Albert was a pretty smart guy “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish.”
Yet he couldn't make even one cell, much less the smallest of a human hair.
Dividing cells, life in general is no doubt a amazing miracle, I just dont believe it is due to divine intervention, hard to just blindly accept traditional christian beliefs that are meant to somehow explain what you cant see, smell, hear or physically feel.... yet evolution is clearly evident........
Are you using "yet evolution is clearly evident" meaning from the Big Bang to the present? Other than life exists what evidence is there for abiogenesis?
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
I merely conveyed the proposition that there's plenty of room for interpretation, within the Genesis account of creation and man's origin, without contradicting what we understand to be true via scientific discovery. They are not mutually exclusive.
“As faith is a belief held without the support of evidence it is a position that needs constant reinforcement, church, fellowship, reading selected material, etc. So if someone questions the faith, they are a threat to the faith.”
You clearly state that faith is a belief held without the support of evidence. I then quoted Hebrews 11:1….”“.... faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see....”
Faith like I am describing is not a belief held without the support of evidence. Let me delve into that.
See John 14:23…” Jesus replied, If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.”
Let me repeat…. “…we will make our home with him.”
See also, John 15:3…. “Remain in me and I will remain in you.”
When God is in you, when the Holy Spirit witnesses to your inner being, there is no doubt about it. This is not blind faith at all. It is belief based on a living and active relationship with God Himself.
So, how does this come about? The thief on the cross …. Luke 23…..knew he was a criminal and only a few crucial words are spoken…”Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom. He replied to him, ‘Amen I say to you today you will be with me in Paradise.”
There is another example….Luke 18 ….. the Pharisee prayed but prayed out of pride…. then….the tax collector prayed….”But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’ (Jesus then said…) I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God…..”
So, it is as simple as that…. here it is re-phrased: “Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.”
Then, God comes into your inner being and then, YOU KNOW.
Circular reasoning is a logical fallacy, not evidence.
Oh, it is indeed evidence. Not proof for you, but testimony. Testimony. Think about it. Testimony is accepted in courts of law.
It is also an explanation for the origin of faith.
Heard a story once about a man blind from birth who denied the existence of light because he had never seen it, never felt it and he rejected the testimony of the sighted people around him.
The tax collector said: “Lord Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.” Jesus said he went home “justified.”
Why are you so uncomfortable with us believers? It's to comfort YOURSELF.
It aint uncomfort with believers. Its hearing some of them spew their pieholes about it and condeming others for not falling in line lock step in what they believe to be their mission to save someone else's soul. And feeling fugging smug about it all while doing it.
I dont need anyone to set me straight about what I beleive. Espeically when their are a million six christain religons all reading outta different versions of gods book. Cut copied and pasted by those men with power thruout time on what they wanted in it or out of it. Then throw benjamins into the equation.
Just saying.....
renegade50, you seem to be missing in some education. I didn't get permission from either of the following so punch me in the head next time you see me. Take a look at this quote from Doc Rocket responding to antlers.
Originally Posted By antlers If ones personal faith and belief in The Messiah is threatened by what others say or believe, or by what ancient manuscripts contain...then maybe the problem isn't with what others say or believe, or with what ancient manuscripts contain. Answered by Doc Rocket
Well, you're kind of right about this, on a basic level.
However, it appears you are not up to speed on the history surrounding the Canon of New Testament scripture, nor the Judeo-Christian tradition of debate over minutiae! Don't worry, you're not alone. I doubt that 1 Christian in 10 in the USA knows even the basic history of the First Century Church. Nonbelievers, maybe 1 in 1000.
The first thing, i.e., why are we Christians so quick to argue about What others say and believe about the Christian faith, is because what we ALL say about our faith matters to EVERY Christian believer. The traditions of Judaism, outlined in the Torah and multiple rabbinical texts, argue that discussion of every new viewpoint on Scripture is not just desirable, but a mandatory exercise in the Jewish religion. And Christianity, which is nothing more nor less than the fulfillment of the Jewish religion in the person, life works, and teachings of Jesus, has followed that tradition for millennia.
