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The crowd here generally, or as a rule, falls all over itself telling everyone that a Remington will stabilize anything you wish. People are apparently idiots to think otherwise. What twist rate are their 243's?

The drama here is incredible.

I think what you're trying to say is that the 9 1/4" twist will (typically) stabilize the 105gr. A-Max.

The 9" twist does not always stabilize the Bergers. That is why people would prefer an 8 twist so they can shoot all the bullets that are currently offered in .243 diameter.



Travis

What percent of $1500 rifles will be sold to the bubba's. They buy 700 BDL, or equal Winchester, as a top of line rifle. A few will buy a Mark V. I am not a VLD shooter, and do not use a little gun and try to make it a bigger gun. However I still prefer the faster twist, and Bubba will never know.

After reading this whole thing this pretty much sums it up for me too. Not really any downside to following the partial public trend toward high BC bullets.

Unfortunately for me it is difficult to find a place to hunt here where 300 yard shots are common much less VLD's.

twofish

Also, it would be great if somebody would be kind enough to send me a PM about the Kimber group buy please.

Thanks,

twofish

"Bubba" isn't going to know or care about the twist rate. So you can put any twist you want in it, and he'll be happy enough.

Those in the know want a fast twist rate, on everything. What's so difficult about this?

The 243 certainly should be 8 twist, as there are already bullets available "to the masses" that require such. We're talking now, not some dream in the future.

Joe has a bushel that holds both large apples and small apples equally well,

Sam has a bushel that holds only small apples,large apples don't fit

They both cost the same

Which bushel would you want Joe's or Sam's?

I will get more apple from Sam. It will take a little longer to peel them though.

You're not buying the apples just the bushel

Well now. That changes things. Its funny to see this about fast twists. PO Ackley's books show several Qick Twist calibers that didn't work out for some reason. We seem to be redoing that, but maybe with more success. Is it bullet balance. Mule Deer has said it is much better than in the past.

Match, target or VLD type bullets don't suffer as much with fast twists. If people are saying that Partitions, CoreLoks or any other type bullets you'd buy off the shelf won't suffer being over spun then twist the shiitt outta them then.

It's settled then .243 and .22-250's shall have 1:8 barrels
Lets not make them with a long throat and have a generous size mag and the market is cornered

22-250 with an 8" twist opens up a whole new world. That one would own the show.

95% of guys paying $1500 will grab a box of cheap bullets off the shelf leaving the store and go hunt/shoot without considering twist.

Most 24hr members(custom rifle enthusiast) are beyond that, but were a very small % of rifle sales. I wouldn't never build a .243 without an 8 twist, but 'Bubba' don't care.

Why yes it would. Anxiously awaiting one...

Don't know about throat geo, but the Ed Brown 704 had a 2.850 mag length. LA was 3.7".

Let's not forget how we came by a 10 twist in the 243. The 244 Remington fell flat because it was twisted 12,and would not stabilize bullets longer than the 90 gr slugs of its day.OTOH, Winchester brought out the 243 with a 10 twist,which stabilized the heavier and longer 100 gr bullets.

So the 243 won the popularity contest and Remington had to rename the 244 to 6mm Rem and twist it 9, IIRC...it was still too late and the 6mm Rem never did catch up.

Then, much like today, the 6mm fans wanted the option of shooting the heavier 6mm bullets; but I never heard anyone complain about shooting lighter bullets in the faster twists of either the 243 or the 6mm Remington as the years went by,and both cartridges were used in a dual role of deer /varmint cartridges.

But today, bullets are even longer, what with the monos,and the VLD types up to 115 grains for those wanting to go long. I have not taken a look at factory 243 offerings but eventually,it's inevitable the factories will start offering VLD type bullets in heavier/longer configurations. So a faster twist in a 243 could be a good thing.

As t "Joe Average", whoever he is, the average shooter has access to more info in places like this site, where these things are discussed....he may not be aware now but he will be if he's paying attention...and may want to develop into shooting the heavier bullets. No sense repeating the mistakes of 60 years ago and handicap his rifle with a slower twist.

There just isn't any question that things are trending this way,and we have many different bullets today vs 60 years ago;and not just 243 but other calibers like 6.5 and 7mm as well.

And in any event I don't see Joe Average buying this rifle; no doubt, some will, but i see it appealing to the guy who wants to move beyond the mass produced-every size fits all type mass production offerings in the sub-$1000 price range...someone who wants to step up in quality.

Or the guy who previously might have built a custom with the features this rifle will hopefully offer but can accomplish most of those things with a rifle in the $1800 price range vs the $2000-$40000 he'd have to spend on a full custom.

In any event I don't see either of these groups loaded with many stooges...since they will know what they are looking for....much like Kimber or Forbes buyers today who want light weights without the heavy weight price tags.

Anyway that's my read on things.

I can't fathom how a 1-9" isn't a nice compromise.

You want to settle for a compromise?

The irony is, you probably live in one, drive one, and are in the employ of one. The world is full of them. For good reason.