It is said that more Grizzlies have been dropped by a 170 grain 30-30 than any other round. In Canada at one time it was the Grizzly stomper per excellence because the model 94 and the 30-30 were the rifle and cartridge that most sourdoughs and Indians had in the back forty.
I always wanted a model 94 in 38-55 but I was never able to find one. It would have been my stomper for everything I hunted back in the day.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
In Canada at one time it was the Grizzly stomper per excellence because the model 94 and the 30-30 were the rifle and cartridge that most sourdoughs and Indians had in the back forty.
Pure and umitigated Bullchit, Mister.
You've never heard of the SMLE / .303 British ?
Myth, Busted.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
In Canada at one time it was the Grizzly stomper per excellence because the model 94 and the 30-30 were the rifle and cartridge that most sourdoughs and Indians had in the back forty.
Pure and umitigated Bullchit, Mister.
You've never heard of the SMLE / .303 British ?
Myth, Busted.
GTC
Yep, the 303 British was the rifle in the hands of most of the British empire, or those who fought as Brits. Australia, Canada, New Zeland, The old 303 was it. Same reasons the 45-70 and later the 30-06 were the mainstay of American rifles.
I vaguely remember a line in that movie where the actor says "The 44/40 should do it."
The older I become the more I am convinced that the voice of honor in a man's heart is the voice of GOD.
Sure do hope he files that front sight off, so when the bear shoves that 30-30 up his ass, it won't hurt quite so much. I'm nuts, but even I wouldn't go that light.
I'd have to say by a ratio of at LEAST 10 to 1, as regards the Win 94 in ANY caliber.
BTDT.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
In the absence of any PRESSING need, e.g. Self Defense, Hunger, etc, this is a GODDAM STUNT, with the potential for an inhumane kill.
Big Bears are really fine animals, and don't deserve that kinda' azzing around.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
so is the guy doing this supposed to be "Extra Brave",...or "Daring", or "A hero",.....or what ?
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
Certainly was an influence on MY choice of caliber for the Great Northwest.
I guess I was to young and dumb to understand that alla' those one shot kills weren't "dead enough".
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
Given the great big "smoking Holes" that one got with cup and core "Hardware Store" bullets than, I can only BEGIN to imagine what these newer ones deliver, in terms of killing performance.
These A-Maxes I'm playing with right now are a real treat,....in terms of wicked accuracy.
The BASIC "Formula" for alla' this has been in place since us white muzzled types were pups, and Cactus Jack had it NAILED when he said "ANY modern high intensity cartridge". Hell he included the mossy 7 X 57 in that mix.
I can't but agree, SHOT PLACEMENT kills, not numbers.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
“The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
I just regret, and lean towards decrying using some fine Grizzly Bear as a pincushion, or "Ballistics experiment".
We all KNOW what's happened re: killing them,.....whatever the point of INTENTIONALLY going after one with something that light is eluding me.
I'm good with using what you HAVE, and doing that well. Just MISSING the point of this whole "Show".
Dittos on filing off the front sight, it would serve the grandstanding goofball right.
"Timmy does Ballistics"
sounds like a new folky C&W song.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
I love the gun ads from the "olden" days. I can remember when Savage featured missionary Harry Caldwell with a large tiger he killed in China with a .22 High Power Model 99. And then Roy Chapman Andrews bumped off a bunch of Mongolian big game with his .250/3000 Savage 99.
The one of the Packer and his string up on some impossible ledge, face to face with a bellicose Ursus, unlimbering his trusty Savage would be in my list of favorites.
Old Elmer and those "H.V." guys sure went round and round, didn't they ?
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
22 LR is the best caliber for grizzlies. They don't feel death coming on. Three well placed rounds and wait five minutes and get to skinning. Holes sew up with two stiches each.
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
"Media" lionizing "Small Caliber Plinking /Sniping" presents some ethical problems, but surprises me not in the least.
Ya' gotta' wonder what Rob Ruark would have had to say on this.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
Funny stuff as always on here.....a grizzly hit properly with a 270 and a good bullet is a "goner"....