So that's why we argue about it. It's our tradition. If you don't like our tradition, butt out and go take care of your own traditions. I'm not being mean or angry here, I'm just sayin'.
The second thing: why does every new "ancient" text or artifact that pops up stir up immediate opposition by so many Christians? Well, it's because our faith is founded on a very carefully selected set of writings from the first century A.D. While some non-Christians (i.e., outsiders who don't "get" our traditions) may take delight in promoting "new" texts that appear to contradict the Canon of Scripture--because they're mostly ch!tt-disturbers, in my experience--these texts are almost always the same old crap that's been popping up since the 2nd or 3rd century, and which has been cataloged in the Pulp Fiction aisle of the theological library for the better part of 2000 years.
99% of Christians are largely ignorant of the history of the early Church, from the time of the Acts of the Apostles to the Fall of Jerusalem in AD 70. This was a time of enormous expansion of the Church, but the very cool part about it was that while the number of Christians exploded over the course of a few decades, the geographic expansion was very small. This meant that pretty much EVERYone knew somebody who actually knew, was taught by, and witnessed the miracles of Jesus. And the Jews, who comprised the early majority of Christians, were/are real sticklers for THE TRUTH.
This means nobody could bullsh!t about the Gospel of Christ. Posers were recognized and cast out immediately. You couldn't hide behind an internet handle in those days. You were either the real deal, or you got stoned to death. Sometimes you even got stoned to death if you WERE the real deal, so being a poser wasn't exactly a high-paying gig, you know what I'm saying? Oh, and keep in mind that in the First Century it wasn't like today, when any schmoe can write a book and publish it online... if you wrote a book then, the only way it got published was if other people agreed that it was really good stuff, and copied it out by hand for other folks to read.
So the people who actually wrote down the life, words, teachings, and miracles of Jesus were guys who actually knew him. If someone didn't really know him and TELL THE TRUTH as it was known by hundreds of first-hand witnesses, their scribblings would've been ignored. If not burned and the author stoned to death. By the early 2nd Century, the de facto Canon of Scripture we know as the New Testament had been pretty much agreed upon by the vast majority of Church leaders and scholars, based on a very tight-knit history they all shared.
Mark wrote his Gospel first, probably within about 20 years of Jesus' death and resurrection. John's gospel was probably written within a few years of the Fall of Jerusalem, Matthew and Luke somewhere in between. Lots of other folks wrote down their memories of the events, too, but for the most part these were ignored by the Church because the majority of the Churches thought they were incomplete, contained too many untruths, or were flawed in other ways. The four main Gospels were endorsed and widely circulated as a result.
Now, there were some dissenters (as there always are in human affairs) and they started up their own versions of church that were anywhere from slightly wonky to batsh!t-crazy. And by the early 3rd Century, enough of these outliers existed that the orthodox Church had no choice but to lay down the law--in keeping with ancient Judeo-Christian traditions of heterodoxy--and they held a series of councils in which the majority of Christian leaders and scholars said what was the truest material in keeping with the historical writings of Church Fathers. All of batsh!t-crazy gospels were ch!tt-canned at that time, but all manner of non-believers keep bringing them up as "proof" against the Christian religion.
So that's why we care about somebody resurrecting (pun intended) some piece of batsh!t-crazy "Christian" writing from the 6th Century. Our forefathers worked really, really hard to clean up the true story about Jesus for us. They paid for it with their blood and their very lives, and we owe them a debt for that.
And that's why we tend to be derisive and dismissive about "ancient" texts that get "discovered" that were written at least 500 years after the Biblical texts we endorse. It's part of our tradition.
People who aren't Bible-believing Christians can say and think what they like for themselves, but they can't expect us not to defend our religion, our tradition, our history is something precious to us, and we don't care to have fools who are ignorant of our tradition and our history to pass off their ignorance as valid opinion.
Not missing any education... Nice innuendo shot attempt though. Which is typical of people that wanta preach to people that dont wanta hear them spread their belief. A mission from god. With just a little smugness for a side dish......
Canons were conducted by men not divine beings. Men with power or men with power behind them deciding and influencing what they wanted in the bible thruout various times .
