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Originally Posted by gunner500
In that case, go and load ALL your questionable 6.8's with 85 gr TSX's, use them for crackheads/HD, go buy yourself an AR-10 in 308W, load the 130 gr TTSX's to 2800 fps and kill the hell outta anything.

Gunner



BINGO! Winning post, right there. And in 308, we can run them a bit faster than 2800 if we want to.


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Originally Posted by rost495
Originally Posted by SanCalPigHunter
Originally Posted by gunner500
I dont understand all the hoopla in this thread, when they become available, chrono a box of factory loads, reload to that velocity and accept the little cartridge for what it is.

200 fps means nothing in the real world, would I like to be hit with a 110 gr TTSX at:

2800 fps.....NO
2600 fps.....NO
2400 fps.....NO
2200 fps.....NO crazy

Gunner


Look up what velocity those Barnes TTSX need to be going before they expand or instead create a pencil hole. Thats why i hope this round works out. I would like to hunt boar with a 120gr Barnes TTSX. I bought a couple of boxes for my grendel then looked at the reloadding guide and saw the velocities and compared them to the required impact velocity for the Barnes TTSX and shelved the boxes. Can't use them in the Grendel. They simply don't go fast enough.


Iv'e tried to back out of this idiocy.

But here you go, what Barnes says they need to be going not to pencil.

Rule of thumb and thats all. I've run a lot of barnes under what they claim impact speed has to be. Every last one has expanded. And I have seen pictures of some run faster than needed that did not...

phuggin computers are great though ain't they.


Thanks for your experienced input. That said i'll stick with a manufactures recommendations vs what some anonymous person says on a forum post that can't be validated in anyway.

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Originally Posted by SanCalPigHunter

Thanks for your experienced input. That said i'll stick with a manufactures recommendations vs what some anonymous person says on a forum post that can't be validated in anyway.




Just wanted to point out the irony of this statement in the context of your prvious responses....

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Sounds like an interesting cartridge to me.

That said, I'll wait for the dies to hit the RCBS standard list before I consider owning it.


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Originally Posted by SanCalPigHunter
Originally Posted by rost495
Originally Posted by SanCalPigHunter
Originally Posted by gunner500
I dont understand all the hoopla in this thread, when they become available, chrono a box of factory loads, reload to that velocity and accept the little cartridge for what it is.

200 fps means nothing in the real world, would I like to be hit with a 110 gr TTSX at:

2800 fps.....NO
2600 fps.....NO
2400 fps.....NO
2200 fps.....NO crazy

Gunner


Look up what velocity those Barnes TTSX need to be going before they expand or instead create a pencil hole. Thats why i hope this round works out. I would like to hunt boar with a 120gr Barnes TTSX. I bought a couple of boxes for my grendel then looked at the reloadding guide and saw the velocities and compared them to the required impact velocity for the Barnes TTSX and shelved the boxes. Can't use them in the Grendel. They simply don't go fast enough.


Iv'e tried to back out of this idiocy.

But here you go, what Barnes says they need to be going not to pencil.

Rule of thumb and thats all. I've run a lot of barnes under what they claim impact speed has to be. Every last one has expanded. And I have seen pictures of some run faster than needed that did not...

phuggin computers are great though ain't they.


Thanks for your experienced input. That said i'll stick with a manufactures recommendations vs what some anonymous person says on a forum post that can't be validated in anyway.


More than welcome to. But I bring real world experience to this conversation, not some computer calculation.

I suspect I may have fired the AR a bit more than most excepting those in combat.

And I've a hair of deer shooting experience since we can shoot from 4 or 5 deer up to however many tags you want to pay for in certain areas.

But by all means go with what you read and calculate.

BTW how are you validating the data the designer is claiming RE this new soon to be out round? Only way you could validate is watch him shoot it or shoot your own over your own chronograph.


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Not skeered of wildcats here. At last count I've formed cases for five of them, and have reformed others, when I had a specific reason to do so. Made .22-250's from small primer .308's once, without any special dies. They worked okay, just weren't worth the trouble.


