Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire So, which of the 6 theories of Evolution do you unbelievers believe in?

Scripture says both heaven and hell are eternal/everlasting. Rejecting Jesus results in permanent eternal punishment for conscious souls, and the fire will never be quenched.

“And these shall go away into everlasting punishment; but the righteous into life eternal.” Matthew 25:46

If hell is not eternal, then neither is heaven.

“Hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched.” Mark 9:43

“Where the worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched.” Mark 9:44

Hellfire is mentioned in Mark 9:47

The 3rd angel’s message in Revelation 14:10-11 is all about eternal hellfire.

He will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.
Revelation 14:10

And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night.
Revelation 14:11

If believers reign in heaven forever and ever, those who reject Jesus will be tormented forever and ever. There are only two choices, eternal life or eternal death. If there were not an eternal consequence for rejecting Jesus, God’s justice would be less absolute than His amazing grace and mercy.

God destroys the wicked with Death as final punishment.. [ as in dead for eternity]...OK,
so where does eternal torment in flames fit in..?

You kill someone then torture /torment them
forever after that.. 🤔





The O.T. does not describe hell/hades as being
flame filled eternal torment, so I take it to
be a N.T. christian cult ploy /construct to
frighten people into believing.

or did God give hell a total make over?

So would god be graceful and show mercy if a non-believer accepted Jesus while in hell, or is there a "best before" date on the mercy?

My testimony as a convert from one faith to another.

I'm now a believer in The One Who Created this universe.

For anyone who cared to watch the Hovind lecture, believers in God believe in something called
Micro evolution. Those are small changes due to genetic variabilities. Some dogs have long hair, some have curly hair and so forth. This can be observed, repeated, measured, and fulfill the scientific method.

I am not trying to be unkind, so please don't feel that way. I am trying to be as concise as I know how, to save you, the readers time. Just stating what I was taught, not necessarily what all evolutionist believe.

What my faith in Evolutionism fell under that which cannot be measured, observed, nor repeated. It was taught by devotees/teachers/professors as following scientific methodology. However, it belonged in the liberal arts department of philosophy and comparative religions IMHO. Most in college was in evolutionary biology. ......First semester of bio... earthworm to professor. That professor died this year. I hope that he came to understand that which was to come upon him before it was too late. I liked Dr. Blades and hoped the best for him. But I digress.
This comes under the belief in MACRO Evolutionism. If classified as a "physical science", then the term Should be the HYPOTHESIS of Macro Evolution. There are many variations on this theme. This has many hypotheses, the two prominent ones being Darwinism, named after their prophet Charles Darwin. The origin of this predated Darwin as far back as Hinduism. It is a doctrine of multiple polytheistic religions, including all of the occultic mystery religions, satanism included.

The other major category of faith, last I checked, was Punctuated Equalibrium(a) or "The Hopeful Monster Theory", if my memory is correct.
This tries to come up with an explanation of why there are major gaps in the Fossil impressions. It gives another's opinion for the vast majority of Evolutionary prophets to latch onto who USED to believe in Darwinism. This is easier to believe for them because of so many issues that can not be explained by their faith. It's more like, one kind of animal had some huge number of mutations that transitioned breeding pairs from one kind to another. ...reptile to birds for example. Now that dinosaur squatted, laid a clutch of eggs, out pecks the multiple breeding mutants that are ....Shazam! Birds. This pair or group can now reproduce as a different kind of animal.This remained stable as a fish, then a reptile, then a bird, then whatever...but the transitions were sudden. This is how it explains the distinct kinds of animals.... Little or no gradual changes.

The other day I was speaking to a group outside and pointed to the different varieties if flowers and said, Some believe that these came about accidentally....the complexity beyond understanding, the order, yet variety. In all of our life unlimited amounts of money has been stolen from us and given to those who are deemed most intelligent who have had our entire lifetime to produce living organisms. All that these brilliant minds can do from all the Earth's labs is take what has been provided to them, rearrange, modify, and pervert that life.
So far they have not so much as produced this leaf that I hold.

I am older and hopefully wiser than I was as a child.
I used to think that those working in academia, anthopoligist friends, professors, just were so much smarter than anyone and that I could put my trust in their opinions.

