Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Deer Hunting Pros and Cons to "Baiting" of deer; those that live and hunt where bait is legal

Food plots in S. TX require more than a tractor. Rain would help, also a fence to keep them out till it matures. And cows out. BTDT

stumpy

"Baiting" in South Texas is not just dumping a pile of corn on the ground, it involves timed feeders set to throw only a small amount of corn once or twice a day. Not only will hogs, coons, and squirrels get it, but a flock of grackles will wipe out anything on the ground if they come though. Kix is right on the money about the thick brush and cactus - this is why it's called the "Brush Country", also why it's good to kill them DRT - instead of losing them. Feeders attract does and young bucks easily down there, but a trophy buck is much harder, doesn't just step out in the open. I used to hunt with hounds in East Texas - same principle, traditional hunting methods have been developed because they work in their respective areas. This said, however, trophy deer hunting in Texas has become a big business that even has a lot of influence in state government, and the problem isn't feeders. Much of it is out-of-state hunters wanting to pay big bucks to hand a geneticaly altered buck on their wall.

Which is why I don't agree with it anywhere. One thing can/may lead to another, especially when some are out to make a "buck".

Not legal maybe, but that is EXACTLY what your doing legally. You can paint it however you want. But you are doing NOTHING different and something that is TEN times better "bait" than any corn feeder.

I've hunted both types of "bait" many times my whole life, I'll take a oat, wheat, bean, or "deer magic food plot" over a corn feeder ANY DAY!!!!!! MUCH, MUCH, MUCH more likely to take a mature deer over a food plot any day.

Bill

Bill,

In the interest of healthy discussion.......Everyone I know who hunts over Bait throws out the "Food Plots are Bait" "Oak Trees are Bait" "Green Briars are Bait" . You can of course even go as far as stating that hunting where a Hot Doe is located would be considered baiting....etc.....

This is where the distinction lies for me......
Is it normal to find Agriculture in Deer habitat?YES

Is a food plot,Fertlized Oak Tree,Green Briar or Honeysuckle beneficial to the deer and other wildlife?YES

Are These things available year round? YES

Are these things Healthy for the Wildlife?YES

Is Corn poured from a bag or thrown from a feeder intended to benefit the deer herd and other wildlife? NO, in fact most baiters I know complain of Coons,Squirrels,Hogs etc...Eating THEIR DEER CORN.

Is Corn more economical for a year round supplemental feed?NO, In fact in order to supply the same 20,000lbs of forage grown in a 1acre food plot for $500.00 you would need to spend almost $5,000 for Corn. So the only advantage to Corn is buying a little during hunting season for the purpose of drawing in deer to shoot....Not Hunt.

Are the timers on feeders set to go off at dark or at daylight for the purpose of killing deer near the feeder? Daylight

Are the benefits of Corn equal to Food Plots or even fertilized native browse? NO, Corn contains less than 8% protein while native browse averages 11% and a quality Clover plot can exceed 20%.

Will deer walk through a food plot to get to a pile of Corn? Yes, I've seen this first hand during the Summer here in Georgia in my back yard. I can set up my camera in the food plot and get 10 pics a week and then pour out a bag of corn and get 300 in 2 nights.

Who is behind legalizing Corn Baiting in most cases? The Insurance Industry.

Why? In order to decrease the number of deer and therefore decrease the number of vehicle collisions with deer.

Bottom Line. If you want to Bait and it's legal where you are located then so be it. Just don't try to compare it with food plots or fertilizing native browse.....And call it what it is.....Population Control.....Not Hunting.

Robert

Bruzer,

I'm not talking about oak trees when they are dropping acorns, etc. that is natural to the area. I agree with you there.

Yes some agriculture plots are "native" to certain areas. I grew up on a ranch and still ranch/run cattle as a side job so I know just a little bit about this........

In your other post you mentioned hand tilling before you had access to tractor. So that means that where you were planting your plot there was not "natively" one there, right.

You really have no arguement for this part, if it was a regulary tilled and worked agriculture plot that the deer were accustomed to than you would not have had to be tilling it by hand or with a tractor you had access too, right? So you were BAITING, nothing more. Granted you are providing some extra nutrition and that is a great thing IMHO, corn provides only carbs that helps keep them warm in the winter time, and thats about it. But if you planted it solely for nutrition for the deer and not to bait them then you would not have a stand anywhere in the general vicinity.