"...the designer of the .270 Ingwe cartridge!..."

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Originally Posted by tex_n_cal
Not skeered of wildcats here. At last count I've formed cases for five of them, and have reformed others, when I had a specific reason to do so. Made .22-250's from small primer .308's once, without any special dies. They worked okay, just weren't worth the trouble.


My list of wildcats is fairly extensive as well, including 22K Hornet, 22 Cheetah Mk 1 and MK ll, 22-250AI, 22/204, 6mmAI, 6/284, 250AI, 7mm Mashburn Super, 300 Belted Newton, 338/8mm RemMag, 348AI and I am sure a few others I am forgetting.

That said, I do NOT try to make or claim that an itty bitty little cartridge is remotely as good as a bigger one, or that it is even sufficient for game that is way above its pay grade.

Who here would have given a second look at a wildcat for a bolt action or lever action rifle that was a 30 Rem or 250 Savage or similar necked down to .277? The collective YAWN such a round would have garnered would be deafening. Yet because this pipsqueak round can be housed in a butt ugly plastic semi automatic rifle that looks sorta like the ones our guys are using in the sandbox, some folks get al giddy about it. Sheesh.....

Useable and interesting velocity's are not reachable ulness one drops down to very low SD bullets and / or plays rifle roulette with nutso pressures.

Just buy a damned hunting rifle, and leave the matchbox rifles for the purposes they are good at (and very good at those, BTW).


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Originally Posted by rost495

BTW how are you validating the data the designer is claiming RE this new soon to be out round? Only way you could validate is watch him shoot it or shoot your own over your own chronograph.

See that's different, because the designer is trying to sell something. No one would ever be led astray by someone trying to sell them something. wink

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Originally Posted by safariman

Who here would have given a second look at a wildcat for a bolt action or lever action rifle that was a 30 Rem or 250 Savage or similar necked down to .277? The collective YAWN such a round would have garnered would be deafening. Yet because this pipsqueak round can be housed in a butt ugly plastic semi automatic rifle that looks sorta like the ones our guys are using in the sandbox, some folks get al giddy about it. Sheesh.....


Bahahaha. But Mark, with this one you could pretend to be P.O. Ackley and play Navy Seals vs. The Taliban at the same time!

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Glad you liked my analogy and drawing out of the comparison and folly.

I like my AR's, but I know what they are and are not. Just like my Harley ain't my pickup truck. When I need to do something big, I get the keys to the pickup and don't try to hitch a trailer to the bike, saying it can do it if I just run the RPMS at 6300 the whole way.


LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.

About 2016 team "R" candidates "We definitely need a crew with a sack of balls the size of hot water bottles, bloviated estrogen leaking feel-gooders need not apply." Gunner 500
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Originally Posted by safariman

I like my AR's, but I know what they are and are not. Just like my Harley ain't my pickup truck. When I need to do something big, I get the keys to the pickup and don't try to hitch a trailer to the bike, saying it can do it if I just run the RPMS at 6300 the whole way.


That's a very good analogy; I agree.

Personally, when using a semi-auto, I have little interest in one chambered for a wildcat cartridge, and zero interest in one which uses expensive parent brass, due to the brass retrieval issue. It's just too easy to lose brass in a field shooting scenario.

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Yeah...'cause what the world needs right now is another cartridge we can't get.

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Originally Posted by prairie_goat
Originally Posted by safariman

I like my AR's, but I know what they are and are not. Just like my Harley ain't my pickup truck. When I need to do something big, I get the keys to the pickup and don't try to hitch a trailer to the bike, saying it can do it if I just run the RPMS at 6300 the whole way.


That's a very good analogy; I agree.

Personally, when using a semi-auto, I have little interest in one chambered for a wildcat cartridge, and zero interest in one which uses expensive parent brass, due to the brass retrieval issue. It's just too easy to lose brass in a field shooting scenario.