I used to be a believer in that of the faith of Darwinian Macro Evolutionism. I changed my mind.
Most here won't. We all have the option of whatever we choose to believe. However, lots of money time and effort.went into shoving that down my throat every time teachers of that faith had the opportunity.
Its a miracle that anyone who was raised a strick devoted Darwinian, like I was, could ever consider another faith. 4 Years old on ....hard core evol- schooling and all 14 years plus 5 more in the sciences....TV, documentaries, on and on indoctrination.
That's part one of my testimony.

You might wonder why I converted to a different faith.
My brief story below.....

Oh schiett, troll schiett. Get the [bleep] over it.

Part two:

The following is my faith and that of other evolutionists as well as quasi-Christians, who found answers to the questions of sin, judgement and the afterlife. This is not based upon science any more than my former faith. However, Jesus was convinced of everything that was written in the Old Testament and was the New Testator. I find it much easier to trust Him over that of any other man I've met.
Now I find it more convincing that The Almighty does truly exist. His name is Jesus. He gave us many gifts by creating such order, power, complexity, and amazing beauty.
"In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:..
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him"

Why did mankind need redemption through His blood?
People sin and are therefore separated from God.
God is just and man can not make things right with the Judge, God by doing any amends or restitution, nor good works.."For the wages of sin is death." "Death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."
God does not want that death sentence to remain on you. That is why the only sinless substitute who did NOT deserve judgement, was judged on behalf of you!
He took the torture upon Himself so that you would not have to undergo that in hell.........
However, God will allow you to chose, His sacrifice or your belief that you are A OK and not going to think about death ....put it off and deal with God maybe after death....at judgement.
Problem is that the second death / condemnation...guilty sentence will be waiting.
At that point God will have to condemn you.
Right now He WANTS to save you. Jesus became a man to die for mankind. After burial, He took His life back on the third day. You cannot add to that by good deeds. The gift was already paid for in full.
"It is the gift of God, Not of works lest any man should boast."
The solution was told over and over again.
"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that BELIEVETH on him is not condemned: but he that BELIEVETH not is condemned already, because he hath not BELIEVED in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

That is my faith and that of Biblical faith given by the object of that trust in God and Savior Jesus Christ. He guarantees, gives His promises, that anyone who realizes their need.to be saved from hell.....they deserve. They can not do any amount of of goodness or works, baptism to pay for sins . Jesus Christ was the only truly good man. He took your punishment on your behalf. The Father can now be just, yet extend undeserving mercy on you....... because of His Son . He will never go back on His Word. After receiving the gift of everlasting life, well, it lasts forever. Even though you will not be perfect here on earth. YES, once you are saved, you will always be saved.!
When you sin after that, He will discipline you as a child, but never throw you into hell.

I am so glad that someone who cared enough to share this with me did so. I extend this gift to you. You can chose now to make Jesus the Object of your trust to save you and to take you to Heaven when you die by telling God the following.

"Dear God, I messed up many times. I've been awful towards You whenever I have sinned and rebelled against You. Please forgive me. I have nothing to offer. I can never pay for the wrong that I have committed. Only Jesus did that when he was tortured and suffered for me on the cross. He died and arose on the third day. I am now placing my faith in Him to save me from the hell that I deserve. I thank you for my free gift to me, that cost Jesus His life. The gift of everlasting life. Thank you for your kindness God...and that of Your Son.
Amen

If you prayed that now, please PM me right now to let me know.
God bless you! 🙂

It seems that Christian doctrine is not compatible with Judaism.

That's what Marcion thought. He didn't see how it was possible the God of the OT and NT were the same God.

Christians seems to confuse the "unquenchable fire",
with eternal torment... but an eternal fire does not
have to mean eternal torment for all the wicked.

These christians explain how such endless
torment does not apply.
https://www.ucg.org/bible-study-too.../the-wicked-will-be-completely-burned-up

of course there is specific exception made
for the devil, beast and false profit.
who get endless torment rather than death.
(Revelation 20:10.) NASB.

"And the devil who deceived them was thrown into
the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast
and the false prophet are also; and they will be
tormented day and night forever and ever."

Will just have to wait see if TRH returns
to explain it away, coz he's one of those
rare special Christians in the fold you know..