Research may disclose...at one time anyway, the World Record grizzly was killed with a 30-30;the story showing up in Outdoor Life in the good old days.....and the World Record Polar Bear, with a 270 Winchester.
I'm also pretty sure the record brown bear fell to a 30/06...I guess these folks were not scared of bears like many internet posters....
The one of the Packer and his string up on some impossible ledge, face to face with a bellicose Ursus, unlimbering his trusty Savage would be in my list of favorites.
Old Elmer and those "H.V." guys sure went round and round, didn't they ?
GTC
Yah, nothing got Elmer going like those "damn, light high-speed bullets" as he used to refer to them.
OTOH, it was hard for Elmer to write a column without mentioning Speer's 275-grain .338 bullet. The way he praised that slug, one would have thought he was getting a royalty on each one that Speer sold.
a grizzly hit properly with a 270 and a good bullet is a "goner"....
Yah
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
a grizzly hit properly with a 270 and a good bullet is a "goner"....
Yah
Yah, one of the posters on the 'fire, I think it's BearinFairbanks, uses the .270 with 150-grain Partitions for everything and has done so for about 40 years.
Funny stuff as always on here.....a grizzly hit properly with a 270 and a good bullet is a "goner"....
Research may disclose...at one time anyway, the World Record grizzly was killed with a 30-30;the story showing up in Outdoor Life in the good old days.....and the World Record Polar Bear, with a 270 Winchester.
I'm also pretty sure the record brown bear fell to a 30/06...I guess these folks were not scared of bears like many internet posters....
The Grizzly shot with a .30-.30 in BC that was the "world record" for some time, was killed by Jack Turner of Lonesome Lake, BC, when it was harassing him on the farm he and his wife, Trudy Edwards, had there. This, happened in May, 1965 and Jack shot the bear because he had to, not because he wanted to or was hunting them; Trudy had told him to not shoot a bear as it is so much work to deal with one.
Jack is a legendary bushman here and was mauled by four yearling Grizzlies one evening just outside of his cabin at Hagensborg, BC while in his early 70s. He survived and is still, I think, alive at about 80.
He is the son-in-law of the famous "Crusoe of Lonesome Lake", the late Ralph Edwards, O.C., who amost singlehandedly, saved the "Trumpeter Swans" who wintered near his pioneer homestead and ended his days at Oona River off Prince Rupert, BC. I knew Jack's brother-in-law, Ralph's eldest son, the late Stan Edwards, at Ocean Falls, BC, more than 40 years ago and they were quite the family of a kind now vanished from BC...to our great loss.
As to the .270 Win. and Grizzlies, I witnessed a fair sized Grizzly killed with a .270 in the East Kootenays of BC in the late '60s and it worked just fine with a "double lung" shot. Within reason, there are lots of cartridge-bullet combos that have been used on Grizzlies successfully.
The ubiquitous .30-.30 was NOT the rifle choice of oldtimers and indians here in Canada's Grizzly country as some have stated here that it was/is. The usual choice from the 1890s on to quite recently was the .303 British and the .30-.40 USArmy and the .30-06 and relatively few kept their old blackpowder rifles of any sort once Winny 1895s in .30-40 and '06 became available.
My first lessons in outdoor sports, some 60 years ago, were from men who lived and worked here in BC in the 1890s and my early training in bush work was by slightly younger men, who had started before "The Great War". I know from these men what the popular guns, etc., were among the oldtimers and, btw, the term "Sourdough" was/is not one widely used in Canada, it refers specifically to particpants in "The Klondike Goldrush" and not to those pioneers here in BC at the same time.
When I started reading the post I recalled this story from long ago. She was squirrel hunting & the bear began stalking her. She climbed some sort of mound & fired at the grizzly. When the bear staggered or fell I can't remember which she reloaded again & again & continued to shoot. I also remember the story of a guy in Canada tending his garden with a 30-30 slung over his back. A grizzly tore through his small fence & attacked. Not sure how many shots were fired, but he killed the grizzly. While there are obviously better choices with premium bullets I see no reason why a grizzly couldn't be shot with a 30-30. I do agree there is no justification for a stunt like this. I rarely watch these TV hunting shows. I especially dislike when the hunter hugs his guide with tears in his eyes after shooting a trophy. Try hugging any of the guides I have hunted with & you would have a black eye to go with your trophy. Must be a California thing.
