Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Mike Vanderboegh, "If you try to take our guns, we'll kill you"

Well, nobody is ever going to accuse Mike of playing footsy, or mincing words, ....are they ?

The Reverend Martin is to be thanked for bringing this excellent piece up at right EXACTLY this time in American History.

What a dynamic and conflicted age we're living in,....here's some PROOF of that.

GTC

Link: http://www.examiner.com/conservativ...ill-kill-you?CID=examiner_alerts_article

"If you try to take our firearms, we will kill you"

June 28, 2011 3:04 pm ET

Anthony Martin

In the continually developing scandal revolving around the Holder Justice Department and its Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (known as the ATF or BATFE), it has become clear that the government concocted a scheme to run U.S. guns into Mexico in order to prop up its false contention that 'U.S. guns are arming the drug cartels.' It has also become clear that the government intends to use the bogus figures resulting from the illegal gun running scheme to make a case for draconian new gun control measures.

However, even now, after ATF whistleblowers put their lives on the line to expose the plot, after a ton of evidence has surfaced that implicates persons at the very top of the ATF and even the DOJ, and after it has been shown that at least 2 cold-blooded murders were committed with the very guns the ATF placed into the hands of the cartels, some 'journalists' still don't get it.

One such journalist, writing for the Miami Herald, placed the blame for Mexican gun violence squarely on 'deadly U.S. guns' and proceeded to call for gun bans.

Such a statement merely follows the script set by the ATF and DOJ brain trust when 'Project Gunwalker' or 'Gunrunner,' or as it is known in ATF circles, 'Operation Fast and Furious,' was first envisioned. Thus, the journalist is now merely nothing more than a mouthpiece and a patsy for the criminals in the Justice Department who implemented this dastardly deceptive plot.

Blogger Mike Vanderboegh, one of the 2 who first broke this story, fired off a letter in response to the Miami Herald article, in which he made it crystal clear that gun owners have no intention of allowing another round of gun bans, particularly not as a result of government treachery.

In response to a question one reporter asked him concerning gun control, Vanderboegh replied, 'If you try to take our firearms, we will kill you.'

Vanderboegh goes further to delineate the firmly held convictions of today's gun owners, who intend to remain firm in their resistance to government tyranny:

There are a considerable number of Americans -- well armed Americans -- who will not obey any further restrictions on our God-given, natural and inalienable rights when it comes to firearms. If, as I believe, that number amounts to a mere three percent of American firearm owners, that means you'll have to kill three million of us in a bloody civil war to achieve what you want. That doesn't count all the tyrannical, gun-grabbing sonsabitches that we'll be forced to kill in righteous self-defense before we meet our Maker, and you should know that we intend -- and have the skills and the means -- to make that more than a one-to-one ratio. The pile of bodies of the next American civil war that you unthinkingly advocate would be in the millions, and we'd almost certainly win anyway, simply because our will to live free is greater than yours to oppress us.

Please, do not extrapolate from your own cowardice. You think that if you convince the federal government to carry out your policy that we'll just meekly submit, because you cannot conceive of resisting yourself. We, on the other hand, have principles that we are willing to die for. Unfortunately for some, that means we are willing to kill in defense of those principles as well.


Lest the pinheaded minions of the 'submit to the law no matter what' crowd view Vanderboegh's statement as 'proof' that he advocates a violent revolution, he has stated on numerous occasions that gun owners are smart enough not to instigate any such course of action. If the first shot is fired, it will have to come from government oppressors bent on forcing citizens into submission. But at that point, average Americans who are now armed to the hilt, especially since 2007, will fight back, and that will result in a bloody rampage that nobody wants.

Be sure to catch my blog at The Liberty Sphere.

Visit my ministry site at Martin Christian Ministries.

A beginning of the second Revolutionary War? I wonder if his estimate that 3 percent of gun owners would fight is correct?
I think that in order to put up an effective fight "the people" would need to organize in advance.

Ernie

People do not need to organize. Organizing will get you killed faster than anything. Spontaneous combustion is what's needed.

Don't worry, when it happens all the usual suspects on here will take the government line hook, line, and sinker and then they will trumpet it loudly on here and other places denouncing the "kooks" who went down in a blaze of futility wearing their tinfoil hats. Then, they'll write some platitude about America being "...the most free country in the world" as they advise you to quit worrying so much because the next election will put a Republican in there and everything will be alright.

That about sums it up. Couldn't agree more.

Amazingly insightful post.

No, wait , You are s'posed to be wise.

Now I'm unamazed.

And in full agreement.

