Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting GMX, XP3, E-tip, TTSX? What experience have you had?

Why is it that you say that?

Why? What is your experience? How many critters have you shot with it?

I shot two Sitka last year with a 7mm SAUM pushing a 150 e-tip at 2900 fps. Each deer took one hit to be put down. The first saw me and wAs a bit adrenaline pumped. He ran 30 yards. The second had no idea of my existence and literally went "hooves up" instantly. Never seen a deer flip on its back quite like that. One leg kicked...once. It was spooky, I could watch the bullet flight path over its 278 yard travel in the cold air...

In another world a friend of mine popped a small 50# piglet with a 180 tsx from an '06. piglet took about 20 seconds to expire, though it never ran more than a foot from impact. Full expansion was evident...

Anyway, no bullets were recovered, they performed as advertised.

Ha. I know.... I put that rig together specifically as an elk rifle. Ended up not getting my elk (I KNEW I should have sprung for the bull tag, too), but figured "what the hell" when deer season rolled around. Kept hoping I'd get one facing straight at me so I could see just how far that TTSX would penetrate. Never happened, but the deer just kept falling in their tracks. Surprised me, actually.

If you go with monos I'd personally recommend shooting through the shoulders to anchor the animal better and get a little more expansion, I'd go with a 180gr Accubond, Partition, Interbond, BTSP, or SP on an elk out of an '06.

Personally, I don't get the fixation with the expanding-mono's.

I'll take a Partition every day, all day and twice on Sunday over any of them. Ditto an Accubond.

No fixation on the monos, I used accubonds last year. And you are right in saying the partition and accubonds are top notch. I am sure that back in 1948 when the partitions were introduced that people were skeptical about them. It took people selecting to use a bullet (the partition) other than the current standard to give the partition the legend and following that is has accrued.

Preach it Brad....

I doubt anyone was skeptical about Partition's in 1948. It's just an improved version of what was already available. It's also doubtful in that era most would pay a premium for them, and I'd bet that was the case.

The Expanding mono's are an entirely different kettle of fish, and they've had over 20 years to show what they do in the field. They don't kill any better than, say a Partition, and in many instances don't kill as quickly IMO. When they work, they work well. When they fail (and I believe they fail more than most think), they fail spectacularly. By "fail" I mean they don't open as designed within their velocity range, and essentially act as a FMJ.

Anyone that's worked with hollow points knows what sort of failure I'm talking about.

I will take select Noz Ballistic Tips over the monos for most applications. I know the 180gr, 30 cal is very stout and even at close range with RUM velocity levels.

BTW, Bwalker's avatar is a pic of a .308/150 TTSX I pulled out of a calf elk a couple years ago... tumbled on impact and was found in the off shoulder backwards. No it didn't hit anything on its flight, and surely a 1-10" 308 Win should stabilize a 150 grainer. I'm convinced this happens more than many think.

I don't understand the infatuation with the PT and AB. The TTSX kills just as well and penetrates from stem to stern

I'm just bustin' yer ballz a little bit, Brad, but IMO most bullets kill modern game animals really well. It seems like the same 2 or 3 pics of failed Barnes bullets keep circulating, but I haven't heard of many other cases of failures, especially with the TTSX.

I've seen what is nearly 100 game animals killed with X/TSX/TTSX bullets, now, and I have yet to see an instance in which I thought that the bullet failed to expand properly. The only wild goose chase that I've had to go on was a WT doe that I personally shot a little far back, and only clipped the top rear of one lung. She went a little less than 200 yards before collapsing, and left a blood trail that was like "the yellow brick road", except it was red Everything else has fallen with 100 yards or less, with the majority falling within 20 yards or DRT. To be fair, I am typically a shoulder shooter, but my friends, family, and clients haven't all shot for bone.

Brad,
Dont get me wrong I think the partition and accubond is a great bullet. There are many good/great bullets available. I personally would take a AB over the PT. People back in the day may not have payed for "premium" bullets but today the PT in the federal vital shok 180gr runs over $40. Nosler trophy is a few bucks cheaper but also only offer 150gr and 165g, I prefer to use 180 gr. I can pretty much buy any other offering mono or not for less than partitions. I may not even use a mono at all but this thread is merely to get experiences from those that have used monos for informational purposes, not to argue which bullet is the king of all time. After all core lokts will kill elk just as dead as partitions or a TTSX, assuming you work within the limits of the bullet, rifle and your own skill.

