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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1 |
If Leupold’s listening, I’d take it as a gesture of good will, if you’d fire whoever’s responsible for designing your website. And their erector system for ALL scopes 😎 Fixed. 
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1 |
Jordan, you obviously never tried an advanced shooter SFP Leupold, as your skill level is pretty basic. You need to emulate the shooter in the below pic; don't forget to attach a GreyBS pic rail decal mount on that unused RH fore-end advertising rail space. ![[Linked Image from photos.smugmug.com]](https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-fg3CrSv/0/39ca2ab5/M/i-fg3CrSv-M.jpg) Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative:
Why, is that Burns in the pic? NM, the skin tone is all wrong.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3 |
Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative: Leup: ![[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49909783532_4a41e29c50_c.jpg) Hensoldt: ![[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49909783767_c59c321845_c.jpg) The Leupold group would be plenty good enough to fill every deer tag I'm ever going to get. Don't even need that good really. I have no interest in shooting "steel" or any other target from a distance at which I'll never shoot game. It serves no purpose for me and targets, steel or otherwise, don't make good stew.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,106 Likes: 10
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,106 Likes: 10 |
Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative: Leup: Hensoldt: The Leupold group would be plenty good enough to fill every deer tag I'm ever going to get. Don't even need that good really. I have no interest in shooting "steel" or any other target from a distance at which I'll never shoot game. It serves no purpose for me and targets, steel or otherwise, don't make good stew. Both of those 3 shot groups look like chidt and are they supposed to not be centered/zeroed on the x?? If you are shooting any kind of longrange (even 400+ yards), you would be off far enough to be out of the vitals.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3 |
Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative: Leup: Hensoldt: The Leupold group would be plenty good enough to fill every deer tag I'm ever going to get. Don't even need that good really. I have no interest in shooting "steel" or any other target from a distance at which I'll never shoot game. It serves no purpose for me and targets, steel or otherwise, don't make good stew. Both of those 3 shot groups look like chidt and are they supposed to not be centered/zeroed on the x?? If you are shooting any kind of longrange (even 400+ yards), you would be off far enough to be out of the vitals. I wasn't commenting on the zero. Just group size.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1 |
Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative: Leup: Hensoldt: The Leupold group would be plenty good enough to fill every deer tag I'm ever going to get. Don't even need that good really. I have no interest in shooting "steel" or any other target from a distance at which I'll never shoot game. It serves no purpose for me and targets, steel or otherwise, don't make good stew. Either is probably good enough for most hunters, which is kind of my point. Leupold can get away with building their erector mechanisms such that they have a 0.5 MOA tolerance in zero shift, and most guys won't notice or complain. But a very accurate rifle can bring such things to light. Just because the zero shift doesn't pose a problem for a particular hunting style, doesn't mean that the shift isn't there.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,518 Likes: 1 |
Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative: Leup: Hensoldt: The Leupold group would be plenty good enough to fill every deer tag I'm ever going to get. Don't even need that good really. I have no interest in shooting "steel" or any other target from a distance at which I'll never shoot game. It serves no purpose for me and targets, steel or otherwise, don't make good stew. Both of those 3 shot groups look like chidt and are they supposed to not be centered/zeroed on the x?? If you are shooting any kind of longrange (even 400+ yards), you would be off far enough to be out of the vitals. If you had bothered to read the post you would know that they are both 5-shot groups. And no, zeroing the scopes was not of any concern for this comparison; I was strictly looking at group size and shifting POI.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3 |
Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative: Leup: Hensoldt: The Leupold group would be plenty good enough to fill every deer tag I'm ever going to get. Don't even need that good really. I have no interest in shooting "steel" or any other target from a distance at which I'll never shoot game. It serves no purpose for me and targets, steel or otherwise, don't make good stew. Either is probably good enough for most hunters, which is kind of my point. Leupold can get away with building their erector mechanisms such that they have a 0.5 MOA tolerance in zero shift, and most guys won't notice or complain. But a very accurate rifle can bring such things to light. Just because the zero shift doesn't pose a problem for a particular hunting style, doesn't mean that the shift isn't there. One might suggest that if one "needs" better than MOA accuracy for deer/big game they're more interested in killing than hunting. For long range targets and competitive shooters no doubt they'd need all they can get.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
Build accurate rifles in case your scope sucks, said nobody ever.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3 |
Build accurate rifles in case your scope sucks, said nobody ever. I'd put a lot more thought into that if I didn't regularly shoot .5 moa groups with the rifles/scopes I have. Some of them are even scoped with Leupolds. I have 14k in my checking account right now. My home and car are paid for and I don't use credit cards ever. If I thought I needed a better scope for anything I do, I'd buy one. If it ain't broke, I'm not fixing it.
