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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,783
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,783 |
I guess it depends on your world view. Our culture, our society, and our country is dying for lack of hearing right and wrong, absolute truth and untruth. It has been drinking the Kool aid of relative values for a half century now and the blood work is getting much worse. The patient is sick and getting sicker.
I have two adult daughters so I can role play here. As an earnestly "practicing" Christian, I read in the Bible that homosexuality is an abomination to God. It has very clear words concerning this "lifestyle". There is no equivocating concerning this subject. If I were to learn this about either of my daughters and loving them as I do, I would engage them concerning their very serious moral position. At the same time I'd be exquisitely aware of some of my own sins that are just as abhorrent to God so would flee from taking any position of moral authority in doing so.
Thus, my love would not ebb nor would I banish them either physically or emotionally. While we can not judge hearts as God does, we can judge actions. We do all the time; I would judge the action but I would hope with a good deal of love.
Good post
Will Munny: It's a hell of a thing, killing a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have.
The Schofield Kid: Yeah, well, I guess they had it coming.
Will Munny: We all got it coming, kid.
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 17,109
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 17,109 |
If I were to believe in a God, I'd like to think he'd ask who the f**k I thought I was in judging others who differed from my preconceived notions. Well, if you truly believed in that God of the Bible, your preconceived notions would be those HE conceived. As the POTTER, HE has been known in times past "to take that tone" (if not those words) with us pots who differed with HIS notions. Though HE is forgiving and long suffering, there is a point beyond which that does not work out well.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 |
Playing off another thread, I was curious as to the opinions of the membership as to this question:
If your son or daughter told you they were gay and in love with someone of the same sex, would that somehow change the love you have for that child?
If your best friend said the same thing to you, would the friendship change?
IMO, true love and true friendship can not be impacted by such a dynamic. For those who believe it can, please help me to understand how that irreparable void occurs. Yea it can. Mostly because I don't spend time with people that don't think like me. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 19,822
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 19,822 |
Unconditional love does not necessarily mean unconditional acceptance or approval.
There you have it. My youngest son "came out" when he was 17. I still love him but I cannot approve of his lifestyle. Unconditional love is just that. Ed
"Not in an open forum, where truth has less value than opinions, where all opinions are equally welcome regardless of their origins, rationale, inanity, or truth, where opinions are neither of equal value nor decisive." Ken Howell
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,065
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,065 |
Love is first a choice, you choose to love them...or not.
If it's unconditional, you have chosen to love them regardless of whatever emotional whirlpools come.
The popular concept of "true love" is backwards...growth follows the choice, rather than movie version that it can be found.
Folks maintain relationship by standing on the past choices they have made after everything else has been washed away by the crisis.
Defend the Constitution
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 245
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 245 |
I have a few friends and family who are gay... Althoght I may not agree with their lifestyle choices they are still my friends and family... and if ANYONE f'ck'd with them they'd be f'c'ing with me... Just my beliefs and choice... I'd NEVER turn my back on them just because I don't agree with their life choice... Just sayin'
Kindness is the language the blind can see and the deaf can hear. - Mark Twain
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,309
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,309 |
Plenty of conditions on a real friendship. Being of like mind is certainly a condition of being a friend imo.
Last edited by wisturkeyhunter; 01/09/14.
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,709
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,709 |
Have female friends, one my high school sweetheart, and relatives who are gay and it matters not to me. They are good people that would take care of me on a New York minute. Same would go for my children.
Conduct is the best proof of character.
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786 |
These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,713
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,713 |
No way an honest person could say their kid turning out a homo would not have an effect on them. It just goes so hard against the grain, smacks down any thought of grand kids, and makes you think where you went wrong.
Not saying the kid should be kicked out of a parent's heart or home, but it's unrealistic to say there would be no effect.
Sam......
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Joined: Jul 2006
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Campfire Kahuna
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OP
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 62,043 |
No doubt as to impact and effect, Sam. It's a comforting day when a dad sees his son bringing females over to the house.
For me, shunning a spouse is doable but not one of my children or best friends.
I'm grateful I've not been confronted with the dynamic. My wife has a 50 plus year old friend who is gay and she told us yesterday that her father hasn't spoken to her for over 20 years.
