Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire All out humanitarian effort to Haiti?

I have a carpenter friend who wanted to go with the Catholic missions to Haiti to work for the poor. They selected another person for the trip. When they got off the plane, they were beheaded! My same friend went to Florida after Hugo to help rebuild and on his first day, he scratched his knee. He got an infection that almost killed him. He said the hospital in Florida was so bad he was begging to be flown back to Rhode Island. They wouldn't let him get on a plane.

We're Catholic, and when they pass the plate at church for the missions in Haiti, we'll contribute. When Father Evans from church, who works with the missions comes and says a mass for Haiti, we'll contribute. I've got old people begging me for firewood, and I've got 2 churches asking for venison. I killed 4 deer this year, butchered and donated them all. They want more. I froze my butt off yesterday, and at this point, I'm about ready to repackage a couple cases of bottom round from Sam's club.

Got word yesterday that I will be heading to DR sometime next week for the army. I'm joining a medical unit from California that had already planned to go before the earthquake. I'm not sure what we'll be doing or where we will be, but I'm sure it won't be a pleasant trip.

Screw Haiti, why is it up to the US to go save them? If someone wants to send them money that is all well and good, but I resent the hell out of the government deciding to send my tax money over there ehrn I can't even get services here for our own. Soon another wave of the poor Haitian refugees Will be arriving here in Fl and be met on the dock, given welfare,free housing, food stamps and free medical all paid for with my tax dollars. Boo hoo the poor Haitians every one feel sorry for them, but how many have them standing on street corners selling drugs and robbing people in their neighborhood like I do and all the while having their bills paid with my tax dollars. Screw them all, maybe God was just thinning the herd over there.

Not to mention the aid we send them will mostly be stolen by thier corrupt government officials, let them fix thier own country or perish, the US has been bailing them out for 100 years and they still have not gotten thier [bleep] together, why do you think the DR wants nothing to do with them.

Bring on the flames but the truth is the truth and all the PC BS in the world is not going to change it.

The best thing Hati could do is abolish it's government, drop it's border and become part of the Dominican Republic.

It seems there is no bottom when it comes to the depth of US taxpayers pockets, I fear we will find out in the not so far future just how bad it can get here when our economy collapses under the strain....but I'm sure we will get all kinds of outside help from country's all around the world.........Try to prepare or at least Brace yourself for whats coming!................547.

Mike,

Did you not read my post? The credit rating is according to Institutional Investor and they are NOT the same ones that rated the derivatives. A credit rating is only as good as their analysis, but I would put more credence in their analysis than yours for a few reasons. One being that they do this for a living, as do I, and their process is much more involved than just one person that doesn't have the time or resources. Not that this is always the correct analysis as exhibited by Moody's and S&P, but again we both do this for a living.

Much of what you write is correct, but your conclusions run into problems with facts. Our credit rating is what it is and I bet that the Institutional Investor number is a whole lot closer to correct than what you are inferring. We are still selling our bonds and foreign countries are buying them. I noticed that you didn't point out the advantage of paying off debt with cheaper dollars. There's a fact for you.

Our national debt is at $12 trillion and our country is not bankrupt. You are blurring the lines when you bring in Social Security obligations because those are also funded by payroll taxes and they are entitlements that can and will be modified. Right now they are not enough and it needs to be fixed, but again our country is not bankrupt. If it were, NOBODY would buy our debt.

Mike,

Here is a simple fact that refutes your analysis of our country being bankrupt.

The interest rates on our currently issued debt is at record lows and our dollar is depreciating which makes the effective interest rate even lower to many foreign buyers. The largest buyers of our debt are foreign. The conclusion is that a bankrupt entity would not be able to issue debt at record low rates.

It just doesn't work that way you suggest.

Have you checked the TIC flows lately? They're at record lows. This past auction for 10 and 30 year bonds had a huge drop in indirect buyers-read foreign interests. The results for that auction won't be out for a few weeks, but more recent results will be released on the 19th of January. Here's the most recent TIC data:

www.treas.gov/press/releases/tg443.htm

The reason that the interest rates are low is due to our central bank-the Federal Reserve- buying the bonds. They use their Primary Dealers to purchase them and then two weeks later they repo the bonds. It's called monetization, and it is in effect printing money. This is how our Fed keeps interest rates artificially low.

