This will not be another Afghanistan for either us or Russia. That being said, How's this going to end ?

I'm going to say this will get very bloody very fast, the current leaders will be sought out and shot for treason without trials or interference from the west, balless Joe Biden will be told to sit the F~ck down and shut the F~ck up, the time for talking has long past, and if any one believes those scary old sanctions will cause Putin to rethink about his breakfast plans are just plain wrong.

Do the Ukrainians have the balls to fight or will they go along with the rest of those we have freed and go back to goat F~cking and bug eating ?

Do these people have both the heart and the hatred of Russia to fight for their own rights and way of life or is the corruption so wide spread that the undesirables will just be eliminated ?

I don't think Putin will use nukes, he knows the cost of the clean up after the Chernobyl fiasco, this is going to get ugly real fast .

IMO - my concern is China - do they see us doing nothing and move in the Pacific? That is MUCH closer to home and a much easier sell on affecting US interests. Do you embolden China by NOT getting involved in the Ukraine. Then again, Ukrainian involvement means you're stretched to get involved with China if need be too.

I think you tell China - we're sitting out Europe so we can focus on PacRim issues and WILL go full tilt there.

What Teal said. Ukraine will get an epic ass whoopin'. Vlad will impale her.

It ends in a day or two and with Russia in control of whatever it wants. But they only want those two eastern provinces.

Low yield battlefield air burst nukes have much less fall out. They have a much larger stockpile than the US of these types of weapons. It was difference in strategic choices. I think the idea is the us of a battlefield nuke would put your opponent in a very difficult situation. Do you go full MAD(Mutual Assured Destruction) or just suffer the losses.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tactical_nuclear_weapon

Chernobyl was so dirty because is smoldered for ever and the smoke was highly contaminated.

Nuke strategy and tactics are new and untried just as Blitzkrieg was new and untried.

They already hod those provinces for all intents and purposes.

I don't know how it ends TBH.

You really believe that?

Putin met with Pakistan and China all within the last month. India hates Pakistan and China. Something is setting up, perhaps.

Russia will still be,,,,,, Russia.

And China will be ,,, well bigger than it is now.

In a way, Brother Kipling’s Great Game continues……..

Nobody is going to stop any aggression.

The allies have nothing but limp wristed puzzies who are incapable of any type of statesmanship, or handling any type of crisis situation.

Nothing but emotion driven idiots.

Our leaders lead the pack in limp wristed puzzies.

Putin has already said he wants the old Soviet Union put back together. Ukraine was part of that as well as the old "stan" countries in central Asia. He is very mad about letting Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania into NATO. Also Poland, Czech Republic, Slovokia, Romania, Bulgaria, and Hungary which once were part of the Soviet sphere of influence and were communist puppet countries.

Putin is or has taken Ukraine and in no uncertain terms has warned the rest of the world to back off or there will be hell to pay.

https://www.aol.com/news/russia-attacks-ukraine-defiant-putin-055130690-092317747.html

Ends with Russia in full control of the Ukraine. I will be surprised if there is much resistance. I’m hoping we keep our people out of it. My disabled EOD friend friends still in are in Europe. They were calling him from Eastern Europe for the last couple of weeks but they went silent this week. The Russians aren’t dune coons !

Putin has no need to use nukes to win as much as he wants. He doesn't care how many Russian soldiers or Ukrainians die. He'll get the territory he wants.

And then Biden will claim victory.

It will never end.

I can't see where anyone would have expected a
different outcome to all this

Those that have been speaking of it were called
alarmists, tin hats, survivalists, etc., but here it is

Why wouldn’t I? And while would I care what they want? I don’t give a damn.

As has been stated Putin will take whatever he wants of Ukraine. Any sanctions will end up hurting us as bad as them and will have no real effect.

I am with you and the upcoming showdown with China is the one that really concerns me. I agree we should be sending the message to China that we are serious about dealing with them. , I just don’t think this administration has the reputation or the ability to get that message across. A confrontation there seems almost inevitable now given the stumbling foreign policy decisions of this administration.

I agree the west will do nothing for a very long time, so what happens is in the mind of Putin and Xi. You can never forget there are truly irrational and megalomaniacal people out there who do irrational things. We have lived in the lap of luxury for a very long time. We have multiple generations who are disconnected from the real world which history shows us.

War has been history's tried and true Great Reset.

My guess is though Putin will take all of Ukraine by imposing a puppet leader while maintaining a phony sovereignty in Ukraine. And teh west will do nothing.

