Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters 30/06 Ai thoughts?

Dave, thanks for the details. I've always liked the 300 SAUM case, though I've never owned one. For a true SA it makes far more sense than the 300 WSM, and I like the SAUM case design slightly better than the WSM case (30* vs 35* shoulder). I've also heard that same problem with Hunter and cold temps. Have you tried H4350 instead?

To the 30-06 Ai, I suppose it makes some sense if a guy has an existing 30-06 and a corresponding itch. However, I find "30-06" and "improved" in the same sentence to verge on blasphemy.

Something that balanced needs no improvement IMHO.

I also wonder whether the extra 5* shoulder on the 30-06 Ai really inhibits case stretch more than the 35* shoulder on the 300 WSM. I guess I'd sooner run the 300 WSM throttled back to 30-06 Ai speeds and get longer brass life. That's just the way I look at it, but I also have no need for anything Ai so that's my bias... though I think the 223 Ai makes the most sense of all of them.

Dave-thx for the info on the 300 RSAUM that's good stuff for those looking to build a long heavy belly gun chambered for that round. But in my world 17lb rigs don't do a thing for me.

That wasn't my intent of this thread but for giggles it'd be fun to twist up a 28" barreled 06AI. Something tells me that it'd pretty well stay with the 300 RSAUM if the barrel lengths were same same.

When I asked about your thoughts about taking 4" off a 28" barrel I wasn't asking you to literally do so. What I was subtly pointing out is that the speeds you mentioned make the RSAUM look faster, but if the barrel length is the same then there won't be much of a gap.

When I started this I was thinking about a lightweight hunting rig, that would shoot well. Have a bit more magazine capacity than a WSM (many handle 2 down, a fair # of 06's will handle 5 down and four for sure and I need all the help I can get).

And in the mean time I could use one of my existing standard bolt faced rigs and do the project for fun and giggles. With very little cost relatively speaking.

I do like the AI's as case stretch is minimal and trimming is fairly nonexistent. Plus I get a bit more gas for the effort. And yet I don't have to hotrod a case. I've had enough of that over the years... .

I have enjoyed the back and forth on this and in particular have enjoyed the comments from those who've worked with the round.

For whatever reason wildcats and AI rounds have long intrigued me. Probably has something to do with the whole odd number thingy...grin

Merry Christmas all!


Dober

i did an 06 Gibbs for a while, 25" barrel and 190 hornady boattail was my go to load,, killed very well and easily sub moa at a little over 2900 fps, i really like the 190 hornady, has always shot as fast as any 180 but seemed like it killed better and shot flatter, shot many hundreds of them in my 300stw's,
i understand the wildcat urge, after the gibbs i went to 376 steyr case on 98 mauser action,, that cased necked to 8mm shooting 200 accubonds proved a great killer, feed extremely well,and a all up rifle at 8lbs with 24" barrel,,, kinda hard on the forehead and bridge of my nose,,,,

Brad.
I know this is supposed to be about 06 stuff.
But the SAUM is very close capacity wise.

I looked long and hard at the 300 WSM case.I to dont care for the shorter neck and 35 degree shoulder.Not saying it wouldn't work for 1000 yard.But even the WSM and the SAUM cases are pretty close.

Lots to like about the 300 RSAUM.
Short action with room left over.
Shoulder and neck are, in my mind perfect.Either long range target or as a hunting round.

Im a long time 6mm PPC shooter.
The 300 RSAUM is just an over grown PPC.

I never got around to 4350 powder.
The Ramshot Hunter shot so well I just couldnt give it up.
Im thinking if I just adjusted my load of Hunter.The cooler temps would not be a problem.

Thinking I trimmed my SAUM cases after like 8 fireings.Didnt really need to.I just did.

I know alot of people poo poo the Nosler brass.
I just cant find anything wrong with it.
Ill put it this way.
We are skim turning Lapua 6.5x47 brass for 1000 yard.
Im running 300 RSAUM Nosler brass right out of the box.
Its that good.



dave

300STW-a fellow shooting buddy and I did 30 Gibbs many moons ago. I used the 190 Horn a bit and he used the 200 Noz if I recall right. 4 me, I enjoy this kind of gackola. But then again I get bored easily...grin

Hope alls well in your world today.

Dober

Dober
Understood.
All im saying is thats its a very nice round to work with thats in your ball park.
Dont have to be 17lb. Not at all.
A SA M700 with mag bolt face on a 23 tube could be as light as you care to make it.
Out of the box ammo for the thing will scare you accuracy wise.
No fire forming.

I get the Ackley thing.
Done a few myself.


dave

Dave-any chance you clocked the speeds when going from the 65-80 to the 38-45 to see what you actually lost for gas?

Also, would 7828 work in that lil fat case? I've used it with 200's in the WSM and I recall it did fairly well.

Dober

Dober.
Nope.
We knew we were down in FPS as we had to add clicks all the way out.
It sure was enough to drop me out of my sweet spot.

