8mm RM; or I could neck up 7 STW. This is a good ACK to have in that light.

I have often said the Classic is a better design. It just is not put toegther wich as much quality (IE, receivers being .003" out of true) as the pre 64s.

BTW, was there in drop off in quality in the 60s with pre 64s?