After a bad experience with the original X bullets (XLC), concern about reliable expansion was why I could never bring myself to hunt with TSX even though I had the loads developed. That picture shows exactly what I was concerned about.

No such concern with the tipped versions (TTSX and MRX), which appear to open very quickly. The only one I've recovered was from water jugs, a 180g MRX launched from my .300WM at about 3050fps. It lost one petal. So far, nothing but good results on game in our group with 100g .257" to 180g .308".

What folks seem to always fail to say is that ALL bullets fail at some point. I"ve even seen cup and core Sierra game kings fail to expand at all on a 125 yard shot from an 06 in 165 grainers.

I'll still err to caution and prefer that the bullet be over capable, read a mono, as long as I have a choice. And at this point I have zero losses with mono and know of NO one else personally, other than a few good folks on the fire who I totally trust their data too, that have ever had an issue with a mono.

E tips I have never gotten to shoot well so gave up on them. And now run the TTSX if I have a choice.

YMMV, but I have never seen monos kill as fast as Nosler BT's unless the CNS was hit.
The above mentioned mono kills were with E-tips, TSX's, TTSX's, X's
What you guys who use monos are doing is giving up quick kills based on the idea that complete penetration from every conceivable angle is required. It isnt.

Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't. I've recovered around 10 monos from game, which tells me that they're not "over penetrating" all the time. It really depends on what kinds of shots you take at game. For the shots that I'm willing to take, I don't mind the extra penetration that the monos offer.

Having said that, I use many different bullets on game, not just the monos. I typically use a TSX/TTSX if I'm pushing the bullet faster than 3000fps, and many are leaving the muzzle at ~3300fps. They kill very well at that velocity, even when I'm not going for CNS. I've seen WT bucks with a pulverized heart from a Nosler BT travel 120 yards, and I've seen lung-shot deer go 15 yards before piling up after being hit with a TTSX at around 3150fps impact velocity. There are no hard, fast rules with this stuff.

For killing game, I like the BT, A-Max, SMK, Berger VLD, Horn IL, and others, in addition to the monos. Some times I need extra penetration, and other times I don't. Game size, shot location, range of the shot (impact velocity), and shot angle determine what bullet I might use, as I usually have a mono and a more frangible bullet with me for whatever rifle I'm using.

Oh, and I mostly made that comment above as a retort to those who diligently preach the gospel of PT and AB

If I need a quick stop, I refuse to be dumb enough to risk it to bullet choice, IE partitions and ballistic tip and the like. IF I have to have that, and there are times I desire that, the ONLY certain way to do it is by bullet placement, not bullet choice.

That being said the comment RE you don't have to have penetration from all angles etc... I go like the scouts... alwyas be prepared. Works just fine into the lungs, may run a bit further or may not. And placement can guarantee an instant stop if so desired.

That is by far the smartest move IMHO. Not right for all I understand. But I fail to see how being prepared for anytying you may encounter is bad.

I wear ALL my fire gear going into a fire. While I don't always need it all, when I do, I really do need it all. Same train of thought on bullet choice for me.

And since I"ve had success with zero failures from very close IE under 25 yards on out to 802 yards so far with mono, I'll keep going that route.

Id not fret shooting a elk or a deer from any angle with a 180BT at 3300+fps.
A few years back my wife's uncle shot a whitetail broadside in the hips with a 140 coreloct out of a 7mm rem mag. The entrance hip joint was exploded and the offside hip was broken as well, if the animal had been able to run it would have bled to death from the sheer size of the wound.
BTW Rost, by your own admission you enjoy tracking so your choice of bullets makes sense.

FWIW, Ive NEVER had to trail a animal shot with a TSX/TTSX. That's through probably 25-30 animals. All have either been DRT or died well within sight.

When I started hunting deer - it was in Siberia in 1989 - the only bullet choice I had was, military FMJ in 7.62x54 in a Mosin-Nagant M38 rifle. I shot two deer with it the one season I hunted, one standing and another running. Both poleaxed, dropped on the spot and never twitched. Both bullets were complete pass through, what you'd call a pencil hole. Except, one went through shoulder blades and another, through the shoulder quartering away.
It is a luck of the draw I am convinced. If one tries for the best shot placement possible, any bullet capable of good penetration will do the rest.