I found that remarkable. I tried to put myself into her father's shoes but they wouldn't fit.
At the same time, I understand Gunner's take on things. It's what makes for horse races, I guess.
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,737
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,737 |
Sure 'true' love can be conditional. I'll bet that Jeffery Dahmer's Mom saw him in a different light.
I think that the homosexual life style is a choice rather then a birth condition. Like the person who decides to live in the mountains, as native/mountain man, or decides to live in a commune, or some other less then optimal life choice. I'll not condem that choice nor will I get in the way of the consequences of those choices.
Jim
"Whensoever the General Government assumes undelegated powers, its acts are unauthoritative, void, and of no force." --Thomas Jefferson
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,250
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,250 |
True love must be unconditional or else it is not love but some sort of a "prize" that must be won or kept by some act of the other person. Pure love, or agape love, is the love of God towards man.
Agape love does not mean freedom of punishment or consequences by the person loved, there are consequences but God loves us even while we're breaking His heart.
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,049
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,049 |
Ive only been around a few gay men, none that I can say I loved. One, a step uncle who I really never got to know. Because of his lifestyle, I kept my distance. Being honest, I think things would change, because I dont want to be around that type of thing.
That said, I did have a woman that I dated in school that after a failed marriage turned gay. Then bisexual. Now has come full circle and only likes men, again. We no longer talk because of some other issue that I spoke of here, but I never treated her any different. I asked myself why a couple times. And I cant answer that. And ive always had that double standard, treating gay men as filth yet gay/bisexual women as something to conquer. I no longer seek that lustful fantasy as I used to, long been fulfilled. But I still see the two on different planes. No love involved maybe? Who knows.
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,250
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,250 |
I would be so disappointed I'm not sure I could fellowship with them. I am raising my sons as Christians and seeing that God calls homosexuality an abomination that is what I teach them. I would continue to pray for them as I do for any other number of things.
I struggle with this and have given it some thought. Humans tend to "rank" our sin from almost acceptable to downright despicable, with homos registering on the Super Evil end of the spectrum. Does God view our sin that way.? What I get from scripture is, sin is sin is SIN... We are all sinners, and sin all the time, even when we don't want to. Paul was struggling with sin in Romans 7. It makes me feel better that he was struggling with it as well... While I find Homosexuality disgusting and a perversion of Nature, is it any more of a Sin than Coveting your neighbors possessions or having an affair with someone other than your wife.? Just some tough questions that have crossed my mind lately... Deerwhacker, I agree with you on every point except that we sin all the time. For this to be true the Scripture that says "He that is in us is greater than he that is in the world" would have no meaning. In our goal to become more Christ like I believe that it is possible to go for quite some time without sinning. We are never totally free from our sin nature so long as we are alive but we are not slaves to sin once we are indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Think about it.
Last edited by MColeman; 01/10/14.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
Wouldn't bother me, in fact I'd welcome it. My friend can now take my wife shoe shopping so I don't have to go....
How about a BEST friend that didn't honor his mother? A true friend that had an affair? A true friend that has seen a hot chick and lusted at her?
I'm pretty sure no one here would have a friend or family member they would talk to if 'picking' them was based on sin.
That said, much like anti-gun, anti-hunting, Obama types that I don't have anything in common with, I think I'd have a tough time with the in common thing with a gay friend.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 19,107
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 19,107 |
I have been studying on this a spell, so my question is not all love conditional? There were some "conditions" that made you love them in the first place that likely varies from person to person, so there is probably some "condition" that will make you stop loving that person. Again what that condition is will likely vary from person. If there were not conditions to loving a person, then you would love everybody. miles
Look out for number 1, don't step in number 2.
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 62,043
Campfire Kahuna
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OP
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 62,043 |
I likely could shun a child who, as a propensity, carried out hate on another but not one who simply loved differently than I do.
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 25,840
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 25,840 |
Yup,when someone is dead to me I have no problem breaking ties...
that course of action has nothing to do with ones sexual oriantaion
My dog is a member of the "Turd Like Clan"
Covert Trail Cameras are JUNK
3 Time Dinkathon Champion #DinkGOAT
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