Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting Standard Cartridges for Elk

Well said 270.

So 300WBY, now you're reduced to qouting a gunwriter and throwing around energy figures... the last refuge of the naive I'd say.

I couldn't give two figs what "energy" I hit an elk with... all I require is enough velocity to open the bullet and a decent diameter for blood leakage. A 308 Win has enough velocity at 500 yards to open a 168 TSX reliably. Put the bullet where it needs to go and all I require is expansion and penetration, which the 308/TSX combo has in spades.

300 WBY, you did in fact say that you'd only gone afield after elk with 7mm Rem, 300 Win or 300 WBY magnums. That's not an assumption, that's an admission. It may be possible that you saw someone shoot an elk once with a standard caliber rifle, but I doubt it. If it performed adequately, you seem to have ignored it, but if the animal ran away, I'm sure you'd be blaming the caliber.

I reach no conclusions from the elk that ran 200 yds after being shot with a 300 WBY. The ones hit with a 300 Win dropped just as quickly as the ones I have seen shot with a 270 or 308. The 300 WBY animal was shot at 250 yds....the ones with the 300 win from 300 yds to much further...leica rangefinder measured. I have six one shot kills the past seven years from 320 yds to beyond, all with a 270. The only one that ran was one that I hit in the liver. She laid down at about 600 yds, and I got her.

No, if you follow my logic, from what I have seen, the 270/30-06 class rifles are adequate for elk, and bigger stuff would be suitable as well. I've seen a good half dozen elk dropped with 300 magnums, and one shot with a 7mm Rem Magnum. I am not claiming the 300 WBY is inadequate, it just happens to be one data point, so it's not particularly telling about anything. The animals also ran downhill, which made it easier to go further.

I just choose to not jump to conclusions with inadequate data.

And, BTW, I hunt elk with a 300 WSM or a 270. I am just not clouded with any delusion that the 270 is inadequate. I get pass throughs at ranges that I will not post on this forum, using Nosler partitions. You like your Weatherby, fine. But anyone using a 30-06 or the like is well served.

No need to defend it , a little explanation was nice tho. If you want to use the 300 then by all means go for it, but until you have some true experience with the other cartridges, it may be best to quit bad mouthing them.
I've killed almost as many elk with the 243 as you have with your 300. Same with the 06. I've shot and seen elk shot with quite a few other cartridges and to tell the truth I've seen little difference in effect on the animal.
But your statement of bigger is better, but the 340,378, and 416 is to much sort of baffles me.

I'm learning lots even though things are getting heated.

My reasons for asking....

I'm on the downhill side of 50 and while it can be slowed down by visits to the gym, staying active, pacing my effort and so on, there's a certain amount of deterioration in one's body. Elk hunting in Alberta is tough, especially when hunting the high country and having to hike 5 to 8 miles a day with equipment and a 9 pound rifle. I have a wonderfully accurate 338 Win but it gets heavier with each passing year.

Going guided on horseback really isn't an option as those of you with college aged kids will agree. Besides being cheap, part of doing it yourself is in the challenge.

Having established that the 7# 30/06 that I use for deer is adequate for elk, what I'm interested in is this: Given that I may have to do some compromising (pass up long shots, avoid difficult angles, etc.), what are these compromises, what do I have to be careful about.

Thanks to your responses, I have a pretty good picture. I've never hunted with a small magnum before, 338 Win has been my smallest with the other a 375 H&H. I'm leaning toward the "small magnum for 400+ yard school" but with the practice that I get (300 rounds of 30 cal, 100 of other centerfire and a couple of bricks of 22), a 200 yard shot is a slam dunk, 250 is probably certain but at 300 with wind and exertion, I'm not sure I want to chance that on a live animal.

Having established that 300 is my max under "ideal" conditions, are there any limits set by standard cartridges. From what I see, just the angles if I understand your comments.

Thanks again!

Boreas I like the 165 gr bullet in the 06. My no 1 prefers Hornadys interloc. At 200 yds that bullet will do a complete pass thru on an elks ribcages.
My self I think 300 yds is a plenty to be shooting at game regardless of what the cartridge is. Just to many things can happen to the bullet between the muzzle and the critter beyond 300.
Find a good load in your rifle with a 165 or heavier bullets go forth have a good time, and post the pics of your bull for us.

A man after my own heart <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />! How does the recoil from your 7lb 30-06 compare to your 9lb 338mag?

Into what, a concrete block? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

No flames intended, but do you have any reasonable amount of data to back up that claim?

I'm genuinely curious, as I have a 308 that I'd like to take elk hunting and the TSX looks like a nice bullet.
I'm leery about the cartridge having enough whizz to open it up, though.

KS

I taken Elk with 270,30-06 ,358 norma ,375 H&H and now I shoot a 45-70. All will do the job with good shot placement and knowing what your limitations are. I have notiest that some big bore shooter have a real problem with recoil and should spend more time with their rifle or go down to a lighter round.

I�m certainly not naive enough to reduce myself to getting personal. How about you? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Yes I said that I have only hunted with those calibers. You, on the other hand, are the one that said I never saw an elk dropped with a standard cartridge. You don�t know me so don�t presume to make judgments about what I believe. If I saw one you doubt it, if it worked I ignored it, if it didn�t I laid blame? That�s all you man�.


