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Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JohnBurns] #14903894 05/23/20
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Gunwerks media statement dated May 22 said they paid everything off and its full speed ahead. So someone is either lying or exaggerated the financial problems.


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Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: jimy] #14903921 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by jimy
Originally Posted by irfubar
For the record I have no skin in this game and have never met Davidson. I simply feel somebody needs to stand up for the small business man..... too many buy into the class envy hate corporations leftist narrative.....

Bunch of fuggin wannabe's..... shameful


I support them , I own a small tool shop, and the banks are your enemies, for me it was the only place I could get the money, I borrowed 20 grand and had to put my house up for guaranteed pay back , [bleep] them !



this is the type of mentality......or lack of it I don't understand.....you needed money....they where the only place that you could get it....


the basturds actually wanted some collateral and you say fugg them...….you should probably be thankful…..you now own a small tool shop...bob

Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: adam32] #14903940 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by adam32


John,

Have you gotten a check?


The finale invoice has not been sent for a project that has drawn on for years.

Originally Posted by mirage243
Originally Posted by Aaron_Davidson
At least the part where I paid Wells Fargo nearly 3m bucks today is true!

It's easy to verify that we are not delinquent on sales tax.

Do we have any vendors claiming delinquent payments?

Read my statement again.


I'd sue the sheit out of somebody if I were you.


For what?

Nobody likes Wells Fargo but if they filed suit in Fed Court for nearly 3 million and got paid nearly 3 million 2 days later it's hard to see what would be the claim in a counter suit.


Originally Posted by MIKEWERNER
Well, let’s hear it. How ‘not fun’ has it been?

How much are you currently ‘owed’?

Originally Posted by JohnBurns
Originally Posted by huntsman22
I don't see how you can get that far behind, unless you're crooked as bleep.....


LOL.

They owe us money.

It's not been fun.




Not quite ready for the full disclosure as there is still a slight chance things can be worked out.


John Burns

Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: MIKEWERNER] #14903952 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by MIKEWERNER
Is it any crazier than paying $400 for a cooler with a particular name on it’s side?



Similar, but a $400 cooler is more within the means of most that make poor financial decisions.



Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: UNCCGrad] #14904318 05/23/20
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Within our means perhaps.

Personally would rather boast (if I did) about how ‘inexpensive’ my purchase prices were.

There are folks that like to brag about how much they paid, the other way. Money-no-object people.

Originally Posted by UNCCGrad
Originally Posted by MIKEWERNER
Is it any crazier than paying $400 for a cooler with a particular name on it’s side?



Similar, but a $400 cooler is more within the means of most that make poor financial decisions.


"Those that think they know everything are annoying those of us that have Google." - Dr. D. Edward Wilkinson

Note to self: Never ask an old Fogey how he is doing today.
Revised note to self: Keep it short when someone asks how I am doing.

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Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: BobMt] #14904635 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by BobMt
Originally Posted by jimy
Originally Posted by irfubar
For the record I have no skin in this game and have never met Davidson. I simply feel somebody needs to stand up for the small business man..... too many buy into the class envy hate corporations leftist narrative.....

Bunch of fuggin wannabe's..... shameful


I support them , I own a small tool shop, and the banks are your enemies, for me it was the only place I could get the money, I borrowed 20 grand and had to put my house up for guaranteed pay back , [bleep] them !



this is the type of mentality......or lack of it I don't understand.....you needed money....they where the only place that you could get it....


the basturds actually wanted some collateral and you say fugg them...….you should probably be thankful…..you now own a small tool shop...bob


I put up a house valued well over 100 grand that I owned free and clear to borrow 20 grand, a little more than "some collateral " , yes f~ck them !


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Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: jimy] #14904702 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by jimy
Originally Posted by BobMt
Originally Posted by jimy
Originally Posted by irfubar
For the record I have no skin in this game and have never met Davidson. I simply feel somebody needs to stand up for the small business man..... too many buy into the class envy hate corporations leftist narrative.....

