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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,980 Likes: 10
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,980 Likes: 10 |
As a FFL dealer (actually a manufacturer) I registered on gunbroker.com to ship and receive firearms. I don't ship many firearms because an unlicensed person may ship directly to a dealer. I accept firearms from unlicensed persons and appreciate a copy of their drivers license but don't require it. I do need their address for my log book. Copies of FFL goes into a file separate from the 4473.
In my area I have the best luck with USPS but we are a small town and the people at the PO know what I am shipping. Don't make any reference to firearms on the package or in the names of the shipper or receiver. The less information you reveal to the shipper the better
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2 |
I recently sold a handgun via Gunbroker, my first sale there. I shipped a handgun from Texas to California using the guys linked below, a division of Bud's. The buyers FFL was not in their database. I provided the name of the FFL's business, a day later they emailed advising the buyers FFL was confirmed. They sent a shipping label via email. I printed it, taped it on the box and dropped it off at a FEDEX office at a mall near me. The handgun arrived at the California FFL next day. Coast was $35 plus insurance, that Bud's covers when the insured value is above FEDEX's $1,000 limit as mine was. All went smoothly and quickly. https://www.shipmygun.com/go/Pretty hard to confirm the serial number and little details like that without laying eyes, let alone hands, on the gun... So who has to confirm the serial number when I, a non-FFL, am shipping FEDEX overnight? I just followed their procedure shipping from an individual overnight via FEDEX. They allowed use of their volume shipping discount. The FFL has to confirm the serial number if he enters it in his book. It sort of defeats the whole purpose of the FFL oversight if someone ships something supposedly entered on his books that he never saw. And please understand, I do not think that such laws make sense in the grand scheme of things, And no one has to confirm non-FFL to FFL except the receiving FFL.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2 |
No problem. Any FFL is ok. Have the send or email you a copy of the FFL. Check the expiration date. Got to FFL EZ Check, and type in the first three and last five digits. FFL EZ CheckConfirm the ship to address and name on the FFL matches. Only ship to the FFL. Not to the buyer. The FFL will transfer it to the buyer. BATFE, for the millionth time, tells FFLs in writing to NOT send an FFL copy to a non-FFL. There have been instances of fraud enabled by the physical copy. Most FFLs refuse to send hard copies to non-FFLs, as they are supposed to. Give me a link or STFU. In probably 300 sales transactions, I have NEVER had an FFL refuse to provide me with a copy, and I would NEVER ship a firearm to someone that I could not verify. Pretty hard to link to written letters, but it has been posted here a number of times as these threads devolve. Verification is supposed to be through the website for non-FFLs.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2 |
So it sounds like the bottom line is, ask the buyer what their preferred FFL is, contact the FFL and get their license #, look their license # up in the EZ Check web site, and only ship to the official address listed in the EZ Check web site. You're making it too difficult. You sell your gun and tell the buyer to have his FFL email you a copy of his FFL. For your part, send a copy of your driver's license with the firearm. You can ship long guns USPS, but only an FFL is legally allowed to ship handguns that way. In short, it's the buyer's responsibility to provide his FFL. You don't have to call them. You would be way ahead asking advice, not giving it. OK, calm down, Sport. You seem to be way to worked up over this. Not even a little bit worked up...
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,984
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,984 |
[OK, calm down, Sport. You seem to be way to worked up over this.
Not even a little bit worked up... For someone that's not even a little bit worked up, you sure seem to take issue with a good many people. All I can say is, "Thank GOD we have you here to enlighten us!" DAMN! What would we do without you?
Kelly
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,822 Likes: 15
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,822 Likes: 15 |
I recently sold a handgun via Gunbroker, my first sale there. I shipped a handgun from Texas to California using the guys linked below, a division of Bud's. The buyers FFL was not in their database. I provided the name of the FFL's business, a day later they emailed advising the buyers FFL was confirmed. They sent a shipping label via email. I printed it, taped it on the box and dropped it off at a FEDEX office at a mall near me. The handgun arrived at the California FFL next day. Coast was $35 plus insurance, that Bud's covers when the insured value is above FEDEX's $1,000 limit as mine was. All went smoothly and quickly. https://www.shipmygun.com/go/Pretty hard to confirm the serial number and little details like that without laying eyes, let alone hands, on the gun... So who has to confirm the serial number when I, a non-FFL, am shipping FEDEX overnight? I just followed their procedure shipping from an individual overnight via FEDEX. They allowed use of their volume shipping discount. The FFL has to confirm the serial number if he enters it in his book. It sort of defeats the whole purpose of the FFL oversight if someone ships something supposedly entered on his books that he never saw. And please understand, I do not think that such laws make sense in the grand scheme of things, And no one has to confirm non-FFL to FFL except the receiving FFL.Precisely my point.
Conduct is the best proof of character.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,625 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,625 Likes: 1 |
No problem. Any FFL is ok. Have the send or email you a copy of the FFL. Check the expiration date. Got to FFL EZ Check, and type in the first three and last five digits. FFL EZ CheckConfirm the ship to address and name on the FFL matches. Only ship to the FFL. Not to the buyer. The FFL will transfer it to the buyer. BATFE, for the millionth time, tells FFLs in writing to NOT send an FFL copy to a non-FFL. There have been instances of fraud enabled by the physical copy. Most FFLs refuse to send hard copies to non-FFLs, as they are supposed to. Not true! Sorry, disabusing you of your fantasies is not on my to-do list today.
FÜCK Jeff_O!
