Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Africa African PH opinion survey

I cannot attest for the scientific accuracy for this survey but the general idea clearly filters. I am not in any way associated with this survey and I did not contact the author at all. Below is merely what the author reported. The source is mentioned right at the end and if you want to remain unbiased then read the report before going to the source. I am also unsure as to when this survey was undertaken and I'm sure salesmen now have a better idea about what to sell because hunters are seemingly becoming better informed prior to arrival.

Pieter

This is the report:
A SURVEY OF WHAT AFRICAN PROFESSIONAL HUNTERS WANT YOU TO BRING.
During the past years, I have undertaken an intensive survey of African outfitters and Professional Hunters, (PH�s).
Most PH�s have said that there are two times they are scared when hunting, (ok, maybe three):
l. When they go to meet a client at the airport that they have never met before. He has no idea what this guy looks like and what kind of shape he is in.
2. When the client opens up his gun case, and they head for the range. Lord only knows what the salesman at the local discount store sold this poor guy. This is especially true, since odds are that the salesman has less experience than the client does.
The client tells the clerk that, "He is going to Africa and what does he need?" The salesman immediately hands him a 300 Loudenstomper-Ultra-Wounderby with a muzzle brake and a great big scope.
The salesman never even asked what he was going to hunt or at what ranges or conditions might be encountered.
3. The final time he is scared is when the client wounds a Buffalo, Lion or Leopard, because he (the PH) is the guy who must find that animal and finish the job. Moreover, guess who has the best chance of being chewed on?
Below is listed the replies of the PH�s contacted.
What do "most" PH�s want a hunter to bring for guns?
For Plains game: (Including Leopard)
Most important, is that a client bring a gun he is familiar with and can shoot the best.
1st choice is 300 Win Mag with 26 votes
2nd choice is 30-06 with 24 votes
3rd choice is 338 Mag with 18 votes
4th choice is 7 mm Rem Mag with 9 votes
5th choice is a 270 Winchester 7 votes
6th choice is 7 mm STW or any of the ULTRA Magnums
For "Dangerous" Game (Buffalo, Lion, Elephant, Rhino, or Hippo):
1st. Choice is 375 H&H with 54 votes
2nd Choice is 416 Rem with 11 votes
3rd Choice is mixed Double Rifles of 470 etC.
Are many of the scopes hunters bring too big? 48 yes and 5 no.
Is there any particular gun or scope that you HATE to see one of your hunters arrive with?
First place went to Weatherby (aka, Wounderby), they got 27 votes. The new ULTRA Calibers and STW�s are not getting any raving reviews so far either.
Followed by the 308 Win, 264 Win.
The reason the most everyone hates the Weatherbys, (and the Ultra�s) is because the recoil is too severe, and the client flinches and then makes a bad shot.
IF a man uses the RIGHT bullets AND can stand the recoil, the Weatherby and Ultra�s are awesome killers.
Scopes were not a major factor, except if a variable power, the client always has it cranked up to max all the time. Better to set it at 4x or 6 x and then if needed, power up to 9x or 12x.
Do very many hunters bring reloaded ammo? 48 yes. Which is about 1/3 or more of their hunters.
Is there particular factory ammo that you LOVE to see your hunters bring?
Federal Premiums with Nosler Partitions or Trophy Bonded Bear Claws got 51 votes,
Remington ammo with Swifts got 19 votes.
PMC or Wby with Barnes X bullets got 14 votes.
Winchester Fail Safes got 9 votes.
Have you ever experienced any misfires?
Factory misfires. 78 no 5 yes
Reload misfires? 79 no 4 yes
Do you or any of your PH's reload? 17 yes 49 no.
Do you think that the "Super Premium" bullets, like Trophy Bonded, Swift A-Frames, Fail-Safes, and Barnes-X etc are worth the extra cost? 59 yes 24 no.
How about Nosler Ballistic Tips and other "plastic tipped" bullets?
A simple NO will cover the replies. They are too violent on impact, and seriously lack reasonable penetration.
Should your hunters practice more? 77 YES
Do reloaders tend to be better shots than those that do not reload? 66 yes 2 no
Do you like hunters to bring guns with KDF or Mag Na Ports?
75 NO and 0 yes (Better to bring a smaller gun that kicks less.)
If hunting dangerous game, does the client REALLY know what might be in store for him?
No way, they watch all the Mark Sullivan videos and see TOO MANY charges, (and most of those are allegedly staged anyway.) What they really do not realize is that their little soft bodies are not ready for the bush.
They bring Boots that are new, and their feet will hurt an hour after arrival. No way are they ready for a long hard hunt on foot or their belly.
Many clients are there only because they feel it is the "IN" thing to do and they must keep up with the "Jones". They are much wiser the second time around.


Source: African PH opinion survey source

Interesting read Pieter. Thank you.

Very cool Pieter, though I must say after half a dozen trips to Africa, your survey pretty well mirrors what I have learned over the years.
We ( Ingwewife and I )make it a point to do a LOT of practice shooting, primarily offhand, or from other field positions. No bench shooting ( havent seen a bench in the bush to use anywhere Ive been in Africa..)
We bring well worn and well broken in hunting clothes and footwear ( unlike most I see who get off the plane in Jo'burg with brand new head to foot 'safari' gear)
The largest scope Ive ever used over there was a Leupy 1.5-5....on anything. No muzzle brakes.
Our rifles are usually as well worn as our clothing,and Ive done far more shooting with conventional cartridges over there than I have with magnums...


