I just got a new bike a month ago and it's been great to get back into bike riding. I'm not what you'd call a cyclist, don't own any spandex, and don't like to ride on the road with traffic. It's just great exercise, easy on the old knees, and more fun than most other forms of exercise. I read the cycling threads on here, and the way they usually go is a bunch of posters telling the cyclists they're idiots for riding on the road with vehicles, don't understand the laws of physics, and so on and so forth. Which I kind of agree with to a point and that's why I don't like riding on the road. You never know what a driver is going to do or even if they see you. All it takes is one driver looking at their cell phone and a cyclist is toast.
So I ride in a local state park, off road on their paved trails. The trails are concrete and 8 or 9 feet wide, wide enough to comfortably pass other riders and walkers as long as everyone understands they need to leave enough room on the left to pass. Riders understand this but walkers don't. I've had people walking toward me three abreast, looking right at me and just stand there blocking the trail. Or walking the same way I'm riding, walking down the middle of the trail with earbuds so they can't hear anything behind them. Or the woman today, walking down the center of the trail with her back to me yakking on her phone, not hearing me as I ride up behind her saying "passing on your left" until I'm actually passing on her left and she pivots to the left right in front of me so I had to lock up both wheels and skid off the trail.
What is it with these lame brains? The traffic on the trails is about 75% cyclists and 25 % walkers, you'd think after about the 30th cyclist passed them a light would go on and they'd say to themselves, "there's a lot of bikers out here, I need to pay attention so I don't get run over." You know, the laws of physics and all that.
And the thing is, every single one of these idiots drove an automobile to the park.
Before I read your last line, I had already crafted it as a response in my mind.
We have some very good bike/pedestrian infrastructure in our area and I use it for about 90% of my miles. Most of the miles I rack up not using it are used to get to it. In some places like City Park and Audubon Park the pedestrians are miraculously disengaged. Even on a well marked path like this one, pedestrians will amble about wherever they want. The ones that walk in the bike only lane ALWAYS do it in the direction of bike traffic so that they have no idea you are coming up behind them. NOBODY knows what the center markings mean, and to think those people drive cars. I don't get in any kind of hurry on this path. It's shaded, so it makes for a nice diversion, as do the yoga pants.
a bunch of posters telling the cyclists they're idiots for riding on the road with vehicles, don't understand the laws of physics, and so on and so forth.
Guys are always tougher when they are riding around inside their trucks.
Tis the reason I ride just before sun up and on residential streets. I might pass a handfull of joggers/walkers, a few people out walking/jogging with their dog and maybe five vehicles driving the streets. Me and goof ball get our 5~6 miles in and are back home before the neighborhood comes alive.
I don't think you qualify for the azzhole bicycle brigade. 1, no spandex 2, no riding in hoards 3, you seem to have some common sense.
Thank you. No spandex is key. With apologies to Paul of course, he rally rocks it.
I really rock a thong, but I don't want to make the boys around here feel insecure.
On a less serious note, have you found that you get into kind of a Zen-like mental space on rides? Not that it's good, but I do my best thinking beginning a few miles into a ride.
a bunch of posters telling the cyclists they're idiots for riding on the road with vehicles, don't understand the laws of physics, and so on and so forth.
Guys are always tougher when they are riding around inside their trucks.
Not until they get out of their truck and waddle around!
Question then. 3-5 riders already in an intersection I'll stay stopped let'em roll its 5 folks no problem.10-50? I'll just ease out foot off brake no gas just a "hey the lights changed might want to stop before you become a stastic." No aggression on my part just nice easy roll. 89.5% will stop them others wont....until those 302 cubic inches and 4495 lbs gently but firmly explain that no matter how loud you cuss me and say bad things about my mother them laws of physics are unbreakable. So take your spandex your foul mouth and just run me over good. Hasn't happened probably never will.
I just got a new bike a month ago and it's been great to get back into bike riding. I'm not what you'd call a cyclist, don't own any spandex, and don't like to ride on the road with traffic. It's just great exercise, easy on the old knees, and more fun than most other forms of exercise. I read the cycling threads on here, and the way they usually go is a bunch of posters telling the cyclists they're idiots for riding on the road with vehicles, don't understand the laws of physics, and so on and so forth. Which I kind of agree with to a point and that's why I don't like riding on the road. You never know what a driver is going to do or even if they see you. All it takes is one driver looking at their cell phone and a cyclist is toast.
So I ride in a local state park, off road on their paved trails. The trails are concrete and 8 or 9 feet wide, wide enough to comfortably pass other riders and walkers as long as everyone understands they need to leave enough room on the left to pass. Riders understand this but walkers don't. I've had people walking toward me three abreast, looking right at me and just stand there blocking the trail. Or walking the same way I'm riding, walking down the middle of the trail with earbuds so they can't hear anything behind them. Or the woman today, walking down the center of the trail with her back to me yakking on her phone, not hearing me as I ride up behind her saying "passing on your left" until I'm actually passing on her left and she pivots to the left right in front of me so I had to lock up both wheels and skid off the trail.
What is it with these lame brains? The traffic on the trails is about 75% cyclists and 25 % walkers, you'd think after about the 30th cyclist passed them a light would go on and they'd say to themselves, "there's a lot of bikers out here, I need to pay attention so I don't get run over." You know, the laws of physics and all that.
And the thing is, every single one of these idiots drove an automobile to the park.
Recreation and traffic doesn't register to walkers or bike riders; play time, breaking a record or becoming the next Lance Armstrong (or Flex Armsrtrong) comes in second to industry and commerce along a modern roadway and now (apparently) a bike path.
I hope all of you asshats get run over or collide with each other or at least stay off of the highways and by ways and sort out your "recreation" on your own paved paths. I'm not surprised you've found karma there...
If I was on a jury where a tractor trailer driver ran over 75 bike riders on a highway I'd be on their side 9 out of ten times, and that's being courteous. Joggers on a bike path seems just desserts for the imbeciles.
Recreation and traffic doesn't register to walkers or bike riders
I wonder how many of the 40,000 motorists killed each year are on the road for recreational reasons...going on vacation, going to a movie, going to a football game, going hunting. Is it funnier when they die than it is when someone going to work dies? I know it's funnier when a bicyclist riding to work dies than it is when a motorist on the road for recreational reasons dies, but I am still trying to get the hierarchy/priority of road users thing down.
The problem I see with bikers, of which I am one of occasionally, is their organizations. They are a large ambitious group who will take over public properties that were paid for and or improved by smaller, possibly less organized groups- even to the point of excluding that group.
I bike a lot. Behind locked gates on public hunting/fishing land. It's all ebike now but I pedaled when I had an intact spine. I also walk a lot. To be honest, I wish I could walk everywhere I needed to go but that's not realistic or viable where I currently live.
I have no problem with any groups of people - that's just asinine - trying to apply some trait or another to a group just because they look a certain way. People are all individuals and there's good and bad ones in any group. People screwing with their phones are far and away more dangerous than any others currently.
Luckily, the people who approve road design here require bike lanes in town and graded shoulders in the rural areas where the bike idiots (those who share the same space with motor vehicles) can bail off the pavement when the soccer mom idiots with a texting habit and an 8 thousand pound suburban decides to kill everything in her path. The state I moved from last was the absolute pits about that - no room to even walk on the shoulder of most roads, let alone fit a bike doing 30 with a badly spooked pilot.
I'm glad you don't ride with traffic - I'm sad the walking idiots are trying to injure you. You need a really loud horn. Give 'em a little beep, if no response, lay down on it and spook the piss out of them. Just be ready to calmly explain why you had to do so if you speak to them. If calmly doesn't work - be prepared to defend yourself.
I started bike touring (multi-day) in 1976. I've always loved bikes and biking. But I've got to say, as a group, bikers are the the most privileged, entitled, self absorbed snobs of any sporting group I've witnessed. They seem want everything their own way. Want to break traffic laws when it suits them, but want the same respect as auto traffic when it suits them. And of course, riding abreast on dangerous roads, riding like maniacs on public trails, etc., etc., ad nauseum. Of course all that is a big generalization, and there are many exceptions, but I think it's true of more than 50%...
I'm glad you don't ride with traffic - I'm sad the walking idiots are trying to injure you. You need a really loud horn. Give 'em a little beep, if no response, lay down on it and spook the piss out of them. Just be ready to calmly explain why you had to do so if you speak to them. If calmly doesn't work - be prepared to defend yourself.
Question then. 3-5 riders already in an intersection I'll stay stopped let'em roll its 5 folks no problem.10-50? I'll just ease out foot off brake no gas just a "hey the lights changed might want to stop before you become a stastic." No aggression on my part just nice easy roll. 89.5% will stop them others wont....until those 302 cubic inches and 4495 lbs gently but firmly explain that no matter how loud you cuss me and say bad things about my mother them laws of physics are unbreakable. So take your spandex your foul mouth and just run me over good. Hasn't happened probably never will.
I don't have patience for gangs of cyclists hogging the road either but that was not the subject of my post, pedestrians were. If you come across something like the gang of cyclists hogging the road in muffin's video and complain about them (rightly so) then don't do the same thing as a pedestrian sharing a trail with cyclists, it's pretty simple.
Anyway, I tend to have the opposite problem with drivers around here. There are lots of riders on the road and all the streets are residential with good bike lanes so drivers tend to be courteous to a fault. There are two four-way intersections with stop signs on the way to the park and if there's traffic I'll always stop even though the law here says I don't have to. The problem is, every car at the intersection wants to stop, wave me through, and give me the right of way even if it's not mine so I feel obligated to roll on through and not keep them waiting.
By my count there are at least 4 lane-splitters in that pic..............
By your count, how many bicycles are creating traffic problems in that jam? Of the thousands of daily traffic jams in this country, how many do you think are caused by cyclists?
I know that perspective is irritating to your cause, but it is important.
I've put on 20,000+ miles on a mountain bikes over at least the last 10 years. Mostly commuting to and from work partly on roads, partly on bike paths and partly on trails. Trail riding whenever I can. I have the most encounters with people in cars hurrying to get into a coffee shop on my route. They are so focused on getting in that huge line to buy a $5 coffee that nothing else matters. Here's my latest ride. Picked it up 2 weeks ago and have 200+ miles on it already. Have paid less for motorcycles and even a few cars/trucks.
I just got a new bike a month ago and it's been great to get back into bike riding. I'm not what you'd call a cyclist, don't own any spandex, and don't like to ride on the road with traffic. It's just great exercise, easy on the old knees, and more fun than most other forms of exercise. I read the cycling threads on here, and the way they usually go is a bunch of posters telling the cyclists they're idiots for riding on the road with vehicles, don't understand the laws of physics, and so on and so forth. Which I kind of agree with to a point and that's why I don't like riding on the road. You never know what a driver is going to do or even if they see you. All it takes is one driver looking at their cell phone and a cyclist is toast.
So I ride in a local state park, off road on their paved trails. The trails are concrete and 8 or 9 feet wide, wide enough to comfortably pass other riders and walkers as long as everyone understands they need to leave enough room on the left to pass. Riders understand this but walkers don't. I've had people walking toward me three abreast, looking right at me and just stand there blocking the trail. Or walking the same way I'm riding, walking down the middle of the trail with earbuds so they can't hear anything behind them. Or the woman today, walking down the center of the trail with her back to me yakking on her phone, not hearing me as I ride up behind her saying "passing on your left" until I'm actually passing on her left and she pivots to the left right in front of me so I had to lock up both wheels and skid off the trail.
What is it with these lame brains? The traffic on the trails is about 75% cyclists and 25 % walkers, you'd think after about the 30th cyclist passed them a light would go on and they'd say to themselves, "there's a lot of bikers out here, I need to pay attention so I don't get run over." You know, the laws of physics and all that.
And the thing is, every single one of these idiots drove an automobile to the park.
Those are the exact same mindless idiots that drive in the passing lane, and refuse to get out of the way.
Now imagine if you will the frustration level of a guy and a semi moving heavy wide excavation equipment get behind something like that. Or possibly worse on like a farm tractor pulling a wide implement in the stupid bastards are too damn dumb to get out of the way. If they can outrun you great get on down the f****** road if not get the hell out of the way.
Before I read your last line, I had already crafted it as a response in my mind.
We have some very good bike/pedestrian infrastructure in our area and I use it for about 90% of my miles. Most of the miles I rack up not using it are used to get to it. In some places like City Park and Audubon Park the pedestrians are miraculously disengaged. Even on a well marked path like this one, pedestrians will amble about wherever they want. The ones that walk in the bike only lane ALWAYS do it in the direction of bike traffic so that they have no idea you are coming up behind them. NOBODY knows what the center markings mean, and to think those people drive cars. I don't get in any kind of hurry on this path. It's shaded, so it makes for a nice diversion, as do the yoga pants.