Digging through a 3 foot snowbank for $1.10 a piece (plus time spent forming) brass sounds like lots of FUN.

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They sell brass catcher gadgets, too. grin


"...the designer of the .270 Ingwe cartridge!..."

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I'd still love to pull up beside the feller plinking away with this little anemic prick and wail a 140 TTSX by way of a 7-08 R25 across a 600 yard stretch and biitch slap the gong at the other end.


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I wouldn't think a 270 AR would exactly be anemic at 600 yards.

140 AB, 20" bbl, BL-C2, 59K psi, 2600 fps.

Code
Tabular trajectory data at Non-Std. Atmosphere
 Gunsite altitude : 4500 ft.
 Air density      : 0.061325 lb./ft�
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Gun / Ammunition : .30 Rem AR, edited to 270 AR
 Bullet           : .277, 140, Nosler AccuBond 54765
 Bullet weight    : 140 grains or 9.07 Grams
 Muzzle velocity  : 2603 fps
 Crosswind speed  : 10 Mph 
 Ballistic Coefficient(s) (G1): 
 C1=0.496@V>0 fps;


 
 Range  Velo Time of  Energy   Path    Deflection    Total  Sight correction  Target
        city  flight            to    at crosswind    drop   for setting new   lead
                                LOS    of 10.0 Mph             zero range     20 fps
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
�Yards   fps     s    ft.lbs.   in.    in.     MOA     in.   Clicks     MOA     yds �
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|    0  2603  0.0000   2106    -2.0    0.0   -----     0.0   ------    -----    0.00
|  100  2463  0.1184   1885    +1.8    0.5    0.52     2.7     -5.1    -1.76    0.79
M  120  2435  0.1425   1843    +2.0    0.7    0.59     3.8     -4.5    -1.56    0.95
X  200  2327  0.2428   1682     0.0    2.2    1.04    11.0      0.0     0.00    1.62
P  246  2266  0.3031   1595    -3.0    3.4    1.34    16.9     +3.4    +1.16    2.02
|  300  2195  0.3761   1498    -8.4    5.3    1.70    25.8     +7.8    +2.67    2.51
|  400  2068  0.5173   1329   -24.0    9.9    2.37    47.9    +16.7    +5.73    3.45
|  500  1945  0.6655   1175   -47.4   15.7    3.00    77.8    +26.3    +9.05    4.44
|  600  1825  0.8238   1035   -79.9   23.3    3.70   116.8    +37.0   +12.72    5.49

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Originally Posted by archie_james_c
I'd still love to pull up beside the feller plinking away with this little anemic prick and wail a 140 TTSX by way of a 7-08 R25 across a 600 yard stretch and biitch slap the gong at the other end.


Ya'd have to wait till I was otu of ammo for my 223 so the gong would quit moving with each hit though. But I'd humor ya at the end of a mag.


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yep the louder and bigger you are the badder you are that is a known fact. whistle

Wow another 6.8 caliber AR cartridge...so what. Second if I need more than a 5.56 I will use a bolt gun in one of 3 other calibers I own. I am down to 3 these days... So far 3 pigs and 1 10 point are dead in two years with the 5.56.


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Quote


Pig shooter, we are just trying to educate you so you have realistic expectations regarding what can, and cannot be done with a new wildcat.

We've seen the promises that never materialize, and know the tricks to maximize velocity.

Once you've lengthened the throat, lengthened the barrel, matched the most modern powder to the barrel length/bullet choice, and increased the case capacity, all that's left is to ramp up the pressure.

Since many of us on this forum own custom rifes and chronographs we've been testing what does, and does not work since the 80's. We are familiar with the effects of custom barrels and changes in OAL.

Oh by the way, if you increase OAL, which way does the pressure go?


You forgot strengthen the bolt.

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All to shoot a deer like its a hundred yards closer..


Originally Posted by captain seafire
I replace valve cover gaskets every 50K, if they don't need them sooner...
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