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Originally Posted by teal
Originally Posted by TexasPhotog
Originally Posted by jorgeI
WEATHERBY.

Adam Weatherby personally called me last night. The narrative below pretty much explains the reason and his personal guarantee to me he's going to make it right. It pays to write a good letter and good companies respond in kind:

SYNOPSIS: I never thought the day would come, but here we are. I recently purchased one of the new "Wyoming Guns" in 7 Mag. This was my third in that caliber, all shot well under MOA. This one however, was a DOG.

So I wrote them a note (below) and followed up with a phone call to their customer service. First they told me there would be a charge of 198 bucks for a "range fee" in order to test the gun. To which I responded, so I'm paying for something you guarantee in writing"? not happening.

Never heard from them so I called them about six weeks ago and they said the gun had been "safety checked" and was awaiting range time. Last week I called back and some irreverant and condescending employee, after first chastising (or trying to) for my "impatience" he proceeded to tell me the gun passed their range test of .89 and .99 using 120gr Barnes TSX ammo. So the gun apparently ONLY shoots with that ammo (see my notes below). Personally, a 120gr is total horseshit in a 7 mag (in my opinion), but had I known this, I would have never even considered it. Suffice it to say, I planned to out them with every publication I know as well as several gun scribes whom I have a personal relationship with, as well as Dallas Safari Club etc. but I figured before I did any of this, I'd Adam Weatherby a note

My letter below:

Mr. Adam Weatherby,
1550 Yellowtail Drive
Sheridan, Wyoming 82801

Dear Mr. Weatherby:

Pursuant to my conversations with customer service, I sent my 7mm Weatherby magnum to you for inspection and evaluation as a result of poor grouping with factory ammo (targets enclosed with rifle). I have been a Weatherby owner since the early 80s. I purchased my first rifle from your old store on Firestone Boulevard in South Gate from your grandfather himself and since then have owned dozens, with my current inventory of six Weatherbys, all MKVs and with them I have taken over three dozen species of game world-wide from Africa to all over the United States. In December 2019, I purchased a pair of your Weathermarks, one in 340 (Paso Robles rifle) and the other a 7mm (Wyoming rifle). The 340 shoots like all other Weatherbys I've owned, well under MOA with most sub half MOA.

However, the 7mm simply does not shoot with any ammunition I tried, both factory Weatherby ammo and my time tested hand loads using the old Weatherby Guide (1985 and older) “Factory Equivalent loads" with Norma MRP. Those loads always grouped exactly like the factory ammo on every Weatherby caliber, including two previous 7mm Weatherbys. I tried 140 gr Barnes TTSXs, 160 gr Nosler Partitions, 154 and 175 grain Hornady Interlocks (both factory ammo and my own hand loads) and the best group was right at 2.5", clearly unsatisfactory and way outside your written .99" guarantee.

While I realize nothing is flawless and I expected your company would make this right, I have to admit I was taken aback when your Customer Service representative (Chip?) informed, me in a condescending way, the rifle was tested and met the accuracy standard using factory 120gr TSX ammunition, which to be honest, is a less than optimum bullet weight for that cartridge and had I known that, I would have never purchased that rifle. Granted, it’s my opinion based on experience, but that caliber is much better suited for 140-160gr bullet weights. Moreover, when he told me I would be charged a 198 dollar "range fee" to correct the problem, in addition to the shipping costs, frankly, I was flabbergasted.
In years past, you used to provide a factory target with each rifle and while I can appreciate and understand your "Range Certified" selling point to justify a higher price that now includes a target, I do not see how you can charge me, the customer to fix a rifle that should have never left your warehouse, not even close to your factory guarantee with REASONABLE bullets weights using your factory ammo. I have to be perfectly up front with you that if I have to pay for this range fee I will do so, but I will have purchased my last Weatherby.