King charles lost his head basically as a result from his Father king james creating his bible and all that was lost in its translations coming outta the protestant reformation times... Those 2 cats thought they were devine and above god also.
The KJV bible endures to this day. Cut copied pasted edited by man in the 1600,s...... Even had a little tiff associated with it called the english civil war...
Why are you so uncomfortable with us believers? It's to comfort YOURSELF.
It aint uncomfort with believers. Its hearing some of them spew their pieholes about it and condeming others for not falling in line lock step in what they believe to be their mission to save someone else's soul. And feeling fugging smug about it all while doing it.
I dont need anyone to set me straight about what I beleive. Espeically when their are a million six christain religons all reading outta different versions of gods book. Cut copied and pasted by those men with power thruout time on what they wanted in it or out of it. Then throw benjamins into the equation.
Just saying.....
renegade50, you seem to be missing in some education. I didn't get permission from either of the following so punch me in the head next time you see me. Take a look at this quote from Doc Rocket responding to antlers.
Originally Posted By antlers If ones personal faith and belief in The Messiah is threatened by what others say or believe, or by what ancient manuscripts contain...then maybe the problem isn't with what others say or believe, or with what ancient manuscripts contain. Answered by Doc Rocket
Well, you're kind of right about this, on a basic level.
However, it appears you are not up to speed on the history surrounding the Canon of New Testament scripture, nor the Judeo-Christian tradition of debate over minutiae! Don't worry, you're not alone. I doubt that 1 Christian in 10 in the USA knows even the basic history of the First Century Church. Nonbelievers, maybe 1 in 1000.
The first thing, i.e., why are we Christians so quick to argue about What others say and believe about the Christian faith, is because what we ALL say about our faith matters to EVERY Christian believer. The traditions of Judaism, outlined in the Torah and multiple rabbinical texts, argue that discussion of every new viewpoint on Scripture is not just desirable, but a mandatory exercise in the Jewish religion. And Christianity, which is nothing more nor less than the fulfillment of the Jewish religion in the person, life works, and teachings of Jesus, has followed that tradition for millennia.
So that's why we argue about it. It's our tradition. If you don't like our tradition, butt out and go take care of your own traditions. I'm not being mean or angry here, I'm just sayin'.
The second thing: why does every new "ancient" text or artifact that pops up stir up immediate opposition by so many Christians? Well, it's because our faith is founded on a very carefully selected set of writings from the first century A.D. While some non-Christians (i.e., outsiders who don't "get" our traditions) may take delight in promoting "new" texts that appear to contradict the Canon of Scripture--because they're mostly ch!tt-disturbers, in my experience--these texts are almost always the same old crap that's been popping up since the 2nd or 3rd century, and which has been cataloged in the Pulp Fiction aisle of the theological library for the better part of 2000 years.
99% of Christians are largely ignorant of the history of the early Church, from the time of the Acts of the Apostles to the Fall of Jerusalem in AD 70. This was a time of enormous expansion of the Church, but the very cool part about it was that while the number of Christians exploded over the course of a few decades, the geographic expansion was very small. This meant that pretty much EVERYone knew somebody who actually knew, was taught by, and witnessed the miracles of Jesus. And the Jews, who comprised the early majority of Christians, were/are real sticklers for THE TRUTH.
This means nobody could bullsh!t about the Gospel of Christ. Posers were recognized and cast out immediately. You couldn't hide behind an internet handle in those days. You were either the real deal, or you got stoned to death. Sometimes you even got stoned to death if you WERE the real deal, so being a poser wasn't exactly a high-paying gig, you know what I'm saying? Oh, and keep in mind that in the First Century it wasn't like today, when any schmoe can write a book and publish it online... if you wrote a book then, the only way it got published was if other people agreed that it was really good stuff, and copied it out by hand for other folks to read.
So the people who actually wrote down the life, words, teachings, and miracles of Jesus were guys who actually knew him. If someone didn't really know him and TELL THE TRUTH as it was known by hundreds of first-hand witnesses, their scribblings would've been ignored. If not burned and the author stoned to death. By the early 2nd Century, the de facto Canon of Scripture we know as the New Testament had been pretty much agreed upon by the vast majority of Church leaders and scholars, based on a very tight-knit history they all shared.