Exactly. While the US and western Europe is being woke and patting themselves on the back for letting dudes swim in races against women, Putin and Xi are plotting to take over the world and all we can/will do is sternly scold them.

Just like here at home, the Democrats are constantly at war against us, throwing 1000 preposterous ideas against the wall and hoping 1 or 2 stick, while Republicans in charge pat themselves on the back for stopping 998 or 999 of those ideas. Nevermind the 1 or 2 that stuck are totally assinine, and now they're going to do it again and again, all because our leadership is a bunch of limp wristed puzzies that won't stop the stuff because "we stopped a lot of it though".

I agree with what was said above^^^^^^^

I sympathize with the everyday Ukrainian people. We and a number of other countries made great promises of protection to them if they just gave up their own heavy missiles, back in the 90’s.
Kinda sounds like our own 2A fight.
As long as Putin is alive he will drive for more. The trend worldwide of appeasement fuels him.

I could be wrong of course. As soon as Joe gets outta bed at the crack of noon he might just go all out Corn Pop on ol Putin.

Osky

China is the real elephant in Americas closet, they will take advantage of this.

China started taking advantage of things really big time back in 2019.

Cough, cough.

I live in mid-eastern Romania, about 300 miles or so , as the crow flies from Crimea. I've been here almost 8 years now and never thought I'd see this. In a few days we will have Russia on our northern border. They are already in Kiev as we type. It may be a while, but I think he (Putin) will go for non-EU, non-NATO Moldova next, which is on our north eastern border. After that if Putin still has ambitions, it will be the acid test for NATO and the free world. Let him or not let him. I know it is not really the United States fight and ever since the Soviet break up, these European countries should have been building their militarys, to defend themselves instead of carrying on with their corruption, but the question is: Does the USA and the rest of the free world want to allow Russia to gobble up a large portion of free Europe and be an even larger menace to the rest of the world in the future? Hopefully the Chinese will not choose to show their asses at this time, RJ

Vlad knows how this is going to end. The rest of us are clueless. Taking Vlad at his word, from his books...the Russian Black Sea Fleet was based at Odessa before the fall of the Soviet empire, and after Minsk agreement they were kicked out and the fleet neutralized without an ice free port. So he takes Crimea, giving him Sevastapol as a fleet base....but it is undefendable if you look at the map. Then the gold braid at NATO says, oh let's get these little pissant countries around Sevastapol to join NATO and screw Vlad. This is Vlads move to secure a base for his fleet. If he takes some real estate to secure his fleet base, it should stabilize. If it's more convenient to take the whole damn Ukraine, he will do that. US presidents and NATO forced the Russian bear into a corner....now they are shocked at the bears response. We are ruled by idiots, renewed with fresh idiots every 4 years.

No they want more, but those can be taken with the lest fuss. They present the best risk/reward ratio for Russia.

Putin doesn't have to take all of Ukraine today. By just pealing off these two additional provinces we weakens Ukraine as a nation and encourages more breakups which will eventually lead to the nation to fracture much like the former Yugoslavia. Putin will get the Ukrainian industrial east, the oil and gas properties and land bridge to the Crimea he wants.

For practical purposed the world will do nothing and our opponents will be further emboldened.

I am guessing he is going to go after non EU non NATO countries bordering Russian Federation first. Next will come Baltic States of Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania with significant Russian populations. The [bleep] will use same excuse as Hitler did with Sudetenland ie trampling on rights of German population there. If he is not stopped now I am guessing he might go to the Oder river line.

Joe byron won’t even remeber the war.

Russia will stop with Ukraine unless the American government starts arming up other nation states which border Russia,...as they did in Ukraine.

I don’t give a frick. We don’t live in a free country. Why the frick should I care if anyone else does? Putin can’t be worse than our current overlords.

A move on Moldova sounds plausible.

Kamala Harris is on it. It'll all be fine.

Moldova is a failed state that has been pillaged by its government. It's the poorest nation state in Europe. It would voluntarily rejoin with Russia.

News is saying now that troops have destroyed a nuclear waste facility at Chernobyl, I wonder if that is the containment site of the reactor?

Phil

If Ukrainians do not roll over like Afghanis did, Russia may have a huge insurgency on their hands. Russia does not have the finance to keep a war running, so it will most likely be short in theory?

I don't care about Ukraine. But WT Crude is already up $7/barrel this morning.

Biden needs to quit cockblocking American oil production.

Yesterday.

But he probably won't.

We need to take back our own country before concerning ourselves with goings on on the other side of the world.

I don't disagree with you in that regard but ...

1) Even a limp wrist can push a button.
2) There's nothing more dangerous or unpredictable than a coward backed into a corner.
3) Our major wars have begun with Democrats in office.

