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Etoh might be right? #14715611 03/28/20
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MM879 Online Content OP
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Etoh might have stumbled on some very interesting information on CV-19 research.
http://www.nephjc.com/news/covidace2

I know that the local Doc's are prescribing Lisnopril for off label conditions.

BP-B2

Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715636 03/28/20
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When Etoh talks, I listen. End o story.

Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715664 03/28/20
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Rock Chuck Online Content
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Originally Posted by MM879
Etoh might have stumbled on some very interesting information on CV-19 research.
http://www.nephjc.com/news/covidace2

I know that the local Doc's are prescribing Lisnopril for off label conditions.
I can't possibly read all of that. Are they saying that Lisinopril specifically or any HT drugs might be useful? Lisinopril has a side affect in that it often causes dry coughing, sometimes severe. I had to get off it and I'm using Losartan. It's not as good but there are no side affects.


A good sermon doesn't tell the difference between right and wrong. It tells the difference between right and almost right.
Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715692 03/28/20
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Yup, Lisinopril gave me the dry cough. I hear about 1 in 10 get it. I also went on Losartin for a while too but am on Amlodipine now, a calcium channel blocker. Interesting video here talks about this very subject.

ACE2 and ARB BP meds



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εγώ δεν θα συμμορφωθεί
Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: Rock Chuck] #14715718 03/28/20
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Originally Posted by Rock Chuck
Originally Posted by MM879
Etoh might have stumbled on some very interesting information on CV-19 research.
http://www.nephjc.com/news/covidace2

I know that the local Doc's are prescribing Lisnopril for off label conditions.
I can't possibly read all of that. Are they saying that Lisinopril specifically or any HT drugs might be useful? Lisinopril has a side affect in that it often causes dry coughing, sometimes severe. I had to get off it and I'm using Losartan. It's not as good but there are no side affects.

The study indicates the association of the ACE inhibitor and the development of COVID-19. Cliff note version; older people don't have as much AEC2. The patients on a AEC2 drug did better than others. Like all medical studies they look at all the things that isn't first and if the `is' stands it is truthful.

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Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715834 03/28/20
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I was recently prescribed lisinopril for high blood pressure. I notice the dry cough later in the day but it is mild and tolerable.

Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: coat4gun] #14715840 03/28/20
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Originally Posted by coat4gun
Yup, Lisinopril gave me the dry cough. I hear about 1 in 10 get it. I also went on Losartin for a while too but am on Amlodipine now, a calcium channel blocker. Interesting video here talks about this very subject.

ACE2 and ARB BP meds



At first Lisinopril gave me such a bad cough I thought a blood vessel would pop in my head. Not so much anymore.

Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715879 03/28/20
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Hmmm. Wifey and I both on Amlodipine. She is also on Losartan.


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Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: Ghostinthemachine] #14715903 03/28/20
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Originally Posted by Ghostinthemachine
When Etoh talks, I listen. End o story.


This^^^^


Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.

DONT BE GETTING ANY CORONA ON YA

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Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715932 03/28/20
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Three weeks ago I was scheduled for dental surgery to install a new Ti tooth post. During the prep I suffered a BP attack. Later that week I went to the Doctors for the BP issue. The Doc put me on Lisinopril in a second. I get the feeling the Doc knew something that he wasn't willing to discuss. My BS meter was pegged. The Lisnopril is an off label prescription for me.

IC-B

Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: jaguartx] #14715934 03/28/20
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Originally Posted by jaguartx
Originally Posted by Ghostinthemachine
When Etoh talks, I listen. End o story.


This^^^^


Absolument!!!!!


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Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715940 03/28/20
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Originally Posted by MM879
Etoh might have stumbled on some very interesting information on CV-19 research.
http://www.nephjc.com/news/covidace2

I know that the local Doc's are prescribing Lisinopril for off label conditions.


I've been taking low dosage Lisinopril since late last summer. It was prescribed not for high blood pressure though but because it's suppose to prevent kidney damage other medications I'm taking are known to cause. Not had much of a problem with a dry cough so far other than sometimes in the late evening.







Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14715994 03/28/20
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Etoh can tell you stuff that will blow your mind. If he thinks the article is valid, I'd take it to the bank.


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Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14716244 03/28/20
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Goodness. Slow down.

It appears this corona virus attaches and accesses the host cell’s via a surface protein called ace2. That is a random unimportant detail, BUT that ace2 expression (the number of receptors the cell places in the surface) increases when one takes an ace inhibitor.

Ace2 receptors are mostly in lung and heart tissues.

There is investigational SPECULATION that per chance, MAYBE this plays a role in who gets sick, how severely they become ill, etc. It is not proven, but just early conjecture. As with A LOT of things in medicine, what appears an obvious discovery, proves later to not be what it seems.

The paper cited above contains an entire chart citing organizations worldwide saying, essentially, “this is interesting, but for lack of durable evidence yet, we recommend no changes to taking ace inhibitors.”

In other words, ace inhibitor use as a RISK (not a preventive) is a theory that is consistent with why those with sundry health issues may be more vulnerable - because ace is widely used (and well proven) in a number of settings. Older you are, the more likely one is on an ace inhibitor. But it is just one theory among many needed to be worked through.

I really did not want to type this out, because now there will be a flood of persons demanding their doctor change their ace to something else. Or persons stop taking their ace to their own detriment. But, the alternative is i let ya’ll go on 180deg from what this article says, so there you go.