Mark wrote his Gospel first, probably within about 20 years of Jesus' death and resurrection. John's gospel was probably written within a few years of the Fall of Jerusalem, Matthew and Luke somewhere in between. Lots of other folks wrote down their memories of the events, too, but for the most part these were ignored by the Church because the majority of the Churches thought they were incomplete, contained too many untruths, or were flawed in other ways. The four main Gospels were endorsed and widely circulated as a result.
Now, there were some dissenters (as there always are in human affairs) and they started up their own versions of church that were anywhere from slightly wonky to batsh!t-crazy. And by the early 3rd Century, enough of these outliers existed that the orthodox Church had no choice but to lay down the law--in keeping with ancient Judeo-Christian traditions of heterodoxy--and they held a series of councils in which the majority of Christian leaders and scholars said what was the truest material in keeping with the historical writings of Church Fathers. All of batsh!t-crazy gospels were ch!tt-canned at that time, but all manner of non-believers keep bringing them up as "proof" against the Christian religion.
So that's why we care about somebody resurrecting (pun intended) some piece of batsh!t-crazy "Christian" writing from the 6th Century. Our forefathers worked really, really hard to clean up the true story about Jesus for us. They paid for it with their blood and their very lives, and we owe them a debt for that.
And that's why we tend to be derisive and dismissive about "ancient" texts that get "discovered" that were written at least 500 years after the Biblical texts we endorse. It's part of our tradition.
People who aren't Bible-believing Christians can say and think what they like for themselves, but they can't expect us not to defend our religion, our tradition, our history is something precious to us, and we don't care to have fools who are ignorant of our tradition and our history to pass off their ignorance as valid opinion.
Not missing any education... Nice innuendo shot attempt though. Which is typical of people that wanta preach to people that dont wanta hear them spread their belief. A mission from god. With just a little smugness for a side dish......
Canons were conducted by men not divine beings. Men with power or men with power behind them deciding and influencing what they wanted in the bible thruout various times .
King charles lost his head basically as a result from his Father king james creating his bible and all that was lost in its translations coming outta the protestant reformation times... Those 2 cats thought they were devine and above god also.
The KJV bible endures to this day. Cut copied pasted edited by man in the 1600,s...... Even had a little tiff associated with it called the english civil war...
Getting deep!
I agree with the editing...... copy paste to fit some narrative.
This short, but Great message is why I reconsidered the religion that I was heavily Indoctrinated in since I was in preschool! None of us know it all, especially a preschooler...but I believed my religion throughout childhood and adolescence as much as anyone here. If you have the courage, you will ask God of the Bible if He will convince you of the truth before and after watching it.
The RELIGION of Evol-utionism started long before Charley Darwin. It was started by someone who said, "Hath God said..?" Undermining God's integrity, calling Him a liar.
Then the father of the alternative religion opposed to friendship with God said, "Ye shall not surely die.". Again calling God a liar and deceiving an intelligent person...a genius, yet gullible. I'm not criticizing the woman, just giving the plain facts....just like most men are. We've been raised by the gt (public fool system), to despise God like the devil and choose to believe that religion's teachings without question. They teach us that we came from a rock and that eventually we shall be as gods.
Third, Satan, the guru of what eventually became a major doctrine of the Hindu religion said, ..."You shall be as god's..."
In a nutshell, keep in mind that Jesus IS THE CREATOR. He demonstrated it to over 10, 000 eye witnesses when He preached to them on multiple occasions He CREATED meals for them. "In Whom we have redemption through His blood, even the forgiveness of sins....ALL things were created by Him..." John chapter 1 That's easier for me to believe than other religions that teach that you are continually improving until someday you will be like a god..😄 1. "Let God be true and EVERY MAN a liar". We have ALL lied and there is a consequence called hell, no matter what Satan says. God can't do something. What is that? He can NOT lie. As it is written,
"All liars shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Even the little white ones? Yup, all of them. And it's not just lies, it's all wrong... including the things we know that we should do, but don't. Revelation 21:8
2. No matter how uncomfortable it may be, You ARE going to die someday. "For the wages of sin is death." Romans 6:23
3. You are not going to evolve/reincarnate and come back as a Brahma cow or whatever. Nor do people give birth to cows or anything besides other people. That's not hard to Believe. You are welcome to believe what you want to, but Jesus warned over and over that you are going to The Lake for longer than you can imagine! Satan is happy with that. Jesus is not.