Yes corn feeders go off in daylight hours, but I can't even begin to recall pics of bucks at corn feeders in the middle of the night that have NEVER been seen there in the daylight hours.People that do not live in areas that feeders are legal can't seem to somehow grasp this, but its a fact.

Bottom line is you are baiting my friend, yes it is a more nutritional bait, but it is still BAIT!!!!!!!!! And much more affective than any corn feeder for drawing in mature deer. Given the choice to hunt near a oat, wheat, or "deer plot" field or a corn feeder and I'll pick hands down the field every time! As I said before I've hunted both a bunch, something you have not.


You can paint this however you want if it makes you feel warm and fuzzy at night. But if you still say I'm totally wrong and your totally right then you are a hypocrit. Sorry if thast seems harsh but didn't know how eelsee to word it.

Bill

AMEN

Bill,

IF what you say in your above post is true. It would then be logical to assume that using Corn is a bad decision....Right?

IF as you state.......

1) Food Plots are more of a draw than Corn.
2) Food Plots are more beneficial than Corn.
3) Food Plots are Cheaper than Corn. (On a yearly basis of course)
4) Food Plots are also Baiting.

Why do you hunt over Corn? Seems to me that you would take the necessary steps to plant as many food plots as possible as hunting over Corn just doesn't make any sense on any level.

Robert

The insurance industry wants to reduce deer populations by encouraging feeders? That's a new one. Why don't we blame it on George Bush, like everything else?

Try a food plot in cattle country, or where hogs can get at it. And I'm talking about on a lease, not public or private land.

What ever made you think we don't plant food plots? Corn feeders just happen to be popular too here. Texas has tens upon tens of thousands of acres in oat and wheat.

Bill

Bill,

If you have plots and they are so much better than feeders then why would you go through the expense of using Corn?

I would really like to understand.This is coming from someone who hunts in a state where using Corn is synonymous with poaching.

Robert

Texas,

The insurance lobbyists here in the East are responsible for extended Deer seasons and Baiting being legalized in several states....Maybe it's different in Texas.

Robert

I'm next door in Alabama and will have to disagree with the insurance companies pushing baiting. The folks pushing baiting are the feeder companies and alot of hunters, me included. If done properly through a tagging or permit method, I don't see what it would hurt. I also saw one recomendation that suggested any feeder would have to be placed in at least a 1/4 acre food plot. I have no doubt, however, that Alabama will screw it up and we'll end up with the most hairbrained and backwards law you can imagine.

Bruzer ther is one important point I wanted to mention earlier but had to leave for a social engagement with the wife.

Food plots cheaper than corn!!?? I don't think so.

Its quite obvious you are way out of touch with the agriculture industry or you would know that seed oats have gone through the roof in the past few years, wheat I know has increased substantially in price too but I'm not 100% sure how much because we plant little of it here due to it's mouisture intolerance or lack there of.

It takes about 80-100 lbs of oat seed per acre to make a decent grazing pasture for cattle or deer. Seed is HIGH or it was in Texas this year. So you take $25 (for 50lbs) a bag (give or take) of quality seed oat, add fertilizer which reached $600-700 a ton, takes a minimum here of 250# per acre or you are wasting time and $$$. Deisel to plow it, diesel to plant it, plus the hours on your tractor, plus your time.

Oh by the way little 1-3 acre food plots don't work here, we have so many deer that they would have it paved to a parking lot in no time (seen it, been there, done that). Better plan on at least a 5 acre food plot, 10 or more is better and less of a waste of time. I don't feel like busting out the calculator at this late hour to justify my points, I can do it tomorrow if you'd like.

Now you take the average Joe who lives in town, does not have access to a tractor, plow,the time to do it, etc, etc.

Corn here runs about 8.00 a 50# bag. The ave. feeder holds 300#. If his/her feeder spits out, oh say 5# of corn per day that about 150# per month or 1800# of corn per year if he feeds YEAR ROUND 365 DAYS A YEAR. So he has spent about $300 to feed an entire year, vs $100 per acre or so for something that will last about 4-5 months. So food plots are cheaper where??!!

