Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Asperger's and Violence

If we cured Asperger's syndrome, we wouldn't have any engineers or other techs.

Autism spectrum disorders have too many variations to easily pigeonhole any particular person without really getting to know them.

My Asperger son loves all of the video games, from "mario cart" to "call of duty"... he is also quite proficient at taking game with shotgun or rifle...

but he was raised with a very large family circle, and has never been sheltered from social interaction. He participates in church and school activities. it often seems a bit stiff, or stilted for him, as he really isn't all that graceful, socially...
but he's there, and dealing with the difficulties in his own way...

he has even developed a sense of humor about his own difficulties...

I credit Campfire member Barak, who shared a bit of his own life and advised against "special" education for "special" kids.
Mainstreaming, from a young age, instills the internal ductility of spirit that goes a long ways towards those who deal with social awkwardness being able to face life...

I read that Lanza was home schooled, and i'm guessing that he was isolated completely from all social aspects of life.

I also read that his father left and from middle school age, he had no father figure in the home...

And finally, it sounds like his mom was a bit of a wacko, as well... very likely had issues of her own...

this kid had the deck stacked against him...

A] single parent home with no father.

B] autism spectrum social disorder.

C] isolated and insulated by an overprotective mom, to the point of homeschooling...

Don't get me wrong... I'm a big fan of homeschooling, but those who participate need other social outlets...
It simply shouldn't be allowed for those with social difficulties...

Sounds to me like mom was on the run from life, and used her son as a reason to shield herself...
A disaster in the making...

I have read that Einstein is suspected to have had Asperger's. My mom and dad were at Princeton after the war when he was there. There were some pretty strange things about him according to them.

I can imagine having meeting with the principle and parents about kids.....but to have those same meetings about themselves.....Holy chit! No wonder the world is so [bleep] up!

I certainly hope I never witness something on this order as I really don't want to have a misdemeanor or felony charge following me around.

BTW, I would consider whaleschit to have more class than that...Now Obama schit might fit better.

I think you are dead on.

First clue - broken family. There are a lot of good reasons why God hates divorce.

I'm not being very hyperbolic when I say that women have no business raising kids without a father. And that is just one problem out of many with broken families.

John, you have provided a solid base for your child. You have addressed the special needs of your child. You stood up and created and fostered what your child needs.

I think I can speak for most here:

God bless you sir. God bless you for standing up like a man and as a father and giving your child what he needs. God bless you and your family.

Adam Lanza didn't have that. Had he then more than likely this would never had happened.

Thanks to all of you folks who gave rational informed responses to the 3 ignorant azzes that posted in this thread!

There were articles that said that Adam's mother was at her wits end with the kid, and was thinking about moving west to get him in a special school and treatment. Apparently there was something far more serious than aspergers going on with him.
She was also a strange duck who played cards or a dice game with neighbors who rotated hosting the games, yet her house was never on the rotation. In fact, several people said she didn't ever let anyone come inside, but would talk to people outside the house.
Reported also was that she had filed for guardianship of Adam so she could have him committed to a mental institution, and that might have been the last straw that set him off.

With the toxic stew that has been reported, it is no wonder he acted out. The few who knew anything about Adam failed to see the signs or just plain ignored them.

Myron

I don't have any true knowledge of Asperger's or Autism. jdm953 probably didn't mean it this way, but....I can say that with my children (and myself), giving/allowing/doing what makes them "happy" is not always the best course for them. Sitting in a basement playing violent games may have been exactly what the murderer wanted...but was not to his benefit.

JFC...the blatant ignorance here knows no bounds...and leaves me utterly speachless. At what point does stupidity become profound enough that one should be locked up as some profess on this and other threads??

First you have the clueless that have no conception of mental illness nor the spectrum and degree it may be manifested.

Then you have the nearly as clueless suggesting 'toxic parenting' with no basis or foundation. From what I have read the mother was private about her family matters - as many are. The ONLY failure we really know was allowing access to the firearms. Items I have read indicated she planned to move and look for a program for her son. Maybe she didn't realize how bad he was...maybe he found out her plans and that's what sent him over the edge.

The reality is that we just don't know. I really don't see much difference in the ignorance displayed by the anti-gun groups and the speculative ignorance displayed here. In both cases people just want a simple answer and that's not reality.

Remember the article says that 84% of Asperger's Syndrome patient suffer from other mental disorders. On of those disorders is schizophrenia.

As it turns out Lanza was taking a medication called Fanapt. These are its physiological side effects.

http://doublecheckmd.com/EffectsDetail.do?dname=Fanapt&sid=164543&eid=2127



And the story thickens doesn't it. Of course if a kid that is taking psychiatric medications kills himself its the meds fault. Not here though, nope, it must be the guns and only the guns.

