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If the ocean suddenly broke through the strait between mainland Turkey and Europe and inundated thousands of square miles you can bet the same thing happened other places all over the world. I would imagine people living close to the original beach had boats on which some survived. I'm not believing the Alps, Himalayas, Rockies, etc. went under water. You don't believe that, do you? Those mountains didn't exist prior to the Flood. Even secular geologist recognize they are uplifted. Well, yes, the mountains are uplifting even now. How long ago was the flood? How old are those mountains? If every piece of ice on earth melted do you think water would have covered the mountains as they were 5000, 10,000, or 12,000 years ago? Mount Ararat is almost 17,000 feet above sea level. Was it flat land back then? Flood was about 5,000 -6,000 years ago. Due to tides and current beyond our present understanding the earth would have been pretty much planed to almost smooth. Any graduate student or serious student of geology knows if the earth was smoothed out, water would be about two miles deep.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
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Campfire Ranger
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Because the next logical question (as you already stated) simply becomes Okay, where did this God come from? What made it? How does it have these powers? And even if one subscribed to the "Hey all this must have come from somewhere so there must be a God" line of thinking (I don't) that generalistic notion in no way indicates which of the many gods the religions on this earth subscribe to is the correct one. Your question is a logical dodge. It's like asking, to whom is the bachelor married? Only an Infinite Being could qualify as God. Anything less is angel or demon worship. The idea that it all came from somewhere actually supports the idea God exist because even a child knows nothing produces nothing. It makes no difference how many degrees a person has they know deep inside the child is correct.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Nope, it never happened. There's evidence of populations of people living elsewhere around the world before and after the time of the alledged flood event. Geological evidence dismisses a global flood event.
The people who wrote the bible didn't know that so got caught out on that lie too. The biblical tale of creation is also fiction. Your ignorant prejudice is obvious when you talk about time lines. Where's your evidence to support your accusation? No evidence that man was even ever globally wiped out, let alone by a mega-flood that never happened. Because you don't accept evidence in no way lets you off the hook.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
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If the ocean suddenly broke through the strait between mainland Turkey and Europe and inundated thousands of square miles you can bet the same thing happened other places all over the world. I would imagine people living close to the original beach had boats on which some survived. I'm not believing the Alps, Himalayas, Rockies, etc. went under water. You don't believe that, do you? Those mountains didn't exist prior to the Flood. Even secular geologist recognize they are uplifted. Well, yes, the mountains are uplifting even now. How long ago was the flood? How old are those mountains? If every piece of ice on earth melted do you think water would have covered the mountains as they were 5000, 10,000, or 12,000 years ago? Mount Ararat is almost 17,000 feet above sea level. Was it flat land back then? Flood was about 5,000 -6,000 years ago. Due to tides and current beyond our present understanding the earth would have been pretty much planed to almost smooth. Any graduate student or serious student of geology knows if the earth was smoothed out, water would be about two miles deep. I didn't know that. I was lucky to graduate high school.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Jesus: "Take heed that no man deceive you."
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even a child knows nothing produces nothing. Then how did god come from nothing. If it's absurd to think that the universe may have always existed in some form then it's equally ridiculous to turn around and say that a god has just always existed. If everything must come from something then where did god come from? You want to give this god you believe in a special exemption from the same logic you want to force others to rigidly adhere to.
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Who here is ‘forcing’ anyone else here “to rigidly adhere to” anything…? We’re just having a discussion. On a discussion forum.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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Who here is ‘forcing’ anyone else here “to rigidly adhere to” anything…? We’re just having a discussion. On a discussion forum. Wasn't talking to you. I was pointing out the ridiculous double standard of saying on the one hand that the universe must come from something but then exempting a god from that same logic. This is pretty easy to understand. It's almost like you guys are intentionally obtuse.
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As opposed to “you guys” pointing out that life on earth and all of creation can come from nothing, but then exempting God from that same logic.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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As opposed to “you guys” pointing out that life on earth and all of creation can come from nothing, but then exempting God from that same logic. Well the difference is that the universe undeniably exists. There is no evidence of god.
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I didn't make up the existence of the universe or the earth. But men did make up god as a means to explain it's origin.
Last edited by Willto; 01/07/22.
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Campfire Ranger
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There is no evidence of god. Others choose to see things differently than you do. And that is their prerogative. But men did make up god as a means to explain it's origin. That’s your assertion; I disagree with it, but I have no problem with it.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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If you believe in a highest good, you believe in God. If you believe in truth, you believe in God. If you believe in transcendent beauty, you believe in God.
Is that worthy of worship? Should we worship this?
Politics is War by Other Means
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I choose to believe what I do. And you choose to believe what you do, despite your assertion that you have “actual evidence” that you clearly don’t have. The ‘only’ one in this particular discourse between you and I who has mentioned “evidence” for God’s existence has been you. Clearly. Can you choose not to believe whatever it is you do believe is true? Being convinced of the truth, are you able to just switch your conviction off as a matter of choice? No answer?
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If you believe in an uncaused cause, you believe in God.
Politics is War by Other Means
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I read that the universe is 13.8 billion years old and was formed when gravity or something pulled all matter into such a dense mass that something had to give and we had the mother of a nuclear type of an explosion. Young earth folks say against all evidence that creation was like 5,000 years ago and earth was created and populated in 7 days. I am not atheist but sticking to that 5000 year story doesn't wash. I believe a lot of these 5,000 year creationists cause a lot of thinking people to shake their heads and walk off.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Jesus: "Take heed that no man deceive you."
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Campfire Tracker
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If you believe in an uncaused cause, you believe in God. False Dichotomy. There are other possibilities, the universe may be cyclic, a part of a multiverse, etc, etc....it is not known. We don't know. We don't know, therefore God, is not an argument.
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There is no evidence of god. Others choose to see things differently than you do. And that is their prerogative. But men did make up god as a means to explain it's origin. That’s your assertion; I disagree with it, but I have no problem with it. How does seeing things differently relate to evidence? Seeing evidence where no evidence exists? Interpreting something that may have multiple explanations in one's own favour? Evidence is something that anyone can examine and draw much the same conclusion.
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If you believe in an uncaused cause, you believe in God. False Dichotomy. There are other possibilities, the universe may be cyclic, a part of a multiverse, etc, etc....it is not known. We don't know. We don't know, therefore God, is not an argument. You are proposing an uncaused cause too.
Politics is War by Other Means
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For those who are interested in such, you might enjoy this read.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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If the ocean suddenly broke through the strait between mainland Turkey and Europe and inundated thousands of square miles you can bet the same thing happened other places all over the world. I would imagine people living close to the original beach had boats on which some survived. I'm not believing the Alps, Himalayas, Rockies, etc. went under water. You don't believe that, do you? Those mountains didn't exist prior to the Flood. Even secular geologist recognize they are uplifted. Well, yes, the mountains are uplifting even now. How long ago was the flood? How old are those mountains? If every piece of ice on earth melted do you think water would have covered the mountains as they were 5000, 10,000, or 12,000 years ago? Mount Ararat is almost 17,000 feet above sea level. Was it flat land back then? Flood was about 5,000 -6,000 years ago. Due to tides and current beyond our present understanding the earth would have been pretty much planed to almost smooth. Any graduate student or serious student of geology knows if the earth was smoothed out, water would be about two miles deep. The bible says it rained for 40 days and 40 nights until the highest mountains were covered to a depth of 15 cubits. It doesn't say the earth was planed smooth. You say the earth was planed smooth.
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk. That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied. Well?
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