That is why He willingly submitted to be tortured and die for YOU. Because He knows when you will die and that you WILL be tortured forever without Him. When He was crucified, He suffered the undescribable pain and punishment necessary that was required for your personal sins against a loving God. He can save you because after he died He came back to life and is THE only Savior. IF you want to try to save yourself, that makes you a savior and you are not ever going to be good enough. The mirror shows a man in need of God, not a savior.
"Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us.". ( Only Speaking to those who made this decision because it's past tense. Notice it's NOT because of your good works.)
The key to everlasting life is to reject the lie that your good works can make you right with God. No amount of works has ever saved anyone. Then you must make Jesus Christ alone the object of your trust. That previous verse continues,
" For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
Don't put it off. Go to God right now and ask Him for what He is offering. The gift has already been paid for. Tell Him,
"Dear God, I don't deserve to go to heaven. I deserve hell, because I've committed sins against You. I know that Jesus Christ Your Son was punished for what I did, so that I won't have to be punished in hell. After He died, He came back to life the third day. I trust Him to save me and to take me to heaven some day. Thank You for the gift of everlasting life. Amen
I've studied the Scientific Method and have applied it many years inside of laboratory settings AND in the field. It's obvious to anyone with one mg of intellectual HONESTY that their belief system is based upon FAITH rather than any SCIENTIFIC METHODOLOGY. I am Not here to debate true science because it will fall upon your deaf ears. What REALLY matters is where you will spend eternity.
Regardless of where you stand on this issue of macroevolutionism, I have provided you with more than a billion dollars worth of information above. IF you have ears to hear and eyes to see what it says about the faith of Jesus, it is in your best interest to consider.
God didn't literally, using his hands, mold Adam from the muck of the earth (as it's poetically described in Genesis). Just like God didn't literally deliver Israel from an iron furnace, as it's described in Deuteronomy. The latter was a poetical way of stating that it was harsh for the Israelites in Egypt. God molding Adam from muck, similarly, refers to Adam's origins stemming from inorganic matter.
This short, but Great message is why I reconsidered the religion that I was heavily Indoctrinated in since I was in preschool! None of us know it all, especially a preschooler...but I believed my religion throughout childhood and adolescence as much as anyone here. If you have the courage, you will ask God of the Bible if He will convince you of the truth before and after watching it.
The RELIGION of Evol-utionism started long before Charley Darwin. It was started by someone who said, "Hath God said..?" Undermining God's integrity, calling Him a liar.
Then the father of the alternative religion opposed to friendship with God said, "Ye shall not surely die.". Again calling God a liar and deceiving an intelligent person...a genius, yet gullible. I'm not criticizing the woman, just giving the plain facts....just like most men are. We've been raised by the gt (public fool system), to despise God like the devil and choose to believe that religion's teachings without question. They teach us that we came from a rock and that eventually we shall be as gods.
Third, Satan, the guru of what eventually became a major doctrine of the Hindu religion said, ..."You shall be as god's..."
