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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2005
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Give me one example of a pedestrian saying to you... you are the same cyclists that I hate on my way driving on the road.
Kent I have never asked, but in my mind it is reasonable to assume that some of those pedestrians are the same ones complaining about bicyclists on the road. Hell, just look at the number of motorists who complain about bicyclists breaking the law. Of course none of those motorists would ever go above the speed limit, never slow roll a stop, never fail to signal a lane change or turn...right? You never asked... the rest is irrelevant to the subject. Kent
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
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Give me one example of a pedestrian saying to you... you are the same cyclists that I hate on my way driving on the road.
Kent I have never asked, but in my mind it is reasonable to assume that some of those pedestrians are the same ones complaining about bicyclists on the road. Hell, just look at the number of motorists who complain about bicyclists breaking the law. Of course none of those motorists would ever go above the speed limit, never slow roll a stop, never fail to signal a lane change or turn...right? You never asked... the rest is irrelevant to the subject. Kent It's a safe assumption. You know it is.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,924 Likes: 2 |
Hundreds of motorists safely passed you because they saw you. What could magically make you hard to see to a driver in the same conditions on the same road? No magic, just inevitable human fallibility, the same thing that happens to those horribly unfortunate parents that unwittingly leave their infants in hot cars every year. It is inevitable that a fraction of drivers passing me will not see me. You are not asking a lot from me as a driver to not run over you when you are riding in compliance with the law. I am telling you, it is ridiculously simple. I think it’s a lot, it is of enormous significance to me. To hear the comments of most drivers they think it’s a lot too. You will reply that of course they are wrong because, in your opinion, they are wrong. The sort of smug pronouncement that PO’s people about cyclists. They think we’re all like you. Few people run over cyclists on purpose, many who do were not otherwise violating traffic laws, they simply didn’t see and/or weren’t expecting the cyclist. Pedestrians are forbidden on roadways because of the hazards to themselves and vehicles. Every other slow-moving vehicle, much larger and harder to miss than cyclists, has to be clearly marked. Laws are always a compromise, is this case the law allows a hazardous situation. So I ride at my own risk and accept responsibility for assuming that risk.
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 17,067 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 17,067 Likes: 1 |
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
If it had been me about something hunting and it was pointed out as ironic when it was, I'd laugh and admit it... it's a cyclist thing I guess, you even eat your own.
Kent
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,580 Likes: 17 |
Hundreds of motorists safely passed you because they saw you. What could magically make you hard to see to a driver in the same conditions on the same road? No magic, just inevitable human fallibility, the same thing that happens to those horribly unfortunate parents that unwittingly leave their infants in hot cars every year. It is inevitable that a fraction of drivers passing me will not see me. . See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here. Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver.
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Joined: Jun 2006
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,114 Likes: 6 |
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic, I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, and I have no reason to complain about motorists (and haven't) explain the irony.
A wise man is frequently humbled.
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 17,067 Likes: 1 |
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic and I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, explain the irony. Can I use Paul's assuming superpower to say... I bet you have ridden at sometime in your life, that you impeded traffic in some way, even in a parking lot or intersection or entrance/exit... some driver had to wait for you once. Kent
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 17,067 Likes: 1 |
And I didn't write my first pointed post in this thread until someone suggested a loud horn to scare pedestrians legally using recreational travel ways.
Kent
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2005
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If you are a pedestrian or a cyclist in this world of moving objects you are at the bottom of the food chain. Some folks are more aware of their position than others, some not so much.
One man with courage makes a majority....
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Joined: Jun 2006
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,114 Likes: 6 |
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic and I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, explain the irony. Can I use Paul's assuming superpower to say... I bet you have ridden at sometime in your life, that you impeded traffic in some way, even in a parking lot or intersection or entrance/exit... some driver had to wait for you once. Kent LOL. I bet at one point in your life you drank too much alcohol and did something that you later regretted. So what.