Most foreign buyers are happy to purchase at the short end of the bond spectrum as it's a cash equivalent, but are very reluctant to do so at the longer end, which is why there is such a steep yield curve right now, almost 285 basis points. The problem with selling debt on the short end is that it has to be rolled over quickly, and we are pushing so much of it out into the market that we're going to have to find buyers for $2.3 Trillion this year alone. Every country is doing the same thing, and that's why the market is saturated with debt. The Fed can only set rates on the short end, and use the monetization trick on the long end, but they are having trouble on the long end, so the yield is creeping up. Buyers are going to demand much higher rates to compensate for the devaluation taking place, or the Fed risks a failed auction.

You may call our debt only $12 trillion if you like, but the other entitlements have to be paid too, and they are increasing because of demographics. They must either be paid, reduced, or defaulted. Just because we're using a budgetary sleight of hand in order to hide this, doesn't mean that it isn't there.

Now that you describe what you do professionally, I understand why you're so adamant that we're not bankrupt; in essence, you're talking your book and have bowed at the altar of the Fed. You believe their propaganda and have probably been trained in either Keynesian or Chicago school economics. Both are frauds which rely on the Ponzi scheme of paper money to have any success. Unfortunately for the country, this Ponzi scheme is coming to an end, as they have every other time they're tried, and it will bring economic and financial devastation never before seen. Haiti will seem like small potatoes when the US FRN$ collapses of it's own weight of debt. Then who will be willing to help us? As I said before, damn few.

Edited to include link

I'll give money to red cross..


One thing I don't understand though. They keep talking on the news about all the trapped people in the rubble, but in every video I see, able bodied men are just standing around like tourists in the streets. WTF is up with that? Why are american search and rescue teams heading there if their own people won't dig through the rubble? They should have plenty of man power to get the job done.

I understand that the chinks, ah, chicomms sent a plane load of stuff over

Yup, they were there FIRST,.....

SRT teams, if I'm not mistaken.

Those folk should be pretty handy about Earthquake recovery,

GTC

For humanity's sake, we should be there in force assisting. As to the (typical) lack of meaningful aid from anywhere else on the globe including the big-mouthed despots of South America - this is our narcissist-in-chief's opportunity to use his big mouth and do as he claimed he would: shame other nations into action. Won't hold my breath, however. Trust his priority is to make it appear, for political gain, how much better his Fed is that Bush's, through good PR and little substance, regarding disaster relief. Again, we'll see....

ditto yep.

"Never waste a good crisis". It'll be interesting to see what stunts the WH tries to pull while the news attention is on Haiti.

I'm kinda' amazed how quiet any coherent response to this "Council Of Governors" E.O. has been,.....

As noted, that place was a pesthole LONG before this latest bump.
What with all the brouhaha 'bout "Pandemics", ....flu shots, etc., I'd still not be surprised to see a MASSIVE influx of New Haitian immigrants.

Do you think MEXICO will offer them some room ?

.....Venezuela ?

Nothing in particular against them,.......as a people, but the "Standing Around" bit is a very perspicacious observation, on your part, C.

GTC

In my original post I asked for opinions knowing that there would be a wide view of the matter.

Personally I'm all for an all out effort in the initial stages, getting the best possible first response medical teams and rescue personal on the ground there as fast as possible.

But I'm then also all for (after the first few months) turning it over to the U.N. or the likes for other nations combined to do the restructuring and rebuilding work.


Phil

I agree with you on getting medical teams/rescue personal there asap but I expect the UN will want the US to pay for rebuilding. I dont know where the US is going to get 100 million in releif to send, guess they will just print it. Anyone know how much The Dominican Rep is sending? I mean their right there are they at least helping? And what about Cuba, are they doing anything?

I wouldn't expect much out of either, but especially the DR. They've hated each other for centuries.

My apologies to the original poster for taking the thread off on a tangent. I would be happy to continue the discussion with Mike in another thread if he wishes.

I'd love to see it. I find the debate quite interesting as well as educating.