Bunch of fuggin wannabe's..... shameful


I support them , I own a small tool shop, and the banks are your enemies, for me it was the only place I could get the money, I borrowed 20 grand and had to put my house up for guaranteed pay back , [bleep] them !



this is the type of mentality......or lack of it I don't understand.....you needed money....they where the only place that you could get it....


the basturds actually wanted some collateral and you say fugg them...….you should probably be thankful…..you now own a small tool shop...bob


I put up a house valued well over 100 grand that I owned free and clear to borrow 20 grand, a little more than "some collateral " , yes f~ck them !


It sounds like your house was the only thing you owned that could be used at collateral, it doesn't matter if it was worth $500k when it's your only possession to use as collateral.

You could've gotten an unsecured business loan but your interest rate would've been a lot higher, as it should be on a high risk loan.

You could've always gotten a loan from a private investor if you hate banks so much.

Would you loan someone $20k with zero mechanism to recoup your money if they stopped paying?



Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JohnBurns] #14904761 05/23/20
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A lot of people have pointed out that Wells Fargo isn't to be trusted and I think that's a critical point. I believe Wells Fargo is based in San Francisco. I have an old college acquaintance that is in upper management at Wells Fargo. He is on the extreme left politically and being in San Fransisco its likely a lot of his coworkers are too.

Under the Obama administration many banks went after gun manufacturers and used what I would call unethical business practices to make things difficult for gun related businesses. I can't help but wonder if some of that mentality is still at work.

I worked on a project for Wells Fargo while in MBA school. They wanted some ideas on how they could attract more business. I had a reputation as a creative problem solver with out of the box ideas and because that's what they said they were looking for my professor recommend me for the project.

After looking into it and estimating the conversion cost of recruiting new customers I came to a conclusion that was not well received by Wells Fargo. I determined they would be much better off to change some business practices in an attempt to keep current customers than to try to recruit new ones. They were loosing a lot of customers because of the poor way they treated them. I looked through a lot of data and read hundreds of reviews. After my experience with them I determined that I will never do business with Wells Fargo.

I had a poor experience with gunwerks on a chambering job and wasn't treated well by a couple of people there. However, when it became fairly obvious to me that someone may be embezzling from them I didn't hesitate to make a call. I was obviously bringing the kind of news no business owner is happy to hear but Aaron Davidson took my call himself and treated me with respect.

It's obvious that this thing is more complicated and involved than it looks on the surface. Time will tell us what really happened here. I won't do business with Wells Fargo and I'm not in the premium turn key market segment that Gunwerks is positioned for either. If Wells Fargo really made untrue statements in their filing I hope they pay for it.

Bb

Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: adam32] #14904793 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by adam32
Originally Posted by jimy
Originally Posted by BobMt
Originally Posted by jimy
Originally Posted by irfubar
For the record I have no skin in this game and have never met Davidson. I simply feel somebody needs to stand up for the small business man..... too many buy into the class envy hate corporations leftist narrative.....

Bunch of fuggin wannabe's..... shameful


I support them , I own a small tool shop, and the banks are your enemies, for me it was the only place I could get the money, I borrowed 20 grand and had to put my house up for guaranteed pay back , [bleep] them !



this is the type of mentality......or lack of it I don't understand.....you needed money....they where the only place that you could get it....


the basturds actually wanted some collateral and you say fugg them...….you should probably be thankful…..you now own a small tool shop...bob


I put up a house valued well over 100 grand that I owned free and clear to borrow 20 grand, a little more than "some collateral " , yes f~ck them !


It sounds like your house was the only thing you owned that could be used at collateral, it doesn't matter if it was worth $500k when it's your only possession to use as collateral.

You could've gotten an unsecured business loan but your interest rate would've been a lot higher, as it should be on a high risk loan.

You could've always gotten a loan from a private investor if you hate banks so much.

