Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Reloading advice

Unless you're loading for a well built "competition grade" rifle, have several other handloading details well under control and are shooting at long range, you're not going to be able to reliably demonstrate any advantage to going to that much trouble weighing powder charges.

Yeah, I used to get bogged down with weighing every charge, then I wised up and only use the scale to confirm the measure setting (old Belding&Mull) and spot check as I go along. Life immediately got better, it stopped raining and the sun came out, and women started buying me drinks at the bar. (Not to mention no noticeable differences in accuracy.) If I were stupid enough to load max or over-max cartridges then maybe I would consider weighing each charge, or not. Reference the 'stupid enough' qualifier.

I assume mathman has done the "math" on this I don't disagree with him.

I'm not surprised many weigh in on a thread like this as handloading is near and dear to many of us. I have been doing it for over 30 years and at one point loaded for over 70 differet calibers. I think I am still set up to load 50 some. I recall as a teenager I strongly contemplated the Lee Loader. I didn't go for it and this probably delayed my getting started for ten years. I still use the first reloading press I bought - an RCBC Big Max. And I still use the first powder scale I bought - a Pacific brand. And I bought an RCBS auto priming tool and still use that. So, I started out with good equipment and it has served me very well - none of it needing replacement. Initially, I sure didn't need the power of the Big Max press but once I started reloading wildcats and performing substantial case forming processes, I was very glad I had it. The point I'm making is that you never know where this stuff will take you. I didn't.

Marty,

The only thing that seems to be left unsaid is that there is a vast difference between bulk measurement and weight.The scale on your adjustable black powder measure has nothing to do with charge weight. That is a bulk measurement only.

John

Thanks, and yes, I understand the difference. I was just contemplating minor volume adjustments being possible rather than using the fixed volume of the scoops in the kits. Marty

My main goal for now is just make some average hunting loads for my own satisfaction. Seems like a fun hobby. I can see how one thing might lead to another, so I'll just get started and go from there! Marty

What Mathman and Gnoahhh say is absolutely true... as far as they went. And I totally agree with Boltman because, except for my powder scale (originally, an Ohaus 505) which I had to replace with an RCBS 1010, I am still using the same reloading equipment I purchased about 55 years ago. Ohaus now makes all of RCBS's mechanical powder scales and got out of the direct sales and retail business (I found that out when I called them to replace my Ohaus 505). And because I WORE OUT my fine ol' Ohaus 505 which I dearly loved... and I don't care for the Ohaus-built RCBS 505 as much as I liked the original Ohaus 505, so I bought the top-of-the-line mechanical RCBS 1010 powder scale as a replacement.

However, even in a sporting rifle used for hunting or personal (non-competitive) target shooting, if you can get a slight "edge" in greater accuracy... and that is what "turns-your-clock-on", why not have it?!? Since I've always reloaded for relaxation and enjoyment, getting extremely accurate reloads is an added BONUS!

Let's just say that I'm satisfied with the relative accuracy of ALL of my rifles for the purpose for which they were purchased... because all of my rifles, except for my Ruger #1 RSI in 7x57mm and my Model 99 in .300 Savage, were purchased for a specific purpose.

Therefore, I don't have any "duplicate" rifles which is the reason I'm not a "collector". I.E., each rifle, pistol or shotgun I have has a specific use (hunting, self-defense, informal target shooting except for a few rare occasions when I won some "pocket change" from another loud-mouthed shooter, etc.) or is used to hunt specific game (squirrels, rabbits, quail, pheasants, grouse, deer, elk/moose, bears, etc.) under specific conditions (deep woods, open woods, open plains, mountains, etc.).

Yet, I obtained my Model 99 and my Ruger #1 RSI simply because I WANTED them for a good many years before allowing myself to obtain them without any specific reason or use except for my personal desire to own them.

However, the one thing I demand of all my rifles is ACCURACY... and in order to insure any lack of accuracy is MY fault rather than my rifle's or ammunition's fault, my handloads MUST be as accurate as possible. Thus the need to have the ability to determine the EXACT weight of my powder load down to as small a degree as possible is very important to me.

Incidentally, I also use all the other "bench-rest shooter's accuracy tricks" when I'm loading my own target or hunting loads which are 100% of my reloads.

Frankly, I sometimes question whether the increase (if any) in accuracy is WORTH all the time and trouble I take to do such a "precision job" of reloading, but I keep thinking it is and so, I maintain my reloading efforts the same way I've done it for over 50 years.

I'll be the first to admit that I'm really not SURE my reloads are MORE accurate than the reloads that some other reloaders throws together and hopes they'll go off and hit the paper somewhere... but, honestly, I believe they are.


Strength & Honor...

Ron T.

Therein, Ron, lies the crux of the biscuit. What works for you, and what gives you peace of mind and satisfaction is all that matters. It's all good.

That's true, friend Gnoahhh... very true indeed...

What works for me is a five group average of .57 MOA at 300 yards, and not a single weighed charge was in the bunch.

WOW !~!~! Really, Mathman???

That's kinda hard to believe, but after reading your posts for the past several years, I know you are an honest man... and I believe you, my friend.

However, I must say, I'd have to put a 5-shot, slightly over a �-inch group at 300 yards in one of those "even-a-blind-hog-finds-an-acorn-once-in-a-while" categories.


Strength & Honor...

Ron T.

I am not a target shooter but it seems to me from what I have read, out of all the very small variables that you can manipulate in handloading (e.g. weighing your brass and loading them in batches), the very precise weighing of powder charges is lower on the list when it comes to attaining accuracy.

I am thinking we are not talking a rifle with a lever on the bottom....

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And let's not leave out how far off the lands and grooves one seats the bullet... I've found this to also be very important to "ultimate accuracy".

I've noted that "MuleDeer", the well-known and excellent gun-writer who occasionally posts here, claims that none of these "accuracy tricks" really work... and he's hard to dispute since I believe that he is truthful and he sez he has also tested his beliefs in real life.

I'm not that good. It was half minute, just over 1.5" at 300.

A "half-a-minute-of-angle" at 100 yards isn't very difficult to attain, but at 300 yards with wind and other considerations, that's a BUNCH!!!

It was a Rem. 700 XCR CT, Swarovski Z5 3.5-18x44 scope and the targets were 1" dots. The load used thrown charges of IMR8208XBR and 168 grain bullets. The air was cool and relatively still that day. I was able to shoot all five groups without a gust catching me off guard.

WHOA!!! Now the smallish sized groups are making a LOT more sense... that Swarovski scope is first-class equipment... and the Remington Rifle is an accurate one as well... but an $1800 "Annie" is the ultimate accuracy rifle, in MHO.

You didn't indicate the caliber or powder load... but looking at the equipment and group size, I'd guess a .308 Winchester?

It's a 308, and the charge was 42.8 grains IIRC.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm...

Not familiar with that powder since I don't have a .308 Win. Is that size charge (42.8 grains) even up to the "published" suggested starting load of that powder with a 168 grain bullet?

This is also starting to make a LOT more sense to me. My Lyman 55 Powder Dispenser will "throw" load after load within 1/10 of a grain of powder with boring consistency... a load as good or even possibly BETTER than an individually-weighed load when weighed by an "average" reloader.

I thought you meant you were "dipping" your powder load.