What have I missed on that list?

I think these are very dangerous times.

Tom

The Foundation of ALL THINGS... the very core of human nature.

People/Governments TAKE STUFF UNTIL THEY ARE STOPPED.

What will stop Russia/China?

Blow Biden?

Cameltoe?

The will of the people?

Chit...

I hear what you are saying, but what gets us into jams is weak leaders.

Russia and China see that. Hell, the world sees it.

It's strong leaders who are willing to do something that keep the Russias and Chinas at bay.

In that respect, we DO live in dangerous times.

This right here is the absolute bottom line. And the only reason all this is coming down now. The plan has all come together!

It ends with us still stuck with a dementia ridden dumbfugg and a clueless whore.

The Ukraine military will put down their arms. Russia will occupy Ukraine to prevent the American government from rearming Ukraine and turning it into a puppet state that's hostile to Russia. Moldova and Belarus will someday petition to rejoin with Russia.

China and Russia will form an uneasy alliance in order to prevent western based globohomo from getting a foothold in the east.

A "new world order" has been established in the east.

The big problem for American will occur when the dollar loses world currency status,.....which is already in the works.

I bet ukraine is asking Biden and his son for their money back... 😀

Y'all don't worry. I really like General Tso...he will take it easy on us lol

I expect Putin to hold trials/hearings to expose the financial corruption of Ukraine with Joe and Hunter Biden. Nothing would come from it but expose to the world what Our leadership is about.

That would be fugging GREAT

Might be the beginning of the end ?

I think Bristoe has a valid point here. For some reason I think Bidet's relationship with Ukraine had a lot to do with this escalating. Russia does not want NATO on their border and Bidet has an established financial relationship with Ukraine. I think Russia and China have aspirations of world domination and they are competing with the World Economic Forum and the UN. Somehow I think the three significant players are Putin, Xi and Klaus Schwab. While the democraps and Bidet focus on green energy, wind turbines and electric vehicles, these three are focused on world domination.

I used this on my Facebook. Probably gonna get booted again lol

Me, too...

Ah yes, all mymilitary influences go back to the tactical applications of the chicken dishes of that famous Chinese general as well as the victories set forth on the cholestérol front by our own Colonel Sanders!!!

Vive Pullet frit!

Funny as fugg lol

Looking at numerous high government officials from US and Britain visit there high on the list will be government of Poland. I would not be surprised if Russians do not advance to Oder river line.

Let the gutless Europeans sort it out, it's their problem. I'm sick of USA being everybody's daddy.

Yep

Russia won't bother Poland.

There is a better chance of Poland invading Russia than Russia invading Poland. Poland would love to have back the western half of Ukraine which was Poland up until the end of WW II when Stalin basically picked up Poland and set it down 100 miles west of where it always had been.

There will be no nukes. The Russians want the Ukraine's resources. It's a great farming area and they need it. This is 1 more in a long series of fights that go back for several centuries.

^^^^

I was listening to some guy the other day talking about his family. They were all from Eastern Europe. One had been born in Poland. One had been born in Soviet Union. And one had been born in either Belarus or Ukraine, I can’t remember. Anyways that sounds cool.

Except they were all born in the same house in the same village.

The Poles have most pro American ruling elite class in Central/Eastern Europe. Where does one start? They are the reason Russians had to construct Baltic Pipeline because the Poles would not agree to pipeline through their territory. They have backed opposition government in Belorussia. They will now become to Americans and the British what Pakistan was to Taliban. I do not see how Russian Federation can tolerate this. The only way the Poles could get land back east of Curzon Line is by cooperating and helping the Russian Federation. One must remember the reason current western border is on the Oder river was because Josef Stalin wanted to move German border further west from Russia. The Americans wanted Poland to have pre World War II border with Germany.

Poland should worry as much looking immediately to their west as they should to the east.

Just think? What if Prussia was still around???

It may yet rise again. There might be some old junkers hiding in the basement ready to get the band back together again.

The helmets would be way cooler.

Mission from God, you know.

Ukrainians aren't just laying down. There's some fight in them. I saw them deploying manpads against helos and one shot down for sure

Ironically, 80 years ago we fought against Germany who attacked Russia, and Japan who attacked China. Perhaps we fought on the wrong side...

Blocking the Russian pipeline was serious mistake. Russians offered to build it at their own cost plus pay Poles over billion dollars per year for it existance, not to mention affordable energy source. The Poles would be much better off if they cooperated and traded with Russian Federation and Germany. They would not be in danger of annihilation now.