In a nutshell, keep in mind that Jesus IS THE CREATOR. He demonstrated it to over 10, 000 eye witnesses when He preached to them on multiple occasions He CREATED meals for them. "In Whom we have redemption through His blood, even the forgiveness of sins....ALL things were created by Him..." John chapter 1 That's easier for me to believe than other religions that teach that you are continually improving until someday you will be like a god..😄 1. "Let God be true and EVERY MAN a liar". We have ALL lied and there is a consequence called hell, no matter what Satan says. God can't do something. What is that? He can NOT lie. As it is written,
"All liars shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Even the little white ones? Yup, all of them. And it's not just lies, it's all wrong... including the things we know that we should do, but don't. Revelation 21:8
2. No matter how uncomfortable it may be, You ARE going to die someday. "For the wages of sin is death." Romans 6:23
3. You are not going to evolve/reincarnate and come back as a Brahma cow or whatever. Nor do people give birth to cows or anything besides other people. That's not hard to Believe. You are welcome to believe what you want to, but Jesus warned over and over that you are going to The Lake for longer than you can imagine! Satan is happy with that. Jesus is not.
That is why He willingly submitted to be tortured and die for YOU. Because He knows when you will die and that you WILL be tortured forever without Him. When He was crucified, He suffered the undescribable pain and punishment necessary that was required for your personal sins against a loving God. He can save you because after he died He came back to life and is THE only Savior. IF you want to try to save yourself, that makes you a savior and you are not ever going to be good enough. The mirror shows a man in need of God, not a savior.
"Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us.". ( Only Speaking to those who made this decision because it's past tense. Notice it's NOT because of your good works.)
The key to everlasting life is to reject the lie that your good works can make you right with God. No amount of works has ever saved anyone. Then you must make Jesus Christ alone the object of your trust. That previous verse continues,
" For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
Don't put it off. Go to God right now and ask Him for what He is offering. The gift has already been paid for. Tell Him,
"Dear God, I don't deserve to go to heaven. I deserve hell, because I've committed sins against You. I know that Jesus Christ Your Son was punished for what I did, so that I won't have to be punished in hell. After He died, He came back to life the third day. I trust Him to save me and to take me to heaven some day. Thank You for the gift of everlasting life. Amen
I've studied the Scientific Method and have applied it many years inside of laboratory settings AND in the field. It's obvious to anyone with one mg of intellectual HONESTY that their belief system is based upon FAITH rather than any SCIENTIFIC METHODOLOGY. I am Not here to debate true science because it will fall upon your deaf ears. What REALLY matters is where you will spend eternity.
Regardless of where you stand on this issue of macroevolutionism, I have provided you with more than a billion dollars worth of information above. IF you have ears to hear and eyes to see what it says about the faith of Jesus, it is in your best interest to consider.
In your shaded highlights.
I always thought God was the creator and Jesus his son.
Albert was a pretty smart guy “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish.”
Yet he couldn't make even one cell, much less the smallest of a human hair.
Dividing cells, life in general is no doubt a amazing miracle, I just dont believe it is due to divine intervention, hard to just blindly accept traditional christian beliefs that are meant to somehow explain what you cant see, smell, hear or physically feel.... yet evolution is clearly evident........
Are you using "yet evolution is clearly evident" meaning from the Big Bang to the present? Other than life exists what evidence is there for abiogenesis?
Do you not find the existence of life rather compelling evidence...?
For those without thumbs, it's s Garden fookin Island, not Hawaii
“As faith is a belief held without the support of evidence it is a position that needs constant reinforcement, church, fellowship, reading selected material, etc. So if someone questions the faith, they are a threat to the faith.”
You clearly state that faith is a belief held without the support of evidence. I then quoted Hebrews 11:1….”“.... faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see....”
Faith like I am describing is not a belief held without the support of evidence. Let me delve into that.
See John 14:23…” Jesus replied, If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.”
Let me repeat…. “…we will make our home with him.”
See also, John 15:3…. “Remain in me and I will remain in you.”
When God is in you, when the Holy Spirit witnesses to your inner being, there is no doubt about it. This is not blind faith at all. It is belief based on a living and active relationship with God Himself.
So, how does this come about? The thief on the cross …. Luke 23…..knew he was a criminal and only a few crucial words are spoken…”Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom. He replied to him, ‘Amen I say to you today you will be with me in Paradise.”
There is another example….Luke 18 ….. the Pharisee prayed but prayed out of pride…. then….the tax collector prayed….”But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’ (Jesus then said…) I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God…..”
So, it is as simple as that…. here it is re-phrased: “Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.”