Would you loan someone $20k with zero mechanism to recoup your money if they stopped paying?


no he got fugged straight up......I see that now...they should have kissed his ass....given him money out of the goodness of their heart.
hes probably a good ole boy whose word is his bond...and he dosent suffer fools...bla bla bla…..bob

Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JohnBurns] #14904823 05/23/20
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I wish them well. I love small businesses to succeed.


Go Broncos!
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Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: Burleyboy] #14904881 05/23/20
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I'm responding to the whole thread, just read it

Originally Posted by Burleyboy
A few years ago all of the gunshops and pawnshops around Idaho Falls had new GW rangefinders and scopes for sale on consignment. I found it odd and knew most of the shops so I asked around and they had all been consigned by the same person.

I knew the name and knew he worked at gunwerks because they screwed up a chamber job on a 7 lrm for me and he was one of the guys that jerked me around on the deal.

Seemed pretty obvious that the stuff was embezzled goods so I called Aaron Davidson and let him know. He was a little surprised because he said the guy was one of his brothers best friends but did say a lot of stuff was missing. I talked to his brother a few times and he really seemed shady so I wouldn't surprise me he has friends like that.

They were advertising for a director of marketing a few years back and advertising it at about 200k a year. I have an MBA in marketing and 14 years experience so my friend kept telling me to apply for it. I told my friend I'd had some experience with them and didn't think they were honest so I wasn't even going to bother looking into it. He thought I was crazy and kept telling me it was a dream job. I just told him I'm no longer going to waste my time trying to build a career with people I don't trust.

Bb


If a business was short on money, and morals, while being long on
inventory and balls...."Embezzled" goods, sold for cash on consignment,
would be a hugely profitable venture.
Did they do that? No way to know. Hope not, I like to
give people the benefit of a doubt.
Was anyone fired and/or charged?



Everyone is down on WF. Never delt with them, don't
have any around here.
I trust no big business, especially fianiancial and insurance companies.
There is one person in this world who wants the best for me. Me.
Many will be honest, many will not.

If you borrow money, it's on you to understand the terms and
conditions. The bank is required to do the Truth in Lending thing.
But it's on you.

Signing our mortgage terrified me.
I knew I was on the hook for a lot, and that the lender was not my friend.
(Even though the writer was my cousin. The only comforting part)

WF made a deal.
It wasn't followed.
When it was, things worked out.
Don't let prejudice against one party affect your judgement.


I'm an American, we kneel to no man.
Only to God!

The Alabama section of Pennsylvania.
Where we cling to our God and Guns.
Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: Dillonbuck] #14904924 05/23/20
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I do believe the person I suspected of embezzlement from them was let go soon after I reported my suspicion. I can also say that based on Aaron's response when I reported it he was blindsided by it.

I wasn't really accurate in my first comment about the timeline. This happened more than just a few years ago. It was probably something more around 6-7 years ago and before they seemed to be expanding as a fast as they have the last few years. If Aaron was guilty of anything at that time in my opinion it was not having great inventory control measures in place.

Embezzlement happens to many small businesses and it's often committed by a family friend or person of trust. I'm not their #1 fan but wouldn't be fair to suggest what I said was something much more nefarious than I thought it was. I really believe it was a rogue employee.

I also found a kid in Blackfoot that was selling lots of Gunwerks brass and berger bullets along with "surplus powders". He sold a bullet puller he said he had patented too. I asked him were he got all the ammo components and he said it came as loaded ammo from the same guy that was consigning the rangefinders and scopes. He was buying it cheap from him and pulling it down. Not a plan that would seem to have come from the top as it probably netted pennies on the dollar.

Bb


Last edited by Burleyboy; 05/23/20.
Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JohnBurns] #14905001 05/23/20
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Never meant to suggest anything about what you had to say.
Just my thoughts on a maybe...
Good to think it wasn't the case.

It all is sounding like a screw up. That will be resolved.
Their product isn't my cup if tea in any way other than
being accurate. So I don't really GAS.