The problem with food plots here is propably 90% of the fellows who hunt live in town, don't have access to a tractor, plow, etc. so they have to live with corn or hope the farmer/rancher who's land they hunt on will plant oats/wheat for their cattle in order for them to have a food plot.

You don't hand till anything in most of Texas unless you have a jackhammer for the rock. Do that for a couple acres then report back to me.

Most average guys here would give their left you-know-what to have food plots all over the places they hunt, but here for most it is not $$$ feasible. They have to rely on the rancher they lease from to provide it if he needs or wants to provide it for his livestock.

I'm too tired to make any more points now, but I hope you are starting to get a clue.

Bill

Bill,

I have more than a clue.....I have facts.

You can verify here.....This is where I buy my supplies.

http://www.cooperseeds.com

The cost of producing 20,000lbs of quality forage with a food plot versus the cost of the same 20,000lbs of Corn.

Duranna/Patriot Clover Plot Costs (1 Acre)

4lbs of Duranna $32
4lbs of Patriot $32
100lbs of Winter Wheat $50
100lbs of Buck Forage Oats $50
50 lbs of Austrian Winter Peas $35
300lbs of 10-10-10 $150
Tractor Rental Weekend $300
Total $650

Corn
Feeder $200
20,000lbs of Corn $3,200
Gas for trips to refill feeder all year $600
Total $4,000

Even with renting a tractor for the weekend it's much cheaper than filling up a feeder all year.......Unless of course you only fill up the feeder when you plan on hunting or just prior....Which I believe is probably the case for most baiters.

Robert

Bruzer, Just curious. You ever been to Texas and looked at their soil. It would be like trying to plant oats or wheat in a parking lot. Some of the land out there just won't sustain a food plot. I've seen deer walk past corn to get a white oak acorn. I've also seen them prefer a green field over corn. Alot depends on the time of year. We shouldn't bash the Texas folks for hunting in a way that is perfectly legal in their state. Furthermore in my opinion the state of Alabama is backwards in their thinking about baiting, unless of course you have a high fence, then you can do what you darn well please. That's an argument for a different day.

I'm not bashing them.....If they want to hunt over Corn who am I to say it's wrong? I'm simply pointing out that the arguments concerning baiting aren't valid. Bill stated that there are thousands of acres of agriculture where he hunts and then claims that he can't get anything to grow there.Doesn't have a tractor etc.....?Which is it?

I'm done here. I will just say that it's not my cup of tea and hope everyone has a good 2009-2010 Season.

Robert

Bruzer, I understand what you're saying. Shooting 4 points isn't my cup of tea, but it's completly legal....
Just saying, he's not breaking any law by hunting over a feeder. I've done it before and enjoy it. If done responsibly, I see no problem with it, and in fact, hope our state adopts a law alowing it. It's going on now, the state may as well sell permits and get some revenue. Baiting is alive and well in Alabama, and I don't see an end to it. Most folks I know who have gotten a ticket (400 bucks) just say "just part of the cost of hunting"

JMJ,

My favorite saying is "Hunt what you want,When you want,How you want with the weapon of your choice as long as it's leagal and encourage others to do the same."

I lease 1100 acres in Cleburne County Alabama myself.(Your land is much much cheaper than Georgia). We good hunting without any baiting.....Just Food Plots and Fertilized native browse.











Robert

baiting is legal in my state. i own 2 farms and live on one of them. one of the crops grown on both farms is soybeans. the whitetail eat acres of beans every year as the plants are growing, so i do what i can to curb the population. i hunt primarily with a longbow, and have several stands here on this farm. i use beans that i raised as it is legal bait, and kill 7-10 does every year (sometimes more) just in an attempt to ease the deer pressure on the spring bean crop. at one time the state gave me 25 doe tags per year, but i couldn't even give away that many deer. i can understand some people not agreeing with baiting, but in my area the deer will destroy your crop without some form of population control, and a bait pile 15 yards from a stand does and excellent job of getting them within easy bow range. my state game folks came out to the farm and said "yep, you have a deer problem. let us give you 50 control tags and you can shoot them throughout the year, but you have to leave them where they fall." i didn't agree with waisting good meat, so i bait and kill them during the season and give many away.