Signs, signs, everywhere a sign"
Even painted on the path now.
Sheesh.
y'all bicyclists need a bell, like we used to use on the concrete "boardwalk" at the beaches in SoCal. 6 pack of beer in the water bottle holders and backpack and such.
Before I read your last line, I had already crafted it as a response in my mind.
We have some very good bike/pedestrian infrastructure in our area and I use it for about 90% of my miles. Most of the miles I rack up not using it are used to get to it. In some places like City Park and Audubon Park the pedestrians are miraculously disengaged. Even on a well marked path like this one, pedestrians will amble about wherever they want. The ones that walk in the bike only lane ALWAYS do it in the direction of bike traffic so that they have no idea you are coming up behind them. NOBODY knows what the center markings mean, and to think those people drive cars. I don't get in any kind of hurry on this path. It's shaded, so it makes for a nice diversion, as do the yoga pants.
Signs, signs, everywhere a sign"
Even painted on the path now.
Sheesh.
y'all bicyclists need a bell, like we used to use on the concrete "boardwalk" at the beaches in SoCal. 6 pack of beer in the water bottle holders and backpack and such.
Before I read your last line, I had already crafted it as a response in my mind.
We have some very good bike/pedestrian infrastructure in our area and I use it for about 90% of my miles. Most of the miles I rack up not using it are used to get to it. In some places like City Park and Audubon Park the pedestrians are miraculously disengaged. Even on a well marked path like this one, pedestrians will amble about wherever they want. The ones that walk in the bike only lane ALWAYS do it in the direction of bike traffic so that they have no idea you are coming up behind them. NOBODY knows what the center markings mean, and to think those people drive cars. I don't get in any kind of hurry on this path. It's shaded, so it makes for a nice diversion, as do the yoga pants.
Signs, signs, everywhere a sign"
Even painted on the path now.
Sheesh.
y'all bicyclists need a bell, like we used to use on the concrete "boardwalk" at the beaches in SoCal. 6 pack of beer in the water bottle holders and backpack and such.
RING RING RING comin' through.
I just go around without a fuss most of the time.
No sneaking up on the ones with earbuds, or old deaf ladies, then yelling HEY!! ???
Or the woman today, walking down the center of the trail with her back to me yakking on her phone, not hearing me as I ride up behind her saying "passing on your left" until I'm actually passing on her left and she pivots to the left right in front of me so I had to lock up both wheels and skid off the trail.
I passed the same woman on the trail yesterday. She gave me the stink eye but I noticed she was walking over on the right side and giving riders plenty of room to pass. Good on her.
I noticed a couple questions come up about riders and I'd like to shed some light on those for those who don't ride. The first one was "why don't cyclists ride as far to the right as possible?" The answer is twofold, potholes and debris on the shoulder. Potholes in the driving lane get fixed pretty quick, on the shoulder not so much. Then there's the debris on the road--gravel, nuts, bolts, nails, broken hose clamps, you name it. Debris in the driving lane gets kicked off to the shoulder. If you ride on the white line there's no debris because vehicles keep it clear. But get a few feet off to the right and you've got all kinds of schit that will puncture a bike tire. I've had two flats in the last two weeks.
The second question or comment rather was about bikers on trails riding fast and "pretending they're Lance Armstrong." Personally my top speed is around 23 mph so there are no time trials in my future. But I guess the question is, "why do you have to ride fast?" My answer is, if I give pedestrians the right of way and avoid hitting them (I do) why do you care how fast I ride? Also, the reason I ride is to get a workout. You can't get a workout on a bike unless you push yourself and if you push yourself you'll be moving at a good clip. The thing is, if others using the trail exercise just a modicum of courtesy, riding fast is never a problem. Last, there's these things called "hills." If you're riding downhill two things will happen in short order: 1) You'll get to the bottom of the hill; and 2) you'll start back uphill. I tell ya, it didn't take me long to figure out the faster you're going when you start up a hill the easier it is to get to the top. So yes, when I'm going downhill I take full advantage of the physics.
Last, I'll make a comment about a group of trail users that needs to clean up its act---dog walkers. You're in the middle of a thousand acre park with wide open spaces all around and you not only let your dog schit on a paved trail, but you leave it lay there?
And every single one of 'em drove a vehicle to the park.
Or the woman today, walking down the center of the trail with her back to me yakking on her phone, not hearing me as I ride up behind her saying "passing on your left" until I'm actually passing on her left and she pivots to the left right in front of me so I had to lock up both wheels and skid off the trail.
I passed the same woman on the trail yesterday. She gave me the stink eye but I noticed she was walking over on the right side and giving riders plenty of room to pass. Good on her.
I noticed a couple questions come up about riders and I'd like to shed some light on those for those who don't ride. The first one was "why don't cyclists ride as far to the right as possible?" The answer is twofold, potholes and debris on the shoulder. Potholes in the driving lane get fixed pretty quick, on the shoulder not so much. Then there's the debris on the road--gravel, nuts, bolts, nails, broken hose clamps, you name it. Debris in the driving lane gets kicked off to the shoulder. If you ride on the white line there's no debris because vehicles keep it clear. But get a few feet off to the right and you've got all kinds of schit that will puncture a bike tire. I've had two flats in the last two weeks.
The second question or comment rather was about bikers on trails riding fast and "pretending they're Lance Armstrong." Personally my top speed is around 23 mph so there are no time trials in my future. But I guess the question is, "why do you have to ride fast?" My answer is, if I give pedestrians the right of way and avoid hitting them (I do) why do you care how fast I ride? Also, the reason I ride is to get a workout. You can't get a workout on a bike unless you push yourself and if you push yourself you'll be moving at a good clip. If I wanted to lollygag along at 5 mph I'd get an ebike and be done with it. The thing is, if others using the trail exercise a modicum of courtesy, riding fast is never a problem. Last, there's these things called "hills." If you're riding downhill two things will happen in short order: 1) You'll get to the bottom of the hill; and 2) you'll start back uphill. I tell ya, it didn't take me long to figure out the faster you're going when you start up a hill the easier it is to get to the top. So yes, when I'm going downhill I take full advantage of the physics.
Last, I'll make a comment about a group of trail users that needs to clean up its act---dog walkers. You're in the middle of a thousand acre park with wide open spaces all around and you not only let your dog schit on a paved trail, but you leave it lay there?
And every single one of 'em drove a vehicle to the park.
So I guess the point of all this is: vehicle drivers, your schit does in fact stink.
More on why riders don't hug the right on the road. VISIBILITY. That's the primary reason. The overwhelming majority of the time a car crashes into a cyclist in an at-fault accident the driver says "I didn't see them." Studies have been done, and my own experience bears this out. You draw much more attention and are much more likely to be seen out in the travel lane. You are also much more like to be processed and treated as traffic when you behave as traffic.
By hugging the right, you invite a squeeze pass. I honestly don't mind letting someone squeeze by when I know that they have seen me and they have backed off the throttle a bit.
My tactic is to put myself out in the lane. If someone approaches from the rear, and I am confident they see me, and it is safe for them to pass, I move over.
I have said this often on these pages. Unfortunately the protective measures cyclists use to enhance their visibility (riding in the lane and riding with others) are often points of consternation with motorists.
For reasonable motorists, all of this makes sense. For those that feel like they are so important that they should never have to let off the gas or move over, no amount of reasoning will sway them. To me, it's a dance of give and take, and when motorists and bicyclists are cooperative in that dance it works beautifully.
I'll offer something for your consideration about passing speed. When I pass pedestrians or other cyclists from behind I slow to pass with minimal disparity. I cannot tell you how many times I have had pedestrians loop a 180 without looking or cyclists drift over unwittingly. On crowded paths, this can be a PITA, but it's the right thing to do.
Dog walkers with 20 foot leashes warrant tremendous caution. I pass with minimal speed disparity.
Yep, I always slow down when I'm passing someone, especially old folks and little kids. If I hadn't done that with the woman who pivoted right in front of me I'd have mowed her down or run off the trail and crashed.
And also make noise so they hear me. The bell is kind of gay (no disrespect Paul) but it works.
Yep, I always slow down when I'm passing someone, especially old folks and little kids. If I hadn't done that with the woman who pivoted right in front of me I'd have mowed her down or run off the trail and crashed.
And also make noise so they hear me. The bell is kind of gay (no disrespect Paul) but it works.
I always speak. "I am easing around your left." Then I always bid them a good day or exchange some other cordiality. I often say something nice to the doggies. Kids on bikes get complemented on their cool bikes.
Yep, I always slow down when I'm passing someone, especially old folks and little kids. If I hadn't done that with the woman who pivoted right in front of me I'd have mowed her down or run off the trail and crashed.
And also make noise so they hear me. The bell is kind of gay (no disrespect Paul) but it works.
I always speak. "I am easing around your left." Then I always bid them a good day or exchange some other cordiality. I often say something nice to the doggies. Kids on bikes get complemented on their cool bikes.
Good advice. If they don't move to the side to let you pass, do you apply the cycling version of rolling coal?
Yep, I always slow down when I'm passing someone, especially old folks and little kids. If I hadn't done that with the woman who pivoted right in front of me I'd have mowed her down or run off the trail and crashed.
And also make noise so they hear me. The bell is kind of gay (no disrespect Paul) but it works.
I always speak. "I am easing around your left." Then I always bid them a good day or exchange some other cordiality. I often say something nice to the doggies. Kids on bikes get complemented on their cool bikes.
Good advice. If they don't move to the side to let you pass, do you apply the cycling version of rolling coal?
You know, crop dusting?
It is with great trepidation that I fart in bicycling shorts. They change pressure points, and I am afraid it will affect the check-valve that keeps farts dry. Last thing I want to do is rear back good and schidt myself to get back at someone.
This is one of the most useful write-ups I have encountered on bicycle safety. It identifies 10 scenarios in which riders are hit by cars. A risk mitigation measure in 6 of the cases is riding further left/further from the curb.
Biggest problem with going around walkers on a path is that many of them have headphones in and are oblivious to the world around them. Could blast an air horn behind some of those idiots and not get their attention.
Biggest problem with going around walkers on a path is that many of them have headphones in and are oblivious to the world around them. Could blast an air horn behind some of those idiots and not get their attention.
Or worse yet, two women "power walking" side-by-side and yakking about whatever. It's like the rest of the universe doesn't exist.
Biggest problem with going around walkers on a path is that many of them have headphones in and are oblivious to the world around them. Could blast an air horn behind some of those idiots and not get their attention.
Or worse yet, two women "power walking" side-by-side and yakking about whatever. It's like the rest of the universe doesn't exist.
Some years ago there were 3 Holsteins walking side by side on the path chewing their cuds and occupying every bit of it. I could see them for a good while before I came up close to them. You'd think that their necks didn't work. I thought "screw it, I'll just go around in the grass." I went about 3 feet off of the asphalt. The right most one, for whatever reason took several side steps to the right off of the path, did some kind of pirouette thing and swung her fat addled arm wide when she did. She hit my handlebar with her hand. She let out a guttural bellow that sounded like a ship's foghorn on the adjacent river. I thought for a second about stopping, but decided there was no value in it.
Did 40 miles this morning. I don't think I have gone that far since last fall.
Paul, you need to get single speed. They are a fun change every once and a while. Doing hills on them will put you in the hurt locker though. They do make what is an easy ride on a geared bike harder.
Mine is just an old Frankenbike I built up from the parts I had handy, but I put quite a few yearly miles on it.
Did 40 miles this morning. I don't think I have gone that far since last fall.
Paul, you need to get single speed. They are a fun change every once and a while. Doing hills on them will put you in the hurt locker though. They do make what is an easy ride on a geared bike harder.
Mine is just an old Frankenbike I built up from the parts I had handy, but I put quite a few yearly miles on it.
My shredded knees won’t let me grind. I am a spinner
Yeah, I'm probably more of a masher, The SS is 48x16 and I don't really have any issues with hills on it, other than the fact that I'm well over 200 pounds. My normal cadence is probably 75 RPM or so. I've been working on getting it higher with Rouvy, but it hasn't taken yet.
Here's a link to some of what I normally ride. I stay away from the NW portion of the loop since I don't ride in town. There is a big parking area at the NE corner of the loop and lots of routes from there.
I had a Team Sergeant the was a big fan of the weights who'd say "Those who can run, will!". He sucked at running, but was stronger than hell.