Frankly, I hope that what I heard was in error. You are Weatherby! There is a reason I have purchased and enjoyed Weatherby Rifles over the past 40 years. I am the customer you want, i.e. the loyal repeat customer that sings the praises of America's finest rifles. Weatherby was started by a your grandfather, with a passion for perfection,, not a Wall Street Investment Capital Group. Performance matters. People like me will and do spend more to get more and that means more quality and top customer service, not more run around. You are Weatherby and I had every confidence that your folks would have worked with me on this, but now I was informed the rifle Is on its way back to me and once I received it, I will trade it in or sell it, with the caveat to the prospective buyer, this rifle only shoots with a bullet weight suitable for deer or smaller game. I ever thought the day would come, but here we are. If you would like further information or would like to discuss, I am available anytime

Sincerely,
Jorge

I will keep you guys posted on the outcome, but I know full well it will be fixed.


To be read in a Thurston Howell III voice:


“Men, I had a real problem the other day with a WEATHERBY of all things!

It just wouldn’t shoot worth a darn! Ok, well technically it did shoot sub MOA, but that was only with 120 grain triple shocks and, as we all know, any bullet under 180 grains is unmanly!

Worse, I was rebuffed by an employee who was rude enough to point out that the rifle did, in fact, meet their guarantee! The arrogance!

What was I to do?! Well, let me tell you, I penned a strong letter to Mr. Adam Weatherby! Of course I had to explain to him I’ve been everywhere and done everything, and did it when his dad was just a gleam in his grandad’s eye.

And Adam called me! At home! And held my hand over the phone. Wowwee! Coronavirus or no, I’ll never wash that hand again.

Honestly, I’m relieved. I WAS going to out the company to the world! And let me tell you men, I can be a raging BULL when a company pisses me off by making a product that meets their guarantee. I was prepared to tell on Weatherby to Mr. MuleDeer and other gun “scribes.” And, next time I went to DSC (in my safari hat with the leopard tail hat band), I was going to tell EVERYONE that Weatherby sucks! And then I was going to tell the whole world via the internet! I’m telling you, I had my nasty Yelp review mostly written!

But you can rest easy now men, because I took care of it.

Did I mention Adam Weatherby called me?"



No dog in this but I read that more in a Ted Knight voice. Judge Smails.


Texas Photog's post and the reference to Thurston Howell III were inspired, but Ted Knight is pure genius.



A wise man is frequently humbled.

GB1

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Why do campfire threads have to always take this route?

Plenty of you guys can criticize the O.P. ( Jorge)... but in scanning the rest of the posts after getting thru page 4..
I see no one really address, how they would have handled purchasing a rifle for the amount a Mark V costs,
and it not performing up to the specs as it is sold...

and I guess a real "campfire man" would have taken the responses "Chip" gave the OP, and just been satisfied with it?
while taking the time tho to criticize the OP for not doing so....calling him a snow flake etc..

There are plenty of folks here who come to the campfire to criticize others, while offering no solutions to the post on what they would have done differently.....

And they wonder why so many good folks have left here...

and the same ones that love to criticize others, are the ones that seem to get the most sensitive when they are suddenly in the crosshairs....

now lets watch the accusations fly at me, after posting this....

Jorge... sorta off topic at this point, but glad your situation is taken care of...
you got to the man, who owns the company.. and let him know as a customer you had an issue...

as a person who runs a company, I appreciate it when a customer lets me know about some dissatisfaction that they have, as it allows me to take care of it and make it right... vs relying on someone else to just let it go..

probably a news flash to some critics on here.. both the average person who has a good experience on a situation like this, will normally tell 10 to 12 people about it... someone feels screwed will tell everyone who will listen...

from Adam Weatherby's chair, I'll bet he's glad he had to opportunity to know about it, and to be able to correct it...
regardless of what the campfire 'experts' and critics may think....most of them think they are smarter than everyone else anyway.


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Originally Posted by SpritWalker
Big Stick is a dip sh--...


I'm really not sure why the retards antics are tolerated around here.

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Originally Posted by TexasPhotog
Originally Posted by teal
Originally Posted by TexasPhotog
Originally Posted by jorgeI
WEATHERBY.