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 162
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 162 |
[/quote] One might suggest that if one "needs" better than MOA accuracy for deer/big game they're more interested in killing than hunting. For long range targets and competitive shooters no doubt they'd need all they can get.
One could very easily argue the very opposite. What deserves a more accurate setup? An animal or a piece of steel or paper? If a rifle struggles to do MOA it shouldn't be carried to the woods imho. Myself I feel I owe it to the animals to carry as accurate of a setup as possible. So that when the time comes for the shot I don't have to hope that my gear is up to the task. Leupold won't be found on any of my rifles for that very reason
Last edited by Luvbowhuntn; 05/20/20.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6 |
Jordan, you obviously never tried an advanced shooter SFP Leupold, as your skill level is pretty basic. You need to emulate the shooter in the below pic; don't forget to attach a GreyBS pic rail decal mount on that unused RH fore-end advertising rail space. Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative:
Why, is that Burns in the pic? NM, the skin tone is all wrong. Ha! That, and the fact his mouth isn't running 190mph.
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,247 Likes: 3 |
One could very easily argue the very opposite. What deserves a more accurate setup? An animal or a piece of steel or paper? If a rifle struggles to do MOA it shouldn't be carried to the woods imho. Myself I feel I owe it to the animals to carry as accurate of a setup as possible. So that when the time comes for the shot I don't have to hope that my gear is up to the task. Leupold won't be found on any of my rifles for that very reason
If MOA isn't completely adequate, get closer. That's why it's called hunting.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,939 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,939 Likes: 1 |
One could very easily argue the very opposite. What deserves a more accurate setup? An animal or a piece of steel or paper? If a rifle struggles to do MOA it shouldn't be carried to the woods imho. Myself I feel I owe it to the animals to carry as accurate of a setup as possible. So that when the time comes for the shot I don't have to hope that my gear is up to the task. Leupold won't be found on any of my rifles for that very reason
If MOA isn't completely adequate, get closer. That's why it's called hunting. MOA is good enough for any hunting distance
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,927
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,927 |
Pics like this aren’t hard to find. Are they supposed to be on the orange dot? You’re stil an idiot. Both of those 3 shot groups look like chidt and are they supposed to not be centered/zeroed on the x?? If you are shooting any kind of longrange (even 400+ yards), you would be off far enough to be out of the vitals. ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/657YKIs.jpg)
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,138 Likes: 13
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,138 Likes: 13 |
Why, is that Burns in the pic?
NM, the skin tone is all wrong.
Living rent free. Makes me smile. Build accurate rifles in case your scope sucks, said nobody ever. There is a Scientifically proven correlation between those who have accurate rifles and those who don't have Leupold Derangement Syndrome. Just Sayin, Science.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
There is a Scientifically proven correlation between those who have accurate rifles and those who don't have Leupold Derangement Syndrome.
Just Sayin, Science. Clearly, as was previously illustrated by Blackheart.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,259 Likes: 6 |
Look who's back.....must have gotten fired again for the 3rd time.
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,939 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,939 Likes: 1 |
Came across another Leup that has some internal zero shift induced by recoil. Fired several 5-shot groups at 100 meters from a very accurate .308 with a Mk4 8.5-25x50 on top, followed by a Hensoldt 3-12x. Most guys would never know the Leup has an issue and would think that the rifle/ammo is simply capable of ~1 MOA precision. The fired groups were revealing. Here are a couple of sample groups that are representative: Leup: Hensoldt: The Leupold group would be plenty good enough to fill every deer tag I'm ever going to get. Don't even need that good really. I have no interest in shooting "steel" or any other target from a distance at which I'll never shoot game. It serves no purpose for me and targets, steel or otherwise, don't make good stew. Both of those 3 shot groups look like chidt and are they supposed to not be centered/zeroed on the x?? If you are shooting any kind of longrange (even 400+ yards), you would be off far enough to be out of the vitals. BS
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,531
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,531 |
Build accurate rifles in case your scope sucks, said nobody ever. I'd put a lot more thought into that if I didn't regularly shoot .5 moa groups with the rifles/scopes I have. Some of them are even scoped with Leupolds. I have 14k in my checking account right now. My home and car are paid for and I don't use credit cards ever. If I thought I needed a better scope for anything I do, I'd buy one. If it ain't broke, I'm not fixing it. That right there makes more sense than anything I've read on this thread yet.
What goes up must come down, what goes around comes around, there's no free lunch. Trump's comin' back, get over it!
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