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When I started reading the post I recalled this story from long ago. She was squirrel hunting & the bear began stalking her. She climbed some sort of mound & fired at the grizzly. When the bear staggered or fell I can't remember which she reloaded again & again & continued to shoot. I also remember the story of a guy in Canada tending his garden with a 30-30 slung over his back. A grizzly tore through his small fence & attacked. Not sure how many shots were fired, but he killed the grizzly. While there are obviously better choices with premium bullets I see no reason why a grizzly couldn't be shot with a 30-30. I do agree there is no justification for a stunt like this. I rarely watch these TV hunting shows. I especially dislike when the hunter hugs his guide with tears in his eyes after shooting a trophy. Try hugging any of the guides I have hunted with & you would have a black eye to go with your trophy. Must be a California thing.
Just about ANY hi power round will work when being mauled by a grizzel. Just remember to put it in your temple or in your mouth angled up to the top of your skull
The pain will end quickly.
"wanna hear God laugh? Tell Him you have complete control now!"
22 LR is the best caliber for grizzlies. They don't feel death coming on. Three well placed rounds and wait five minutes and get to skinning. Holes sew up with two stiches each.
My problem is, i'd have a rough time out running a Griz in rough country for five minutes at my age.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
I think it is considerate of DD to preface his B.S. posts with a disclaimer:
"It is said that more Grizzlies have been dropped by a 170 grain 30-30 than any other round."
That good ol' "It is said" serves as fair warning that B.S. follows.Of course,in some instances,you can just look at the poster's name.... .
Osbourne Russel,in "Journal of a Trapper" relates shooting his first Grizzly with a muzzleloader and then following it into a thicket and finishing it off when it charged him.He admits that it was pure luck that he hit the bear in the head and allowed he would never follow one into thick cover!.
According to him the Mountain Men preferred Grizzly meat to just about any other kind and killed 'em regularly with round ball and BP.
Kutenay: "Jack Turner".....that's the guy.....thanks for jogging an old memory......and that is what I recall...he shot the bear because he "had to"....
I went on line last night.....looks like the current world record polar ear was killed with a 30/06,and the one before that with a 270....
Some of this makes sense I guess because traveling hunters frequently use bigger rifles than locals or natives,who use more common stuff.Since a great many world record animals are not killed by globe trotting trophy hunters, but more so by local folks,these animals get shot with what they had at their disposal....and not with what some think to be "ideal".
Ballistic gack tends to soften ballistics but the bottom line is that anyone armed with a 30/06 or 270 has a very effective and lethal weapon in his hands....not really much to fear.
Does anyone make a belt-fed .30-30? If not, I don't think I'd care for trying to jump 15 greyhound buses on a motorcycle, or taking on a Grizz with my Marlin or my Winchester. Both have been done, but it seems that the potential for getting busted up, is very high.
"The number one problem with America is, a whole lot of people need shot, and nobody is shooting them." -Master Chief Hershel Davis
Any animal that can weigh in excess of 800 pounds, can run 35 MPH and has an attitude that is possessed by a Griz will get a little more respect than a 30-30 from me. And if I were a native to the country where they and their kin are found on a regular basis I would invest in an appropriate gun and caliber. I have an 06' that I load stoutly for black bear. I'm sure it would do but if I were living in Alaska I may think seriously of investing in a 338WM or a 375 H&H to settle arguments quickly.
Any animal that can weigh in excess of 800 pounds, can run 35 MPH and has an attitude that is possessed by a Griz will get a little more respect than a 30-30 from me. And if I were a native to the country where they and their kin are found on a regular basis I would invest in an appropriate gun and caliber. I have an 06' that I load stoutly for black bear. I'm sure it would do but if I were living in Alaska I may think seriously of investing in a 338WM or a 375 H&H to settle arguments quickly.