Adam Weatherby personally called me last night. The narrative below pretty much explains the reason and his personal guarantee to me he's going to make it right. It pays to write a good letter and good companies respond in kind:

SYNOPSIS: I never thought the day would come, but here we are. I recently purchased one of the new "Wyoming Guns" in 7 Mag. This was my third in that caliber, all shot well under MOA. This one however, was a DOG.

So I wrote them a note (below) and followed up with a phone call to their customer service. First they told me there would be a charge of 198 bucks for a "range fee" in order to test the gun. To which I responded, so I'm paying for something you guarantee in writing"? not happening.

Never heard from them so I called them about six weeks ago and they said the gun had been "safety checked" and was awaiting range time. Last week I called back and some irreverant and condescending employee, after first chastising (or trying to) for my "impatience" he proceeded to tell me the gun passed their range test of .89 and .99 using 120gr Barnes TSX ammo. So the gun apparently ONLY shoots with that ammo (see my notes below). Personally, a 120gr is total horseshit in a 7 mag (in my opinion), but had I known this, I would have never even considered it. Suffice it to say, I planned to out them with every publication I know as well as several gun scribes whom I have a personal relationship with, as well as Dallas Safari Club etc. but I figured before I did any of this, I'd Adam Weatherby a note

My letter below:

Mr. Adam Weatherby,
1550 Yellowtail Drive
Sheridan, Wyoming 82801

Dear Mr. Weatherby:

Pursuant to my conversations with customer service, I sent my 7mm Weatherby magnum to you for inspection and evaluation as a result of poor grouping with factory ammo (targets enclosed with rifle). I have been a Weatherby owner since the early 80s. I purchased my first rifle from your old store on Firestone Boulevard in South Gate from your grandfather himself and since then have owned dozens, with my current inventory of six Weatherbys, all MKVs and with them I have taken over three dozen species of game world-wide from Africa to all over the United States. In December 2019, I purchased a pair of your Weathermarks, one in 340 (Paso Robles rifle) and the other a 7mm (Wyoming rifle). The 340 shoots like all other Weatherbys I've owned, well under MOA with most sub half MOA.

However, the 7mm simply does not shoot with any ammunition I tried, both factory Weatherby ammo and my time tested hand loads using the old Weatherby Guide (1985 and older) “Factory Equivalent loads" with Norma MRP. Those loads always grouped exactly like the factory ammo on every Weatherby caliber, including two previous 7mm Weatherbys. I tried 140 gr Barnes TTSXs, 160 gr Nosler Partitions, 154 and 175 grain Hornady Interlocks (both factory ammo and my own hand loads) and the best group was right at 2.5", clearly unsatisfactory and way outside your written .99" guarantee.

While I realize nothing is flawless and I expected your company would make this right, I have to admit I was taken aback when your Customer Service representative (Chip?) informed, me in a condescending way, the rifle was tested and met the accuracy standard using factory 120gr TSX ammunition, which to be honest, is a less than optimum bullet weight for that cartridge and had I known that, I would have never purchased that rifle. Granted, it’s my opinion based on experience, but that caliber is much better suited for 140-160gr bullet weights. Moreover, when he told me I would be charged a 198 dollar "range fee" to correct the problem, in addition to the shipping costs, frankly, I was flabbergasted.
In years past, you used to provide a factory target with each rifle and while I can appreciate and understand your "Range Certified" selling point to justify a higher price that now includes a target, I do not see how you can charge me, the customer to fix a rifle that should have never left your warehouse, not even close to your factory guarantee with REASONABLE bullets weights using your factory ammo. I have to be perfectly up front with you that if I have to pay for this range fee I will do so, but I will have purchased my last Weatherby.

Frankly, I hope that what I heard was in error. You are Weatherby! There is a reason I have purchased and enjoyed Weatherby Rifles over the past 40 years. I am the customer you want, i.e. the loyal repeat customer that sings the praises of America's finest rifles. Weatherby was started by a your grandfather, with a passion for perfection,, not a Wall Street Investment Capital Group. Performance matters. People like me will and do spend more to get more and that means more quality and top customer service, not more run around. You are Weatherby and I had every confidence that your folks would have worked with me on this, but now I was informed the rifle Is on its way back to me and once I received it, I will trade it in or sell it, with the caveat to the prospective buyer, this rifle only shoots with a bullet weight suitable for deer or smaller game. I ever thought the day would come, but here we are. If you would like further information or would like to discuss, I am available anytime

Sincerely,
Jorge

I will keep you guys posted on the outcome, but I know full well it will be fixed.


