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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,147
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,147 |
Well, of course there is the practical aspect that is more important to the great majority of rifle buyers than the issues of "cool" and nostalgic. Practical in 2019 calls for the purchase of a rifle chambered in either 243 or 6.5 CM, while nostalgia seduces a buyer to take the road less traveled and find a rifles chambered in either 250-3000 or 257 Roberts.
I find practical to be a good thing, it make life easier, but owning something that may not be practical, but which prompts nostalgic memories is nice, even if it requires a little extra effort to operate. Every time I pick up a Savage 1920, I think about Larry Koller and wonder if he might have hunted with it and if it might be a rifle that he alluded to in "Shots At Whitetails. I wonder if a Savage Axis found under a Christmas tree two days hence will prompt similar memories for a young teen in 2069?
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Joined: May 2005
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2005
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My 99 takedown .250, circa 1919, does very well with the load from Hornady #3, 37gr IMR4320. It gets 3071 fps and 1.5-1,75" three shot groups. My 700 Classic with 24" barrel, 100gr NBTs, and the same powder charge, clocks 3003fps and 1/2" groups. The big (26" barrel) .257 with 85gr NBTs and 47gr W760 clocks 3347 and sub 1/2", while the 23" barreled 95 Mauser shoots sub 1" with several loads. Velocity of the 100gr Hornadys is about 3100. I love them all. Shootinurse, some questions. 1) What barrel length of the M 99 takedown? 2) Hornady #3 manual load, are you using the 100 grain Hornady bullet and what case and primer? 3) How many firings can you get from a case with that Hornady load? Barrel is 23 3/4 inches. Had to be cut back a bit to clean up the crown. 87 gr Speer Hot Core, Remington brass, and Remington 9 1/2 primer. Worked up the load. Velocity is just under the 3100 fps Hornady had with their 87gr bullet. Have not had much luck with 100gr bullets in that rifle. Three-four inch groups are about average. That 87gr Hot Core drops deer nicely, even close range through the shoulder. Don't shoot the rifle much, but I've had five or six loadings without case loss. I'm doing partial resizing rather than squeezing things all the way back.
"Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing." Robert E. Howard
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Joined: Feb 2013
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 1,722 |
“Alive in JESUS!” NRA LIFE MEMBER
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,147
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,147 |
Your picture reminds me of the 700 Classics in 250-3000 that I bought in the 1990's and early 2000's for the sole purpose of rechambering to 25-284.
Too bad that Remington never chose to make the 700 MR in 250-3000.
My favorite newer 250-3000 is the Winchester 70 Lightweight Carbine made in 1987. A nice little rifle that is forever handicapped by its 1-14" ROT barrel. Aesthetically even nicer if the barreled action is put into a 70 FWT stock, giving us an idea about what the Savage 1920 might have grown into.
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Joined: Feb 2013
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,722 |
Your picture reminds me of the 700 Classics in 250-3000 that I bought in the 1990's and early 2000's for the sole purpose of rechambering to 25-284.
Too bad that Remington never chose to make the 700 MR in 250-3000.
My favorite newer 250-3000 is the Winchester 70 Lightweight Carbine made in 1987. A nice little rifle that is forever handicapped by its 1-14" ROT barrel. Aesthetically even nicer if the barreled action is put into a 70 FWT stock, giving us an idea about what the Savage 1920 might have grown into. Put a 1-10 ROT barrel on the Win 70 and have some fun! Save the 1-14 ROT barrel just in case.
“Alive in JESUS!” NRA LIFE MEMBER
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,445
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,445 |
Well, of course there is the practical aspect that is more important to the great majority of rifle buyers than the issues of "cool" and nostalgic. Practical in 2019 calls for the purchase of a rifle chambered in either 243 or 6.5 CM, while nostalgia seduces a buyer to take the road less traveled and find a rifles chambered in either 250-3000 or 257 Roberts.