A wise man is frequently humbled.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 17,067 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 17,067 Likes: 1 |
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic and I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, explain the irony. Can I use Paul's assuming superpower to say... I bet you have ridden at sometime in your life, that you impeded traffic in some way, even in a parking lot or intersection or entrance/exit... some driver had to wait for you once. Kent LOL. I bet at one point in your life you drank too much alcohol and did something that you later regretted. So what. No. my regrets are self-imposed without the excuse of a crutch... and there are many at my age. Kent
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 14,960 Likes: 1 |
Ridin, with crutches is frowned on here.
--- CAUGHT IN THE CROSSFIRE --- A Magic Time To Be An Illegal In America---
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,924 Likes: 2 |
[quote=Birdwatcher][quote=PaulBarnard]See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here. No, this is just more Paul Barnard smug wordplay. To whit: The drivers are wrong, they don’t find bicycles hard to see, they’re just being inattentive. or.... Drivers are wrong, bicycles do not present a road hazard to drivers if they ride in a legal manner Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver. It means less likely to steal the attention of ANY driver. I’m familiar with this phenomenon from my years on motorcycles, drivers are less likely to see a motorcycle approaching, so they sometimes pull out in front of one. Happens to every rider. This is why if you’re on a motorcycle and you’re smart, you ride with the headlight on, better yet with a strobe effect. Still can happen anyway. Whatever the Paul Barnard version is, is irrelevant to the reality on the street of course.
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,580 Likes: 17
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,580 Likes: 17 |
[quote=Birdwatcher][quote=PaulBarnard]See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here. No, this is just more Paul Barnard smug wordplay. To whit: The drivers are wrong, they don’t find bicycles hard to see, they’re just being inattentive. or.... Drivers are wrong, bicycles do not present a road hazard to drivers if they ride in a legal manner Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver. It means less likely to steal the attention of ANY driver. I’m familiar with this phenomenon from my years on motorcycles, drivers are less likely to see a motorcycle approaching, so they sometimes pull out in front of one. Happens to every rider. This is why if you’re on a motorcycle and you’re smart, you ride with the headlight on, better yet with a strobe effect. Still can happen anyway. Whatever the Paul Barnard version is, is irrelevant to the reality on the street of course. I guess its just a matter of time before you run over a hard to see cyclist.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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OP
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,114 Likes: 6 |
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on.
A wise man is frequently humbled.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,924 Likes: 2 |
[quote=Birdwatcher][quote=PaulBarnard]See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here. No, this is just more Paul Barnard smug wordplay. To whit: The drivers are wrong, they don’t find bicycles hard to see, they’re just being inattentive. or.... Drivers are wrong, bicycles do not present a road hazard to drivers if they ride in a legal manner Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver. It means less likely to steal the attention of ANY driver. I’m familiar with this phenomenon from my years on motorcycles, drivers are less likely to see a motorcycle approaching, so they sometimes pull out in front of one. Happens to every rider. This is why if you’re on a motorcycle and you’re smart, you ride with the headlight on, better yet with a strobe effect. Still can happen anyway. Whatever the Paul Barnard version is, is irrelevant to the reality on the street of course. I guess its just a matter of time before you run over a hard to see cyclist. In my pickup? Could happen, could happen to anyone. They’re called “accidents”.
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Joined: Aug 2002
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,924 Likes: 2 |
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on. Didn’t you begin this thread by talking about how you won’t ride on the road?
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,580 Likes: 17
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,580 Likes: 17 |
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on. Didn’t you begin this thread by talking about how you won’t ride on the road? He's obviously smarter than me, recognizing that there are plenty of drivers out there willing to excuse their own inattentiveness.
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Posts: 8,899
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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One man with courage makes a majority....
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 9,088 Likes: 5 |
I did a two hour mountain bike ride Sunday afternoon. Trail system was busy, lots of runners, hikers and cyclists. No problems.
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