For me cycling replaced running which was something I always enjoyed. I wasn't very good at it, but I enjoyed it regardless (11:30ish was my best ever 2 mile).
I don't ride motorized two-wheelers for recreation. I ride them for recreation.
Thanks for clearing that up. LOL.
Originally Posted by deflave
The purpose of a bicycle is to make the transport of a singular human being easier and more efficient than a self-propelled human being.
To try and morph that into exercise is about the dumbest GD thing a human being could do.
How many fat cyclists do you see riding around? And I don't mean fat tourists on rentals or people on ebikes, I mean people who ride regularly. Like I said, you can make a ride as easy or as strenuous as you want. Not surprising that a scooter rider wouldn't know that.
PS, I'm glad you agree that cyclists are singular human beings. But there is more than one purpose for a bicycle. Some people have been known to race them in competition and make millions of dollars doing it.
How many fat cyclists do you see riding around? And I don't mean fat tourists on rentals or people on ebikes, I mean people who ride regularly. Like I said, you can make a ride as easy or as strenuous as you want. Not surprising that a scooter rider wouldn't know that.
PS, I'm glad you agree that cyclists are singular human beings. But there is more than one purpose for a bicycle. Some people have been known to race them in competition and make millions of dollars doing it.
I see fat bicyclists all day, every day. They are a constant.
Racing stupid is still stupid.
If you want to exercise do core lifts and run. Otherwise you're just aspiring to stay eight years old your entire life.
How many fat cyclists do you see riding around? And I don't mean fat tourists on rentals or people on ebikes, I mean people who ride regularly. Like I said, you can make a ride as easy or as strenuous as you want. Not surprising that a scooter rider wouldn't know that.
PS, I'm glad you agree that cyclists are singular human beings. But there is more than one purpose for a bicycle. Some people have been known to race them in competition and make millions of dollars doing it.
I see fat bicyclists all day, every day. They are a constant.
Racing stupid is still stupid.
If you want to exercise do core lifts and run. Otherwise you're just aspiring to stay eight years old your entire life.
LOL, the fugging exercise police. You sure do like to mind other people's business. Who said riding a bike is the only exercise I get, wasn't me, I'm in the gym all the time. And recommending running over cycling to someone you know nothing about is the height of stupidity. And you may see fat people on bikes, but they're not cyclists. They're fat people on bikes.
Obviously pedestrians have right of way, courteous or not, ironic as it may be.
Kent
Damn right they do, wherever they want, with earbuds, kids, dogs whatever.
It’s on me as a cyclist on a shared path to make allowances for them, to expect the unexpected.
Well, I'll assume that's directed to me.
No sh*t Sherlock. If I didn't make allowances for pedestrians I would've hit a few dozen by now. I just wish they'd show the same courtesy they expect bikers to show when they're driving their automobiles---stay to the right so the faster traffic can pass.
It's not rocket science. . Also, the trail I'm talking about is not in a school zone, near a Starbuck's, or an old folks home. It's a pretty well-known 40 mile trail that's heavily traveled by cyclists.
Obviously pedestrians have right of way, courteous or not, ironic as it may be.
Kent
Damn right they do, wherever they want, with earbuds, kids, dogs whatever.
It’s on me as a cyclist on a shared path to make allowances for them, to expect the unexpected.
Well, I'll assume that's directed to me. .
A reasonable assumption but I actually didn’t write it with you in mind.
My opinion is when you’re out walking, you’re out walking and shouldn’t have to be constantly watching your back.
So what if the cyclist has to slow way down, big fuggin’ deal, pedestrians have right of way, it is my responsibility as a cyclist to accommodate most any dumbfuggery on their part.
I ride a lot, have put in 40 mile days on our local hike/bike paths. I find d$ckhead cyclists thinking they’re Lance Armstrong way more irritating than Karens on the path with kids and dogs.
I find self-righteous Karen bike riders to be the most annoying of all.
🙂
It doesn’t matter what righteous I am, I go out of my way to accommodate pedestrians. Not sure how that translated to Karen or self-righteous status.
Sorta similar, I put most of my miles in on the road, and in the last eight years have crossed much of this Continent twice, plus a 1,500 mile loop in Europe.
On the road I ride with the attitude that if I get hit it’s ALWAYS gonna be my fault, for riding a bicycle on the road, and try to ride accordingly.
Not sure how that translated to Karen or self-righteous status.
Yes, that's obvious. Let me help you out:
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
I’m out for exercise, speeding back up after clearing them is just part of that, and I’ll slow way down for the next bunch too.
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
I ride a lot, have put in 40 mile days on our local hike/bike paths. I find d$ckhead cyclists thinking they’re Lance Armstrong way more irritating than Karens on the path with kids and dogs.
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
I put most of my miles in on the road, and in the last eight years have crossed much of this Continent twice, plus a 1,500 mile loop in Europe.
On the road I ride with the attitude that if I get hit it’s ALWAYS gonna be my fault, for riding a bicycle on the road, and try to ride accordingly.
This thread ain't about you, how much you ride, or whether you think it's your fault if a drunk driver on a cell phone hits you while you're on your bike. When someone talks about what they do/how they do it and holds it up as the shining example of how it should be done, that's self-righteousness defined. It's a pity you can't see that.
On the road I ride with the attitude that if I get hit it’s ALWAYS gonna be my fault, for riding a bicycle on the road, and try to ride accordingly.
I'd like to explore how absolute that is. Texting driver crosses the centerline slams into you head-on, that's your fault? You are riding in a protected bike lane. The kind where there is a row of cars between the road and the bike lane. A drunk driver slams into a parked car, knocking it into you, is that your fault?
Not sure how that translated to Karen or self-righteous status.
Yes, that's obvious. Let me help you out:
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
I’m out for exercise, speeding back up after clearing them is just part of that, and I’ll slow way down for the next bunch too.
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
I ride a lot, have put in 40 mile days on our local hike/bike paths. I find d$ckhead cyclists thinking they’re Lance Armstrong way more irritating than Karens on the path with kids and dogs.
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
I put most of my miles in on the road, and in the last eight years have crossed much of this Continent twice, plus a 1,500 mile loop in Europe.
On the road I ride with the attitude that if I get hit it’s ALWAYS gonna be my fault, for riding a bicycle on the road, and try to ride accordingly.
This thread ain't about you, how much you ride, or whether you think it's your fault if a drunk driver on a cell phone hits you while you're on your bike. When someone talks about what they do/how they do it and holds it up as the shining example of how it should be done, that's self-righteousness defined. It's a pity you can't see that.
Not sure how long your kids been out of school but that's the MO of his profession these days.
On the road I ride with the attitude that if I get hit it’s ALWAYS gonna be my fault, for riding a bicycle on the road, and try to ride accordingly.
I'd like to explore how absolute that is. Texting driver crosses the centerline slams into you head-on, that's your fault?
You want to see how absolute that is, ask him if he'll be filing a claim for his medical bills with his own insurance company. Since it was his fault and eveything.
I just got back from my morning ride. I passed a bunch of people walking on the trail. Came up behind 'em, slowed down and let 'em know I was coming, and passed 'em on the left with no hit pedestrians, injuries, or conflagrations.
Every single one of 'em was either already walking over to the right or moved over when they heard me coming.
Toward the end of yesterday's ride, I stood an hammered to cross a road. When I did, I heard a loud metallic noise. A quick look didn't reveal anything wrong. Today, about 12 miles into my ride I discerned a bit of thump. A glance at the back wheel showed pronounced wobble. I found the source of yesterday's metallic noise. When you are cranking out serious quadpower, things can break.
On the road I ride with the attitude that if I get hit it’s ALWAYS gonna be my fault, for riding a bicycle on the road, and try to ride accordingly.
I'd like to explore how absolute that is. Texting driver crosses the centerline slams into you head-on, that's your fault?
You want to see how absolute that is, ask him if he'll be filing a claim for his medical bills with his own insurance company. Since it was his fault and eveything.
I just got back from my morning ride. I passed a bunch of people walking on the trail. Came up behind 'em, slowed down and let 'em know I was coming, and passed 'em on the left with no hit pedestrians, injuries, or conflagrations.
Every single one of 'em was either already walking over to the right or moved over when they heard me coming.
It ain't rocket science.
It's almost as if some people think it costs money to pay attention.
LOL, I've seen those and the dick grabbing ain't subtle!!
But oh man, what is that helmet you're wearing in your avatar, I gotta get me one of those!!
PS, I don't think Paul is really gay, he just says that stuff because he craves all the positive reinforcement that comes with being a gay cyclist on here.
LOL, I've seen those and the dick grabbing ain't subtle!!
But oh man, what is that helmet you're wearing in your avatar, I gotta get me one of those!!
PS, I don't think Paul is really gay, he just says that stuff because he craves all the positive reinforcement that comes with being a gay cyclist on here.
Toward the end of yesterday's ride, I stood an hammered to cross a road. When I did, I heard a loud metallic noise. A quick look didn't reveal anything wrong. Today, about 12 miles into my ride I discerned a bit of thump. A glance at the back wheel showed pronounced wobble. I found the source of yesterday's metallic noise. When you are cranking out serious quadpower, things can break.
That story is almost as exciting as a new bicycle.
I've had people walking toward me three abreast, looking right at me and just stand there blocking the trail. Or walking the same way I'm riding, walking down the middle of the trail with earbuds so they can't hear anything behind them. Or the woman today, walking down the center of the trail with her back to me yakking on her phone, not hearing me as I ride up behind her saying "passing on your left" until I'm actually passing on her left and she pivots to the left right in front of me so I had to lock up both wheels and skid off the trail.
What is it with these lame brains? The traffic on the trails is about 75% cyclists and 25 % walkers, you'd think after about the 30th cyclist passed them a light would go on and they'd say to themselves, "there's a lot of bikers out here, I need to pay attention so I don't get run over." You know, the laws of physics and all that.
And the thing is, every single one of these idiots drove an automobile to the park.
I gotta presume that if I had written that you’d call me a “Karen”.
I wrote....
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
Damn right they do, wherever they want, with earbuds, kids, dogs whatever.
It’s on me as a cyclist on a shared path to make allowances for them, to expect the unexpected.
WTF, I’m out for exercise, speeding back up after clearing them is just part of that, and I’ll slow way down for the next bunch too.
Yepper, I don’t agree that people merely out enjoying a walk are supposed to worry about cyclists. Should be the other way around and, by law, it is.
Anyhoo.... you got offended and went to personal insults and then puzzlingly wrote as a counter argument pretty much exactly what I would do
Originally Posted by smokepole
I just got back from my morning ride. I passed a bunch of people walking on the trail. Came up behind 'em, slowed down and let 'em know I was coming, and passed 'em on the left with no hit pedestrians, injuries, or conflagrations.
Every single one of 'em was either already walking over to the right or moved over when they heard me coming.
It ain't rocket science.
If I wrote this I gotta assume you would call me “self righteous” etc....
I'd like to explore how absolute that is. Texting driver crosses the centerline slams into you head-on, that's your fault? You are riding in a protected bike lane. The kind where there is a row of cars between the road and the bike lane. A drunk driver slams into a parked car, knocking it into you, is that your fault?
Among motorcyclists there’s a truism.. “It ain’t IF you’re going down, but when.”
Indeed, I got lucky and somehow walked away from my big motorcycle wreck, no helmet and all. A good friend nearly lost a leg in his, suffers chronic pain and now has to keep a cane handy.
I think cycling on the road is far more dangerous than on a motorcycle, you will post stats showing that it isn’t, but having put in many miles on both I know how many close calls there’s been.
On a road bike it ain’t if you’re getting hit but when. Getting killed out there is a real possibility but at this point in my life, that ain’t the worst possibility.
Texting driver scenario? Yep if I hadn’t been out there on a bicycle I wouldn’t have gotten hit. Drunk driver etc etc... no me, no bicycle, I wouldn’t have gotten hit (the ‘Fire would say the exact same thing )
Some years back my own family suffered a tragedy in a large part because of someone’s error in judgement. Coulda sued, was encouraged to, didn’t. It wasn’t intentional and suing would not have brung that person back. Suing ain’t what we do.
I'd like to explore how absolute that is. Texting driver crosses the centerline slams into you head-on, that's your fault? You are riding in a protected bike lane. The kind where there is a row of cars between the road and the bike lane. A drunk driver slams into a parked car, knocking it into you, is that your fault?
Among motorcyclists there’s a truism.. “It ain’t IF you’re going down, but when.”