I find practical to be a good thing, it make life easier, but owning something that may not be practical, but which prompts nostalgic memories is nice, even if it requires a little extra effort to operate. Every time I pick up a Savage 1920, I think about Larry Koller and wonder if he might have hunted with it and if it might be a rifle that he alluded to in "Shots At Whitetails. I wonder if a Savage Axis found under a Christmas tree two days hence will prompt similar memories for a young teen in 2069? Practical is what most people want, but loonies need to be loonies. Feel free to quote me if you like.
"Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing." Robert E. Howard
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,653
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,653 |
My 99 takedown .250, circa 1919, does very well with the load from Hornady #3, 37gr IMR4320. It gets 3071 fps and 1.5-1,75" three shot groups. My 700 Classic with 24" barrel, 100gr NBTs, and the same powder charge, clocks 3003fps and 1/2" groups. The big (26" barrel) .257 with 85gr NBTs and 47gr W760 clocks 3347 and sub 1/2", while the 23" barreled 95 Mauser shoots sub 1" with several loads. Velocity of the 100gr Hornadys is about 3100. I love them all. Shootinurse, some questions. 1) What barrel length of the M 99 takedown? 2) Hornady #3 manual load, are you using the 100 grain Hornady bullet and what case and primer? 3) How many firings can you get from a case with that Hornady load? Barrel is 23 3/4 inches. Had to be cut back a bit to clean up the crown. 87 gr Speer Hot Core, Remington brass, and Remington 9 1/2 primer. Worked up the load. Velocity is just under the 3100 fps Hornady had with their 87gr bullet. Have not had much luck with 100gr bullets in that rifle. Three-four inch groups are about average. That 87gr Hot Core drops deer nicely, even close range through the shoulder. Don't shoot the rifle much, but I've had five or six loadings without case loss. I'm doing partial resizing rather than squeezing things all the way back. I read your original post as too hot of a load for the 99 if the bullet was a 100 grain bullet. Thanks for clearing that up. Yes sir, that 87 grain Speer Hot-Cor is the ticket for the ROT 1-14" 99s, I even use it exclusively in my 99-A with a ROT 1-10" and not afraid to put it into shoulders.
You're Welcome At My Fire Anytime
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Joined: Dec 2019
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Dec 2019
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All 25s are cool IMO, older is better it shows it's been around the block a few times. Some may be harder to get but are still available if you look and can be given a boost with the newer powders and projectiles. How many of these new whiz bang cartridges will be around in 90 years or more like the 25/35, 250 savage and 257 Roberts. Time will tell if newer is better or the old just plod along in the background quietly getting the job done. To all a merry Christmas and a happy New year. No matter what floats your boat be safe, be happy and keep shooting no matter what caliber you used.
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,204 |
Maybe an action issue too. If I was itching all over for a .25, I'd pick the cartridge that best fit my action of choice. In a single shot, some thought would be given to barrel life and availability of good brass and/or ammo too.
All things considered, my 6mms make the most sense for me right now. I can shoot 115s out of my Creedmoor if I feel a need. Well, some [bleep] had to bring up the creemoooore in this thread. Heaven forbid its not mentioned for a couple hours.
Quit giving in inch by inch then looking back to lament the mile behind ya and wonder how to preserve those few feet left in front of ya. They'll never stop until they're stopped. That's a fact.
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Joined: Nov 2013
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 28,753 |
Maybe an action issue too. If I was itching all over for a .25, I'd pick the cartridge that best fit my action of choice. In a single shot, some thought would be given to barrel life and availability of good brass and/or ammo too.
All things considered, my 6mms make the most sense for me right now. I can shoot 115s out of my Creedmoor if I feel a need. Well, some [bleep] had to bring up the creemoooore in this thread. Heaven forbid its not mentioned for a couple hours. To be fair, azzhole, the Creedmoor reference was made because that particular 6mm has a twist that allows the use of bullets tending towards the heavier end of the commonly available .25 caliber spectrum. The same applies to any .24 with the same twist and a magazine that lets you use them. Hardly a reason to call someone a f*g. Perhaps you should just avert thine eyes if you're so sensitive. CREEDMOOR CREEDMOOR CREEDMOOR, bitch!
