Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Question for the holy guys

You are the proof

I do believe that the day will come when all of us will stand before God and give an account of our works, good or bad. For those who also believe this, do you wanna trust in your own good works…despite your sins…to earn your way into God’s good graces, and salvation…?

Or do you wanna stand before God and give an account of your own works, good or bad, with your sins covered by the Blood of the Atonement because you accepted God’s grace…?

And, for those in the first category above, do you feel that trusting in your own good works…despite your sin…to earn your salvation diminishes, in any way, the work that Jesus did for you on the cross…?

Yea!!

The question is for those who have drank the kool aid of Wesleyan Christian perfectionism or pietism. They quote James and hold those verses high as though they are a banner of victory! To them I say, “Proclaim your good works and holiness! Show us that which causes you to rise above those others”!

….yet they are silent. Quiet. Yet they “have so So much to share”.

I’ve heard that most of My life. Yet, Paul says that there is NO CONDEMNATION to those who are in Christ,

If there is no condemnation there is no guilt. If there is no guilt how can there be judgement?

agreed...........

John 3:18 ...he that believes in HIM is not judged, he who does not believe has been judged already..........

I gave a jake, I'd inspire ya ta another black cock meltdown.

More fun ta do the slow bleed, where actual 'fire members post pictures a your wife, til ya can't stand it anymore.

Pm Happy Camper.
Lol

I wanted your opinion of the Big Bang (BB), I was not saying you are wrong, just wanted your perspective of Big Bang...since you refuse to give me your opinion, here is mine....I am sure this will bore many, but my years of research for the BB is as follows and this is my belief.....one professor gave me an A and the other gave me a C...he was an atheist.

Technically, the Big Bang does not describe how the universe ‘began to exist’. The Big Bang describes how a singularity (a speck of infinite heat and density) rapidly expanded and produced everything in the universe. So actually, you have no explanation for how the universe began (or why for that matter). Where did the singularity come from? What caused it?

I used to believe that science cannot, by definition, explain the origin of the universe....I kinda still do, but you'll in the see last paragraph.

Science relies on the laws of physics, chemistry and other natural laws in order to operate. But these laws were only created after the universe began to exist.

Newton came along, when everyone believed that God or gods did everything, and discovered the laws of physics, which then did everything. Thinkers then had two choices - either the laws of physics did everything, and there was no need for God or gods to do anything, or God worked through the laws of physics to make everything happen.

The curious thing was that the Newton's people worldview, was entirely dependent upon the universe being infinite in size and time, infinitely old and large. Thus, the laws of physics had always been here, along with the universe itself and everything in it - energy, matter, stars, galaxies, everything had always been there. And thus no need for any deity to have started the whole thing off, no need for a Genesis point, for a creator, since it was not a creation. Creations are created at a moment in time and space, but the laws of physics did all the creating that was needed. This didn’t get rid of God, but it seemed to get rid of the need for God as an explanation.


Now stick with me......

Then something terrible happened to the infinitely large, infinitely old universe - Big Bang. Suddenly, the universe had a starting point, a Genesis moment.......It’s important to understand what the Big Bang says - according to hot BB cosmology as predicted by the General Theory (ignoring quantum mechanical problems for the moment) and overwhelmingly and convincingly confirmed by all observations so far, the Big Bang produced space and time. There was no empty universe waiting for something to happen inside of it. The empty universe came into being, vanishingly small for a vanishingly small amount of time, and then almost instantly becoming a cosmos-sized cosmos, expanding from the size of a proton to a quarter billion light years across in a trillionth of a trillionth of a trillionth of a second.

And with this universe arrive not just space and time, but the laws of physics - gravity, the strong, weak and electromagnetic forces. And energy. And matter. They all arrived. They didn’t pre-exist the universe, they didn’t pre-exist the Big Bang. Everything came into existence, apparently from nothing. Really nothing.

Now. If one bases the non-existence of God on a Newtonian worldview, dependent on an infinite universe in time and space, and one learns that the universe is not infinite, that the laws of physics have not always been there, then suddenly we can have a conversation about God.

Worth noting that the science community rejected the idea of Big Bang, of the universe having a starting point, because it sounded too much like religion. Fred Hoyle: “The passionate frenzy with which the Big Bang cosmology is clutched to the corporate scientific bosom evidently arises from a deep-rooted attachment to the first page of Genesis, religious fundamentalism at its strongest.” William Bonner “The underlying motive is, of course, to bring in God as creator. It seems like the opportunity Christian theology has been waiting for ever since science began to depose religion from the minds of rational men in the 17th Century.”

And then George Smoot, after winning the Nobel Prize for discovering evidence in the Cosmic Background Explorer (COBE) satellite, that firmly established BB as the way the universe began, said this: “We have observed the oldest and largest structures ever seen in the early universe. These were the primordial seeds of modern-day structures such as galaxies, clusters of galaxies, and so on. If you’re religious, it’s like seeing the face of God.”

So scientists largely considered BB as evidence for the existence of God, until BB was shown to be true. Then many of them decided that it wasn’t evidence, after all. That’s not science. That’s just personal bias. And that’s kind of the way we work. There is evidence, but not proof, and we can and do decide whether or not to accept it based upon what we believe to be true.

Tagged

You realise that all you do is critisize the response without addressing the particular issues, either that or ad hominen attacks. You can do better.

You have a communication issue. You never asked for my opinion, you asked for evidence of the big bang. I provided some info for you to research (there's plenty of info available) but you rejected it and went straight to head in sand.

Just because we don't know what happened at the instant of the big bang, or prior, it gives no validity to creation by galaxy farting pixies or whatever else you choose to nominate.

Ha ha. Yes, he's the one closest to God here.

There sure are a lotta people nowadays who see things that way. Maybe more than at any other time in our lives.

There has certainly been a significant increase in those who choose to be religiously unaffiliated in any way whatsoever.

Iron bender said a while back, "dead is dead." He is correct, that's what makes the Resurrection so great.

Not at all correct on your part - read again, and again. You act like the evidence king and made a declarative post about your soul. I simply asked for your evidence/proof. You flunked - posted none. What normal person would not comment on such behavior? No answer = no hall pass for you !

I do not have a communication issue, but you absolutely do...You originally said there is plenty of evidence of the big bang....I said name one....you said go look it up...I already knew the theory about big bang but just wanted your opinion....so I got my old old papers out and replied to you... and now you say you say George Smoot is full of shiet.....you do realize he won the Nobel Prize for discovering evidence in the Cosmic Background Explorer (COBE) satellite, that firmly established BB as the way the universe began.

Raspy, based on his behavior here, you are on target with mauserand9mm - he must have issues. But, maybe not so much "communication" - maybe more like faking or hypocrisy. He talks so big about valuing and needing "evidence" for his logic, but when another poster asks him to provide evidence regarding one of his questionable claims, he seems unwilling or unable to do so. What does such behavior symbolize?

God created the Heavens, and the earth.

How He did it, is not that important.

I agree. And I think Apostle Peter would agree too. His trust and faith and hope wasn’t anchored to the Genesis account of a literal 6 day creation, nor was it anchored to theology or any book. He clearly and unequivocally said that his trust and faith and hope were anchored to an event…an event that he and many others saw with their own eyes…the resurrection of Jesus.