Indeed, I got lucky and somehow walked away from my big motorcycle wreck, no helmet and all. A good friend nearly lost a leg in his, suffers chronic pain and now has to keep a cane handy.
I think cycling on the road is far more dangerous than on a motorcycle, you will post stats showing that it isn’t, but having put in many miles on both I know how many close calls there’s been.
On a road bike it ain’t if you’re getting hit but when. Getting killed out there is a real possibility but at this point in my life, that ain’t the worst possibility.
Texting driver scenario? Yep if I hadn’t been out there on a bicycle I wouldn’t have gotten hit. Drunk driver etc etc, same thing.
Some years back my own family suffered a tragedy in a large part because of someone’s error in judgement. Coulda sued, was encouraged to, didn’t. It wasn’t intentional and suing would not have brung that person back. Suing ain’t what we do.
Would I sue? Actually prob'ly not.
YMMV
Do you subscribe to the same "always my fault" irrespective of the mode of transportation?
Yepper, I don’t agree that people merely out enjoying a walk are supposed to worry about cyclists. Should be the other way around and, by law, it is. .
People merely out enjoying a walk on a trail where they're outnumbered by cyclists 2:1 don't have to worry about cyclists as long as they keep their head out of their ass and themselves over to the right so the bikes can pass.
It's called "common sense."
It's funny that you think it's always your fault if an automobile hits you while you're on the road ("by law it's not") but a pedestrian on a trail used primarily by cyclists can do anything they want including jump in front of a bike and if they get hit it's the cyclist's fault.
People merely out enjoying a walk on a trail where they're outnumbered by cyclists 2:1 don't have to worry about cyclists as long as they keep their head out of their ass and themselves over to the right so the bikes can pass.
It's called "common sense."
It also implies that bicycles have the right of way and not pedestrians. Pedestrians having to limit their travel for the convenience of the cyclists.
Quote
It's funny that you think it's always your fault if an automobile hits you while you're on the road ("by law it's not") but a pedestrian on a trail used primarily by cyclists can do anything they want including jump in front of a bike and if they get hit it's the cyclist's fault.
If the cyclists were not traveling at speeds that were likely to result in injury to one or both parties while passing said pedestrians this would not be an issue.
In reality the speed that the majority of cyclists fly by pedestrians on hike/bike paths is one of the reasons cyclists are disliked by so many.
not the best video quality, but thinking about doing so still gives me a rush!
This is for anyone that has drafted 6' off the bumper of a big rig.....for any lenght of time!
Start at the 1:50 mark.
ya!
GWB
I moved from NJ to S Fla in the early 70’s. Around 1975 or ‘76 a couple buddies decided to visit me and their mode of transportation was doubling up on a Honda SL350 I couldn’t imagine 2 guys riding 1200 miles on that small of a bike or doubling up at all for that matter but it wasn’t uncommon back then. I guess any mode of transport works when you’re 16 or 17. They said it wasn’t too bad because they were able to draft a semi for most of the trip. I couldn’t imagine riding the bumper of any car let alone a semi, especially not being able to see more than 5 foot ahead. Their visited and never went back to NJ.
People merely out enjoying a walk on a trail where they're outnumbered by cyclists 2:1 don't have to worry about cyclists as long as they keep their head out of their ass and themselves over to the right so the bikes can pass.
It's called "common sense."
It also implies that bicycles have the right of way and not pedestrians. Pedestrians having to limit their travel for the convenience of the cyclists.
LOL, bullshìt. It implies pedestrians are willing to share the trail with cyclists and show a little common courtesy
WTF does being the same have to do with fault in a collision?
It's okay if your logic is "just because." I simply wanted to know how you arrived at your belief.
Laws pertaining to risk are all relative, and can vary with locales. Just the other day did 80 across West Texas. If I got in a collision at 90 I could be held at fault because I was travelling in a manner legally deemed to be unsafe.
Likewise I am legally obliged to buckle my seatbelt, and in some places wear a helmet depending on mode of transportation because of relative risk.
Motor vehicles cannot legally be sold without expensive design features intended to protect the occupants in the event of a collision.
Likewise, slow moving vehicles such as Amish buggies and farm machinery are in many locales deemed a risk to other travelers in motor vehicles and are required to have large reflective triangles and warning lights to protect both the occupants and the occupants of other vehicles.
When I presume to ride a bicycle on a public roadway I accept the fact that I am assuming an egregious level of risk to myself and would not be inclined to hold others responsible for injuries I suffered as a result.
I also recognize the fact that merely by being out there I present a distracting road hazard to motorists and put them at risk of a collision they do not want.
You believe motorists should be held liable for not seeing something as often hard to see as a cyclist traveling at an enormous disparity in speed. I do not.
WTF does being the same have to do with fault in a collision?
It's okay if your logic is "just because." I simply wanted to know how you arrived at your belief.
Laws pertaining to risk are all relative, and can vary with locales. Just the other day did 80 across West Texas. If I got in a collision at 90 I could be held at fault because I was travelling in a manner legally deemed to be unsafe.
Likewise I am legally obliged to buckle my seatbelt, and in some places wear a helmet depending on mode of transportation because of relative risk.
Motor vehicles cannot legally be sold without expensive design features intended to protect the occupants in the event of a collision.
Likewise, slow moving vehicles such as Amish buggies and farm machinery are in many locales deemed a risk to other travelers in motor vehicles and are required to have large reflective triangles and warning lights to protect both the occupants and the occupants of other vehicles.
When I presume to ride a bicycle on a public roadway I accept the fact that I am assuming an egregious level of risk to myself and would not be inclined to hold others responsible for injuries I suffered as a result.
I also recognize the fact that merely by being out there I present a distracting road hazard to motorists and put them at risk of a collision they do not want.
You believe motorists should be held liable for not seeing something as often hard to see as a cyclist traveling at an enormous disparity in speed. I do not.
When I’m out there, it’s all on me.
Seems logical to me.
What design features on a Scooter protect the passengers in a collision?
When driving, I have never been "distracted" by a bicyclist. I negotiate them like I do any other law abiding motorist or pedestrian.
Bicyclists are not hard for me to see, assuming daylight conditions. If they are hard for anyone to see, it's time to get corrective lenses or get the hell off the road.
Using your logic, pedestrians are hard to see, so they go in the same group of "at fault" when some dipschidt hits them.
People merely out enjoying a walk on a trail where they're outnumbered by cyclists 2:1 don't have to worry about cyclists as long as they keep their head out of their ass and themselves over to the right so the bikes can pass.
It's called "common sense."
It also implies that bicycles have the right of way and not pedestrians. Pedestrians having to limit their travel for the convenience of the cyclists.
LOL, bullshìt. It implies pedestrians are willing to share the trail with cyclists and show a little common courtesy
Common sense, get some..
Pedestrians are hard to see and are distracting to bicyclists. When they get hit, it's their fault.
What design features on a Scooter protect the passengers in a collision?
Brakes, lights and tires subject to annual inspection do make collisions less likely. Also the disparity in speed between them and motor vehicles is less.
If they cannot maintain certain highway speeds they are banned on some highways specifically due to the disparity in speed, yet many of these same roads are legal for bicycles, go figure.
Quote
When driving, I have never been "distracted" by a bicyclist. I negotiate them like I do any other law abiding motorist or pedestrian.
Bicyclists are not hard for me to see, assuming daylight conditions. If they are hard for anyone to see, it's time to get corrective lenses or get the hell off the road.
This is exactly the sort of presumptive statement that gets ‘Fire members PO’d at you and further besmirches the image of all cyclists
Quote
Using your logic, pedestrians are hard to see, so they go in the same group of "at fault" when some dipschidt hits them.
If a pedestrian were walking where a road cyclist rides it would be called “jaywalking” and the motorist would probably not be held liable as long as they did not leave the scene.
The trauma suffered by the motorist and the vehicle could be significant however.
What design features on a Scooter protect the passengers in a collision?
Brakes, lights and tires subject to annual inspection do make collisions less likely. Also the disparity in speed between them and motor vehicles is less.
If they cannot maintain certain highway speeds they are banned on some highways specifically due to the disparity in speed, yet many of these same roads are legal for bicycles, go figure.
Quote
When driving, I have never been "distracted" by a bicyclist. I negotiate them like I do any other law abiding motorist or pedestrian.
Bicyclists are not hard for me to see, assuming daylight conditions. If they are hard for anyone to see, it's time to get corrective lenses or get the hell off the road.
This is exactly the sort of presumptive statement that gets ‘Fire members PO’d at you and further besmirches the image of all cyclists
Quote
Using your logic, pedestrians are hard to see, so they go in the same group of "at fault" when some dipschidt hits them.
If a pedestrian were walking where a road cyclist rides it would be called “jaywalking” and the motorist would probably not be held liable as long as they did not leave the scene.
The trauma suffered by the motorist and the vehicle could be significant however.
My bicycle has brakes, lights, and tires. You are right though. I am without the benefit of the protection that an annual inspection provides. LOL.
I DGAF if a 'fire member is POd at me for holding motorists accountable for a standard of attention. Let's play with the "hard to see" cop out, and make no mistake about it, it's a cover for not paying attention. In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver? Hint. inattention.
It's good to finally get you to acknowledge that a pedestrian's "right of way" is not absolute.
IDGAF if a 'fire member is POd at me for holding motorists accountable for a standard of attention. Let's play with the "hard to see" cop out, and make no mistake about it, it's a cover for not paying attention. In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver? Hint. inattention.
It doesn’t matter what you GAF about or not, humans are innately fallible, which is why pilots have checklists, and why even larger and easier-to-see slow-moving vehicles are required to have conspicuous lights and large red, reflective triangles. This is because such vehicles pose a significant collision risk to other vehicles moving at usual highway soeeds.
Quote
It's good to finally get you to acknowledge that a pedestrian's "right of way" is not absolute.
Are you seriously suggesting that a hike/bike trail is the same, either actually or in the eyes of the law, as a public roadway?
Hike/bike trails were created to give both cyclists and pedestrians a space AWAY from the hazards of public roadways
On a hike/bike trail it is the cyclists impinging silently upon the pedestrians, often from behind, the cyclist who has the simple opportunity to slow down or stop. This is why pedestrians on such paths have the right of way.
Once again I will observe that the majority of cyclists on such paths, since so many of them are d$cks, will fly by pedestrians in a totally inconsiderate manner.
Which is part of the reason so many dislike cyclists.
IDGAF if a 'fire member is POd at me for holding motorists accountable for a standard of attention. Let's play with the "hard to see" cop out, and make no mistake about it, it's a cover for not paying attention. In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver? Hint. inattention.
It doesn’t matter what you GAF about or not, humans are innately fallible, which is why pilots have checklists, and why even larger and easier-to-see slow-moving vehicles are required to have conspicuous lights and large red, reflective triangles. This is because such vehicles pose a significant collision risk to other vehicles moving at usual highway soeeds.
Quote
It's good to finally get you to acknowledge that a pedestrian's "right of way" is not absolute.
Are you seriously suggesting that a hike/bike trail is the same, either actually or in the eyes of the law, as a public roadway?
On a hike/bike trail it is the cyclists impinging silently upon the pedestrians, the cyclist who has the simple opportunity to slow down or stop. This is why pedestrians on such paths have the right of way.
Once again I will observe that the majority of cyclists on such paths, since most of them are d$cks, will fly by pedestrians in a totally inconsiderate manner.
Which is part of the reason so many dislike cyclists.
The first part of your response seemed disconnected from my central question.
In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver?
The first part of your response seemed disconnected from my central question.
In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver?
I’m always harder to see than, say, an Amish buggy or tractor. I make allowances for being on my mirrors and totally vacating the asphalt in a heartbeat if necessary.
I am asking a lot from drivers. Why have I not been hit yet?
The first part of your response seemed disconnected from my central question.
In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver?
I’m always harder to see than, say, an Amish buggy or tractor. I make allowances for being on my mirrors and totally vacating the asphalt in a heartbeat if necessary.
I am asking a lot from drivers. Why have I not been hit yet?
Luck.
This is the second response that didn't answer the question.
Hundreds of motorists safely passed you because they saw you. What could magically make you hard to see to a driver in the same conditions on the same road?
You are not asking a lot from me as a driver to not run over you when you are riding in compliance with the law. I am telling you, it is ridiculously simple.
The first part of your response seemed disconnected from my central question.
In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver?
I’m always harder to see than, say, an Amish buggy or tractor. I make allowances for being on my mirrors and totally vacating the asphalt in a heartbeat if necessary.