Definitely. They're kind of scary when they're suddenly low to the ground and with their nose up, coming at you like all Hell's devils from just a few yards away and while you're surrounded by dense alder brush.
Bob; I trust that this finds you and yours doing well on this foggy morning.
Our local gun club puts on a sheep count today as it has every 2nd Sunday in February for more than 60+ years and I've been an area leader for 20+ now I guess. The ceiling is really, really low this morning and unless the wind picks up we'll need to be at conversational distances from any California's before we can count them!
Oh well, February in the Okanagan can be that way.
One of my hunting mentors was a Mennonite chap who had a farm in the Ft. St. John area for years. To say I miss him would be a gross understatement. Anyway Bob, he did some market gardening as part of it and had many "bear in the garden" and "bear in the pig pen" stories to share.
His primary rifle for most of his life was a 95 in .30-40, which marked him as a little more serious about his gear than the "average" hunter.
I asked him one time how many animals he thought the 95 had accounted for and after some thought, figured that there were at least 50 moose taken with it, as well as a few caribou and sheep. He related that he really wasn't able to calculate how many deer died in front of it and when it came to bears, Jake would just wink and say something like, "Most people wouldn't believe me anyway Dwayne."
That said, I'd agree with crossfire that the various versions of .303's outnumbered the lever guns by a wide margin. Almost everyone had one - honestly they were everywhere in rural Saskatchewan.
When I was younger, I judged a fellow a "semi-serious hunter" if they had a 94 - which was most often a .30-30 but occasionally a .32 Special. We saw the odd Marlin, but not that many somehow.
The "serious hunters" in my young eyes anyway, had Winchester 88's and Savage 99's.
I suspect a couple things played into the .303 working as well as it did on the yard pests, one was that it was behind the kitchen door and two that it was likely loaded with Dominion 215gr. "Kling Kore" round nose bullets. I still can see the blue and yellow boxes sitting on a shelf or ledge near the farm house doors. Usually beside some mittens, a flashlight and perhaps a wrench or pliers. Farmers and ranchers, eh?
Speaking of bullets, a lot of animals likely died as a result of military surplus full metal jackets as well, but that's more of a guess on my part.
Anyway, that's just my recollections from the late '60's and then the '70's from a gun crazy farm kid as he was bouncing around the rural sections of a few provinces visiting farmers, ranchers, trappers and the like.
Well, I'm off to count some California's Bob.
All the best to you and yours in the upcoming week.
Use the Partition or Barnes bullet and the 30-30 should work just fine. Most would be surprised just how many Grizzly have been taken with the 30-30 . I would much rather have a 94 Win in 30-30 for Bear Protection in the bush than any pistol most people recommend for Bear Country.
A Doe walks out of the woods today and says, that is the last time I'm going to do that for Two Bucks.
NO offence intended here, but, I spent quite a few years working for the BC Forest Service, Alberta Forest Service and the BC Fish&Wildlife (briefly) all over BC and western-northern Alberta. I have seen about a dozen Grizzlies killed and had several dozen encounters with these bears, usually when alone.
During this time and even in the '50s and '60s, while learning from the kind of oldtimers I mentioned above, I have never seen a .30-.30 used to kill a Grizzly and never known anyone to hunt with one.
The aboriginal women mentioned earlier who killed a giant Grizzly with a .2Lr. was Bella Twin, an Albertan and I used to work for the AFS in the area where this happened and knew some of her family slightly while there. This is the region of Alberta, where the surviving members of the "Plains Grizzly" are to be found and since her encounter happened some 60 years ago, there were some huge bears there.
A good place to start with a rifle-combo. for Grizzly hunting is the old .30-06 with 180NPs and I would bet that more Grizzlies shot by BC-Alberta sportsmen have been killed by .30-06s than anything else.
Dwayne I guess the 303 had a good reputation up in Canada,maybe like a 318 WR in Africa..probably with similar long, bluenose softs weighing over 200 grains.I don't know....never used either.