A pickelhaube in every haus!

Wrong, Americans created an empire that lasts to this day.

Have the Poles modernized? When Hitler invaded them, they tried to hold off the tanks with horse mounted cavalry.

Germany just wants the whole thing over so they can continue buying natural gas from Russia again. In fact, none of NATO wants to be involved with this situation.

Word is out on the American Government and no one wants to participate in its aggressions any longer.

The Cold War was over and it will be over again as soon as the warmongers who control the American government stop pushing fratricide between Russia, Europe, and the U.S.A.

No, that’s not true. There was never an attack of cavalry against tanks in direct attacks. Cavalry was used on both sides in that conflict and there were at least two instances of Polish cavalry taking positions from German infantry and support troops. They completely routed one German support company column.

Like Sadam’s soldiers taking babies out of incubators and throwing them on the floor, the cavalry against tanks was entirely a creation of the western press.

In the scale of empires, 70 to 80 years ain’t much of an accomplishment. More like a fart in the wind.

The Polish government at the time acted stupidly. They should have joined Czechoslovakia with backing of the French and attacked Germany. Instead they did nothing when Hitler took Austria and Czechoslovakia. When everyone assumed the Poles were allies of Germany they came crawling to French and British for help (one hiding behind Maginot line and other a sea power). After Hitler took Czechoslovakia had enough military hardware to strike the poles from three sides. Current Polish government is repeating mistakes from the past.

anyone read Putin's address which he made yesterday? interesting.

Exactly. And look at what Russia and China are up to today...

So, when does NATO invade the western half of Ukraine to “protect it from Russian aggression”?

Kerry is worried how this might fug up his grift.

Twitter vid

Well, actually the burden of empire was more or less handed off to us by the Brits about 60 years ago when they became too broke to maintain it. It should have died after WW II, but we couldn't help ourselves. Must be part of our Brit-spawned DNA.

Wow. Unbelievable.

The American Empire has been disassembled by the globalists. America now lacks a manufacturing base which could be utilized to fight a global war.

Now, the globalists are attempting to ignite a global war which would cause the destruction of America.

That Leftist self importance defined there.

Fuggin' idiots all.

Stolen elections have consequences.

We can't even get our own pickups off the assy line now.

As long as Russians keep thugs like Putin in power, it will never end. This is why we need to stay out.

It’s a damned shame, no?

Slow Joe and the G7 "leaders" are having a virtual meeting, so I'm guessing surrender is close !

Nothing makes the world more dangerous than having a corrupt, feckless, senile old fart in charge of the most powerful ( for the time being) nation .

I think we’re operating on inertia which is quickly waning; we already are destroyed it just hasn’t been fully realized yet.

On the other hand, that Turley piece that stevelyn posted above presents a viewpoint with more potential for optimism. It’s well worth watching.

Indeed.




Poles are in no danger of annihilation. Russia may be able to beat Ukraine about the head, but they don;t have the numbers much beyond that. End state likely to be "independent" Donbass and pro-Russian Ukranian gov't tied tightly to Russia in every way.

That empire was christened in 1865, not 1945.



1. True, the Poles had actual cavalry units at the outset of WW2. So did USSR and IIRC, did Germany.

2. EVERY combatant except the Americans, relied on horse-drawn logistics for the last link of the supply chain to the troops. ALL of them. And the USSR could not have fought WW2 without American trucks.

3. People forget that a Germany vs Poland match-up was not considered a shoo-in for Germany. A quick and dirty list of wars/conflicts Poland participated in between 1900 and 1939:

1905 Polish revolution squashed by Imperial Russia L
1914-1918 WWI, Poland emerged a polity partly due to their own devices. W
1918-1919-ish Poles fought Imperial Germany, Wiemar Germany, Czechoslovakia, Ukrainian Commies/Bolshies with the following record: W, D, L, W
1919-1921: Poland beats back various Soviet armies and beats the Red Army on the Vistula, stopping Soviet incursion into central Europe butt-cold. Poland thumps on Lithuania BIG W
1938 Poland wins the rematch with Czechoslovakia W


In 1939 Poland was coming off a big win vs Czechoslovakia, which was not backwards, industrially. And the Czechs had good armaments to the point the Germans used Czech tanks in the blitz vs France later.

Poland suffered from its perennial weakness: abso-freaking-lutely awful leadership (aristocracy, dictator, or otherwise). Pig-headed, foolish, and belligerent, Poland's leadership walked them into a calamity with the urging of the UK and France.

Garry Kasparov on what the west should do.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1496865471995523080.html

Does anyone know who the brains are behind Putin's desires to control Europe ?