I am asking a lot from drivers. Why have I not been hit yet?
Luck.
This is the second response that didn't answer the question.
Hundreds of motorists safely passed you because they saw you. What could magically make you hard to see to a driver in the same conditions on the same road?
You are not asking a lot from me as a driver to not run over you when you are riding in compliance with the law. I am telling you, it is ridiculously simple.
The first part of your response seemed disconnected from my central question.
In those thousands of miles of riding you have done, you have ridden roads where dozens if not hundreds of motorists have seen you and taken proper action. Had one not seen you, what was it that magically made you "hard to see" to that driver?
I’m always harder to see than, say, an Amish buggy or tractor. I make allowances for being on my mirrors and totally vacating the asphalt in a heartbeat if necessary.
I am asking a lot from drivers. Why have I not been hit yet?
Luck.
This is the second response that didn't answer the question.
Hundreds of motorists safely passed you because they saw you. What could magically make you hard to see to a driver in the same conditions on the same road?
You are not asking a lot from me as a driver to not run over you when you are riding in compliance with the law. I am telling you, it is ridiculously simple.
You cyclists are friggin' crazy.
SP, pretty much all the cycling threads end up this way............
I spent 24 years in a job where my 'Mission' was to provide for 'the Safe, Orderly, Expeditious' flow of air traffic............ in that order....
What I, and the others like me, really did was look for stuff that was going to go bad............... Nobody got in trouble when things were going 'right'....
If you're into that sort of thing, looking for the potential for bad, then road cycling is a wet dream....
Again... pedestrians have right of way and bicyclists don't like it... ironic...
Kent
Nope. I can't speak for "cyclists" just like you can't speak for "motorists" but since I started this dumpster fire I'll speak for myself.
It's not that pedestrians have the right of way that I don't like. Pedestrians must have the right of way, there's no way around that and I don't know any bikers that begrudge them for having the right of way. Like birdwatcher said, a bike rider has to make allowances for not only walkers but slow riders, kids on tricycles, dogs on 20 foot leashes, etc. There's an elderly woman who gets out on the local trail in her motorized wheelchair and she gets the royal treatment by everyone who passes her. And she's always over to the right so people can pass.
It's what some pedestrians do with their right of way (or rather don't do) that I don't like. That being, hog the trail so that faster traffic can't pass.
The irony is, when they're in their car driving to the trailhead and come across a biker riding on the road, they expect the biker to move to the right so they can pass. Hell, some have commented right on this thread that bikers shouldn't even be on the road. But when those drivers are walking down a trail, some don't have the presence of mind to show the same courtesy and stay to the right. The golden rule and all that.
If you're into that sort of thing, looking for the potential for bad, then road cycling is a wet dream.... IMHO....
IMHO, that depends 100% on the road. I have to ride a little over 5 miles round trip to and from the trail. All on residential streets with a top speed limit of 30 mph and marked bike lanes with plenty of room for cars to pass. ANd a ron of bike riders.
That may not fit your definition or road cycling but it's about as far as I'll push my luck.
I’d support a regulation that cyclists come to a full stop before passing pedestrians.
LOL, you can't make this shìt up.
Do you wear a helmet when you go out to get the mail?
The point was this; if it was put to a vote, how would the pedestrians vote, and why?
I've got a better one. If we asked cyclists whether pedestrians should always have to carry chilled lemonade (fresh squeezed of course) and provide the lemonade to thirsty cyclists, how would the cyclists vote, and why?
Again... pedestrians have right of way and bicyclists don't like it... ironic...
Kent
It's what some pedestrians do with their right of way (or rather don't do) that I don't like. That being, hog the trail so that faster traffic can't pass.
Irony... you don't like so you complain.
And there is a difference on cars driving on roads where there are traffic laws vs recreational travel ways. And driving to the recreational travel ways is not recreating, or to work, or to the store, or movies, or on vacation.
Cars vs cyclists 'in' the roadway and cyclists vs pedestrians on recreational travel ways, It's about the disparity in speeds and the hazard this presents. Cyclists want it both ways.
I didn't bring up the subject of this thread, but do see the irony, and irony can be a source of humor.
If by "both ways" you mean cyclists expect the same courtesy from pedestrians that the pedestrians expect from cyclists when they're driving, you'd be right.
Traffic laws on roads say a biker can ride in the lane and has the right of way vs an automobile approaching from the rear. And if you don't think there are rules governing bikers and pedestrians on trails, get on your bike, mow down a pedestrian, and see what happens.
This isn't about courteousness, it's about complaining about uncourteousness...
Why complain when it's a reality of life, going to happen, deal with it.
Irony...
Kent
It's a little deeper than that. Most cyclists walk and can identify when a pedestrian is being discourteous or oblivious relative to their position on the path. Most out of shape, middle aged, angry, white men don't bicycle and often misinterpret a cyclists defensive tactics as discourtesy.
This isn't about courteousness, it's about complaining about uncourteousness...
Why complain when it's a reality of life, going to happen, deal with it.
Irony...
Kent
It's a little deeper than that. Most cyclists walk and can identify when a pedestrian is being discourteous or oblivious relative to their position on the path. Most out of shape, middle aged, angry, white men don't bicycle and often misinterpret a cyclists defensive tactics as discourtesy.
Most guys rode a bike for transportation from age 5 to 15, I think we can relate to a cyclist, especially one that uses it for primary transportation vs recreation.
This isn't about courteousness, it's about complaining about uncourteousness...
Why complain when it's a reality of life, going to happen, deal with it.
Irony...
Kent
It's a little deeper than that. Most cyclists walk and can identify when a pedestrian is being discourteous or oblivious relative to their position on the path. Most out of shape, middle aged, angry, white men don't bicycle and often misinterpret a cyclists defensive tactics as discourtesy.
Most guys rode a bike for transportation from age 5 to 15, I think we can relate to a cyclist, especially one that uses it for primary transportation vs recreation.
Kent
We lived on bikes as kids. Those experiences do not transfer well at all to what I experience on the road today. A person's purpose for legally using the road has NOTHING to do with the post you quoted.
wishes to ride with abandon on the highway and on the recreational by way, complaining about faster traffic and then slower traffic... but not wanting to hear any complaints from either about themselves.
This isn't about courteousness, it's about complaining about uncourteousness...
Sorry, I was not aware you were clairvoyant, and knew what this thread is all about. I just started the thread, what do I know?
But let me ask you a hypothetical. You're walking alone on a popular bike trail, nine feet wide. Bikes are passing you at the rate of about one every 2-3 minutes.
Do you:
1) Take notice and walk over on the right side of the trail so the bikes can pass; or
2) Walk down the middle of the trail and act surprised when a bike comes up behind you.
A pedestrians purpose for legally using a 'recreational' travel way, is of no concern of yours then, how do you know they aren't being defensive?
What do you experience on the road today that pedestrians don't experience from cyclists on a 'recreational' travel way.
It's sure they experience the same complaining.
Kent
I have relevant experiences walking. Those experiences tell me when there's no legitimate reason for a pedestrian to be where they are on a path. Take this person for example. Two clearly marked lanes with a separation zone in between the two paths to keep flailing arms and handlebars out of contact. The separation zone has markings that should be familiar to anyone who has a driver's license. Those markings mean "keep off." I won't get an honest answer out of you, but I'll give you an opportunity to be disingenuous. What possible reason would this person have for being in the separation zone?
Bear in mind that I am not complaining. It's very easy for me to deal with that. I have had groups of pedestrians strung completely across the bike lane on this MUP. I have had groups of up to 10 people standing in the middle of the bike lane chatting. Hell, I'd go around them without uttering a word, but there is about a 4 inch lip of asphalt along the edge that won't allow me to reasonably do that.
I experience a very real threat of serious bodily injury or death from motorists when I am bicycling. Statistics bear this out. The statistics bear out that there is very little threat that a pedestrian faces from bicyclists. You'll get your disingenuous on here too. I am guessing through obfuscation or red herring. It will be interesting to see what tactic you use.
This isn't about courteousness, it's about complaining about uncourteousness...
Sorry, I was not aware you were clairvoyant, and knew what this thread is all about. I just started the thread, what do I know?
But let me ask you a hypothetical. You're walking alone on a popular bike trail, nine feet wide. Bikes are passing you at the rate of about one every 2-3 minutes.
Do you:
1) Take notice and walk over on the right side of the trail so the bikes can pass; or
2) Walk down the middle of the trail and act surprised when a bike comes up behind you.
I am always courteous.
And the 'this' in my post is reply to the quote you put up about... cyclist want it both ways.
Again... pedestrians have right of way and bicyclists don't like it... ironic...
Kent
It's what some pedestrians do with their right of way (or rather don't do) that I don't like. That being, hog the trail so that faster traffic can't pass.
Irony... you don't like so you complain.
No, it's not irony. For it to be ironic, I would have to be a road cyclist that rides in the traffic lane and slows down traffic.
I'm not a road cyclist and I don't slow down traffic. Maybe you should actually read the thread?
Originally Posted by krp
And the 'this' in my post is reply to the quote you put up about... cyclist want it both ways. Kent
A pedestrians purpose for legally using a 'recreational' travel way, is of no concern of yours then, how do you know they aren't being defensive?
What do you experience on the road today that pedestrians don't experience from cyclists on a 'recreational' travel way.
It's sure they experience the same complaining.
Kent
I have relevant experiences walking. Those experiences tell me when there's no legitimate reason for a pedestrian to be where they are on a path. Take this person for example. Two clearly marked lanes with a separation zone in between the two paths to keep flailing arms and handlebars out of contact. The separation zone has markings that should be familiar to anyone who has a driver's license. Those markings mean "keep off." I won't get an honest answer out of you, but I'll give you an opportunity to be disingenuous. What possible reason would this person have for being in the separation zone?
Bear in mind that I am not complaining. It's very easy for me to deal with that. I have had groups of pedestrians strung completely across the bike lane on this MUP. I have had groups of up to 10 people standing in the middle of the bike lane chatting. Hell, I'd go around them without uttering a word, but there is about a 4 inch lip of asphalt along the edge that won't allow me to reasonably do that.
I experience a very real threat of serious bodily injury or death from motorists when I am bicycling. Statistics bear this out. The statistics bear out that there is very little threat that a pedestrian faces from bicyclists. You'll get your disingenuous on here too. I am guessing through obfuscation or red herring. It will be interesting to see what tactic you use.
Well, again you post something that doesn't relate to what I posted, and you create a what'if from a picture that I can only answer with another, what'if, so you can say it's a red herring.
Just posting the picture and what'if and insinuating she's not where she's allowed to be is complaining about where's she's at.
If that's a two way bike lane, she looks pretty defensive to me and in the safest place on the track.
I don't think even Paul rides in a manner that causes traffic trouble unless completely unavoidable. The 'road' isn't the only place bicycles and vehicles can collide. Obviously residential streets are safer because the speed differential is minimal, people are more careful with kids playing, walkers, bikers... parking lots, intersections.
Anyway, you as a cyclist complained about pedestrians, others jumped in, I find that ironic and humorous, which it is.
I'm really only on this site for the sarcasm and ironic humor.
A pedestrians purpose for legally using a 'recreational' travel way, is of no concern of yours then, how do you know they aren't being defensive?
What do you experience on the road today that pedestrians don't experience from cyclists on a 'recreational' travel way.
It's sure they experience the same complaining.
Kent
I have relevant experiences walking. Those experiences tell me when there's no legitimate reason for a pedestrian to be where they are on a path. Take this person for example. Two clearly marked lanes with a separation zone in between the two paths to keep flailing arms and handlebars out of contact. The separation zone has markings that should be familiar to anyone who has a driver's license. Those markings mean "keep off." I won't get an honest answer out of you, but I'll give you an opportunity to be disingenuous. What possible reason would this person have for being in the separation zone?
Bear in mind that I am not complaining. It's very easy for me to deal with that. I have had groups of pedestrians strung completely across the bike lane on this MUP. I have had groups of up to 10 people standing in the middle of the bike lane chatting. Hell, I'd go around them without uttering a word, but there is about a 4 inch lip of asphalt along the edge that won't allow me to reasonably do that.
I experience a very real threat of serious bodily injury or death from motorists when I am bicycling. Statistics bear this out. The statistics bear out that there is very little threat that a pedestrian faces from bicyclists. You'll get your disingenuous on here too. I am guessing through obfuscation or red herring. It will be interesting to see what tactic you use.
Well, again you post something that doesn't relate to what I posted, and you create a what'if from a picture that I can only answer with another, what'if, so you can say it's a red herring.