Im thinking 7828 would be a tad to slow in the SAUM case.
Although rel 22 in mine woke the thing up big time.
In the WSM case might just be the ticket.
I have more to think about than just raw speed for the game im in.


dave

Hay,

in case I forgot.

Merry merry dude...

Hope all is well with you and yours...



dave

Dave-I'm cheap by nature so if possible I'll use one of my existing old friends to work with a round. Plus I like using the same rifle year after year as it adds to my intimacy with the rig and trust me on this I need all the help I can get when it comes to the accuracy game...<g>

But, if I wanted to work with a RSAUM then the 700 wouldn't scare me a bit. I have been around enough 7's and 700's that were chambered in WSM that I know I'd not do one around a Rem bolt gun. That said, I've also seen more WSM rifles of differing makes that didn't feed in a manner which I approve of than all the other rounds put together.

Rancho Loco's RSAUM is a dream to run and shoot and it's about model perfecto for a hunt rig for me. Plus one can get a Jewell to stick in it and or the 70's and for me the triggers a big deal.

This gack is all fun and games. Bottom line, I love to hunt, and I love to shoot. For me it's just a way of life.

Dober

Side note to the RSAUM thingy, if I was going that way it'd not be 30 cal it'd be either 7 and or if starting from scratch the 6.5. That catz gonna gain some serious traction among shooting loony's in the very near future!

Dober

Id be hunting as much as as you if I lived where you did.
I make up for it by shooting Impossibly Small targets at incredibly stupid distances.

The trick to making the M700 a bomb proof fatty feeder is single up.
No matter what hardwear you use.
Single up works everytime.

Sounds like you need to talk to the MontanaMarine dude.
Not sure if he does the AI thing but for 06 stuff.
Hes the man.


dave

Shane does have some mad skills for sure, one of these days I'm gonna get his way and have him try to give me some help. But alas I'm probably more than a skosh bit helpless...grin

I was gonna ask if you were running a solo feeder. For me a solo is all about a #1 not a bolt gun. But, that's just my world.

We're kind of the same as I shoot incredibly large targets at incredibly close ranges...

Dober

When I did my 300 SAUM the 180g Berger 7mm Hybrid was still on the drawing board.
I'd will be looking at it again come rebarrle time.

The 6.5 SAUM is good on paper.
Gunsmith built one.

After looking at his loads and data.

I would not.

Pressure spikes,peekie weirdness.
And your 06 AI would out shoot it.

If I were to look at something like that.

I do a 6mm WSSM with 105g Berger hybrids.



dave

Yea ,i've seen how helpless you are..


dave

I do not know about blasphemy, but it sure makes me scratch my head.

With all the various 30 caliber cartridges available, it just seems so much easier to pick a cartridge in the power level/platform you desire than to take the 30-06 and try to improve it.

One of the main reasons an individual chooses a 30-06 is for simple common sense functionality.
There are much more complicated cartridges to choose, if a challenge is what you desire.

Mark,

While we are discussing the 190 Hornady, it was my absolute favorite bullet in the '06.

From my notes circa 1995, I pushed it to 2800 with IMR and H 4831 in a 22 inch standard '06. It gave me great accuracy from a bone stock Win 670.

I also played with the AI '06 for a couple years in the early nineties. I did not have a Chrony yet so I could judge velocity only from observed trajectory numbers. And the rifle (an old H&R 308 barrel screwed onto a Venezuelan tanker carbine Mauser built for 7x57 with the mag box lengthened a 1/4 inch) was so inaccurate that trajectories were unmeasurable.

I came to the same conclusions as already shared by our more knowledgeable compatriots: the '06AI is a waste of time with bullets lighter that 180 gr.

But I think it would really shine with that Hornady 190 or any 200 gr spitzer boat tail.

I would have the mag box built to 300 Wea length and and the chamber reamed so that I could seat the bullet as long as good handloading practices would allow.

IS-Ingwe from here has used the 190 Horn more than a bit. I think mainly from his 300 H&H and has liked how they do their stuff. I'd think it'd be a good match of softness, excellent BC and weight retention on big game.

I'd think that the 200 Sierra could do well in it as well.

Thx 4 sharing your thoughts.

Dober

Taking inventory of the comments on this thread I've some good and pertinent info. What I noticed is that those who've built and used a 06AI have positive comments and seemed pleased with what their experience with the round.

As well, not all but most seemed inclined to use the heavier bullet weights. Which for me is fine as that's the way I tend to lean as well.

The negatives that came up didn't come from those who've actually worked with and have experience with the round.

By my way of thinking it'd be awfully close to and 06 Plus P (WSM) but would more than likely feed better and more importantly allow me more belly cap. And if I feel like I can always run plain Jane 06 ammo in the bugger right?

Could be fun to do sometime. Maybe I will and maybe not. Only time will tell. Now if someone has a set of dies they're no longer using... .


2014 will be a fun year whether we do projects like these and or not.

Dober

Dober, there were no negatives, just opinions and observations of the good natured variety IMO.

Merry Christmas.