To be read in a Thurston Howell III voice:


“Men, I had a real problem the other day with a WEATHERBY of all things!

It just wouldn’t shoot worth a darn! Ok, well technically it did shoot sub MOA, but that was only with 120 grain triple shocks and, as we all know, any bullet under 180 grains is unmanly!

Worse, I was rebuffed by an employee who was rude enough to point out that the rifle did, in fact, meet their guarantee! The arrogance!

What was I to do?! Well, let me tell you, I penned a strong letter to Mr. Adam Weatherby! Of course I had to explain to him I’ve been everywhere and done everything, and did it when his dad was just a gleam in his grandad’s eye.

And Adam called me! At home! And held my hand over the phone. Wowwee! Coronavirus or no, I’ll never wash that hand again.

Honestly, I’m relieved. I WAS going to out the company to the world! And let me tell you men, I can be a raging BULL when a company pisses me off by making a product that meets their guarantee. I was prepared to tell on Weatherby to Mr. MuleDeer and other gun “scribes.” And, next time I went to DSC (in my safari hat with the leopard tail hat band), I was going to tell EVERYONE that Weatherby sucks! And then I was going to tell the whole world via the internet! I’m telling you, I had my nasty Yelp review mostly written!

But you can rest easy now men, because I took care of it.

Did I mention Adam Weatherby called me?"



No dog in this but I read that more in a Ted Knight voice. Judge Smails.


Mr. Teal,

You may have a future as a casting director.

Rufus seems to agree with your call, but I thought Thurston bloviated with the best of them.

Let's take a poll here: who votes for Judge Smails and who votes for Thurston Howell III?



I already have a casting couch, ready to go.

Now if you'all will excuse me, I'll be in my bunk.


Me



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Originally Posted by AU7MM08
Originally Posted by SpritWalker
Big Stick is a dip sh--...


I'm really not sure why the retards antics are tolerated around here.


He adds to the click rate and every click is money in Rick's pocket. If you put Larry on "ignore" he ceases to exist.

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The boy is in serious need of some vitamin P.


There is no way to coexist no matter how many bumper stickers there are on Subaru bumpers!

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Looks like it's time to start beating up on Fug Stick again.


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Originally Posted by 260Remguy
Originally Posted by AU7MM08
Originally Posted by SpritWalker
Big Stick is a dip sh--...


I'm really not sure why the retards antics are tolerated around here.


He adds to the click rate and every click is money in Rick's pocket. If you put Larry on "ignore" he ceases to exist.


Bingo, although he has used aliases before but he wasn't fooling anyone with them.

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Well done Jorge !
How many people send Rugers, Winchesters, or Remingtons back because of issues ?
Look at the bitching about the Kimber roulette !
You took direct measures.
Well done........

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Originally Posted by Seafire
Why do campfire threads have to always take this route?

Plenty of you guys can criticize the O.P. ( Jorge)... but in scanning the rest of the posts after getting thru page 4..
I see no one really address, how they would have handled purchasing a rifle for the amount a Mark V costs,
and it not performing up to the specs as it is sold...

and I guess a real "campfire man" would have taken the responses "Chip" gave the OP, and just been satisfied with it?
while taking the time tho to criticize the OP for not doing so....calling him a snow flake etc..

There are plenty of folks here who come to the campfire to criticize others, while offering no solutions to the post on what they would have done differently.....

And they wonder why so many good folks have left here...

and the same ones that love to criticize others, are the ones that seem to get the most sensitive when they are suddenly in the crosshairs....

now lets watch the accusations fly at me, after posting this....