Just posting the picture and what'if and insinuating she's not where she's allowed to be is complaining about where's she's at.
If that's a two way bike lane, she looks pretty defensive to me and in the safest place on the track.
Kent
Looks like we are in agreement on the fact that motorists are a real threat to bicyclists but bicyclists are statistically a nominal threat to pedestrians. Glad we made that progress.
Your response the first part of my post helped make my point. While I didn't come right and say that the part of the path to the left was for pedestrians. I spoke about pedestrians, bicyclists and separation zones. To the observant, that alone would clearly indicate that the picture doesn't show a two way bicycle path. BUT, I also included a picture. You have to look closely to see the clear lane markings. They appear regularly at about 200 foot intervals. Then there's also the clue of the pedestrians in the pic. There was also my comment about separating flailing arms and handlebars. You missed ALL of that but would be the kind who thinks they know what's best for a bicyclist. LOL. Sometimes this stuff writes itself.
A pedestrians purpose for legally using a 'recreational' travel way, is of no concern of yours then, how do you know they aren't being defensive?
What do you experience on the road today that pedestrians don't experience from cyclists on a 'recreational' travel way.
It's sure they experience the same complaining.
Kent
I have relevant experiences walking. Those experiences tell me when there's no legitimate reason for a pedestrian to be where they are on a path. Take this person for example. Two clearly marked lanes with a separation zone in between the two paths to keep flailing arms and handlebars out of contact. The separation zone has markings that should be familiar to anyone who has a driver's license. Those markings mean "keep off." I won't get an honest answer out of you, but I'll give you an opportunity to be disingenuous. What possible reason would this person have for being in the separation zone?
Bear in mind that I am not complaining. It's very easy for me to deal with that. I have had groups of pedestrians strung completely across the bike lane on this MUP. I have had groups of up to 10 people standing in the middle of the bike lane chatting. Hell, I'd go around them without uttering a word, but there is about a 4 inch lip of asphalt along the edge that won't allow me to reasonably do that.
I experience a very real threat of serious bodily injury or death from motorists when I am bicycling. Statistics bear this out. The statistics bear out that there is very little threat that a pedestrian faces from bicyclists. You'll get your disingenuous on here too. I am guessing through obfuscation or red herring. It will be interesting to see what tactic you use.
Well, again you post something that doesn't relate to what I posted, and you create a what'if from a picture that I can only answer with another, what'if, so you can say it's a red herring.
Just posting the picture and what'if and insinuating she's not where she's allowed to be is complaining about where's she's at.
If that's a two way bike lane, she looks pretty defensive to me and in the safest place on the track.
Kent
Looks like we are in agreement on the fact that motorists are a real threat to bicyclists but bicyclists are statistically a nominal threat to pedestrians. Glad we made that progress.
Your response the first part of my post helped make my point. While I didn't come right and say that the part of the path to the left was for pedestrians. I spoke about pedestrians, bicyclists and separation zones. To the observant, that alone would clearly indicate that the picture doesn't show a two way bicycle path. BUT, I also included a picture. You have to look closely to see the clear lane markings. They appear regularly at about 200 foot intervals. Then there's also the clue of the pedestrians in the pic. There was also my comment about separating flailing arms and handlebars. You missed ALL of that but would be the kind who thinks they know what's best for a bicyclist. LOL. Sometimes this stuff writes itself.
I don't think even Paul rides in a manner that causes traffic trouble unless completely unavoidable. The 'road' isn't the only place bicycles and vehicles can collide. Obviously residential streets are safer because the speed differential is minimal, people are more careful with kids playing, walkers, bikers... parking lots, intersections.
Anyway, you as a cyclist complained about pedestrians, others jumped in, I find that ironic and humorous, which it is.
I'm really only on this site for the sarcasm and ironic humor.
Kent
He wrote of a truism. The very people who complain about bicyclists on the road are the ones who become what they complain about when they walk on a path. Him pointing that reality out isn't a complaint.
He wrote of a truism. The very people who complain about bicyclists on the road are the ones who become what they complain about when they walk on a path. Him pointing that reality out isn't a complaint.
No, it's irony. Irony that the connoisseur of ironic humor can't see.
Give me one example of a pedestrian saying to you... you are the same cyclists that I hate on my way driving on the road.
Kent
I have never asked, but in my mind it is reasonable to assume that some of those pedestrians are the same ones complaining about bicyclists on the road. Hell, just look at the number of motorists who complain about bicyclists breaking the law. Of course none of those motorists would ever go above the speed limit, never slow roll a stop, never fail to signal a lane change or turn...right?
Give me one example of a pedestrian saying to you... you are the same cyclists that I hate on my way driving on the road.
Kent
I have never asked, but in my mind it is reasonable to assume that some of those pedestrians are the same ones complaining about bicyclists on the road. Hell, just look at the number of motorists who complain about bicyclists breaking the law. Of course none of those motorists would ever go above the speed limit, never slow roll a stop, never fail to signal a lane change or turn...right?
You never asked... the rest is irrelevant to the subject.
Give me one example of a pedestrian saying to you... you are the same cyclists that I hate on my way driving on the road.
Kent
I have never asked, but in my mind it is reasonable to assume that some of those pedestrians are the same ones complaining about bicyclists on the road. Hell, just look at the number of motorists who complain about bicyclists breaking the law. Of course none of those motorists would ever go above the speed limit, never slow roll a stop, never fail to signal a lane change or turn...right?
You never asked... the rest is irrelevant to the subject.
Hundreds of motorists safely passed you because they saw you. What could magically make you hard to see to a driver in the same conditions on the same road?
No magic, just inevitable human fallibility, the same thing that happens to those horribly unfortunate parents that unwittingly leave their infants in hot cars every year. It is inevitable that a fraction of drivers passing me will not see me.
Quote
You are not asking a lot from me as a driver to not run over you when you are riding in compliance with the law. I am telling you, it is ridiculously simple.
I think it’s a lot, it is of enormous significance to me. To hear the comments of most drivers they think it’s a lot too.
You will reply that of course they are wrong because, in your opinion, they are wrong. The sort of smug pronouncement that PO’s people about cyclists. They think we’re all like you.
Few people run over cyclists on purpose, many who do were not otherwise violating traffic laws, they simply didn’t see and/or weren’t expecting the cyclist.
Pedestrians are forbidden on roadways because of the hazards to themselves and vehicles. Every other slow-moving vehicle, much larger and harder to miss than cyclists, has to be clearly marked.
Laws are always a compromise, is this case the law allows a hazardous situation. So I ride at my own risk and accept responsibility for assuming that risk.
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
If it had been me about something hunting and it was pointed out as ironic when it was, I'd laugh and admit it... it's a cyclist thing I guess, you even eat your own.
Hundreds of motorists safely passed you because they saw you. What could magically make you hard to see to a driver in the same conditions on the same road?
No magic, just inevitable human fallibility, the same thing that happens to those horribly unfortunate parents that unwittingly leave their infants in hot cars every year. It is inevitable that a fraction of drivers passing me will not see me.
.
See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here.
Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver.
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent
OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic, I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, and I have no reason to complain about motorists (and haven't) explain the irony.
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent
OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic and I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, explain the irony.
Can I use Paul's assuming superpower to say... I bet you have ridden at sometime in your life, that you impeded traffic in some way, even in a parking lot or intersection or entrance/exit... some driver had to wait for you once.
And I didn't write my first pointed post in this thread until someone suggested a loud horn to scare pedestrians legally using recreational travel ways.
If you are a pedestrian or a cyclist in this world of moving objects you are at the bottom of the food chain. Some folks are more aware of their position than others, some not so much.
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent
OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic and I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, explain the irony.
Can I use Paul's assuming superpower to say... I bet you have ridden at sometime in your life, that you impeded traffic in some way, even in a parking lot or intersection or entrance/exit... some driver had to wait for you once.
Kent
LOL. I bet at one point in your life you drank too much alcohol and did something that you later regretted.
And you know when I say it's ironic that cyclists complain about pedestrians, it's true... regardless of whatever projectionism you guys throw out there.
Kent
OK I'll bite. I'm the one who started the thread, and I'm the chief complainer. Given that I don't ride my bike on roads where I impede traffic and I don't give motorists a reason to complain about me impeding traffic, explain the irony.
Can I use Paul's assuming superpower to say... I bet you have ridden at sometime in your life, that you impeded traffic in some way, even in a parking lot or intersection or entrance/exit... some driver had to wait for you once.
Kent
LOL. I bet at one point in your life you drank too much alcohol and did something that you later regretted.
So what.
No. my regrets are self-imposed without the excuse of a crutch... and there are many at my age.
[quote=Birdwatcher][quote=PaulBarnard]See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here.
No, this is just more Paul Barnard smug wordplay.
To whit: The drivers are wrong, they don’t find bicycles hard to see, they’re just being inattentive.
or.... Drivers are wrong, bicycles do not present a road hazard to drivers if they ride in a legal manner
Quote
Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver.
It means less likely to steal the attention of ANY driver.
I’m familiar with this phenomenon from my years on motorcycles, drivers are less likely to see a motorcycle approaching, so they sometimes pull out in front of one. Happens to every rider. This is why if you’re on a motorcycle and you’re smart, you ride with the headlight on, better yet with a strobe effect. Still can happen anyway.
Whatever the Paul Barnard version is, is irrelevant to the reality on the street of course.
[quote=Birdwatcher][quote=PaulBarnard]See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here.
No, this is just more Paul Barnard smug wordplay.
To whit: The drivers are wrong, they don’t find bicycles hard to see, they’re just being inattentive.
or.... Drivers are wrong, bicycles do not present a road hazard to drivers if they ride in a legal manner
Quote
Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver.
It means less likely to steal the attention of ANY driver.
I’m familiar with this phenomenon from my years on motorcycles, drivers are less likely to see a motorcycle approaching, so they sometimes pull out in front of one. Happens to every rider. This is why if you’re on a motorcycle and you’re smart, you ride with the headlight on, better yet with a strobe effect. Still can happen anyway.
Whatever the Paul Barnard version is, is irrelevant to the reality on the street of course.
I guess its just a matter of time before you run over a hard to see cyclist.
[quote=Birdwatcher][quote=PaulBarnard]See how easy it was. It's not that cyclists are hard to see. It's that motorists are inattentive. We sure went through a lot to get here.
No, this is just more Paul Barnard smug wordplay.
To whit: The drivers are wrong, they don’t find bicycles hard to see, they’re just being inattentive.
or.... Drivers are wrong, bicycles do not present a road hazard to drivers if they ride in a legal manner
Quote
Any time I see the words "hard to see," assuming daylight conditions, it means less likely to steal the attention of a marginally engaged driver.
It means less likely to steal the attention of ANY driver.
I’m familiar with this phenomenon from my years on motorcycles, drivers are less likely to see a motorcycle approaching, so they sometimes pull out in front of one. Happens to every rider. This is why if you’re on a motorcycle and you’re smart, you ride with the headlight on, better yet with a strobe effect. Still can happen anyway.
Whatever the Paul Barnard version is, is irrelevant to the reality on the street of course.
I guess its just a matter of time before you run over a hard to see cyclist.
In my pickup? Could happen, could happen to anyone. They’re called “accidents”.
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on.
Didn’t you begin this thread by talking about how you won’t ride on the road?
Will, there's this thing called a "mouse." If you hold it over the "1" (that's a page number) and do what the kids call "click it," it'll take you back to page 1 and you can read what I said there.
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on.
Didn’t you begin this thread by talking about how you won’t ride on the road?
Will, there's this thing called a "mouse." If you hold it over the "1" (that's a page number) and do what the kids call "click it," it'll take you back to page 1 and you can read what I said there.
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on.
Didn’t you begin this thread by talking about how you won’t ride on the road?
Will, there's this thing called a "mouse." If you hold it over the "1" (that's a page number) and do what the kids call "click it," it'll take you back to page 1 and you can read what I said there.
At least that's what I hear tell.
Tks. Yep, you did 👍🏻
No, you're wrong.
I didn't say I "won't ride on the road." Here's exactly what I said:
Originally Posted by smokepole
I'm not what you'd call a cyclist, don't own any spandex, and don't like to ride on the road with traffic. .
And you accuse Paul of word play.
The park I ride in is 2 3/4 miles from my house, I have to ride on the road to get there.
I'm not what you'd call a cyclist, don't own any spandex, and don't like to ride on the road with traffic..
And you don’t like to ride on the road with traffic because........
Because motorists are willing to excuse their own inattentiveness. I feel like we are somewhat circular in this discussion.
