Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters MPBR....270W/130gr.

Pot head, again meet kettle...

Jeff and I have communicated many times on a variety of subjects and we find that we don't agree on practically anything!

.....but he does not take it personally,and neither do I...

I also communicate with lots of others who post here,by phone and email (I was on the phone for 45 minutes yesterday with Dober);two of my closest younger buddies(avid shooters/hunters both and widely traveled)show up at the range with a wide array of solid gear,some expensive,some not so,replete with turrets, variables, McSwirly,etc.....

I make fun of the McSwirly's and big scopes,the 300 and 338 RUM's and they make jokes about my pipsqweak 270's and 4X scopes and mousy wooden and synthetic stocks dating from the 80's.We laugh at the generation gaps and differences in tastes and methodologies,and plan hunts together.

Anthony and I shoot 500 yards together;he spins turrets on the 300 RUM,and I twist the 2.5-8 to 6X on the 7 mag and use the bottom post to aim.POI is the same for both;groups, ditto.

Point is,I don't knock him for his method,and he doesn't knock me for mine;we both kill game.We both know this.There is no "one upmanship" as is seen on here.I don't tell him he's "wrong",and he doesn't call me a "pompous prick" or tell me I'm "obtuse" for not using turrets, because he knows I have been doing it "my way",successfully for 30+years.....He knows full well the advantages and disadvantages of spinning turrets;and the advantages of my methods....

But for some reason....on here.....you mention a method,cite experience doing it a certain way...and the name calling begins by some who disagree,and the childish behavior kicks in......

One thing I've learned in 30 years of practicing law....when the conversation degenerates into personal attacks and name calling....you just lost the debate,even if you are "right". Some on here are not grown up enough to "get it".

Only thing that rubs me wrong is when I put up how I do it and the attacks are thrown my way FIRST by folks that have NEVER done it.

You ain't a bad guy Bob but it's best to not discuss that which you do not know, unless of course you are JO.

MPBR? i'm not familiar with this term, can anyone explain?

Its maximum point blank range. The greatest distance that you can shoot directly at an animal without hitting over or under your kill zone. For my 270 its about 325 yards.

Cheers understood. I'm new to this site and you guys use terms that i'm not used to

That cuts both ways.......

Peace brother

Amen

Interesting thread.
I have in the last year gone to my 270 with a 130 partition as my all around rifle, which in Southern Idaho is all a guy needs.
I get 3100fps and I am zeroed for 200 yards which puts me around 6" low at 300 and 20" low at 400.
Simple and easy to remember.
YMMV.

I have never used turrets. Using MPBR has worked fine for me, with the flat shooting calibers I have used. However, I am not along range hunter and have only taken a couple shots on game over 300 yards.
Most of the game I have shot hasn't given me the time to deploy a rig like JWP uses. And this includes hunting in Montana, Alaska and Canada.

I can't understand why this thread got so acrimonious.

Turrets work, as does MPBR, and in fact they can work together. And you don't have to use a rifle that offends your esthetic senses, either. I have several very nice walnut-stocked rifles equipped with reliable scopes that can easily be cranked up for longer ranges, and look like "normal" scopes.
One of them is my Heym .300 Winchester, with a Schmidt & Bender Summit that can easily be cranked up for shots out to 750 yards, though I have never taken a shot that far with it. The adjustment turrets are normal size, with caps, but are marked for cranking and can be easily rezeroed because they're marked that way too.

In fact many of today's scopes have adjustment dials that can be loosened to be set to a zero mark, with hashmarks that tell how many clicks you've cranked. As somebody already said, it isn't rocket science.

[/quote] In fact many of today's scopes have adjustment dials that can be loosened to be set to a zero mark, with hashmarks that tell how many clicks you've cranked. As somebody already said, it isn't rocket science. [/quote]

I thought I was only simpleton that noticed this. After zeroing all my scopes at 100 yds, I then spin the dial until the zero mark reads 'zero". It is easy to make adjustments from there w/o even having turrets, although it does take a few seconds longer and a penny or other tool to spin the adjustment.

