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Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: SuperCub] #15982944 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by SuperCub
One cannot separate the Word of God from God and expect to fully know God.
When “the Word” is interpreted as referring to Jesus...as it is in John 1:1...I agree with you. Wholeheartedly.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: antelope_sniper] #15983007 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by antelope_sniper

Sorry to hear that you don't like facts, but they are stubborn things.


I love facts, and the fact is that none of what you have posted that quoted me has anything to do with our society. Your response to my original post was simply the use of the leftist tactic of distract and deflect. When called on that, you refuse to acknowledge it and instead you double down just as any good leftist would.

I have come to believe that you are only a notch or two above the leftists of BLM and Antifa. They seem determined to undermine and destroy the nation that they have been the beneficiary of. Likewise, you seem determined to undermine and destroy the Christian faith, which you, whether you realize it or not, whether you will admit it or not, have been the beneficiary of. This country was founded by men whose minds were steeped in Christianity and the wisdom they had derived in part from that was what led to the form of government and society that you now enjoy.

To some degree, you are just as much a useful idiot of the globalists as are the anarchists of BLM and Antifa.

Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: ctsmith] #15983031 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by ctsmith
Originally Posted by wabigoon
it;s not works good folks, it's Grace!



Yes sir.

True story. I was at a church where the pastor was making a point. Said old Miss Mable could cook 1000 meals for the needy, could have perfect attendance at church since she was 5 years old, and those works alone will send her straight to hell. Old Miss Mable got up and walked out of church. grin

This is the stumbling stone, it's what folks can't swallow because of pride. It's self righteousness. Man wants to think he can attain salvation by works. Church attendance, long prayers, Bible reading, alms to the poor, tithes, all are good things. The only work that can allow us to attain eternal life has already been done by Jesus. If we stop comparing ourselves to others, & compare ourselves to Jesus then we clearly see we'll never match up. We need his righteousness, which comes by sincere faith. Faith comes by hearing the word of God. Men make it so complicated when it's so simple. Jesus said seek & you will find. Searching God's word with a sincerity of heart, laying aside all pride & a man's life will eternally be changed.


Romans 5:1
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: IndyCA35] #15983045 04/11/21
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I've been wrong more than once, but.

Seems I recall works building a place on heaven.


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Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: ctsmith] #15983347 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by ctsmith
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
So the non-believing, non-slave owning, good deed person definitely goes to hell but the slave owning believer, who was welcomed by the church, may or may not. Better odds owning slaves. Got it.


Apparently you don't "got it". How can the non believing man go somewhere that doesn't exist (to him)?


The mere fact that I have a hard time wrapping my head around a concept does not necessarily make it untrue.


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Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: There_Ya_Go] #15983693 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by There_Ya_Go
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper

Sorry to hear that you don't like facts, but they are stubborn things.


I love facts, and the fact is that none of what you have posted that quoted me has anything to do with our society. Your response to my original post was simply the use of the leftist tactic of distract and deflect. When called on that, you refuse to acknowledge it and instead you double down just as any good leftist would.

I have come to believe that you are only a notch or two above the leftists of BLM and Antifa. They seem determined to undermine and destroy the nation that they have been the beneficiary of. Likewise, you seem determined to undermine and destroy the Christian faith, which you, whether you realize it or not, whether you will admit it or not, have been the beneficiary of. This country was founded by men whose minds were steeped in Christianity and the wisdom they had derived in part from that was what led to the form of government and society that you now enjoy.

To some degree, you are just as much a useful idiot of the globalists as are the anarchists of BLM and Antifa.



TYG,
Sure I provided data at the country level, but correlation does not stop there. Within the U.S. when you break the data down at the state level, the same correlation exists. As an example, the more religious a state the higher the teenage pregnancy rate and the lower the per capita incomes.


Nobody spends somebody else�s money as carefully as he spends his own.
The U.S Government has a unique capacity for getting things upside down.
Milton Friedman.

Go quiet or full tilt, just don't get caught in the middle of the stupids. DD
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: IndyCA35] #15983703 04/11/21
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Whats it mean?

Less money for Churches. Still.

Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Cheyenne] #15983706 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by Cheyenne
Did the slave owners who believed in Jesus wind up in a better place than the non-believing, non-slave owning people who did really good deeds but could not wrap their brains around 1800+ year old code words?


Exodus 21:

20 “When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. 21 But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money.

Not only does the bible condone slavery, it even condones beating your slaves, so long as it takes a couple of days for them to die.


Nobody spends somebody else�s money as carefully as he spends his own.
The U.S Government has a unique capacity for getting things upside down.
Milton Friedman.

Go quiet or full tilt, just don't get caught in the middle of the stupids. DD
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: IndyCA35] #15983713 04/11/21
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See?

Its nice the slave gets a couple more days to work after you bommy knocked him.

Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Jim_Conrad] #15983718 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Whats it mean?

Less money for Churches. Still.


This is what it boils down to.


�Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.�
IC-B

Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Cheyenne] #15983729 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by Cheyenne
So the non-believing, non-slave owning, good deed person definitely goes to hell but the slave owning believer, who was welcomed by the church, may or may not. Better odds owning slaves. Got it.

What is wrong with owning slaves? Why would the slave owner be less deserving of his heavenly reward?

Most of the notables in the OT were slave owners. Even when not actually recognized as slaves, peasants were chattel to be used by and traded among the nobility, up until a very few hundred years ago. Nobility definitely included the priesthood of every major religion on every continent.

