Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Congress woman Gabby Giifords has been shot.

I agree and while I am all for us modeling good behaviors to others I value being a father and husband enough that this is one area where I am going to err on the side of caution. If you want to pack at such events, it's your own business, but I'm not going to.

Thanks for trying to stick up for me.

Radical, huh? You think I'm radical? Interesting. All I did was accept the premise "Everyone owns himself" and try to follow it to its logical conclusions. Maybe that is radical.


In my world, if somebody commits a crime (initiates force) against you, you're the only one who's qualified to determine what retaliation is justified. I have no standing to decide, because the crime wasn't committed against me. The State has no standing to decide, because the crime wasn't committed against it.

Of course, if you decide to delegate that decision to somebody who makes a profession of those decisions and is much more likely than you are to come up with a solution that will address the problem without completely screwing up the rest of your life, that's your prerogative. But the decision should be ultimately yours, if you're the victim.

It's just like hiring a plumber. If your pipe freezes and breaks, nobody should say you're not allowed to try to fix it yourself. It's your pipe, your house, your problem, and you have every right to do what you think is appropriate. Lots of people, though, will decide to hire a plumber to take care of it, because they believe his solution will be better and more professional than their own.


That's what they say, for sure. It's interesting, though, how they finance their efforts with the very same sort of extortion that every other politician uses. Also, notice how they always conveniently fail, so that they don't actually have to give up any power.


And The_Real_Hawkeye is a minarchist libertarian.

Ken, thanks for the reminder; I had come to the point where I though the word statesman had become completely obsolete...

EXACTLY so.

I wholeheartedly agree.

Saying this, this way, or agreeing with it, might make Steelhead/me/you an azzhole for being so blunt with the facts. However, that does not change the factual content of what he said.

He pegged Barak squarely.

Off into Barakistan we go, as the Barakian attention-whore twists this thread right down the rabbit hole with him.

or cars, what if he would of driven a legally purchased car at high speed into the crowd? would they be crying to outlaw cars?

Short of banning firearm ownership and becoming a Soviet style police state, there will always be firearms, and there will always be kooks.

And the disgruntled/kooks still choose places where firearms in the hands of good Americans are unlikely......whether it be a school, university, an intentionally disarmed military building, liberal political event, or commercial airliner.

Let some kook try this at some of the Tea Party events I attended here in Colorado this summer........where 10% of the attendees were openly packing.......felt pretty safe from any assasins or kooks.....



Casey

CBS News is now reporting:
The gunman used a Glock with an extended magazine.

My wife even questioned the reports last night, saying
he must have reloaded. I guess a 30 rnd mag would explain that.

That's pretty much what I thought you'd say. Thanks for looking out for me.


That surprises me, though. Which position do you find untenable?

Barak,

Politicians and you are a lot alike. You feel what you are saying is correct and politician feel what they say and do is correct. Politicians do what they feel is best for the country not what they know is best for the country. No one is perfect, read the bible, you'll learn we all have flaws. God the father, Jesus the son, and the Holy spirit are perfect, we on earth are not. Politicians make mistakes just like you and I make mistakes.

You said they are a step or two below a armed robber, You are a step or two above a nut job.
In no way shape or form were any of the victims doing anything to harm anyone. There is no justification for that mans action. She was holding a meeting to hear the people she represents. I don't see how that is/was hurting anyone.

Like I said I have never had an issue with you, but saying it is ok to kill innocent people (yes politicians and judges are innocent people in this case)is crazy! If they do something wrong you vote them out (their punishment) not kill them and people around them.

+1, though I understand Cole Younger's point too.

Speaking of the kooky ones...

Well said.

This whole thing is a terrible tragedy for the victim's and their families. Just no other way to look at it. I always enjoy your posts Enrique.

Loughner scheduled to be arraigned at 11 am. IF anyone knows,is the jail part of the court complex or are the inmates housed in a separate facility separate from the courthouse?

Is vehicle transport necessary?

I think that I know now what a cauterized conscience is.

Superb choice of words.

I won't even get into a discussion of the worth of a politican's life vs. another human being--I disagree with you completely, but arguing the point with you won't do any good.

What's untenable is your attempt to assign some kind of rationale or justification for the gunman's selection of his victims. Because there is none.

The guy is insane, and I'm sure this will come out at trial. He had no reason to choose to kill a politician, judge, or little girl, he just wanted to kill someone.

Only an idiot would attempt to rationalize it. Or someone completely out of touch with reality.

One thing that can be pointed out is this:
People want what they can't have. When Clinton in the 90's issued his ban on certain weapons the value and want for those guns went up. Extended mags were sought. After the ban everyone that wanted one got one. Companies that seen how they could capitalize on it did. A handgun with a 33 round mag is not needed. At least I don't. If I can't defend myself and end a threat with a few shots, I doubt I am gonna have enough time to unload 33 rounds down the range.
It is my belief that extended mags, more people with military style weapons and the likes are all the effect of gun control and the fault of Clinton.
Look at Mexico, people can't have guns their without a permit. very few own guns because of the cost and fees. That leaves the population at the mercy of law enforcement/government and criminals. Proof that gun control does not work.