Jorge... sorta off topic at this point, but glad your situation is taken care of...
you got to the man, who owns the company.. and let him know as a customer you had an issue...

as a person who runs a company, I appreciate it when a customer lets me know about some dissatisfaction that they have, as it allows me to take care of it and make it right... vs relying on someone else to just let it go..

probably a news flash to some critics on here.. both the average person who has a good experience on a situation like this, will normally tell 10 to 12 people about it... someone feels screwed will tell everyone who will listen...

from Adam Weatherby's chair, I'll bet he's glad he had to opportunity to know about it, and to be able to correct it...
regardless of what the campfire 'experts' and critics may think....most of them think they are smarter than everyone else anyway.


"The Democrat Party looks like Titanic survivors. Partying and celebrating one moment, and huddled in lifeboats freezing the next". Hatari 2017

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Originally Posted by Seafire

and I guess a real "campfire man" would have taken the responses "Chip" gave the OP, and just been satisfied with it?
while taking the time tho to criticize the OP for not doing so....calling him a snow flake etc..





Since you run a company:

You have a policy and Chip being an employee is supposed to follow policy. Customer calls and you being the boss expect Chip to follow policy. Now the product is processed thru warranty testing, and after it comes up threw the chain, Chip is told the product was up to specs and here are the reasons. What is Chip supposed to do? Take it on his own to ignore your directive? If you had an entire workforce of Chips who ignored your directives, that would be ok?

Chips response in this case, was the response he was directed to give by upper management.....

We have an obvious pompous, self admitted demanding individual, who likes to apply stress to underlings in order to have things done his way, telling us how Chip supposedly handled his situation. Who you going to believe....

Trump has his work cut out for him, if he thinks he can drain the entire DC bureaucratic swamp....


Addition: Ted Knight gets my vote....

Last edited by battue; 03/06/20.

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Just musing, but I wonder how sincere Mr. Weatherby really was?

Any executive worth his/her sale can smoothly lay on the grease in order to placate a dissatisfied customer.

Not saying that my musings are germane to Jorge's interaction with Mr. Weatherby, but having been on the other side, well, just musing.

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Originally Posted by Oldelkhunter
The Customer is always right without exception especially in the age we live in.


It amazes me how many people think this is correct !

Extensive customer service, face to face sales, management & business ownership experience says different.

The customer, is not always right, but they always come first !

YMMV


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I’ll start by saying that I have always thought Jorge to be a pretty classy dude. It would take a lot more than this to make me think otherwise.

From a sales perspective, I would be glad and grateful that he made me aware of the situation. The train can come off the rails in situations like this, and that isn’t necessary. I’d jump through some hoops to keep him as a loyal customer.

Considering the relationship, I would be a bit taken back, and a bit disappointed, by the tone of the letter. I may also have been a bit disappointed in my customer service representative? No real right or wrong in this whole situation. Everyone involved had a judgment call to make. Sometimes you get it right, sometimes you don’t. I have some very good customers that take a similar approach to a comparable situation. I tend to shake my head, shrug my shoulders, and proceeded to fix the problem. While I consider them “very good” customers, they never become “partner “ accounts. Just sayin.... The bottom line is, if you are a successful organization, you get it right most of the time.

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Originally Posted by battue
]
Originally Posted by Seafire

and I guess a real "campfire man" would have taken the responses "Chip" gave the OP, and just been satisfied with it?
while taking the time tho to criticize the OP for not doing so....calling him a snow flake etc..





Since you run a company:

You have a policy and Chip being an employee is supposed to follow policy. Customer calls and you being the boss expect Chip to follow policy. Now the product is processed thru warranty testing, and after it comes up threw the chain, Chip is told the product was up to specs and here are the reasons. What is Chip supposed to do? Take it on his own to ignore your directive? If you had an entire workforce of Chips who ignored your directives, that would be ok?

Chips response in this case, was the response he was directed to give by upper management.....

We have an obvious pompous, self admitted demanding individual telling us how Chip supposedly handled his situation. Who you going to believe....