The reference to "3 percenter's" is that was the estimated amount of our populous that originally rose up against the British. Look what that created.
Steve

It was three percent of the population that were the backbone of the American Revolution.

Think about that for a bit.

I think Joe's point is that the 3% would not include the ones on here who make the most noise about resisting.

Shhh

There's a britt sitting next to me right now...


Went down to High Falls ( Rochester, ny) last night after an hour in Dinosaur and he was reading the plaques describing the erie canal, Washington defeating the Indians ( Seneca) and the Britts kicking ass on the French aholes who were here in ~ 1821...

At least the Britts whooped on the French before we sent the Britt's home....lol


I think the "quiet gun owners" will stand firm, if needed. Hopefully we can keep our Military from actions at home, but I also suspect many of our young hero's won't fire a shot against our citizens just because the president says to.


Another chance to thank our Veterans, current and with past service..... For allowing us the freedoms to speak our minds...


Allen

It is the quiet ones ya have to watch out for. Always was, always will be.

Excuse me for responding without having read the rest of the thread...but I find this kind of this refreshing in the EXTREME...its about time somebody quit pussy-footing around the big issue and tells it like it is...

This OP gave me a warm and fuzzy feeling....Thank You for that!

It reminds me of a discussion a bud and I were having during the dark Clinton Years...
he said " what we need is a bunch of old pharts who just don't give a schitt anymore..."

I quickly pointed out to him.." We ARE a bunch of old pharts who just don't give a schitt anymore...."

And also thank our forefathers who made The Republic and bravely stood for this great nation. They have passed the torch to us.

the leaders of the liberals have written that they would need to kill about 18 million of us americans to effect true and lasting democratic change

Nobody would be killing anybody.

It would be done incrementally, slowly restricting ammunition, gun sales. Outlawing certain models but "grandfathering" those alread out there. Soft registration at time of sale or transfer.

This generation would clung to their guns fiercely, but with restrictions on travel/places to shoot wouldn't get to use them much.

The next generation would inherit grandpa's guns but, ya know what, they could get in trouble for 'em and they didn't shoot much when they were younger anyhow.

Law becomes culture, this has happened in every state and nation where restrictive gun laws are passed. Pretty soon them kids are thinking they would be nuts to keep grandpas guns, expecially as they risk a felony.

Just give a constant amnesty for turn ins and the supply of guns out there trends steadily downwards.

Nary a shot fired, jsut takes 40 years to get most of 'em is all.

Birdwatcher

An awful LOT of folks just don't understand that there still remain vast, deep, and tranquil pools of what I'd call "American Certitude".

Washed and refreshed in these waters of liberty , we can calmly, unabashedly, and yes,...with CERTITUDE, make the comment per the OP.

I'm SO glad I was brought up that way.



GTC

BW, I could not agree more. But the key is ammo and primers. Hasbeen

I was brought up that way too...by a father who fought through Europe in WWII and saw first hand what happens to an oppressed, unarmed populace. It was instilled in me early that Absolutely Nothing is more important than to remain armed as a citizenry....Repeat... nothing....

"armed as a citizenry"

Nice word picture that.

Than of course there's those that spit out the word "Citizen" as though it's a slur.

WATCH them.

GTC

I agree that the vast majority of the 3% will not utter a word until lead starts flying. To pick a side, if anyone comes for my guns I'm relatively certain I'll die, but I'll kill more than one of them...a lot more. My dad was an avid collector, shooter and hunter. He made sure we understood the tool first, and then what it represented. He's in an Alzheimer's ward now, and I'm thankful only that he doesn't have to see this renegade government taking what he fought for apart, piece by piece.

You try to take my guns and I will kill you.

I'm proud to be in the 3%.

This all reminds me of a campfire conversation I had in Zimbabwe ten years ago with a couple PHs and a dude from NJ...when the topic came up he asked " What would you do?"

I just said " The war will start on my porch...."


He thought I was nuts..he had " too much to lose..." a business and a family....


I could only tell him, I promise if you dont do it, they'll drag your family out to the nearest alley and systematically put a bullet behind their ears...

Yup. Never underestimate the power of anger and and nothing left to lose.

Some of the best shots I ever met were cynical like you.

I doubt that will fly in the US of A, least ways where I been hangin'...