Seems like TRH like some others on the CF
want people to believe they have revelatory
insight into scripture...Yet we have folks like
that, that still disagree on whose revelatory
knowledge is the actual truth... Apparently God
purposely sends mixed messages to a whole
circus of special christians 'in the know'..making
Christianity divisive.

Christianity just wouldn't be the same without
them... 😂

"But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day." - 2 Peter 3:8

This isn't meant to be taken literally, such as 1 day equals 1,000 years. It means only that our reckoning of time and God's are quite distinct.

“For as Adam was told that in the day he ate of the tree he would die, we know that he did not complete a thousand years [Gen. 5:5]. We have perceived, moreover, that the expression ‘The day of the Lord is a thousand years’ [Ps. 90:4] is connected with this subject.”

- Justin Martyr 155 AD

“And how could creation take place in time, seeing time was born along with things which exist? . . . That, then, we may be taught that the world was originated and not suppose that God made it in time, prophecy adds: ‘This is the book of the generation, also of the things in them, when they were created in the day that God made heaven and earth’ [Gen. 2:4]. For the expression ‘when they were created’ intimates an indefinite and dateless production.”

- Clement of Alexandria 208 AD

“For who that has understanding will suppose that the first and second and third day existed without a sun and moon and stars and that the first day was, as it were, also without a sky? . . . I do not suppose that anyone doubts that these things figuratively indicate certain mysteries, the history having taken place in appearance and not literally.”

- Origen of Alexandria - 248 AD

"In discussing questions of this kind, two rules are to be observed, as Augustine teaches (Gen. ad lit. i, 18). The first is to hold the truth of Scripture without wavering. The second is that, since Holy Scripture can be explained in a multiplicity of senses, one should adhere to a particular explanation only in such measure as to be ready to abandon it if it be proved with certainty to be false; lest Holy Scripture be exposed to the ridicule of unbelievers, and obstacles be placed to their believing."

- Summa Theologica 1274 AD

I could go on and on. You are not knowledgeable about the subject on which you are speaking.

Correct. It is not. Judaism is a demonic distortion of the teachings of the Prophets and Patriarchs, and Jesus himself told them this when on the earth. Whenever he pointed this out to them, he was plotted against, and even stoned. Eventually, the Jews arranged for his execution by Pilate, thinking that this would finally put an end to the accusation (which they could not defend against, since it was true) that Judaism (i.e., the teachings of the rabbis) was a false and demonic religion that originated in Babylon during their captivity there.

Starman and DBT, you are both quite likely demon possessed. It really comes across. Pray for deliverance from this.

What a childish and loony comment.

There are THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of transitional fossils within the human lineage alone. Learn to read.

The reason you cannot compare DNA of Australopithecus amanensis with Homo sapiens is simply that DNA does not last long enough. However, we can compare our DNA with that of [bleep] and bonobos and guess what? Both their skeletal anatomy and DNA demonstrates they are our closest relatives.

I guess you don't understand the concept behind "punctuated equilibrium." It doesn't mean evolution doesn't happen. It means that changes in the environment of a species can lead to faster evolution of some traits than if environmental changes didn't happen.

Then there's this "well we believe in micro evolution but macro evolution is impossible." How dumb can you get? Micro evolution, over hundreds of years, is the same stuff as macro over thousands or millions. Why would there be some mythical limit as to where the "micro" must stop? The fossil record proves there isn't.

Well said, and precisely correct on all points.

How does that quote contradict what I said above??

Wikipedia: Anti-Judaism is the "total or partial opposition to Judaism as a religion—and the total or partial opposition to Jews as adherents of it—by persons who accept a competing system of beliefs and practices and consider certain genuine Judaic beliefs and practices inferior."
Anti-Judaism, which is the rejection of a particular way of thinking about God, is distinct from antisemitism, which is more akin to a form of racism. Scholars who see a less clear line between theology and racism have coined the term religious antisemitism.

Marcion was in error, as are those who are of the mind that the God of the OT is not the God of the NT. These folks may not fully understand dispensations, the Law and the New Covenant.

Some folks even get confused with Jesus’ teachings on the law..... his teachings on the law were..... Before..... the sacrifice on the cross and the before the New Covenant.

All this info is readily available to one who desires to understand.

This^^^^