EXACTLY. And Adam's response to me was "we are still learning the new process regarding this issue (accuracy guarantee without providing a larget with all their rifles like they used to and letting the customer decide) and your letter served as an indicator we need to revisit our processes". This was specifically valid in the way they achieved the accuracy guarantee which was precisely backwards, instead of tuning the rifles for more appropriate loads (by their own words, the 140-160 grain bullets are preferred), they went through their inventory of ammunition until they found one that barely met specs with vertical stringing, but I'm sure the ankle biters here will come up with some more witty remarks that bring nothing to the discussion, other than their obvious shortcomings and hangups. Maybe next time I'll just expect mediocrity, say nothing even when talked down to and sell the rifle at a loss, but that would be "un-pompous" of me...

Last edited by jorgeI; 03/06/20.

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The only time I had an issue with a bee Adam made it right. And yes Jorge I understand the issue with the 120 loads in the 7 bee. That is like having a 378 bee that shoots only the 235 grain Speers.


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I had the same issue with a Sako finlight 270 that loves 140 grain bullets but won’t shoot 130 grain for it’s life....

I bought the 270 to run 130’s.... Sako practices basically said use 140’s if it doesn’t shoot, then return it.... I choose to rebarrel it..

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Originally Posted by TexasPhotog
[ but that was only with 120 grain triple shocks and, as we all know, any bullet under 180 grains is unmanly!




Originally Posted by TexasPhotog
7 boxes (20 rounds each) of new factory154 grain 7mm Remington Magnum Hornady Whitetail ammo for sale.

These feature the 154 grain Interlock and they dig deep.

They're $32.99/box + shipping at Midway. Midway link

$189 total (that's $27/box) shipped to you in the lower 48.

No trades, thanks.


Maybe you should try those 180gr 7 Mags or maybe the 120s will be gentler on you? On the Ted Knight impression, boy, I'd sure like to talk like that, but let me ask you this: is "deer" a two syllable word for you? Do you spell "acorn" with one or two "r"s and here's the bonus question; how do you spell the lubricant that goes in your crankcase two or three letters?


A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Originally Posted by jorgeI
Originally Posted by battue
]
Originally Posted by Seafire

and I guess a real "campfire man" would have taken the responses "Chip" gave the OP, and just been satisfied with it?
while taking the time tho to criticize the OP for not doing so....calling him a snow flake etc..





Since you run a company:

You have a policy and Chip being an employee is supposed to follow policy. Customer calls and you being the boss expect Chip to follow policy. Now the product is processed thru warranty testing, and after it comes up threw the chain, Chip is told the product was up to specs and here are the reasons. What is Chip supposed to do? Take it on his own to ignore your directive? If you had an entire workforce of Chips who ignored your directives, that would be ok?

Chips response in this case, was the response he was directed to give by upper management.....

We have an obvious pompous, self admitted demanding individual telling us how Chip supposedly handled his situation. Who you going to believe....


EXACTLY. And Adam's response to me was "we are still learning the new process regarding this issue (accuracy guarantee without providing a larget with all their rifles like they used to and letting the customer decide) and your letter served as an indicator we need to revisit our processes". This was specifically valid in the way they achieved the accuracy guarantee which was precisely backwards, instead of tuning the rifles for more appropriate loads (by their own words, the 140-160 grain bullets are preferred), they went through their inventory of ammunition until they found one that barely met specs with vertical stringing, but I'm sure the ankle biters here will come up with some more witty remarks that bring nothing to the discussion, other than their obvious shortcomings and hangups. Maybe next time I'll just expect mediocrity, say nothing even when talked down to and sell the rifle at a loss, but that would be "un-pompous" of me...



I can't read Weatherby's mind re him thinking you being pompous or not. I can make a conclusion from what you present here. Seems as if a little stress has you on edge....hea???? you deserve it, enjoy the squirm....

Last edited by battue; 03/06/20.

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Originally Posted by battue
[ Seems as if a little stress has you on edge....hea???? you deserve it, enjoy the squirm....


Stress, from an internet "discussion" with someone I don't know? obviously your bar for stress is several orders of magnitude below mine. Maybe your senior center has a class for that..


A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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