Steve,

The anger has been brewing since clinton disgraced the Office of the President of the United States, and, as Rush puts it so well, his (any liberal) willing accomplices in the media. The 1994 crime bill that targeted a type of shooter, not any type of weapon. Now, hussein, who openly hates this country and the principles it was founded on. All propagated and amplified by the lap dogs in the media. I find myself so angry sometimes I have to stop what I'm doing and take several deep breaths, count to 100, and hope my anger subsides. So far, that's worked. One day, if things don�t change course radically back to our constitutional roots, my anger won�t subside. I fear for my family on that day. I can only hope that it coincides with the door splintering open in the middle of the night..

That would be the mother of all insurgencies.

That would be wouldn't it.

You better not let Drag-Queen1960 hear ya' talkin' like that,....I can't even talk about shooting arsonists around here, without getting a ration of chit.

GTC

One of the most poetic and true things I have read in my ten short years here at the Campfire.

Looks like I could go down along with a lot of good company.

If they can take away your gun rights, they can take away all the others too. It happened in Europe in the 1930's & 40's.

To hussien, we're ALL "fly over" country and people. We don't matter, because we don't know what's really good for us; we need that nappy-headed, jug-eared treasonist, treacherous, community-organizer to tell us.

Hunter 1960 better pray he's not the among the hit-team sent to my house.

This ain't Europe. Tryin' to figure out how to do that skeleton hand in the sand with this one....

It's nice to know that there are still folks left in this country that value freedom......

Ml Garand. 100m.prone


I know a thing or three about violence

Er,....all the "Kevlar" in the world is not going to mitigate the impact involved there,....is it ?

GTC

All I can say is if they come at me dressed as tuna cans they are goners!

Nope. Three shots too. I have a supply of M63

That's a shootin iron! What is it?

Yep.


The ones who bark the loudest usually have the smallest bite.

my bedside gun is a Marlin Guide Gun in 45-70......after watching the video of that LA bank robbery where the thugs were wearing body armor my wife asked me once what would happen if someone broke into our house wearing body armor, though it will never happnen, would the kevlar stop a 405 grain hard cast lead bullet out of the Marlin?

i told her most definitely the vest would stop the bullet but it wont matter.....she asked why?.....told her it will take a couple weeks before their able to take in a deep breath in again cause its gonna crack and break ribs, stop the bullet itself or not the SOB is gonna hit like a freight train at household ranges

The weapon you have at your disposal os irrelevant. Whatever it is, it only has to work once; then you will be in possession of a well-maintained whatever is issued to your enemy, plus ammo. Here is some food for thought:

The Grey Man

Lots of brave talk here! I'm wondering....how many of you have ever been in combat or shot at???

You guys are correct. The standard estimate is 3% during the Revolutionary War. During WWII, 16 million men and women wore the uniform of this country, including my dad. Using 1945 census data as a guide and assuming all 16 million were in uniform at war's end, only 12% actually were in uniform. A lot smaller percentage actually fired weapons in anger. Allowing for losses, discharges, etc let's just say that at any one time during the war there was a total of 9% of Americans in uniform.

Today, there are somewhere between 80 million and 90 million gun owners in the US. If we assume that during an attempted gun grab by the government only 9% of them take up arms and fight back, they would form a military force some 8 million strong. We would outnumber our current military by about a 3-1 ratio BEFORE the inevitable desertions to our side. This would be the most formidable military force in the world.

I admire Mr. Vanderboegh, and will echo his statement here. "If you try to take our guns, we'll kill you".

I'll throw that statement right back in your face and ask the question...

How many had ever been shot at before the first time they WERE shot at? What's that? ALL of them? Yep, all of them so your question is moot. I'd be willing to bet the house that almost all who went off to WWII put on a brave face and went willingly to fight even though they were afraid. It's called bravery.

No...the question 'ain't' moot! This isn't WWII we're speaking to here! It's RIGHT NOW! The bravery of WWII Vets, Korea, VN, and our present conflicts are without question being tended by the same 'blood' of the previous conflicts! Change whiskey! That you're partaking of has your thinking [bleep] up!!

Just a thought, but given the complete absence of any effective firewalls on this site, have you thought about the fact that making a lot of noise about killing people could already have you on a "list" somewhere ? When SWAT kicks in your door, your 45-70 or whatever might let you get off one shot.

IMHO the most important thing is to be at least farther away than one tank of gas will take the "wreckers" (Atlas Shrugged) from any large population center.

What's happening in Greece today will be happening in England next week and will be here before you know it.

OR maybe the Yellowstone caldara will blow and it will all be moot.

First of all, I don't drink hard liquor so you can shove that comment where the sun don't shine.

Next, maybe I misunderstood what you said in your first comment, ("Lots of brave talk here! I'm wondering....how many of you have ever been in combat or shot at???") sure sounded like you were calling the guys here cowards or calling their conviction into question. With that in mind, your second post doesn't make a damned bit of sense to me. Did you or did you not insinuate that there are big talking cowards here on the fire?