I do hope whatever the deal involving John is resolved.
He has showed a bit of class not using this opportunity to
air the dirt, and get sycophants to pile on,


I'm an American, we kneel to no man.
Only to God!

The Alabama section of Pennsylvania.
Where we cling to our God and Guns.
Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: BobMt] #14905025 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by BobMt
Originally Posted by adam32
Originally Posted by jimy
Originally Posted by BobMt


this is the type of mentality......or lack of it I don't understand.....you needed money....they where the only place that you could get it....

the basturds actually wanted some collateral and you say fugg them...….you should probably be thankful…..you now own a small tool shop...bob


I put up a house valued well over 100 grand that I owned free and clear to borrow 20 grand, a little more than "some collateral " , yes f~ck them !


It sounds like your house was the only thing you owned that could be used at collateral, it doesn't matter if it was worth $500k when it's your only possession to use as collateral.

You could've gotten an unsecured business loan but your interest rate would've been a lot higher, as it should be on a high risk loan.

You could've always gotten a loan from a private investor if you hate banks so much.

Would you loan someone $20k with zero mechanism to recoup your money if they stopped paying?


no he got fugged straight up......I see that now...they should have kissed his ass....given him money out of the goodness of their heart.
hes probably a good ole boy whose word is his bond...and he dosent suffer fools...bla bla bla…..bob



And after a couple of years payments , the value of my home went up my debt went down , yet I was still on hand to lose over a 100 grand on a debt of less than 10 grand , by the third year of the 5 year note I had paid them in full. I owed them nothing Zero , yet because of a little clause on one of the dozens of pages of the loan guarantee, they still held my home until the full 60 month term of the loan was up , a full two years after being paid in full. Their answer to this was that I could always borrow more money from them, and they knew that my extra effort to pay them early, simply prevented me from shopping for a better bank. This was National City bank, who not surprisingly is now bankrupt and out of business, once again F~ck them !


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Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: Burleyboy] #14905032 05/23/20
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"I determined they would be much better off to change some business practices in an attempt to keep current customers than to try to recruit new ones. They were loosing a lot of customers because of the poor way they treated them."

You had it figured out, too bad they didn't listen.

Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JohnBurns] #14905035 05/23/20
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I've owned several businesses myself. Not one time did someone hog-tie me, weld a pen in my hand, and make me sign loan documents. If I didn't know what was in there completely before signing it was my fault. Don't like the terms, borrow someone else's money.


There is nothing that enters a man from outside which can defile him; but the things which come out of him, those are the things that defile a man.
Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JohnBurns] #14905056 05/23/20
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I getta' kick outta' John Squirms starting this Thread on at least (3) Sites.

Bless her heart.

LAUGHING!...................


Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JGRaider] #14905058 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by JGRaider
I've owned several businesses myself. Not one time did someone hog-tie me, weld a pen in my hand, and make me sign loan documents. If I didn't know what was in there completely before signing it was my fault. Don't like the terms, borrow someone else's money.


Nor me, I was younger and dumber , I've never made that mistake again, but to them, it wasn't an error, it was a business plan, a bad one at that. Their crooked ways ended their business, I learned from it , I learned that bankers are not there to help you, but to help themselves, at any cost .


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Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: Judman] #14905074 05/23/20
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Originally Posted by Judman
How they even came close to start a bidness selling $10,000 rifles is beyond me... and to think there’s dumbfucks here trying to peddle used ones is even more dumb. And then there’s arrons $3500 scopes ... 😂😂😂🖕🏿🤭😘


I have a friend with a Revic scope. He says its an amazing piece of kit and worth every cent. As far as their rifles, you can't fault GW if they've found there's alot of guys who'll pay $10,000 for a rifle they could have for $2500.00.


Tarquin
Re: Wells Fargo sues Gunwerks [Re: JohnBurns] #14905079 05/23/20
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Still waiting for John Burns to weigh in. He started this thread. John? John?


Tarquin
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