Again, that�s all you. I never said anything of the sort. What I DID say was that I PREFER .300mags for elk. I know the 270 works on elk all the damn time I just said I like a bigger gun.

As I mentioned previously - I sometimes, depending on my tag situation, will be hunting elk and deer at the same time. Don�t you think a .340wby+ might be a bit much for deer? I like the .300 because it hits hard and it�s not into a realm of what I consider really punishing recoil. I can practice with my 300 reasonably often and have no ill effects induced from the recoil.

300, pointing out the obvious is not the same as "getting personal"...

Killsoft, a 168 TSX started at 2,750 fps will be going 1900 fps at 500 yds... while not super fast, that's enough to open one up. I used the 308 example as many consider it a marginal round for elk. I don't. If you're concerned about your bullet opening at long range use a Partition. Regardless, very few elk are shot at those ranges and are only for those that have practiced at those ranges, have a rangefinder, a steady rest and no cross wind.

Of course the 30-06 or .270 will kill Elk cleanly and effectively. NO ONE who has been there and done that argues otherwise. I took a nice 5x5 with my 270 and a 130 gr Nosler Partition but it wasn't by choice, it just happened to be what I had in my hand at the time and fortunately the range was very short. Interestingly enough on that occasion I immediately decided that the VERY BEST Elk rifle and caliber of all is the one you have in your hand when a big bull is standing right in front of you. Most of my western friends do tend to use non magnum calibers on Elk and I think I understand why. They all have much more time to hunt and scout than I do. They can afford to be more picky about what kind of shot they take and none have the money on the line for the hunt that I usually do. Most traveling hunters of my acquaintence tend toward magnums because they give you more options in the field. Guys, I love my 30-06 and have killed a truckload of game with it but trying to argue it is the equal of my .338 or .375 for anything over 500lbs. is just silly. IT IS NOT!!!!!!!!! I'm not talking about any stats I found in the back of some reloading manuel either. I know everyone on the internet always gets under 100 yards and ALWAYS gets their bullet into just the right spot having laid their tackdriver across their sweat stained old battered Stetson. Down and out with one well placed shot in less time than it takes to tell about it. Well, it doesn't usually work that way for me. Hell, I've missed! I've also put the bullet in less than the ideal place and I've put it in what looked to be exactly the right place but but it seemed nobody told the damned animal it was dead! If all of that hasn't happened to you then you are either very lucky or haven't pulled the trigger on enough game yet. Good hunting.

JBD, I have killed elk with the 338 WM and I have killed them with the 30-06. The 338 definately makes more of a visible impression when it hits. However, "dead is dead" and a bull hit with either correctly is not long for the world... elk are singularly unimpressed with "energy."

"The best elk rifle is whatever the best elk hunter has in his hands."

Well, that got me so lathered up I'm going to go apply for another Elk hunt - no foolin' got the Wyoming hunt application right here on the desk. Good luck to you all.

Nothing personal intended just asking a question.
As a matter of fact I don't think any of those would be overkill. I don't buy into ovekill under kill theories.
If a person did buy into that stuff then you'ld have to believe that none of the straightwalled handgun cartridges are adequate for killing game, and that would bring a huge uproar from folks that use the 44 mag and hot loaded 45 colts (myself included)
I also don't see the benefits of using a belted 30 unless a person moves up into the 200 gr+ bullets where the real advantages for those cartridges really lives.

In all fairness to 300WBY he has pick one of the best Elk calibers there is. I use the 300WBY most of the time at 500 yards it has more energy than my 30-06 has at 300 yards.

That being said I have killed a lot of Elk in my time when one lives on a Ranch these things happen. I have killed a half a dozen Elk with the 6mm Remington the longest shot with it was 290 yards with little to no meat damage hard to beat that

I have killed Elk with my 25-06 270 30-06 7mm .300Win .338Win and all of My Weatherby calibers that I own which include the .257WBY through the 340WBY.

If I�m shooting over 300 yards I will usually pick up a magnum. If I plan on shooting 500Yards out comes the .300Wby or my .340 maybe it�s just me but I like the .300 better than the 340.

You can kill Elk with any standard or magnum caliber. The trick is to take your time and make a good shot if you do not have a good shot don�t shoot its just that simple.

"dead is dead and a bull hit with either correctly is not long for the world..."

Brad's got it nailed. The .300 Mags are great for elk, but there are no flies on the .30-06.

And by the way, the energy figures for the .30-06 stated earlier don't match with the .30-06 that I shoot. I've used the 180-gr. Nosler Federal HE load in mine for elk, and it produces 2100 ft.-lbs at 300 yards.
This year, after reading JJHack's recommendation on this site, I put down an elk at approx. 300 yards with the 165-gr. Hornady Interbond bullet, loaded by Hornady in their Light Magnum line. I think the 300 yard energy level is around or just under 2000 ft.-lbs. The bullet made a pass-through at a slight angle, entering the rib cage and exiting the shoulder. Mr. Elk went about 20 yards and collapsed.

Brad calling me naive is getting personal. If you want to get personal get personal, don�t side step it can call it something it isn�t.

Brad, calling me naive is getting personal. If you want to get personal get personal, don�t side step it and call it something it isn�t.

--edit for spelling