I pulled out of this discussion when I saw it going south. Some people are unable to agree to disagree. Just because one guy does something different doesn�t necessarily make the other guy wrong....Unless it is voting for Obama. This does not apply to those that haven't actually done anything and just like to speculate....

That's a fairly common argument....

I can understand not having time when hunting doves, or rabbits, or grouse....but not having time to make a shot on big game just doesn't wash with me where the far reaches of MPBR or the need for turrets would be concerned.

If the animal is aware of the hunter enough to make it spook, then that lends very little to the ability of the hunter to actually hunt....especially at "long" range, which is the crux of this "debate" as JO wants to call it.

The concept of turrets is easy, if one takes a second to understand it.....

Using a 200 yard, or 250 yard zero with turrets is actually employing a form of MPBR. From the muzzle to 200, or 250, it's a simple matter of holding on a kill zone and squeezing the trigger. My ten point last year walked himself right into that "MPBR" and I didn't have to twist anything on him. 205 yards, bang flop, with a 208Amax out of my '06.

If the hunter is doing things right, an animal that is beyond that 200, or 250, yard zero is easily ranged, and easily range compensated for by twisting an ele turret. The shot is made, a follow up shot is readied just in case, and once death is confirmed the ele turret is returned to zero.

An accurate method to determine range, a range card (confirmed by actually shooting it) and an intimate knowledge of the shooting platform is all that's needed.

For me that's an LRF, a detailed dope card (much of which is committed to memory), and I shoot constantly off season.

There are sensible limitations that anyone with common sense would adhere to. Certain wind conditions will prevent me from taking a shot at game regardless of having a windage knob and a dope sheet. I also limit myself to a maximum effective range with each chambering. This is dictated by the level of energy at that range, and what the bullet will do there. With turrets I can certainly hit beyond that range but I won't depend on the physics to do the job it needs to do on the animal.

The animal too, is a determining factor. With my 243AI I will most definitely take a shot on a groundhog or coyote out to 1K, but the same load will never be fired at a deer beyond 500 yards. To make a 500 yard shot with that rifle and it's 200 yard zero, I would need to dial 7.25 MOA elevation. A full twist gives 15 MOA. Spinning to 7.25 on my M1's takes about one second....if a person can recognize whole numbers and count by 1/4's.

My guess is that typing the correct characters on a key board is much more difficult.....

Sure, everything I've mentioned can be done with dots instead of turrets, and to some extent MPBR, but to me those are just not as precise as dialing dope and pasting crosshairs. Not every shot on game is made under ideal conditions. There are enough external forces at play that without as much inherent precision as possible, a miss or wounding is too easy.

Noone will ever convince me that they can judge a distance by eye and hold over a shot with more precision than I can do with an LRF and turrets....ain't happening.

Turrets give you the precision not found BETWEEN the dots, and not found out further than MPBR allows. Anyone that feels they need to argue that is either one helluva great shot, or hasn't shot much at all.......

Lets see here�..you live in beautiful HI, have a son as a hunting partner, get to hunt Axis deer, have fresh venison in the cooler and need our support? You got a lot of nerve. Good thing you didn�t post this about mid February when we were buried in 2 foot of snow

You sound like you got it pretty good !

LB..I can give you the best advice ever...honest....if you take me on an Axis hunt..I promise I'll teach you everything you need to know......




Ingwe

"In fact many of today's scopes have adjustment dials that can be loosened to be set to a zero mark, with hashmarks that tell how many clicks you've cranked."

Thought I'd put this out there in case no one has seen how the Vortex Viper E and W adjustments work. That turret knob is spring loaded. Don't know if you could/should leave the E cap off for turret use in the field though.

It works well on the Vortex and the Conquest.

Thank you brother....Hawaiian born and bred

It's HOME!!!!

Just want to expedite the LEARNING CURVE a wee bit...I know nothing can substitute TIME in the field,,,,

Alohaz!

Ro