Home Forums Birds & Dogs Turkey Hunting TSS facts verses fiction

It's more of a question than a statement. "Better," for the purposes of my question, is with respect to shot quantity, penetration and recoil. All else being equal.

Given your demonstration, you can approximate the performance of a 3.5" #5 shot shell with a 28g #9 TSS sheel, with signifcantly less recoil. Extrapolation suggests that you can, then, better the performance of the 12g 3.5" shell with a 20g 3" shell with #9 TSS shot with more recoli that the 28g but still less than the 12g.

Yes, I understand that there are variation in gun weights, patterning, etc. But again, right now, I'm thining in terms of all else being equal.

Indeed, they are. I have a Maxus II and a SX4. Both are Browning-made in the same factory. Both operate substantially the same way. Both are short stroke gas guns. The Maxus has a little more refinement, with some parts being metal versus plastic on the SX4. The Maxus has a magazine cutoff and a quick load feature the SX4 doesn't have. But I scarcely ever use those features. In terms of performance, they are equals. The SX4 gives up nothing to the Maxus II except a little refinement and a few parts that are materially different. Otherwise, you get very comparable guns and identical performance with about $700-$800 less for the SX4. I used my SX4 quite a bit this season with 00 buck. It takes a big bite out of 3.5" shell recoil versus, say, my A5 or Benelli Super Nova.

Absolutely.

BP 181211-10741 has 1 5/8 TSS at 1100 fps out of a 2 3/4 20 gauge.



TSS #9 1 5/8 oz (581 pellets)
(maxxes out pellet count of ~equal lethality)

@ 2 inches gel penetration

Final Vel: 663
Distance: 40.5 yards
Energy (ft/lbs): 1.19
Energy Density (ft / lbs /sq in): 236.7

@ 8 pound gun weight

Recoil velocity: 16.80
Recoil Energy (ft/lbs): 35.07


Kick it up to TSS #7.5 (347 pellets)
(maxxes out lethality of ~equal pellet count)

Final Vel: 558
Distance: 65.9 yards
Energy (ft/lbs): 1.41
Energy Density (ft / lbs /sq in): 199.3

I know a guy that had his retina detached shooting a Beneili super nova off a bench rest...


My signature line disappeared....I guess it offended someone in high places.

LFC from Tennessee sounds like steelhead to me .just a little bitch of a piss ant punk . rick will figger it out

Why you guys that shoot little balls so nasty....

Slummy sais you make lots of little balls shoot....into your mouth

10Glock
I went 20 ga years ago because the only shells with TSS were the ones you loaded yourself. TSS data was black magic back then and you had to know someone to get the recipe.
12 and 20 ga data was all there was. Fast forward a couple of years and people were loading 28 ga and a year or so later 410 came along.
I have a 28 ga semi auto and a 410 O/U but no desire to turkey hunt with either so never tried TSS in them.
The 28 and 410 as a general statement makes a light carry guns and that is why some like it for turkey hunting.
For me the 20 is fine, it is lighter than the 12's I hunted with before, less shot change means less recoil (the way mine are loaded, not trying to go max on fps). Better pattern density is also a plus, as is the better penetration. For me and what I am looking for the 20 is as far as I want to look.
If I had tons of land to hunt and was having to walk my butt off ( the main farm I hunt is only about 150 acres so fairly easy to cover) I might look at a super light 28 ga, but for now I am good.
I bought up a life time supply of TSS years ago and still have about 30 lbs of it.

I've killed turkeys way further than I care to admit with T9s...never once have I lost a bird that I cleanly hit with shot. I shoot the Apex GT-20 1-5/8oz load in my little single shot 20 gauge turkey rig. With a .555" Indian Creek choke I get around 350 hits in a 10" circle at 40 yards. Dense, but even pattern. I'm setting up a 12 gauge SX4 this spring for birds. I ordered a .665" Indian Creek to start, and likely shoot T8s in the big 3.5" hull.

TSS you just gotta see to believe. 7 gobblers have fallen to my little 20 gauge. Not one has moved after being shot.

That is one thing I have noticed as well, they typically don't flop or move after the shot.
I guess there is so much trauma to the brain and neck is the reason, not sure

Tss #9's are a game changer for my grandson, his 410 has gotten a good workout this year, is it expensive.... yes and worth every penny to me,

His first tom..

First canadian honker..

Beautiful pictures!!

Rick why would you not use Bismuth for upland game ?

Answer #1: I do. Out of older shotguns that cannot shoot steel.

Answer #2: Because TSS is better.

I can't really see where it could be better especially for upland birds.

I'll say first off I want a choke and a pellet size that will kill what I shoot with minimal meat damage....that puts me off to shooting a high number of pellets like small TSS shot at something I intend to eat.

Bismuth shot....

I've squirrel hunted on duck refuges that required environmentally safe shot and consistently killed squirrels tree top high with 2&3/4" Bismuth #6 shot In a modern 12 gauge...

Try it with steel shot and you better keep shooting till the squirrel hits the ground dead.