Is there a real difference between a slave owner and a King or priest running around the kingdom lopping the heads from miscreants and deflowering 13 year old virgins as the whim strikes?

I think there is a difference, with the benefit going to the slave owner, as long as he was a benevolent master.

Did the plantation owner keep families together? Did he educate the children? Did he keep his slaves well fed, well clothed, warm, and comfortable? Did he instill in them a sense of accomplishment and pride in work performed?

Many, some say most, in the American South were good Christian men who did so.

Of course over the course of history, time, and geography, there have been many who treated slaves of all colors as sexual playthings, or beasts of burden to be discarded as their usefulness expired.

And there is no denying the horrid conditions of the trans-atlantic slave transport ships where a high percentage of the cargo died and was tossed overboard. Or the cruelty of the black slave traders in Africa raiding villages and driving their captives to the coast for sale and transport.

Point being, many plantation owners were good and benevolent men, who did well consider the welfare of their slave property. Just as I consider the welfare of my dog, horse, or cow. Just as the OT Kings considered the welfare of their peasant tribe.


My ideal as a conservative:

That each person may reap as he/she has sown.
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: antelope_sniper] #15983735 04/11/21
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Just WOW!

Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
Did the slave owners who believed in Jesus wind up in a better place than the non-believing, non-slave owning people who did really good deeds but could not wrap their brains around 1800+ year old code words?


Exodus 21:

20 “When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. 21 But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money.

Not only does the bible condone slavery, it even condones beating your slaves, so long as it takes a couple of days for them to die.


One of my issues is that people can find a quote in the Bible to justify anything, which I suspect is your point. I_S went with it.


"Don't believe everything you see on the Internet" - Abraham Lincoln
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Jim_Conrad] #15983740 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Whats it mean?

Less money for Churches. Still.


It also means this nation is less likely to devolve into a theocracy, which is a good thing.

We have no need of a "Grand Inquisitor".

But, of course, as the majority of the population dons the cloak of socialism and then communism, they will rally behind their "Political Officers".

And there you have the new religion with its own "Inquisition" and state sponsored purges.

New names, same old schitt!


My ideal as a conservative:

That each person may reap as he/she has sown.
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Cheyenne] #15983748 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by Cheyenne
One of my issues is that people can find a quote in the Bible to justify anything,...
Yep. They cherry-pick.

People almost invariably arrive at their beliefs not on the basis of proof but on the basis of what they find attractive. - Blaise Pascal

And then they go looking for reasons to substantiate their belief.

They can actually justify their behavior by using the words of God to devalue people bearing the image of God...people whom God loves...people for whom Jesus died.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: antlers] #15983765 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by antlers
Originally Posted by SuperCub
One cannot separate the Word of God from God and expect to fully know God.
When “the Word” is interpreted as referring to Jesus...as it is in John 1:1...I agree with you. Wholeheartedly.


When I said the word "Word" I was not referring to John 1:1, but was referring to the Bible as a whole.

Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: SuperCub] #15983786 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by SuperCub
Originally Posted by antlers
Originally Posted by SuperCub
One cannot separate the Word of God from God and expect to fully know God.
When “the Word” is interpreted as referring to Jesus...as it is in John 1:1...I agree with you. Wholeheartedly.
When I said the word "Word" I was not referring to John 1:1, but was referring to the Bible as a whole.
I know. And as you pointed out earlier, you and I diverge on this matter, to which I concurred. We disagree on this matter. That’s fine. Our disagreement doesn’t diminish the Gospel in any way whatsoever.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Idaho_Shooter] #15983806 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Whats it mean?

Less money for Churches. Still.


It also means this nation is less likely to devolve into a theocracy, which is a good thing.

We have no need of a "Grand Inquisitor".

But, of course, as the majority of the population dons the cloak of socialism and then communism, they will rally behind their "Political Officers".

And there you have the new religion with its own "Inquisition" and state sponsored purges.

New names, same old schitt!



I fully believe that half of the church goers would support a form of Christian Sharia if they could.

We would be back to stoning gays and adulterers, burning witches and arranging marriage.

Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Jim_Conrad] #15983815 04/11/21
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Originally Posted by Jim_Contad
I fully believe that half of the church goers would support a form of Christian Sharia if they could.

We would be back to stoning gays and adulterers, burning witches and arranging marriage.
I agree. They’d do it in a nanosecond if they could.

And burning those who held a belief or opinion contrary to their orthodoxy would be paramount.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: antlers] #15985662 04/12/21
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Originally Posted by antlers
Originally Posted by SuperCub
Originally Posted by antlers
Originally Posted by SuperCub
One cannot separate the Word of God from God and expect to fully know God.
When “the Word” is interpreted as referring to Jesus...as it is in John 1:1...I agree with you. Wholeheartedly.
When I said the word "Word" I was not referring to John 1:1, but was referring to the Bible as a whole.
I know. And as you pointed out earlier, you and I diverge on this matter, to which I concurred. We disagree on this matter. That’s fine. Our disagreement doesn’t diminish the Gospel in any way whatsoever.


How do you separate Christ from the Bible? Is the Bible not the infallible word of God for our direction?

If not, what is?

Re: What Does Declining Church Attendance Mean for Our Society? [Re: Jim_Conrad] #15985665 04/12/21
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Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
I fully believe that half of the church goers would support a form of Christian Sharia if they could.

We would be back to stoning gays and adulterers, burning witches and arranging marriage.


I've never personally heard anything like that from a Christian and the churches I've attended & pastors I've sat under have been quite conservative.

Have you?

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