What fresh Hell is this?
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Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 665
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2017
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Mule Deer Thanks for clarification on the 250 savage improved I knew there was two different angles just thought they were both AI as my reloading stuff just mentions a 28 degree, 40 degree and standard My own personal 25/303 Epps Newton improved has a 35 degree shoulder So in short, you were wrong. How so? The Ackley is 40°, but there is a 250 Improved 28° cartridge. A reloading die set from Huntingtons' is # 56162 another reloading set: die set or another die setReamer: reamerDid you read the whole thread? Do you need Cliff notes?
'If you say the parent you were most afraid when you were a kid was your dad, you grew up in the city.'
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Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 665
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 665 |
All 25s are cool IMO, older is better it shows it's been around the block a few times. Some may be harder to get but are still available if you look and can be given a boost with the newer powders and projectiles. How many of these new whiz bang cartridges will be around in 90 years or more like the 25/35, 250 savage and 257 Roberts. Time will tell if newer is better or the old just plod along in the background quietly getting the job done. To all a merry Christmas and a happy New year. No matter what floats your boat be safe, be happy and keep shooting no matter what caliber you used. I'd but a box of doughnuts, that you'll be able to find a Creedmoor in 90 years. To find a 250 Savage, someone will need to know your full name and have a shovel.
'If you say the parent you were most afraid when you were a kid was your dad, you grew up in the city.'
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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That one was SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO tempting. Near about a perfect little 250 Savage.
'If you say the parent you were most afraid when you were a kid was your dad, you grew up in the city.'
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,147
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,147 |
Well, of course there is the practical aspect that is more important to the great majority of rifle buyers than the issues of "cool" and nostalgic. Practical in 2019 calls for the purchase of a rifle chambered in either 243 or 6.5 CM, while nostalgia seduces a buyer to take the road less traveled and find a rifles chambered in either 250-3000 or 257 Roberts.
I find practical to be a good thing, it make life easier, but owning something that may not be practical, but which prompts nostalgic memories is nice, even if it requires a little extra effort to operate. Every time I pick up a Savage 1920, I think about Larry Koller and wonder if he might have hunted with it and if it might be a rifle that he alluded to in "Shots At Whitetails. I wonder if a Savage Axis found under a Christmas tree two days hence will prompt similar memories for a young teen in 2069? Practical is what most people want, but loonies need to be loonies. Feel free to quote me if you like. That explains my rifles chambered in 218 Bee, 219 Zipper, 22HP, 25-20, 25-35, 256 WIN MAG, 256 Newton, 276 Pedersen, etc.
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,266
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,266 |
To me the 250 Savage and 257 Rbt's are at their best in a nicely stocked wood/blue rifle like Sakohunter264's above. In a plastic-fantastic, I'll take the Creedmoor.
I've got a Kimber Classic Select in 257 Rob showing Friday... fingers crossed the wood is as good as it appears in the photos... it's a 2012 mfg, not one of the blonde 2x6's found on the current crop of Kimbers (insert gag-reflex here).
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 4,046 |
AAA French Roberts in the middle
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,512
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,512 |
The 250 AI is the one I'd really like......but then you are just .007 away from a yes, the dreaded 6.5 Creedmoor! Never was a Roberts fan, good round, but then you are almost a twin of the 6.5x55........they all get the job done no doubt. I do like the vanilla 25-06........it needs a big brother....commercialized..........
The Wins and Kimbers with blue/wood are nice.
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,266
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,266 |
sqweeler, I've seen that photo before... you absolutely got one of the better sticks of wood on a Kimber 257 out there!
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,266
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,266 |
A pic from the auction I bought...
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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