I just got back from a 25 mile ride. 100% on the path. No issues. A few inattentive pedestrians, but that's to be expected because many pedestrians drive too.
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on.
Didn’t you begin this thread by talking about how you won’t ride on the road?
Will, there's this thing called a "mouse." If you hold it over the "1" (that's a page number) and do what the kids call "click it," it'll take you back to page 1 and you can read what I said there.
At least that's what I hear tell.
Tks. Yep, you did 👍🏻
No, you're wrong.
I didn't say I "won't ride on the road." Here's exactly what I said:
Originally Posted by smokepole
I'm not what you'd call a cyclist, don't own any spandex, and don't like to ride on the road with traffic. .
And you accuse Paul of word play.
The park I ride in is 2 3/4 miles from my house, I have to ride on the road to get there.
It's not if, it's when. You cyclists are crazy, runnin' over oneanotha and carrying on.
Didn’t you begin this thread by talking about how you won’t ride on the road?
Will, there's this thing called a "mouse." If you hold it over the "1" (that's a page number) and do what the kids call "click it," it'll take you back to page 1 and you can read what I said there.
At least that's what I hear tell.
Tks. Yep, you did 👍🏻
No, you're wrong.
I didn't say I "won't ride on the road." Here's exactly what I said:
Originally Posted by smokepole
I'm not what you'd call a cyclist, don't own any spandex, and don't like to ride on the road with traffic. .
And you accuse Paul of word play.
The park I ride in is 2 3/4 miles from my house, I have to ride on the road to get there.
Tote you bike to the park in your Prius.
.
I sold the Prius, it was contributing to greenhouse gas emissions. But not as much as you are.
That's great, you could use the fresh air. I'll probably just install the new air horn on the bike and ride around, find some unsuspecting pedestrians to scare the schidt out of.
Fresh air and exercise every day, all day, not just an hour or two a few days a week.
Last job until I'm done hunting, end of september, told everyone their jobs will have to wait till oct... Done by 8:00 this morning. Loading and headed to the mountains 4am tomorrow.
Tried to retire last year and again in May... No one to do the work anymore, people I've worked for, played golf with, fished with and even taken hunting, begging for just one more job. With the interest rates and economy things have slowed from full out to just normal... maybe I can retire from construction next spring... and get fat, out of shape... have to ride a bike.
Please don't resist. I figure these threads are therapeutic for those who suffer Spandex PTSD. Get it all out of your system!
You don’t have to wear spandex to be a ass hole bike rider.. These 3 ph uck tards pedaling down the middle of the road like they owned the damn thing. When I passed them you thought I chit in their bowl of ice cream.
Fresh air and exercise every day, all day, not just an hour or two a few days a week.
Last job until I'm done hunting, end of september, told everyone their jobs will have to wait till oct... Done by 8:00 this morning. Loading and headed to the mountains 4am tomorrow.
Tried to retire last year and again in May... No one to do the work anymore, people I've worked for, played golf with, fished with and even taken hunting, begging for just one more job. With the interest rates and economy things have slowed from full out to just normal... maybe I can retire from construction next spring... and get fat, out of shape... have to ride a bike.
Kent
Good luck on the hunt, hope it cools down some for you. But get your bike before you get fat and ugly, riding it will keep you from getting that way, at least fat. It won't help with ugly, but of course you've seen Paul's pics so you know that. And whatever you do, don't get one of them scooters and end up like deflave.
Please don't resist. I figure these threads are therapeutic for those who suffer Spandex PTSD. Get it all out of your system!
You don’t have to wear spandex to be a ass hole bike rider.. These 3 ph uck tards pedaling down the middle of the road like they owned the damn thing. When I passed them you thought I chit in their bowl of ice cream.
It must have been physically and emotionally challenging for you to get around them with all that traffic.
Please don't resist. I figure these threads are therapeutic for those who suffer Spandex PTSD. Get it all out of your system!
You don’t have to wear spandex to be a ass hole bike rider.. These 3 ph uck tards pedaling down the middle of the road like they owned the damn thing. When I passed them you thought I chit in their bowl of ice cream.
It must have been physically and emotionally challenging for you to get around them with all that traffic.
It appears the highway is marked with a double yellow centerline. Is it even legal to pass them there?
Please don't resist. I figure these threads are therapeutic for those who suffer Spandex PTSD. Get it all out of your system!
You don’t have to wear spandex to be a ass hole bike rider.. These 3 ph uck tards pedaling down the middle of the road like they owned the damn thing. When I passed them you thought I chit in their bowl of ice cream.
It must have been physically and emotionally challenging for you to get around them with all that traffic.
It appears the highway is marked with a double yellow centerline. Is it even legal to pass them there?
In Florida it became legal to do so last year..............
Please don't resist. I figure these threads are therapeutic for those who suffer Spandex PTSD. Get it all out of your system!
You don’t have to wear spandex to be a ass hole bike rider.. These 3 ph uck tards pedaling down the middle of the road like they owned the damn thing. When I passed them you thought I chit in their bowl of ice cream.
It must have been physically and emotionally challenging for you to get around them with all that traffic.
It appears the highway is marked with a double yellow centerline. Is it even legal to pass them there?
In most states it is. In states where it isn't, I doubt you'd find anyone who cared if you safely passed a bicycle, tractor, mail truck etc. in a place like that.
Please don't resist. I figure these threads are therapeutic for those who suffer Spandex PTSD. Get it all out of your system!
You don’t have to wear spandex to be a ass hole bike rider.. These 3 ph uck tards pedaling down the middle of the road like they owned the damn thing. When I passed them you thought I chit in their bowl of ice cream.
It must have been physically and emotionally challenging for you to get around them with all that traffic.
See 79, if ya get PO’d by cyclists in the roadway creating driving issues it’s because you’re wrong, just like all them other drivers. Paul said so.
'Flave, I need your help. I was at the doctor today. I have been having allergy issues. My blood pressure was all the way up to 98/64. My pulse was 60. I have got to get some real exercise. How many beers per 9 holes do you recommend?
Please don't resist. I figure these threads are therapeutic for those who suffer Spandex PTSD. Get it all out of your system!
You don’t have to wear spandex to be a ass hole bike rider.. These 3 ph uck tards pedaling down the middle of the road like they owned the damn thing. When I passed them you thought I chit in their bowl of ice cream.
It must have been physically and emotionally challenging for you to get around them with all that traffic.
See 79, if ya get PO’d by cyclists in the roadway creating driving issues it’s because you’re wrong, just like all them other drivers. Paul said so.
See 79, if ya get PO’d by cyclists in the roadway creating driving issues it’s because you’re wrong, just like all them other drivers. Paul said so.
[/quote]
Triggered?
Naaah, merely stating fact. Over and over again people get on here stating that they find bicycles on the road to be at best an irritating nuisance and at worst a dangerous road hazard.
Every time you’ll come back and assure them they’re wrong, well, because you think they’re wrong.
Exactly the sort of attitude that PO’s regular folk about cyclists in the first place.
I put in my regular 10 alongside morning commuter traffic this morning. Survived another one. Morning rush hour and Friday evenings, the two worst times to ride.
Naaah, merely stating fact. Over and over again people get on here stating that they find bicycles on the road to be at best an irritating nuisance and at worst a dangerous road hazard.
Every time you’ll come back and assure them they’re wrong, well, because you think they’re wrong.
Exactly the sort of attitude that PO’s regular folk about cyclists in the first place.
I well understand that a lot of drivers don't have the emotional IQ to deal with bicyclists. Can you quantify the danger that bicyclists present to motorists with some data?
I live in the country bicyclists are a pain in the ass on the narrow roads, but I get it. I know a guy who is not a friend of mine but I know him who carries urine with him and throws it out his window at bike Riders just like you Paul :-) I can’t believe he Does it but he does, I told him that’s just not right. Someday he’s going to get his ass in a jam over that but so far nothing, can’t believe it.
Back in the 80s, I knew more than one person that kept a CB radio antenna in their truck for bike riders that were blocking traffic.
Were they pussies? I have yet to have anyone that [bleep] with me come back when I invited them. Seems they are bigger badasses in their trucks.
Paul everybody back then carried guns in their trucks also. different times.
And stepping out of the truck to beat some ass was a common occurrence. Carried a shotgun and baseball bat in the rear window of my first truck.
There are quite a few folks (men and women) that I know that always carry when they ride. Getting out of a motor vehicle to confront a cyclist won't likely play out in the favor of the motorist in a court of law.
I have yet to have anyone that [bleep] with me come back when I invited them.
Maybe you should try a breath freshening toothpaste, and get the genital warts burned off.
Wouldn't matter, the guy would still be scared sh*tless, thinking to himself "that's bad-ass bicyclist back there, no telling what he's capable of. Plus, I bet he's got a big hairy posse."
Back in the 80s, I knew more than one person that kept a CB radio antenna in their truck for bike riders that were blocking traffic.
Were they pussies? I have yet to have anyone that [bleep] with me come back when I invited them. Seems they are bigger badasses in their trucks.
Paul everybody back then carried guns in their trucks also. different times.
And stepping out of the truck to beat some ass was a common occurrence. Carried a shotgun and baseball bat in the rear window of my first truck.
There are quite a few folks (men and women) that I know that always carry when they ride. Getting out of a motor vehicle to confront a cyclist won't likely play out in the favor of the motorist in a court of law.
I was speaking generally, calm down frisky britches.
A club cut jersey hides a weapon very well. When I was in college, two guys got out of a pickup truck in stop-and-go traffic just north of Phoenix. They each grabbed a ballbat out of the bed and went after a cyclist who, for whatever reason, brought them some unhappiness. I don't know what happened to the cyclist but the dudes in the pickup have been dead for 42 years now. And come next year, they'll still be dead.
Can you quantify the danger that bicyclists present to motorists with some data?
Easy:
Surly Troll; 32lbs Ford F-150; 4,021 - 5,740lbs Insurance deductible for grillwork on truck; Varies w/policy
Oh, I see?
Here ya go, 1,000 cyclists dead, another 130,000 injured each year.
...and if ya don’t think having to come up with the deductible to patch up the truck after hitting one of them idiot cyclists qualifies as “danger” then ya plainly ain’t been in enough car wrecks.
Can you quantify the danger that bicyclists present to motorists with some data?
Easy:
Surly Troll; 32lbs Ford F-150; 4,021 - 5,740lbs Insurance deductible for grillwork on truck; Varies w/policy
Oh, I see?
Here ya go, 1,000 cyclists dead, another 130,000 injured each year.
...and if ya don’t think having to come up with the deductible to patch up the truck after hitting one of them idiot cyclists qualifies as “danger” then ya plainly ain’t been in enough car wrecks.
Oh, so the danger that cyclists pose isn't to motorists, it's the danger cyclists present to their paint jobs?
Can you quantify the danger that bicyclists present to motorists with some data?
Easy:
Surly Troll; 32lbs Ford F-150; 4,021 - 5,740lbs Insurance deductible for grillwork on truck; Varies w/policy
Oh, I see?
Here ya go, 1,000 cyclists dead, another 130,000 injured each year.
...and if ya don’t think having to come up with the deductible to patch up the truck after hitting one of them idiot cyclists qualifies as “danger” then ya plainly ain’t been in enough car wrecks.
Man, that’s a lot of dead cyclist an injured cyclist. More people are killed on bicycles then I killed with A.R. 15’s. Sorry Paul but we should outlaw all bicycles.it’s for your own good, safety first :-) I honestly didn’t realize it was that high, that’s crazy. Watch your ass out there.
I'm not one to pick a fight. But I would like my chances against a cyclist. Unless it was a kicking contest. Then I may have my work cut out for me
Don't judge all cyclists by those that are professional racers. Some of the guys I see out on the path (purposefully removed from posing a hazard to paint) are pretty damn stacked.
Or is my supposition that these words that you used: "at worst a dangerous road hazard" don't equal these words "a traumatic event for a motorist"
Do you see how your language has drifted as I have tried to drill down?
A situation where someone is liable to receive crippling injuries or dies is not a dangerous road hazard?
If the incident becomes a life changing event emotionally and/or financially for the operator of the vehicle does not that represent danger to the driver?
Are drivers NEVER placed in danger of a collision when avoiding cyclists in the roadway? If so, why do so many feel they are?
Why then is it unreasonable for drivers to resent cyclists? Crap, even in a minor collision just having to deal with the hassle of being made late for work and having to make an insurance claim because some retard was in the road on a bicycle is legitimate grounds for resentment.