His ruling by sword has never been a long term solution or even a profitable one, Afghanistan was a good proving point for that.

Ruling a people that despise you is no way to prosper either as a leader, or a country, does this not put Putin himself in an undesirable position or a target of opportunity ?

How long before our electrical grid goes down ?

Last, Poland has been spending real money on armaments.

'
I agree with this. Our institutions and industry were so strong at one time, it is just taking time for the wheels to grind to a halt. Barring a major turnaround, we are finished.

Looking like we have a 21st century example of a Russian Blitzkrieg.

Read the Bible. It will tell you.

I don't know if anyone mentioned this yet but they want you watching that war so you'll not notice the war being waged against us.

For everyone here blaming Russia for the hot war remember that we started this war back in ‘14 with our CIA Orange Revolution in the Ukraine. We also just escalated and reminded Russia just how evil we are with another attempted color revolution on their border in Kazakhstan. The Russians are just now punching back. The Russians will install a puppet government in western Ukraine and insure the Russian majority breakaway areas of the Ukraine are protected. The Russians tried to end the Cold War and we never stopped. We’re the evil empire now and we’re the bad guys in the Ukraine today. Pax Americana needs to rot in Hades ! Pax Americana was never peaceful to anyone including the American people.

I just discussed this same idea with several folks. General consensus was similar to yours. For example how would the US feel if a foreign power was trying to install a hostile leader in one of our border nations and then equip them militarily etc? Also see our reaction to the Cuban Missle Crisis.....

Or the Chinese and Canada joining in an anti USA alliance and stationing Chinese troops in Canada ? Or Mexico ?

I honestly think Putin wants to, Return Russia to its glory days as a feared world power. If they retake Ukraine which was once the bread basket of Russia. He will keep going, Russia does not give a chit look what they did in Chechnya. Leveled the whole damn capital in a massive artillery barrage.

Putin definitely wants Russia respected. As for keeping going it isn’t going to happen. The Russian economy and military isn’t big enough nor is it well suited for offensive operations. If you look at the structure of the Russian military it is a more defensive military. Stretching into Poland or beyond would lead to real resistance and the loss of airspace control. The Russian army isn’t near big enough to absorb the losses it would suffer without air superiority. The Ukraine isn’t a NATO member and much of the Ukrainian airspace is within range of Russian ground based networked layered air defense systems. The Russians can muster enough mobile S400 SAM systems to control the airspace over all of the Ukraine when combined with Russian aircraft but Russia aircraft are not up to fighting US aircraft without the advanced SAM component. Once airspace over the Russian army is lost the losses on the ground would be unsustainable.

done in 72 hours at most . Hardly an invasion of Europe. Putin has made is point showing how weak and feckless NATO, the US and Canda are. Just like he did last time under Obama another weak feckless puzzzi

It will end real soon with new government in Kiev friendly towards Russian Federation. The only thing standing in the way are Ukrainian military and security forces which are being taken care of by forces of the Russian Federation. It should not be hard to convince most of Ukrainian high and middle brass to hang up arms. I expect "Comic" and his adminstration to be out real soon.

In the last couple of hours, 10k automatic weapons have been passed out to civilians in Kyiv.

They're gonna get used.

Well, basically the whole world sold out Ukraine. Ok, it is time for them to give up.

Holy crap, why can't Putin invade Arizona?

Ukrainian forces blew up the bridge over the Oskil River to stop the Russians. Heavy fighting in Sen'kove and Sumy.

Slavek would like yo to believe Ukraine is simply rolling over like a puppy.

They're not.

Just exactly what do you expect can be done by anyone putting military on the ground over there? How many troops can we get in place to do any good? In the past the communist funded those we fought, North Korea and Vietnam. Now they're doing to job themselves. How did that go for us in Korea and Vietnam? What form of government do they have now? We won't go full throttle on them and that's what's needed. No we'll get a few thousand, maybe more of own people killed then that many more maimed and for what. If Putin was landing troops in Alaska tomorrow biden would do nothing and that's what will describe anything he does in Ukraine. You want to get serious about liberating some people under the communist thumb? Well get started in Cuba then move right on down into Central and South America. Or lets go north and kick the ever living s h i t out of Trudeau and company.

Ukraine will have a new puppet government and that will be that.

The western governments will voice their displeasure and it will mean nothing to Putin.

If I lived in Taiwan, I'd be looking for a way out.

China will see that the angry words from the west mean nothing and if they want to exert control, now is the time.

remember when he did the sam under Obama? Did Ukraine fight back much?