Conversations about minimum calibers and bullets for big bears are fun, but in the end, you'd never see me with a 30-30 deliberately looking for a grizzly or brown bear....I am basically chicken hearted and both of mine have been killed with a 375
If I could shoot 30-40 more, I'd have a better idea of what works good and what doesn't...
I think it is considerate of DD to preface his B.S. posts with a disclaimer:
"It is said that more Grizzlies have been dropped by a 170 grain 30-30 than any other round."
That good ol' "It is said" serves as fair warning that B.S. follows.Of course,in some instances,you can just look at the poster's name.... .
Osbourne Russel,in "Journal of a Trapper" relates shooting his first Grizzly with a muzzleloader and then following it into a thicket and finishing it off when it charged him.He admits that it was pure luck that he hit the bear in the head and allowed he would never follow one into thick cover!.
According to him the Mountain Men preferred Grizzly meat to just about any other kind and killed 'em regularly with round ball and BP.
No BS.
At one time the model 94 was the most popular rifle in the US and certainly in the Klondike area if for no other reason than there were so many Americans in the Klondike. Model 94s were relatively inexpensive, considered powerful, and ammo was cheap and plentiful.
When I moved to Montana over 30 years ago or so, I drove over the road coach and had a lot sheepherders moving from one side of a ranch to the other side or sometimes from ranch to ranch using the bus service. The rifle of most of them were model 94s in 30-30. These guys were in Grizzly country (and wolf country although FWP denied it). I thought these old timers were nuts as I had been told that even my 30-06 wasn't enough for Grizzly. These old timers just laughed and said no Griz was safe as long as they had their 30-30 and it was stoked with 170 grain bullets.
The 170 grain bullet is a big round nose bullet with a lot of lead exposed. It expands and penetrates deep.
The trouble today is that none of us shoot or hunt as much as the old timers did and we have a safe full of rifles. These old timers had one rifle to do it all. They could shoot and shoot well. They also were fearless.
Us modern day Internet hunters and shooters are not fearless, don't shoot as much, have a safe full of rifles, and we believe all the marketing hype about the newest and bestest super duper magnum and bullet that some how kills on mere contact.
Maybe if we looked at what the old timers used, had one rifle, shot a lot, why they were so successful with such privatise rifles we might all be better hunters and shooters.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
NO offence intended here, but, I spent quite a few years working for the BC Forest Service, Alberta Forest Service and the BC Fish&Wildlife (briefly) all over BC and western-northern Alberta. I have seen about a dozen Grizzlies killed and had several dozen encounters with these bears, usually when alone.
During this time and even in the '50s and '60s, while learning from the kind of oldtimers I mentioned above, I have never seen a .30-.30 used to kill a Grizzly and never known anyone to hunt with one.
The aboriginal women mentioned earlier who killed a giant Grizzly with a .2Lr. was Bella Twin, an Albertan and I used to work for the AFS in the area where this happened and knew some of her family slightly while there. This is the region of Alberta, where the surviving members of the "Plains Grizzly" are to be found and since her encounter happened some 60 years ago, there were some huge bears there.
A good place to start with a rifle-combo. for Grizzly hunting is the old .30-06 with 180NPs and I would bet that more Grizzlies shot by BC-Alberta sportsmen have been killed by .30-06s than anything else.
Well I'll be damned, when did you get back? I hope you are doing well these days.
Good to see you back, Mister ! Your yarns made the morning coffee more fragrant.
Kute, did you ever rub elbows with Andy Russell ?
Curdog sez' "According to him the Mountain Men preferred Grizzly meat to just about any other kind "
Damn straight, BEST eating I've ever hed !
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
I think it is considerate of DD to preface his B.S. posts with a disclaimer:
"It is said that more Grizzlies have been dropped by a 170 grain 30-30 than any other round."
That good ol' "It is said" serves as fair warning that B.S. follows.Of course,in some instances,you can just look at the poster's name.... .
