Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting GMX, XP3, E-tip, TTSX? What experience have you had?

The Partition and AB just work so well, I can't understand why go with the mono's unless law dictates? I guess it is a question more than a statement, why?

I guess I am just intrigued by the penetration and lack of lead fragments/bloodshot. I have heard the bullets being longer than the same weight lead bullets make them more b.c. friendly. I have used accubonds with great success before but was looking at the options.

jcrain,

Any of the bullets you list will expand wider if driven faster. This does tend to help them kill quicker, in my experience, the reason I prefer to start any of them at 3000 fps or more. The XP3, however, does have a lead core in the rear, which tends to shift forward, expanding the back end of the bullet at high impact velocities, especially when it hits bone. This can reduce penetration, just as it does in the Swift A-Frame when the rear core expands.

A lot of people are confused about the extra length of monolithic bullets, compared to a lead-core of the same weight. The length does NOT increase ballistic coefficient or sectional density. SD is purely related to weight and diameter. Any 100-grain .25 caliber bullet has exactly the same SD as any other 100-grain .25 caliber bullets, no matter what it's made of, no matter the length.

Ballistic coefficient is a combination of form and sectional density. A .25 caliber 100-grain TTSX or E-Tip is longer than a .25 caliber 100-grain Partition or GameKing, but that has nothing to with BC.

Bullets kill by tearing up vital organs. The monolithic bullets tear up less tissue, the reason they result in less meat damage, but that also results in less damage to the vital organs. If you put one in the right place, say through the top of the heart and both lungs, it will kill pretty quickly, especially on deer-sized game where the size of the hole is relatively large compared to the animal. But on larger animals the monolithics don't kill as quickly, on average, as bullets that fragment somewhat. They also don't kill deer as quickly when the shot is off-center a little, say in the rear half of the lungs.

The monolithics penetrate quite well, but don't have as big an advantage over some lead-cored bullets as many hunters believe. I've shot lengthwise through deer and antelope with Nosler Ballistic Tips and Partitions, for instance, and almost lengthwise through elk with Partitions. Lead-cored bullets, however, do have more tendency to stop under the hide, due to their rounded, less jagged mushroom. This really has nothing to do with killing power, however, as a bullet that stops under the hide has obviously penetrated everything up to that point, and the skin isn't a vital organ like the heart or lungs.

So, yeah, monolithic bullets work, often very well. But they aren't magic.

Mule deer,
So what lead core bullet would you recommend for elk using a .270 win? The partition, accubond, seem to be popular. What about interlock? And the a frame you mentioned? Or the XP3 as it looks to expand wider & faster

Only seen one TTSX on an elk, but seen a dozen or more on elk sized critters in Africa.

The only TTSX I have seen put into an elk made the elk not last long. Nice size, healthy cow... Little brother, 235 yards, 257 wby, 100 TTSX.... One shot, cow fell so fast I would have thought he missed if I wasnt watching through my binos.

I have confidence in the TTSX and the Partition. I like the Hornady SP for deer, and it doesn't mean I wouldn't consider any of the other bullets you mentioned, but I have confidence in both the TTSX and the Partition.

How does the a frame compare to the partition? Seems like the design is similar but the a frame seems to retain weight better from what I have read. Is that accurate? Any performance difference?

The A-Frame tends to retain more weight than the Partition, but that also depends on the Partition. The bigger the Partition, in both diameter and weight, the more weight it's designed to retain. A-Frames typicall retain about 90% of their weight, but they also tend to open up more widely than Partitions, both front and rear, so usually penetration is very similar. The A-Frame tends to make a bigger hole the entire length of the wound channel, while the Partition makes an even bigger hole on entry, which tapers to a smaller hole after several inches.

Any experiences trophy bonded bear claws? Or interbonds?

I've killed seven deer with the 139 GMX in 7mm Rem Mag. 6 of 7 fell where they stood, but all were high shoulder shots. When you hit that scapula, it makes little difference what bullet you're using. All were complete pass throughs at ranges up to 300 yards.

I like the GMX and the TTSX a lot -- mostly because I can get them to shoot well consistently. However, I take high shoulder shots when hunting with them for the reasons previously stated. I wouldn't hesitate to punch both lungs if that's the aspect I was presented with, but I'd expect a slower kill and, possibly, a tracking job.

jcrain,

I've used all the versions of the Trophy Bonded, since they were produced by Jack Carter himself in the 1980's up to the present nickel-plated, plastic-tipped, groove-shank version. There are some people who think the original was the best, but that hasn't been my experience. It fouled like crazy, sometimes didn't shoot that well, and in all but the very largest calibers the front end tended to expand into a ball, which didn't kill nearly as well as the flatter mushroom of many other controlled-expansion bullets, such as the TSX and Partition. When Federal took over the manufacturing they revamped the jacket to create a flatter mushroom, which killed quicker. The present version is very accurate and kills quite well.

Interbonds open up widely and so don't always penetrate as deeply as some other controlled-expansion bullets--but they generally penetrate enough. I've never gotten super-accuracy out of them, which seems to be common, but they generally shoot well enough for most big game hunting.

That's been my experience with X/TSX/TTSX bullets, as well. I usually shoot between 1/2 and 2/3 up the body, in line with the shoulder, and they usually collapse at the shot, with little meat damage. The bullet usually passes within a couple of inches of the lower spinal processes, breaks some scapula or shoulder bone, and punches both lungs.

Mule deer,
Seems like you have experienced most bullets available and have a wealth of knowledge. If you were to choose a bullet for an elk hunt using a 270 win, what would you choose? And what would be the second choice?

What about the SST? I think its a bit thinly cased for elk but anyone use it for em?

jcrain,

Have seen more 150 Nosler Partitions used on elk than eny other bullet from the .270, and it does a fine job. But it's really hard to go wrong these days, with all the premium bullets on the market.

I have seen more Elk killed with the 270 Win than any other caliber and never seen one yet killed with a 150 NP that a 130 grain Partition would not have killed.I have used both and stick to 130 Partitions and the old 140 Trophy Bonded.

Like in the 30-06...You don't need a 200 grain bullet because the 180 does it all.I think the record Brown bear for years was taken with a 180 grain pill.

The 270 Win and 130 grain Noslers are like peanut butter and jellie in a jar,with the twist just perfect.

Jayco

Jayco,

What is your favorite 130 partition load?

I have tried most of the powders early on and liked RL-22 for speed(I was young) but these days I save my W-760/H-414 for my personal loads and IMR-4350....

I use Winchester brass and Winchester LRP..I don't give out powder charges on the net..Seems to cause problems for some reason...

But 3100 fps in my 24" Winchester is fairly easy.

Jayco

I need to get into reloading, all the fac tory stuff i can findshoots pretty mildly except the Superformance.

Easy on the assessment, my oldest boy hit a cow elk in the boiler room 3 times, all right next to each other (because the elk would not go down) with a 180 grain Accubond at 225 yards with his 30-06 two years ago. We found 2 of the bullets on the aft hide. The cow elk would not go down so the guide kept telling him to put another one in her. So you cant just assume bonded are better or delivering a faster kill in all cases either.