Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Remington Extractors

Just my .02...I read a lot here but don't post much. Anyway, I worked my way through high school and college in the late '70's and '80's working for a pretty well-known gunshop and parts distributor in California (sorry). I didn't and don't call my self a gunsmith because our machinest did rebarreling and trickier parts manufacturing, I just did general repairs. We were a warranty station for about nine companies, including Remington,Colt, Browning, USRA, Marlin, Ithaca, Charter (I think)and 1-2 others. Anyway, as I recall, Remington changed the design of their extactors at least three times...sometimes they needed a little tiny rivit to hold them in, other designs were spring-fit. We replaced extractors on 700's, 760's, 742's pretty regularly, probably one at least monthly. In the seven years, I distinctly recall having to send two new 700's back for their bolt handles coming off.

The problem wasn't so much the tensile strangth of the extractor themselves, it was that they would come out of the bolt face. Yeah, I know that's supposed to be impossible, and yeah, I know the harder you pull on a case, the tighter the extractor is supposed to expand and hold in the bolt face, but it obviously didn't always work. Sort of like the Sako scope rings...why some of those would immediately come off under recoil, I dunno.

No doubt if it can break, it will, and I'm sure the repair departments of every manufacturer stays busy. But, the 700 bolts handles definitely can and do come off occasionally.

I have a model 700 from the early 1980s. Wondering if I should have a backup extractor on hand. I am not expecting it to break but what does it take to replace one (tools)?

PAndy I don't know what tools it takes for a Rem700..

A M70 or Mauser is pretty easy.

Remington has a long going problem with 223 bolt face extractors. They know its a problem and have chosen to ignore it rather than correct it.
I bought a nib 700 XCR compact tactical, from the box it would not chamber a round. Remove bolt, clip a round and feed it manually and it would feed like a dream. Called them up and they sent me a new one, well guess what? Same [bleep] problem......
Ended up fixing it myself with a Dremel .
What pissed me off was they played completely dumb but do a quick google search on Remington extractor problems.

I find it interesting that something that has been said to me many times by bench rest shooters and gunsmiths is never mentioned here in the US.

That being that it is not uncommon to see extractors fall out in 2 pieces when being removed which was a common practice when Sako extractors were substituted.

The interesting aspect being that it was surmised that these extractors actually broke during original fitting with the lock pin holdig the two parts together.

Any 'smiths note that here?

John

I'm a few posts late but here's Jim Carmiacheals narrative of the extractor test from his "Book of the Rifle":

"Let�s look at extractors another way. When a traditional Mauser-type extractor lets go and fails to pull a stuck case out of the chamber, it�s usually because it springs outward and slips over the case rim. Of course, this seldom happens, but I�ve experienced it several times with virtually every existing action type having an external leaf-type extractor. Fortunately, this never happened at a critical time. It always occurred when I had faulty ammo or when I was fooling around with some overly hot handloads at the test bench. By comparision, the Remington 700 extractor and similar systems can�t easily override the cartridge rim. Being supported by the steel wall formed by the countersink, it can�t spring away from the case. The Remington extractor doesn�t need to be any stronger because it is supported by the tremendous strength of the bolt itself. Because the extractor can�t back over the case rim, it has no choice but to hang on.
Tiring of all the amateur complaints they were getting about their miniature extractor, some engineers at Remington Arms concocted an empirical tug-of-war test between a standard Model 98 Mauser extractor and their Model 700. A steel rod was lathe-turned to cartridge diameter, with rims turned on each end. These rims were fitted into each bolt under the extractor in the way a cartridge rim fits. The bolts were fixtured into a giant laboratory instrument used to measure tensile strength. In a simple tug of war, the machine ran the pressure on each extractor up to hundreds and then thousands of pounds. Even the steel rod connecting the two extractor systems began to stretch, but then the Mauser extractor let go. The Remington extractor was victorious.
I didn�t witness the test, but I did see movies of the event, and it was certainly impressive. While it left no doubt about the strength of the Remington system, the test may have been somewhat misleading. Had a brass rather than a steel rod connected the two bolts, the softer brass rim probably would have been torn away. Since the Remington extractor claw grasps less brass than the Mauser system, the rim in the Remington bolt might have failed first. In any event, there is no reason to doubt the strength of the Remington system. My own experience with Remington rifles bears this out because I�ve never had a failure. I have, however, had cases stuck so tight that I couldn�t open the bolt; even after pounding on the bolt handle, the extractor did not let go."

excellent post Rogue1.

Might that have something to do with Remingtons outselling Winchesters by at least 100 to 1 ?

kenjs1....

I'm guessing your opinion will not be universally held.

I admire Carmichaels objectivity....that and his great experience,his technical knowledge, make him one of our best gunwriters.

I note in passing that his 4 favorite hunting rifles(from what his writings seem to indicate)were/are a 280 Remington built on a pre 64 M70 built by Clayton Nelson( rifle retired after many worldwide hunts),a 458 Win Mag he built himself on a Mauser 98, a David Miller 338 on a Mauser action, and a 7x57 on a Mauser 98 built by Al Biesen, if memory serves.Things may have changed...I don't know....

What gunwriters "say",and what they "do",are sometimes completely different things.

Just an observation...

Not to mention REAL observations made by men whose lives depend on their rifles and with no commercial endorsements to protect. The article that I posted a link to is about as close to ground truth as it gets. Still, people read what they want and believe what they want, just as long as it agrees with their pre-conceived notions. Facts just get in the way of that practice.

I'm gonna go out on a limb on this one and guess that the majority of folks the majority of time don't hunt dangerous game with a PH in Zimbabwe. I'm also gonna guess the majority of guys don't hunt dangerous game on a regular basis in the states.

I'm certain if all my hunts were paid hunts I'd make damn sure to use a CF so as to impress my third world PH.

Class warfare notwithstanding, I insult them by using PF Weatherbys and I'll be on the other limb and say again the PH that wrote that article didn't need to impress anybody but instead make other PHs wary of using product ill prepared for the job..

This thread reminds me again why I come here,some very bright and funny people who can even beat a dead horse in worthwhile fashion.

+1 Ruraldoc

Not sure if it's a favorite, but I saw him write that he retired his original .280 for a NULA .280 years ago. Not a 700, but a dreaded PF...

Lou

you mean men like U.S. military snipers? and most of the U.S. LEO snipers?



i'll give you that one...

Lou you could be right about the NULA......I have no idea.

Maybe he wanted a lighter rifle! Like all of us,he ain't as young as he used to be....

Had a problem with the extractor on my 700, which made it extremely hard to close the bolt on a loaded factory, handload, or even once-fired case. Cycled it enough times to wear it down and help resolve that issue though.

Jorge, a brief overview of the article in question goes something like this: Weatherby's Mark v's suck,Remington 700's suck, Rugers suck, pre 64 Winchester's suck, most mausers suck, old BRNO's that are no longer made are good and Borwning A bolts are OK, but its too early to tell for certain.
I have know two PH's via my dad, and lived with one in Durban, SA for almost two months. IME they certainly have some weird ideas. Like one that advocated using a 30-06 with 220gr RN bullets downloaded to 2300fps for plains game. Point being these guys are hunters and not gun nuts. Many have limited knowledge of ballistics and gun mechanics and are by nature very hard on equipment. I wouldnt have any problem taking a 700 to Africa as my dad did. Just as you didn't have a problem taking your Mark V, which is a big POS,lol.