Then, God comes into your inner being and then, YOU KNOW.
Circular reasoning is a logical fallacy, not evidence.
Oh, it is indeed evidence. Not proof for you, but testimony. Testimony. Think about it. Testimony is accepted in courts of law.
It is also an explanation for the origin of faith.
Heard a story once about a man blind from birth who denied the existence of light because he had never seen it, never felt it and he rejected the testimony of the sighted people around him.
Testimony in courts is based on observed events. To be proved or disproved by facts. None of us alive today can testify about observed events in biblical times.
That God didn't pull Israel from an iron furnace? Just doesn't make sense interpreted literally. Was there enough iron to even build a furnace that large? Makes much more sense that it was poetical.
I went to the Painted Desert last year. When in the visitors center by the petrified forest, I started telling everyone how this was all a big hoax, because it didnt fit into the bibles narrative...
God was playing a big joke on us with all that petrified rainforest we were standing, in the middle of Ari freaking zona hahahahahaha
They looked at me just as freaking crazy as I look at all of Jag’s posts hahahaha
Albert was a pretty smart guy “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish.”
Yet he couldn't make even one cell, much less the smallest of a human hair.
Dividing cells, life in general is no doubt a amazing miracle, I just dont believe it is due to divine intervention, hard to just blindly accept traditional christian beliefs that are meant to somehow explain what you cant see, smell, hear or physically feel.... yet evolution is clearly evident........
Are you using "yet evolution is clearly evident" meaning from the Big Bang to the present? Other than life exists what evidence is there for abiogenesis?
Do you not find the existence of life rather compelling evidence...?
I went to the Painted Desert last year. When in the visitors center by the petrified forest, I started telling everyone how this was all a big hoax, because it didnt fit into the bibles narrative...
God was playing a big joke on us with all that petrified rainforest we were standing, in the middle of Ari freaking zona hahahahahaha
They looked at me just as freaking crazy as I look at all of Jag’s posts hahahaha
“As faith is a belief held without the support of evidence it is a position that needs constant reinforcement, church, fellowship, reading selected material, etc. So if someone questions the faith, they are a threat to the faith.”
You clearly state that faith is a belief held without the support of evidence. I then quoted Hebrews 11:1….”“.... faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see....”
Faith like I am describing is not a belief held without the support of evidence. Let me delve into that.
See John 14:23…” Jesus replied, If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.”
Let me repeat…. “…we will make our home with him.”
See also, John 15:3…. “Remain in me and I will remain in you.”
When God is in you, when the Holy Spirit witnesses to your inner being, there is no doubt about it. This is not blind faith at all. It is belief based on a living and active relationship with God Himself.
So, how does this come about? The thief on the cross …. Luke 23…..knew he was a criminal and only a few crucial words are spoken…”Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom. He replied to him, ‘Amen I say to you today you will be with me in Paradise.”
There is another example….Luke 18 ….. the Pharisee prayed but prayed out of pride…. then….the tax collector prayed….”But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’ (Jesus then said…) I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God…..”
So, it is as simple as that…. here it is re-phrased: “Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.”
Then, God comes into your inner being and then, YOU KNOW.
Circular reasoning is a logical fallacy, not evidence.
Oh, it is indeed evidence. Not proof for you, but testimony. Testimony. Think about it. Testimony is accepted in courts of law.
It is also an explanation for the origin of faith.
Heard a story once about a man blind from birth who denied the existence of light because he had never seen it, never felt it and he rejected the testimony of the sighted people around him.
Testimony in courts is based on observed events. To be proved or disproved by facts. None of us alive today can testify about observed events in biblical times.
I am not referring to biblical times. I am giving testimony as to the source and reality of my faith....here and now, in these times.
God is active today. I testify to that.
The tax collector said: “Lord Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.” Jesus said he went home “justified.”
That God didn't pull Israel from an iron furnace? Just doesn't make sense interpreted literally. Was there enough iron to even build a furnace that large? Makes much more sense that it was poetical.
Yeah ok. Not arguing here, just asking. How do you know? Isn’t there more to the story?
Again, just asking, not trying to be confrontational.