Perhaps “emotional immaturity” on your part plays a role here, ‘cause you’re gonna go back to the drivers are wrong to feel that way because you don’t think they should feel that way, your only argument 🙄
Like I said, the sort of smug patronizing attitude among cyclists that pisses off drivers so much.
Anyhoo, just recently got done helping shepherd an evening group ride, about 150 bicycles 10 miles around downtown.
I always bring up the rear with pump, flashlight, tools and spare tubes for the newbies. Plus I’m lit up like a Christmas tree and I’ll cover their back while trying to keep them from running into traffic or traffic from running into them.
....and if me or them get hit, it’s our fault for being out there on bicycles in the first place 🙂
Or is my supposition that these words that you used: "at worst a dangerous road hazard" don't equal these words "a traumatic event for a motorist"
Do you see how your language has drifted as I have tried to drill down?
A situation where someone is liable to receive crippling injuries or dies is not a dangerous road hazard?
If the incident becomes a life changing event emotionally and/or financially for the operator of the vehicle does not that represent danger to the driver?
Are drivers NEVER placed in danger of a collision when avoiding cyclists in the roadway? If so, why do so many feel they are?
Why then is it unreasonable for drivers to resent cyclists? Crap, even in a minor collision just having to deal with the hassle of being made late for work and having to make an insurance claim because some retard was in the road on a bicycle is legitimate grounds for resentment.
Perhaps “emotional immaturity” on your part plays a role here, ‘cause you’re gonna go back to the drivers are wrong to feel that way because you don’t think they should feel that way, your only argument 🙄
Like I said, the sort of smug patronizing attitude among cyclists that pisses off drivers so much.
Drift on my friend drift on. Going back to my previous comment. What does the data tell us about the hazard that bicyclists present to motorists? It's right up there with the threat that right wing extremists present. It mainly exists in the imagination of the frightened and uneducated.
You dismiss drivers as “emotionally immature” and now “frightened and uneducated”. Likewise a dangerous hazard is not a dangerous hazard unless it involves injury to the driver. A consistent theme in all of your posts on this topic over the years.
You ain’t making this stuff up, you actually believe it.
Perhaps this is the exact mindset that prevails among those spandex-clad packs on weekends that PO so many.
And the White Supremacist analogy? If there were many thousands of actual White Supremacist incidents all over America every year, few people would dismiss those objecting as frightened and uneducated.
You have a point that's hard to argue against. Birdwatcher could mow down a bicyclist in the bicycle lane, and it would be their fault.
Smokepole has already dismissed himself from this topic by avoiding answering direct questions.
Now you bring up an improbable argument equivalent to the possibility of rape as a reason to keep abortion legal.
I didn’t get into bicycles until I was 56. Before that it was motorcycles. Ten long-term riding companions over the years; one death, three life changing injuries (amputation, shattered leg and closed-head brain injury). 40% casualty rate across thirty years. So should I swing a leg over a motorcycle again I assume that risk and blame no one else.
Bicycles? Eight years, one death, four collisions with vehicles resulting in injury among people known to me (out of a couple hundred). I assume the risk and accept responsibility for that risk every time.
Anyhoo, just recently got done helping shepherd an evening group ride, about 150 bicycles 10 miles around downtown.
I always bring up the rear with pump, flashlight, tools and spare tubes for the newbies. Plus I’m lit up like a Christmas tree and I’ll cover their back while trying to keep them from running into traffic or traffic from running into them.
....and if me or them get hit, it’s our fault for being out there on bicycles in the first place 🙂
Tell that to your insurance company when the medical bills roll in. I'm sure they'll see it your way and cover all your expenses.
Wife and I were in Olympic National Park last week, driving down the mountain from Hurricane Ridge to Port Angeles. The speed limit is 35 mph on a curvy downhill two lane road, park speed on a road that could handle faster. Medium heavy traffic and a fair number of bicyclers, co-existing just fine, courteous and passing safely.
Then we caught up with a line of vehicles following behind one bicycle that stayed in the center of the right lane or out toward the center line of the two lane highway. The young man on the bike seemed oblivious to the number of cars piling up behind him and hogged the lane for nearly four miles before he pulled off into a viewpoint. He had plenty of wide shoulder sections to ride that would allow plenty of room for cars to safely pass him, with no need for him to slow down. He was averaging 25 mph, a few times slower and a few times briefly got up to 35.
Bullshart. Which question did I fail to answer, Lido?
I have no idea who or what Lido is, most likely not a complement.
No time right now to cut and paste, it’s up there.
The first question was if pedestrians who use shared bicycle/pedestrian paths could vote on a rule requiring cyclists to slow way down or even stop before passing them, would they vote in favor of that rule?
You dismiss drivers as “emotionally immature” and now “frightened and uneducated”. Likewise a dangerous hazard is not a dangerous hazard unless it involves injury to the driver. A consistent theme in all of your posts on this topic over the years.
You ain’t making this stuff up, you actually believe it.
Perhaps this is the exact mindset that prevails among those spandex-clad packs on weekends that PO so many.
And the White Supremacist analogy? If there were many thousands of actual White Supremacist incidents all over America every year, few people would dismiss those objecting as frightened and uneducated.
I want to say this in the nicest possible way. You are either dumb as fugking hell, marginally literate or disingenuous. I never typed a goddam thing about white supremacy.
Perhaps your cognitive challenges are indicative of the motorist mindset that finds them struggling to negotiate the occasional cyclist they encounter.
I want to say this in the nicest possible way. You are either dumb as fugking hell, marginally literate or disingenuous. I never typed a goddam thing about white supremacy.
Perhaps your cognitive challenges are indicative of the motorist mindset that finds them struggling to negotiate the occasional cyclist they encounter.
You’re right, you used the analogy that motorists PO’d about bicycles (which is almost all of ‘em) were as frightened and uneducated as those who worry about Far Right Extremists, not White Supremacists. My mistake, but you will agree the terms are commonly conflated in the MSM. I could not see your post when replying.
My apologies.
What I meant to say is if thousands of Far Right Extremists were acting up in thousands of incidents all Across America every year as is true of bicycles on the roadway no one would consider those alarmed by this to be frightened and uneducated.
I think it’s old news that you view motorists who have problems with bicycles as being cognitively challenged. This is what you have always said.
I am more certain than ever that yours is the typical mindset of those spandex clad crowds on weekends.
Bullshart. Which question did I fail to answer, Lido?
I have no idea who or what Lido is, most likely not a complement.
The Lido Shuffle is a classic song by Boz Scaggs. I called you Lido because your answers to Paul's questions are shuffling all over the map depending on the level of obtusity and obfuscation needed to avoid answering the question.
Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
The first question was if pedestrians who use shared bicycle/pedestrian paths could vote on a rule requiring cyclists to slow way down or even stop before passing them, would they vote in favor of that rule?
And you expected an answer to a hypothetical question that I can't answer because I have no idea how pedestrians would vote on that. Except that pedestrians whose heads are not firmly planted up their asses would vote "no."
What I meant to say is if thousands of Far Right Extremists were acting up in thousands of incidents all Across America every year as is true of bicycles on the roadway no one would consider those alarmed by this to be frightened and uneducated. .
Wife and I were in Olympic National Park last week, driving down the mountain from Hurricane Ridge to Port Angeles. The speed limit is 35 mph on a curvy downhill two lane road, park speed on a road that could handle faster. Medium heavy traffic and a fair number of bicyclers, co-existing just fine, courteous and passing safely.
Then we caught up with a line of vehicles following behind one bicycle that stayed in the center of the right lane or out toward the center line of the two lane highway. The young man on the bike seemed oblivious to the number of cars piling up behind him and hogged the lane for nearly four miles before he pulled off into a viewpoint. He had plenty of wide shoulder sections to ride that would allow plenty of room for cars to safely pass him, with no need for him to slow down. He was averaging 25 mph, a few times slower and a few times briefly got up to 35.
Simple. Courtesy.
I never let cars stack up behind me. As soon as I can safely get out of the way, I do.
Another annoying anecdote. I rode my bicycle up and over Independence Pass from East to West into Aspen. On the way down, I was passing cars when I could, being held up at times by slower moving cars. None moved over.
I think it’s old news that you view motorists who have problems with bicycles as being cognitively challenged. This is what you have always said.
Most of 'em yep. When someone whines about having to lift off the gas or apply pressure to one side of the steering wheel to go around, they are emotionally challenged. The guys acount of being held up for 4 miles is legit. Cyclist was a dick. Even with that, the dick only cost them about 2 1/2 minutes. Meh, I get delayed that much by other motorists on an afternoon commute on a regular basis.
The first question was if pedestrians who use shared bicycle/pedestrian paths could vote on a rule requiring cyclists to slow way down or even stop before passing them, would they vote in favor of that rule?
I am sure some would. I slow to pass with minimal speed disparity anyway, so it wouldn't matter to me. It's that Golden Rule thing.
We have about 5 miles of trail on our place, some of it pretty steep and rocky/rutted. Hope to add a few more miles over the next year.
Normally get around with the Land Cruiser or walking, but wanted something faster than walking that didn't have a fuel tank or a battery.
So yesterday we bought a couple bikes suited for 65 year olds who don't plan to go airborne, but need some good gearing. Not to mention an outfit that can take some abuse.
As the OP said, we found it fun to ride again, after about 40 years of not setting on a bike.
We have about 5 miles of trail on our place, some of it pretty steep and rocky/rutted. Hope to add a few more miles over the next year.
Normally get around with the Land Cruiser or walking, but wanted something faster than walking that didn't have a fuel tank or a battery.
So yesterday we bought a couple bikes suited for 65 year olds who don't plan to go airborne, but need some good gearing. Not to mention an outfit that can take some abuse.
As the OP said, we found it fun to ride again, after about 40 years of not setting on a bike.
Butt sure needs to get used to that saddle!!
Yep, butts take some conditioning. Wrists and feet can as well.
I think you'll enjoy it. My preference is to get away from it all, but not many opportunities here.
Wife and I were in Olympic National Park last week, driving down the mountain from Hurricane Ridge to Port Angeles. The speed limit is 35 mph on a curvy downhill two lane road, park speed on a road that could handle faster. Medium heavy traffic and a fair number of bicyclers, co-existing just fine, courteous and passing safely.
Then we caught up with a line of vehicles following behind one bicycle that stayed in the center of the right lane or out toward the center line of the two lane highway. The young man on the bike seemed oblivious to the number of cars piling up behind him and hogged the lane for nearly four miles before he pulled off into a viewpoint. He had plenty of wide shoulder sections to ride that would allow plenty of room for cars to safely pass him, with no need for him to slow down. He was averaging 25 mph, a few times slower and a few times briefly got up to 35.
Simple. Courtesy.
I never let cars stack up behind me. As soon as I can safely get out of the way, I do.
Another annoying anecdote. I rode my bicycle up and over Independence Pass from East to West into Aspen. On the way down, I was passing cars when I could, being held up at times by slower moving cars. None moved over.
Thanks, Paul. May you survive to be an example to others.
This morning's ride took me down the Mississippi River Levee path, through refineries, out to the Bonnet Carre Spillway and back. My first 50 miler in a while.
This morning's ride took me down the Mississippi River Levee path, through refineries, out to the Bonnet Carre Spillway and back. My first 50 miler in a while.
This morning's ride took me down the Mississippi River Levee path, through refineries, out to the Bonnet Carre Spillway and back. My first 50 miler in a while.
Is there good money in being that gay?
Careful, it ain’t IF you catch the monkey pox, but when.....
Riding a bicycle isn't my deal. I ride a Harley, years back jap bikes weren't cool. My exercise is lifting weights and hitting the heavy bag. One of my Tae Kwon Do training partners rode a bike 25 miles one way was nothing for him. Paul I do admire the fact that you have a healthy passion, good for you. Now days I don't care what you ride just have fun. I also noticed you have a keen sense of humor. Have fun be safe. Watch out for the old guys that sit and do nothing they have slow reflexes.
Riding a bicycle isn't my deal. I ride a Harley, years back jap bikes weren't cool. My exercise is lifting weights and hitting the heavy bag. One of my Tae Kwon Do training partners rode a bike 25 miles one way was nothing for him. Paul I do admire the fact that you have a healthy passion, good for you. Now days I don't care what you ride just have fun. I also noticed you have a keen sense of humor. Have fun be safe. Watch out for the old guys that sit and do nothing they have slow reflexes.
I hope my last breath of life is a laugh! Riding locally isn't my preference. I do it because I need some kind of exercise and I do enjoy it some. Getting away from it all on a bike is my thing.
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