MAGA
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,625 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,625 Likes: 1 |
No problem. Any FFL is ok. Have the send or email you a copy of the FFL. Check the expiration date. Got to FFL EZ Check, and type in the first three and last five digits. FFL EZ CheckConfirm the ship to address and name on the FFL matches. Only ship to the FFL. Not to the buyer. The FFL will transfer it to the buyer. BATFE, for the millionth time, tells FFLs in writing to NOT send an FFL copy to a non-FFL. There have been instances of fraud enabled by the physical copy. Most FFLs refuse to send hard copies to non-FFLs, as they are supposed to. Not true! Sorry, disabusing you of your fantasies is not on my to-do list today. Blow me
FÜCK Jeff_O!
MAGA
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
No problem. Any FFL is ok. Have the send or email you a copy of the FFL. Check the expiration date. Got to FFL EZ Check, and type in the first three and last five digits. FFL EZ CheckConfirm the ship to address and name on the FFL matches. Only ship to the FFL. Not to the buyer. The FFL will transfer it to the buyer. BATFE, for the millionth time, tells FFLs in writing to NOT send an FFL copy to a non-FFL. There have been instances of fraud enabled by the physical copy. Most FFLs refuse to send hard copies to non-FFLs, as they are supposed to. Give me a link or STFU. In probably 300 sales transactions, I have NEVER had an FFL refuse to provide me with a copy, and I would NEVER ship a firearm to someone that I could not verify. Give me a link that shows an FFL should send a copy of the license to a non-licensed person. Double dog dare ya. Again, you can verify WITHOUT the FFL.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
There is ZERO requirement for a non-licensed person to have a copy of the FFL license. The only requirement is that a firearm is mailed to an FFL. An individual can verify that via Ez-check. PERIOD.
Also, there is ZERO reason to send a copy of your driver's license.
This may be technically true, but in the real world shipping clerks often like to see an FFL when shipping a firearm and I'd rather just show them a copy than get into an argument over Federal law with them. By the same token, receiving dealers often require a copy of ID from the seller because it gives them something to fill out the FROM part of the log book. Sure it's not foolproof, but again I'd rather just provide it than argue with them. As far as how to ship goes, UPS has changed how it measures packages and now charges by dimensional weight. This means that a long package like a long gun is very expensive. I found this out when I tried to ship a 5 lb 22 rifle and they wanted $50 to ship it. Off it went via USPS. Not sure what 'technically true' means. Something is either true or it ain't. I've NEVER been asked and have never shown a copy of the FFL when shipping.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,425 Likes: 2
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,425 Likes: 2 |
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~ As Bob Hagel would say"You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong."Good words of wisdom...............
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,625 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,625 Likes: 1 |
No problem. Any FFL is ok. Have the send or email you a copy of the FFL. Check the expiration date. Got to FFL EZ Check, and type in the first three and last five digits. FFL EZ CheckConfirm the ship to address and name on the FFL matches. Only ship to the FFL. Not to the buyer. The FFL will transfer it to the buyer. BATFE, for the millionth time, tells FFLs in writing to NOT send an FFL copy to a non-FFL. There have been instances of fraud enabled by the physical copy. Most FFLs refuse to send hard copies to non-FFLs, as they are supposed to. Give me a link or STFU. In probably 300 sales transactions, I have NEVER had an FFL refuse to provide me with a copy, and I would NEVER ship a firearm to someone that I could not verify. Give me a link that shows an FFL should send a copy of the license to a non-licensed person. Double dog dare ya. Again, you can verify WITHOUT the FFL. I don't need the copy per se, but you you cannot verify without the numbers (first 3, last 5). Rather than ask the FFL for that info, I have always just asked for a copy or scan, and have never had an FFL refuse to supply it. Either way, the copy alone is worthless, unless you verify it on FFL EZ Check.
FÜCK Jeff_O!
MAGA
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
Section 27 CFR 478.94 requires licensees to verify the identity and licensed status prior to transferring a firearm to a person who states they are licensed to receive it. “Verification shall be established by the transferee furnishing to the transferor a certified copy of the transferee’s license and by such other means as the transferor deems necessary...” This section does not apply to transfers between a licensee and an unlicensed person.
NONLICENSEE STATE-TO-STATE TRANSFER ATF has received questions regarding how a nonlicensee may handle the transfer of a firearm to another nonlicensee residing in a different State. Regulation 27 CFR 478.30 does not allow a nonlicensee to transfer, sell, or deliver a firearm to another nonlicensee who does not reside in the same State. However, per 27 CFR 478.147, a nonlicensee may directly ship a firearm to a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer for any lawful purpose. As such, the nonlicensee may arrange to ship the firearm directly to a licensed dealer in the State where the other nonlicensee lives. The receiving licensee is required to enter the name and address of the nonlicensee from whom the firearm was received. A copy of the nonlicensee’s driver’s license may be used to verify this information, but there is no regulatory requirement that it be provided by the nonlicensee. Afterwards, the nonlicensee who is to receive the firearm would be required to complete ATF Form 4473 and be subject to a background check. Also, any corresponding State requirements would apply, such as a waiting period.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2 |
Sorry, disabusing you of your fantasies is not on my to-do list today. Blow me [/quote] Welcome to my ignore list... damn few get there with JeffO, but you should fit right in. No need to prove you are inbred schit in a simple civil discussion.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
[quote]
Blow me [quote] Welcome to my ignore list... damn few get there with JeffO, but you should fit right in. No need to prove you are inbred schit in a simple civil discussion.
Blow me.........
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,669 Likes: 2 |
[quote=Sitka deer]
Blow me [quote] Welcome to my ignore list... damn few get there with JeffO, but you should fit right in. No need to prove you are inbred schit in a simple civil discussion.
Blow me......... And miss out on a quarter of the Campfire?
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
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