Seen a few things, but it’s the 24hour campfire classifieds that’ll make me break out in a cold damned sweat.

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Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: sandcritter] #14716283 03/28/20
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I don’t take the Avapro anymore, it’s an angio retention blocker, my understanding was that people on ARB have MORE plug-in receptors for those little bastards to plug their peckers into.

I’m on nifedipine which is a CCA



Used to be on the avapro, which btw is a losartan potassium compound (ARB)

Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14716377 03/28/20
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Couple years from now, slumlord finds himself the leader of great swaths of the inner cities, the last survivors. The rest of us, especially health nuts early on, all perished. Turned out, purple-drank was protective.


Seen a few things, but it’s the 24hour campfire classifieds that’ll make me break out in a cold damned sweat.

"Look, I want to help the helpless. It's the clueless I don't give a [bleep] about." - Dennis Miller on obamacare.


Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: sandcritter] #14716388 03/28/20
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Originally Posted by sandcritter
Goodness. Slow down.

It appears this corona virus attaches and accesses the host cell’s via a surface protein called ace2. That is a random unimportant detail, BUT that ace2 expression (the number of receptors the cell places in the surface) increases when one takes an ace inhibitor.

Ace2 receptors are mostly in lung and heart tissues.

There is investigational SPECULATION that per chance, MAYBE this plays a role in who gets sick, how severely they become ill, etc. It is not proven, but just early conjecture. As with A LOT of things in medicine, what appears an obvious discovery, proves later to not be what it seems.

The paper cited above contains an entire chart citing organizations worldwide saying, essentially, “this is interesting, but for lack of durable evidence yet, we recommend no changes to taking ace inhibitors.”

In other words, ace inhibitor use as a RISK (not a preventive) is a theory that is consistent with why those with sundry health issues may be more vulnerable - because ace is widely used (and well proven) in a number of settings. Older you are, the more likely one is on an ace inhibitor. But it is just one theory among many needed to be worked through.

I really did not want to type this out, because now there will be a flood of persons demanding their doctor change their ace to something else. Or persons stop taking their ace to their own detriment. But, the alternative is i let ya’ll go on 180deg from what this article says, so there you go.



This is the conclusion I thought they had reached but the first part of the article seemed to suggest lisinopril would prevent the infection. Very confusing.

Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: sandcritter] #14716454 03/28/20
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Etoh Offline
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Originally Posted by sandcritter
Goodness. Slow down.

It appears this corona virus attaches and accesses the host cell’s via a surface protein called ace2. That is a random unimportant detail, BUT that ace2 expression (the number of receptors the cell places in the surface) increases when one takes an ace inhibitor.

Ace2 receptors are mostly in lung and heart tissues.

There is investigational SPECULATION that per chance, MAYBE this plays a role in who gets sick, how severely they become ill, etc. It is not proven, but just early conjecture. As with A LOT of things in medicine, what appears an obvious discovery, proves later to not be what it seems.

The paper cited above contains an entire chart citing organizations worldwide saying, essentially, “this is interesting, but for lack of durable evidence yet, we recommend no changes to taking ace inhibitors.”

In other words, ace inhibitor use as a RISK (not a preventive) is a theory that is consistent with why those with sundry health issues may be more vulnerable - because ace is widely used (and well proven) in a number of settings. Older you are, the more likely one is on an ace inhibitor. But it is just one theory among many needed to be worked through.

I really did not want to type this out, because now there will be a flood of persons demanding their doctor change their ace to something else. Or persons stop taking their ace to their own detriment. But, the alternative is i let ya’ll go on 180deg from what this article says, so there you go.



Glad you posted this.

the American Heart Association is recommending that folks on ACE inhibitors continue unless confirmed with Crono then discontinue immediately

The reasoning being that the ACE2 group attach to the receptor, (the surface protein) causing vasodilation, (reason why they lower blood pressure) which would cause higher transport rates of virus accross the membrane into the body.


as Plaqinil's mode of action in regards to the virus is its ACE2 pharmacology, why use it when an ACE2 is 1000 less toxic and 100 time "stronger"


This is not talking about using the either drugs in prophylactic


If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: sandcritter] #14716462 03/28/20
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Originally Posted by sandcritter
Couple years from now, slumlord finds himself the leader of great swaths of the inner cities, the last survivors. The rest of us, especially health nuts early on, all perished. Turned out, purple-drank was protective.



you saw that movie too,,, great movie---- But I think it was Mountain Dew.


No wait I think it was Gatorade. ,, they also used to water the crops, but they wondered why the crops didn't grow.

Last edited by Etoh; 03/28/20.

If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
Re: Etoh might be right? [Re: MM879] #14716507 03/28/20
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Etoh Offline
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The blood pressure regulation system in the body is call the Renin Angiotensin mechanisms, and is located in the kidneys.

It releases an enzyme called ACE (angio converting enzyme) which acts as a vasoconstrictor to increase blood pressure , and conversely blocking this enzyme will lower blood pressure.

First generation ACE inhibitors ex. linisopril, and most of all the drugs ending in the last with ---pril. Lots of side effects.

second generation (ARB angio receptor blocking also called ACE2) less side effects and the particular class of drug under discussion because of specific target site.


If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
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