I understand the question. And the answer is very relevent.

Faced with mortal danger, some will run, some will fight. No matter what generation we're talking about. The difference is the WHY.

Through the ages, gorrila fighters have come from many walks of life. So too the brave Marines and Soldiers of WWII. It's not where they came from or what experience they have, it's WHY they are fighting. Look how difficult it is to fight an "insurgency". Whether we agree with them or their tactics, it's their deep seeded belief in what they are doing that makes them fierce. Prolonged conflict just makes them more experienced.

In this discussion, we're talking about a group of free men looking at losing their freedom. There is no greater catalyst to conflict than the threat of one's freedom being taken away. There is no greater warrior than one who truly fights for freedom. His own and his countrymen. Regardless of his lack of training or experience. He may not match up one on one with a proffessional soldier, but as a collective, revolutionaries fighting for their freedom have proven difficult, if not impossible, to defeat throughout history. Especially when you consider how often they are fighting soldiers who may not agree with the conflict and have no heart for it.

For the record, I don't think it will happen that way. I happen to agree that "they" will attempt to whittle our rights and Freedom away one law at a time. It's easier, cheaper, and doesn't necessarily run the risk of your Armies turning against you. Each individual that fights back against a single invasion of his rights can be labled a crackpot and minimizes the risk of a large uprising. They fear a mass uprising. For all the reasons I listed above.

Should it come down to armed conflict, I'll gladly leave my blood on the earth for my country's future. Just don't think it will. Hope it doesn't. And in the meantime, the voting pen is my sword, my voice my cannon.

I've stated before that LE is just a J-O-B to me, a serious duty, but still a J-O-B. If Govt. states that we must take guns from law abiding citizens, the Govt. can have my J-O-B. I don't need the money, between my Mil. Ret. etc. and family business, i'll do well.

The "Frog in the frying pan" with the heat being slowly turned on is already in place. Slowly over the course of the last 50 years give or take, the concept of labeling guns as "evil" has been systemically injected into the American psyche. We'll have to wait and see what happens.

Same here. Except I'd be broke without the Job. But I'll be damned if I take part in stripping American's rights away. I'd be just fine. Homeless for a bit maybe, but just fine. If it came down to draconian tactics of actually removing firearms from otherwise decent American citizens, I'd quit on the spot and become one of the ones they were lookin for. Hopefully that don't happen. Got a few years left till retirement!

I wish he was right.

Maybe more important, who's shot back????

2/17 Cav
1/9 Cav
7/17 Cav

I play, but I don't play fair.

I'd guess if one wears enough it might, but then you aren't very mobile. Works either way for me.

tHIS is just to perfectly 'Topical' not to throw into this gumbo,....

Link: http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/06/the_un-american_american_president.html

The Un-American American President
By Jay Clarke

Something is wrong with Barack Obama. We all know it. We all see it. When he speaks about America, Americans cringe. There is a strangeness to his manner, an unease when he talks about America. He appears awkward and uncomfortable. His speech seems performed and practiced yet, oddly halting. It's reminiscent of American POW's in Vietnam or Iraq reading a forced confession. His eyes, expressions, and vocal tone are disconnected from his words. The words themselves often sound American, but the delivery is clinical and detached. His attempts at patriotic sentiment ring hollow and phony. "Once again, with feeling!" is how Americans are left feeling. He just doesn't seem right. He doesn't seem like, well...one of us.

Before anyone "goes there" and makes accusations of racism, this is about a pervasive, nagging, national perception that Barack Obama does not intuitively understand or appreciate America or Americans. Not our past. Not our present or future. He just doesn't act or sound like an American. In fact, there are good reasons and ample evidence for why.

For many of us, "being an American" was a normal part of our collective upbringing. We learned it in school. We said the Pledge of Allegiance every morning right alongside our teachers. Even in liberal Southern California the day began with the Pledge often followed by singing "God Bless America" or "America the Beautiful." Annual "Flag Ceremonies" were held with quotations from the Declaration of Independence and patriotic songs performed by the student body, in public, for parents and passersby to enjoy. There were even songs that mentioned God. Christmas was celebrated, in school. It was understood that God was integral to the founding of America and that The Creator was the true source of our liberties. Schools reinforced parental authority, being a good citizen, and responsibility to God. Religion was never preached or taught, but it was also never denigrated and never censored.

