Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles 24HC Black Rifle Challenge Thread

Well, 10x is the biggest I've got, so likely it won't be good enough when I do get around to shooting. No doubt a 16x is an advantage.

Waiting on the Dyna Bore Coat to do the new barrel, then get it broken in........got 6 load variants loaded for initial testing to see how the new barrel shoots, so it'll be a while yet to see if it's even good enough to shoot with.

MM

The data so far ain't looking like it; the only real "production" gun so far that makes the grade is Fiddy's Stag Varminter..........that gun is guaranteed .5" from the factory& it looks like his measures up.

Scenar Shooters gun in no way, shape, or form resembles a stock AR..........that's a hand built custom by one of the best shops in the country & it's a 6mm, not a .22.

Virtually all of the rest of the stock guns are well over MOA.

Obviously, optics & ammo are other significant variables, besides the shooter..........Scenar Shooter, for example, would shoot well, as would rost495, with anything they were handed, others, probably not so much.

MM

I still disagree, IIRC, the top half of shooters are at or under MOA.

And the rest, no diss intended, may well not be able to shoot well enough, the ammo likely is not totally tuned, and likely have nerves and conditions to deal with when shooting 10 shot groups. If you think that at 100 you can ignore the wind, if there is wind, you are wrong. It can easily add.25/.50 moa to a group if ignored.

I have no clue how to prove it, but I can say that almost any barrel I've messed with, save for one used bushmaster I was given, and one 6.5 twist Pac Nor, have all been MOA or under capable.

if we are looking for .5moa capable then its another game.

And you have to remember, we've had folks here find out they have mount/scope and ammo troubles so far basically. AND that this is not a flat BR test, its not allowing the big rear bags of heavy sand, the big heavy front rests and prefer not to use benches also basically.

FWIW the last 5 years I shot, I had a test upper, and put all new barrels on it. 12X leupold, the test top, had a 3 inch or 4 inch wide floated AL end with a piece of wood on it, that was slick varnished. IE I could find out what the barrels were capable of totally basically with that rig, it was EASY to shoot well. Before I ever put the barrels on my service rifle uppers.

If I had the time I'd be willing to bet that given most any of the none MOA uppers, I could get MOA out of them.

Don't forget we are shooting 10 shot groups, take out the 5 worst of each group, and it changes yet again. No one shoots 10 shot groups, except highpower idiots that shoot 10 shot on the short and up to 22 shot groups mostly...

The bull barreled Armalite indeed was assembled by me, but the barrel and free float tube are available from Armalite; if you order an M15TBN, you'll pretty much have the same thing.

Bull Barrel Armalite

Yes, that's true & as far as I'm concerned, 5 shots determines if a rifle is MOA............but the rules here are 10 & only 4 of 17 so far have been <MOA with 10 shots avg for 2 groups.

But several of the >MOA groups of 10 would likely be <MOA with 5 shots counted.

MM

Actually it's moa for 20 shots that we're trying for but who's counting?

MOA for 20 shots is pretty damn good for any rifle. Let alone an AR 15/black rifle. Good shooting guys!!

Alright I'm headed to the range tomorrow and I'm really gonna try to work this in at lunch. Since I'm a firm believer that it's never too early to start making excuses I'm going to share my "precision rifle" preparation with you.

Step 1-Pull your hunting scope off your deer rifle and install it with some janky rings you found in a drawer. Be sure and level the scope by shouldering it and getting the vertical crosshair lined up with the support bar on your garage door.


Step 2-Thoroughly clean your lenses with your shirttail.


Step 3-Install custom lens covers so the glass will still be crystal clear tomorrow.

Blue tape will keep those lenses MUCH cleaner...

I had Trespassers on my range yesterday...

The rules as stated go way beyond what any and I mean any MFG would consider within their accuracy guarantee. Most only guarantee 3 shot groups while a few, state 5 shot group, it doesn't matter if it only produces 1 5 shot group every 3rd or 4th time...

No where that I have found does anyone guarantee a 10 shot group under .5 or even 1 MOA. The industry standard is 3 shots and custom makers usually 5. And that's with the shooter taken out of the picture, no bi-pods or heavy bags.

Mine are not production guns but guns I have assembled myself, I still say they will shoot better than I do, this contest is both the shooter and the gun, those like Pat and Jeff should be extra proud of their guns and their shooting.

Ran over to the nice covered range at lunch and got everything set up. Then the dump trucks you see on the left showed up and shut me down.


So I had to move from the covered range with concrete benches and padded chairs to this. I used a range bag full of a first aid kit and shotgun shell caddies and a beach towel for my front rest and a wife-made pinto bean rear bag. The raincoat kept most of the crushed granite off / out of me.
*Different rifle in this pic*


The rifle is a Bluedreaux-built upper and lower.
Vltor A5 receiver extension with A5H3 buffer
Geissele S3G trigger
18" rifle gas BCM SS barrel
15" Troy rail
Surefire brake
The scope is a Burris FF2 3-9 in some unknown make rings that are definitely not high enough.


Ammo was Atlanta Arms & Ammo 77grain BTHP.

First group--1 1/4"


Adjusted 10 clicks down and 4 clicks left--1 3/8"


1 4/16 + 1 6/16" = 1 10/16 averaged to 1 5/16", which I believe is 1.31".

Not bad, that's about like my Daniel Mk12. What loads did you shoot?

Atlanta Arms & Ammo 77grain BTHP

that criterion barrel shoots pretty good!

While I continue to say that 77s shoot very well, I also have found you have to find the right "node" for them in the gun. IE all factory 77s might not be so swift.

With faster twist guns, the gold standard to test factory is federal gold medal match 69s IMHO. The brass is throw away though... as is all 223 by FC(not LC)

OR used to alwyas be 25 of Varget CCI BR 4, LC case, 2.250 oal and 69 smks if reloading.

PS low rings can be a bit of a pain and you may be getting parallax, OTOH it tends to force a good stock weld, and thats a plus IMHO.

But thats just my thoughts and you know they are worth only what you pay ... LOL. Like I'd have a clue. LOL.

I have some 69gr TMK's might give them a whirl

Blue,

Looks like someone ran over a traffic cop with a steam roller...but conveniently missed his rifle.

LOL

I've seen it mentioned time and again here that Federal 223 brass is junk, but I don't think I've ever read the reason behind that statement.

I keep seeing that too but I load and shoot it with good precision.