I've shot ducks in Arkansas and Missouri with 1&5/8 oz of Bismuth #4 shot ahread of 130 grains of black powder and also a low pressure smokeless load that chronographed over 1200 fps in a 32" barreled 1879 10 ga W.C. Scott Premeir grade hammer gun and also with an 1881 10 ga. Purdy hammer gun both guns rocked their world...none dove or swam off when they hit the water like they do with steel shot.

My buddy is an outfitter in Missouri that duck hunts every day of the duck season he switched to Boss Bismuth after I turned him on to Bismuth shot...said he would never shoot another duck with anything else.

I've shot turkeys with a modern 12 ga. with a 3" factory Bismuth #4s on the same duck refuges I squirrel hunted...never noticed it being any less effective than lead on turkeys.

I've hunted quail with an 1871 W.C.Scott hammer gun (built before choke) loaded with 2.5" 12 gauge with black powder and #7.5 lead shot with cylinder bore one of the most effective quail guns I ever shot.

I never noticed any of them lacking in killing power.

How dead is dead.

I've only killed a few spring turkey in fields, clear cuts, actually. I've killed most in swamp bottomlands. Doubt I've ever killed a bird much past 35 yards, and the closest about 10 yards. #5 and #6 has always killed them just as dead. I've never lost a bird. One of the benefits of Winchester XX is that you get a bit of a spread closer in. That's an advantage when you bring them in close.

I shot a bird last day of the season a couple years back with the 7 1/2 tss. Open field, I figured it was about 60 yards. It ended up being a bit further than that. Bird just disappeared in the grass, no flop, nothing....dead. I dont like those shots but I had the bead on him and felt good about it. Buddy sitting with me was impressed. It's some bad stuff, I dont care what it costs. I can only shoot a couple birds in Ga anyway, whats 50 bucks for a 5pack of tss when I'm spending all this money on plots, gas, etc.

I know this guy that shot clean through 3/4in plywood @40 with his 410 and no9 tss when patterning.

Any one remember the Winchester Extended Range ammo ?...every shell I shoot i cut open and check out

They had silver pellets in them that I believe were a Bismuth mix....a silver #4 weighed a tad less than a copper plated #4....the hammer test when smacked with a big hammer they crush into a powdery substance like Bismuth.

Any how I was hunting this big field one afternoon. A big gobbler came out on the edge of the field looked my way them went back in the woods...later he came back out a lot closer too me...went erect turned his back to me and lightly shuffled/checked his wings on his back and I let him have it.....I walked it off 3 times once to him and then back to where I was sitting to pick up my gear....then again back to the turkey....
72 long steps.

I've shot a few more maybe even furthur....some that I didn't pace off because I just didn't want to know.

Not something I was proud of or that was I amazed by....actually I felt ashamed even though I had killed the turkey.

I figured he was closer turkeys look awful big in fields....he might would have came closer you never know.

For me just the opposit is true in the woods....I've passed shots in the woods that after the fact were within 35 to 40 yards.

For a while now I been having to hunt big field turkeys....I don't use blinds or decoys.

I only had one get away that I shot too far....

I used to carry a small pair of binoculars now days I carry a small Lieca range finder....first thing I do when I get to a spot is read something on the ground that I can use for a 50 yard reference. It could be a clump of grass a weed just something I can remember.

50 yards is my personal max "known distance" if I know its further than 50 yards I'm likely not shooting. I came up with this number from years of killing turkeys and then everything needs to be just right.

I let one walk last year that came up on a pasture terrace turned his rear to me and I ranged his azz hole...40 yards full strut. (Only Turkey I've ever ranged)

Could I have gotten him out of full strut and killed him ?
I didn't feel confident enough in the situation.

He strutted back off the terrace and lived to fight me unsuccessfully another day.

I can't even imagine shooting a turkey that far away except with maybe a rifle, which I have done (the rifle part, not the distance). I won't take a rear shot or a quartering away shot. Toms always seem to be pivoting and unless I have a clear line of sight to the head/neck, I don't pull. Exception was a few fall turkeys in my youth that I took with buckshot during deer season. I don't hunt with any optics or red dots. I hunt over fiber optic "rifle" sights mounted on my rib or down a rib with a HiViz sight. Much past 40 yards and it feels like I'm just shooting in that general direction. I know how my guns pattern and won't shoot beyond its reasonable capability. I also hunt cypress and tupelo bottomlands and getting a clear shot at much over 35 yards is rare.

Go sit on an 800 yard crop field and it won't be so hard for you to imagine....I shot that 72 yard gobbled with brass bead sights.

I used a scope years back and went back to bead sights....the pollen and age is catching up to me so this year I'll have my scope back on....the big reasom was because of a 15 foot miss on an 800 yards crop field.

In the back shot is one of the best shot to take on a turkey.

Just like everything else there's always an if....

"If" the head and body is fully erect....his entire spine is more exposed.....

A gobblers vitals are more protected when a gobbler is facing you or broad side.