Public school teachers and administrators modeled patriotism for their students. It was part of growing up in America. Honoring America. Being an American. The 4th of July was a community celebration. We stood with parents, neighbors, and friends and together celebrated America. We learned early on to revere the Stars and Stripes. The Flag was sacred. Many of our fathers, grandfathers, uncles, and brothers had fought for it in wars past and were fighting for it in Vietnam. Many had died and would die for the American Flag and the people and ideals it represented. We saw the sacrifices on the nightly news with continual pictures of dead American soldiers and the daily "body count" recited.

From the World War II Generation to those who lived and fought through Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan today's Americans are those who know, all too well, the price of freedom. Our children and grandchildren witnessed the attacks of September 11, 2001. The memory of distraught parents, difficult dinnertime conversations, and the ensuing War on Terror shaped their youth and young adult years.

These and many other shared experiences before and since have created generations of Americans who cherish this land, this idea that is America. They do so with heart and soul. Standing on cue they remove their hats, place their hands over their hearts or salute, and then choke back the tears as the Star-Spangled Banner is played. They are Americans within the very fiber of their being.

Naturalized citizens often display this same love of country, for many have escaped oppressive regimes or economic hopelessness to come to America and be adopted as America's sons and daughters. They came seeking their American Dream, the freedom and opportunity to build a better life for themselves and their families. There's a common, deep, and intimate connection that Americans feel for their country. The soul of America is maintained in the hearts of its people, fiercely loyal to the vision of our Founders and the ideas and precepts of our founding documents.

These same kinds of experiences did not shape the young Barack Obama. His mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, was an atheist and politically extreme. At the age of 6 the future president was ushered off to Indonesia where he attended school registered as a Muslim, recited the Quran in Arabic, and learned how to be a good Muslim. In these studies, he would have learned that all non-Muslims were infidels worthy of deception and ultimately, death. Christians and Jews were the enemy. Despite what Obama may say, the United States remains a Christian nation with a strong Jewish population and deep ties to Israel. Judeo-Christian principles helped form and continue to influence our national identity with many signers of the Declaration of Independence having been clergy or devout Christians. America remains home to the largest Christian population in the world. What bigger infidel could there be than America?

Obama's teen years were spent living with his maternal grandparents on the Hawaiian island of Oahu. There he met a family friend, communist, purported pedophile, and his eventual mentor, the radical poet Frank Marshall Davis.

Obama's connections to radical leftists are numerous and well-known. He's admitted to attending socialist meetings and participated in a rally organized by the Democratic Socialists of America. In 1996, he sought and received the endorsement of the far left group The New Party. He has worked with, supported, and attempted to shield from investigation the group ACORN which was recently convicted of massive voter fraud. Obama's White House is chock-full of radical leftist, anti-American advisors. As a 20-year attendee at Jeremiah Wright's Trinity United Church of Christ, Obama was steeped in Black Liberation Theology which is rooted in the collectivist philosophy of Karl Marx. Marx's most oft-quoted excerpt from his work "Critique of the Gotha Programme" seems to foreshadow the future President Obama's stated belief in wealth redistribution: "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs."

The reason that Americans feel unease when Barack Obama talks about America is that he is talking about a different America. His words are carefully chosen and crafted to sound American, but the hidden meaning is much more malevolent. His goal is "fundamentally transforming the United States of America" into a nation where social justice reigns and injustice is counted as fairness and equity. He seeks a nation of redistribution where those who succeed through hard work, honest enterprise, financial investment, time, energy, and risk are rewarded with government confiscation of the fruits of their labor. His is a country where communication systems, travel corridors, and private property are tightly controlled by the State. It's a country where education is state-run and curricula are state-mandated. In a fully implemented Obama-nation, it would be illegal to pass the accumulation of one's lifetime on to heirs. This is the America of Karl Marx's dreams.

Barack Obama does not sound like an American because Obama's heart and soul are not American in nature. His thoughts are not American. His attitude and philosophy are not American. He cannot speak from the heart about America because America does not reside there. With a Muslim upbringing, a radical family, radical mentor, a myriad of radical connections, radical advisors, a radical theology, and some say a radical spouse, it's no wonder.

Obama's agenda is informed by Marx and guided by years of close associations with extreme individuals and groups whose stated goals are the demise of America and America's influence in the world. When he says he wants to "fundamentally transform America," he is dead serious.

For the first time in all of American history, we are at the mercy of an un-American American President.

May God truly bless the United States of America.

Jay Clarke is a businessman and lifelong conservative from Southern California. He's a proud husband, father, and grandfather.

I have no idea what you are talking about Sir.