Ive had a lot of people ask for advice going over there, and the #1 thing I tell them is to be a good client, don't be an azzhole. Do what your PH tells you, before and during the trip, shoot what your PH tells you to shoot, and DON'T arrive with a "shopping list" of animals you want and minimum scores you will accept!

Yours is great info Pieter....hopefully some will follow it....

that list works just as well for the states as it does Africa

Very good stuff!!

My first safari in 1990, the PH was very well known, with 30 years experience at the time.

He told me the 3 things he hated to see when the client opened the rifle case were:
1. muzzle break
2. set trigger
3. anything that said Weatherby on it


Pete

I have to ask. Why such dislike of the muzzle break? Is it noise or do they assume with a muzzle break the hunter has too much gun and is trying to over compensate?

Why the hate for the 308?

I shot an 06 AI in Africa, and sure didn't need 6.6 shots per critter...

Thinking about my 25-06 with 2-7X leupy for Argentina next year...my outfitter suggests good ol .270 or -06 class rounds. Maybe I will suprise him by showing up with my .340 Wby and brand new shiny camo just to make an impression, then pull my .270 or .25-06 out and change into jeans and plaid shirt to ease his mind.

In re-reading the thread...I musta missed that part....

Wish I knew why. We cut our teeth on the 308 and I like it a Lott. For many years it was our family hunting rifle - in fact, our only family hunting rifle. My younger brother inherited it when my father passed away and I still look at it longingly when I see it.

Nice to see the .375 H&H held in such high esteem by the PHs. In my limited experience, it kills elephant, hippo, and buffalo just as easily as a .458 with much heavier bullets.

Thanks for the reply. When I get the chance to head over there I'm bringing a 308 with me for the hell of it.

Coincidence I have been preaching here for a decade now that 30 caliber and bigger diameter is the base line for good success.

Coincidence that our loaner rifles when I'm in camp are 30/06 rifles?

Probably

Don't forget the 223 AI. I'm wondering if you could kill an eland with it

Hi Pieter
nice reading
Saw slightly myself in mirrow when read this report
It's seems that most of African vistorts are from US (ammo, guns). I was slightly supprised that 30-06 get so high valuation and 308 so low. Same time was supprised about muzzle brake and Weatherby hate. Have myself for Africa 40 years old Sauer-Weatherby 9,3x64 with mzzle brake and both my PH have value it has good gun

Anyway good to know what specialist think about "greenhorms"

YUP! Although I've only been there twice, I agree with ingwe verbatim.


maddog

I wonder if the no love for the .308 is because they have been seeing tacticool ninja warriors that want to do the sniper thing. Those guys certainly are a bore to me.

It was a bit of both, but mostly that a break indicates a rifle that the owner is afraid of and consequently can't shoot well. This ties in with point no. 3, two sides of the same coin.

As for the set trigger, he told the story of a client who was lagging behind the PH and tracker, endlessly fiddling with his ST.
Then BOOM, round passed between the two of them and hit the dirt 10 yds ahead of them. The old and very experienced tracker just turned around and walked back to the truck, refusing to hunt with that client from then on. The old guy was no coward either, having stood flat footed next to this PH during several lion charges over the years. But getting ventilated by the client was more than he was willing to chance.


Pete

Dude...you are giving me ideas....


Actually Ive often thought if I get to go back, to take the .223AI and shoot a bunch of impala sized stuff..


My last trip over all I took was a .22-250 loaded with TSXs...killed my biggest warthog!


The remarks on the Weatherby's and muzzle brakes are not unique to Africa...Anytime, anywhere someone sees a shiny new Weatherby or any rifle with a brake it is symbolic of two things. 1. The shooter has more gun than he can comfortably handle and 2. He is devoutly hoping that equipment will take the place of expertise ( i.e. he should have spent the extra funds shooting his rifle, and getting to know it...)


I went on one guided hunt with a freind and we spent the first couple hours in camp getting to know guide/outfitter. When we remarked that we'd better get the guns out to check zero and let these guys know we can shoot we got the quick retort " Oh...you guys can shoot...."
I asked him how he knew that and he said simply that we had been there for a couple hours and hadnt drug out our rifles for brag and show and tell....indeed he didnt even know what we had brought to shoot.
Apparently, and Ive noticed since then, one of the first things a visiting hunter does is drag out his ultra-cool rifle to show it off and impress the guides/PHs...
Hint...it doesn't.....



At least not in the 'good' way...

That article contains way too much common sense for many people! For nearly all game other than DG or eland, a fellow really doesn't need anything more than a 30-06. If a fellow wanted to hunt Africa many times and only own one rifle, a .375 would be the ideal 'one gun for everything' rifle.

On my 4 safaris, I've taken a .270, .300 win mag, .338 win mag, .416 Hoffman, .458 win mag and .470 NE. If my next hunt is for plains game only, I'll take a .270 or .30-06 unless Eland is on the license, then will take my .338. If DG is part of it, then my .338 and .416.