The [bleep] media and this [bleep] Whitehouse are dragging those children through the streets for their own political agenda, just like we all knew they would. The truth might not fit their political agenda, so we'll just ignore that. Now you tell me, who in this [bleep] up society is really the bunch of sick [bleep] bastards.

No, the article said 84% of violent offenders with autism also had some other mental disorder when they committed the crime.

a secure gun safe that he did not have access to would have prevented this problem. i knew way too many unstable kids when i was growing up that had full access to firearms with no supervision and i know that it still happens. a local state senators let his 15 y/o son keep a loaded glock in his bedroom. the next door neighbor's kid knew about it and snuck in and stole it and killed himself with it. bottom line, kids will be kids. protect them from themselves. whether its guns, booze, cars, whatever. don't project adult boundaries and common sense on a kid. they don't think like adults and even the best kids will do knucklehead stunts. this shooting was 100% the moms fault.

What is strange is that of a sudden, the anti's including the politicians want to have all these "conversations" regarding three topics, guns, mental health and education. No doubt improvements could be made in all three areas, but at what cost? It also presupposes that a bunch of us with no experience are gonna just come in and kick asss and solve problems that people with tons of experience have not been able to solve. While that is possible, it isn't probable and is very arrogant in its assumptions.

A big thing I see standing out here is that there has been a lot of talk about identifying and restricting certain groups of people with supposed disorders involving their thought processes, etc., such as Asperger's. If you start identifying different groups who have definite positive correlations to violence then don't you have to look at race too? I mean, lots of people here have suggested genetic links to mental health issues and have questioned their relationships to violence. In the past we've been unwilling to do this due to privacy concerns and concerns for the rights otherwise of folks so afflicted, but now we are willing to throw out safeguards in the name of "the children". So if we are, then should we not look at the 800 lb. Gorilla in the room? Black folks seem to have definite genetic correlations between their race and violence. How many violent crimes against persons are committed by young black males? For that matter, how many are committed by young black females as opposed to young females of other races?

Now I know this is racism by today's standards, but hey, it's about the kids and keeping them safe and if you're visiting one population/group then why not visit others and get even more safety? You had twenty kids killed here in one incident, by a young man with Asperger's. How many kids die at the hands of young males of African descent, in the USA, every year?

I knew several young adults with Aspergers while I worked at the local Highschool, only one was an issue. It was becuase his father refused to deal with his behavior and thought it was OK to just let him do what ever he wanted to do when ever he wanted to do with it and if we tried to work or discipline him, daddy would come to his rescue and make excuses for his behavior. Dad was a total a$$ himself so his son was just an extention of himself, along with Aspergers.

The other 15 or so kids, were great and it's becuase of the difference the parents made. It's amazing how one kid can be so screwed up and so many be so well behaved and the only difference is discipline verse non discipline by the parents. kwg

No offense, but if you've read my other posts on the issue, I come down on the side of the fence that Asperger's and violence don't seem to be well-linked. I'm just saying that a lot of people seem to want to and are having these "conversations" about all this great stuff we can do about mental health and nearly magically prevent future occurrences. Since they all want so badly to "help" they at some point, need to look at the racial aspect of the most glaring correlation extant.

I'm sorry, but you were already veering off your trail and totally went off it with the last statement. The responsibility for this shooting lies totally with the shooter and nobody else. No doubt there are things any mom or dad can do better with/for their children, but to say the shootings ultimate responsibility lies anywhere but with the person who pulled the trigger smacks of liberalism.

What makes you feel good is not always what makes one happy.I suspect the games just made him feel good on a short term.

good point, and an important distinction...

about 15% of kids in school now have some form of autism spectrum disorder... Many psychiatric physicians do not consider conditions such as aspergers to be a psych disorder, in and of itself.

it is a communication and developmental issue with underlying sensory and sensory filtering issues.
an asperger kid with auditory sensory issues hears everything around him, and has difficulty filtering out things like conversation from background noise made by passing cars or the refrigerator running.

many asperger folk have visual filtering issues... they can describe what they see in incredible detail...

if an asperger guy doesn't seem to be paying attention to what a teacher says, it's because he hears or senses so much more than most of us... and he senses it all, all of the time...

the asperger kid's brain works much harder focus... some think that this sensory stimulus is what gives asperger kid's their cerebral edge... others wonder what their brains could accomplish if they had more focused concentration...

where many asperger kids get into difficulty is when their sensory super acuity causes them to react negatively...
for some it is taste, or a particular color or visual pattern, or the texture of something that they feel.
This sensory overload, when it comes at them in a form that they find repulsive can cause some real issues.

That's some great info. Thanks for that.

Women have enough trouble raising normal kids alone.
You are nuts if you think it was just as easy for her as it would be if she had the support of a husband.