Osbourne Russel,in "Journal of a Trapper" relates shooting his first Grizzly with a muzzleloader and then following it into a thicket and finishing it off when it charged him.He admits that it was pure luck that he hit the bear in the head and allowed he would never follow one into thick cover!.
According to him the Mountain Men preferred Grizzly meat to just about any other kind and killed 'em regularly with round ball and BP.
No BS.
At one time the model 94 was the most popular rifle in the US and certainly in the Klondike area if for no other reason than there were so many Americans in the Klondike. Model 94s were relatively inexpensive, considered powerful, and ammo was cheap and plentiful.
When I moved to Montana over 30 years ago or so, I drove over the road coach and had a lot sheepherders moving from one side of a ranch to the other side or sometimes from ranch to ranch using the bus service. The rifle of most of them were model 94s in 30-30. These guys were in Grizzly country (and wolf country although FWP denied it). I thought these old timers were nuts as I had been told that even my 30-06 wasn't enough for Grizzly. These old timers just laughed and said no Griz was safe as long as they had their 30-30 and it was stoked with 170 grain bullets.
The 170 grain bullet is a big round nose bullet with a lot of lead exposed. It expands and penetrates deep.
The trouble today is that none of us shoot or hunt as much as the old timers did and we have a safe full of rifles. These old timers had one rifle to do it all. They could shoot and shoot well. They also were fearless.
Us modern day Internet hunters and shooters are not fearless, don't shoot as much, have a safe full of rifles, and we believe all the marketing hype about the newest and bestest super duper magnum and bullet that some how kills on mere contact.
Maybe if we looked at what the old timers used, had one rifle, shot a lot, why they were so successful with such privatise rifles we might all be better hunters and shooters.
Interesting. There have been many debates here in regards to the old adage "beware of the man with one rifle". Many here scoff at the idea. Being a greenhorn and all, I stayed the hell out of it, but in my mind I always wondered how a man with one rifle and one scope, couldn't become more lethal a shot than the man who jumps between many rifles, many calibers? Drive one car, and soon you'll be able to squeeze out of her all she's got.
I get from Dwayne's post the fact of the situation here in BC-Alberta, with people living-working in Grizzly country. The fact is that VERY few people owned more than 3-4 guns, these were seldom anything special and were usually a Cooey .22, a Cooey singleshot 12 Ga. and a "sporterized" Lee-Enfield. In fact, the private forest technologist who used to stage his helo trips from my station out of Slave Lake,AB. carried one as his only bear gun.
"Gunnuts" of the type seen here on the "Campfire" were almost unknown here in rural BC until the later 1970s and are still in a minority. I had the only .338WM among my friends and colleagues in the BCFS in the '60s and '70s and none of us had or had ever shot a .375H&H. So, people just used what was available and made do as practical rural people always have and always do.
I did not get my first .375 until 1982 and have used seven rifles so chambered. I have two now, including a purpose-built P-64 "shorty" that a friend of mine here, "free-miner" started and I finished a few years ago, when I was going to return to wilderness work and wanted a specific Grizzly gun as I would be responsible for some of his prospecting camps.
Now, at 65, I know that my bush working days are behind me and I will sell this and my matched pair of P-64s in .300 and .375 as I will never carry them. It is fun to speculate, but, 40+ years of packing various rifles in BC has taught me that many combos will work just fine, it is my shooting prowess that I need to be most concerned about.
I suspect that most "dude" hunters and most "local" hunters fit into this category as well.................
According to Osbourne Russel,who was a contemporary of Bridger,as soon as berries and such fruited in the Spring,a Grizzly never touched meat until they died out in the Fall.
He also claimed that they lost no fat during hibernation IIRC.
His book is over at the fishing camp , so I can't check it.
Good to see you back, Mister ! Your yarns made the morning coffee more fragrant.
Kute, did you ever rub elbows with Andy Russell ?
Curdog sez' "According to him the Mountain Men preferred Grizzly meat to just about any other kind "
Damn straight, BEST eating I've ever hed !
GTC
I met Andy Russell at Selkirk College in Castlegar, BC, circa 1970 and debated him, with good humour on both sides, concerning "trophy" hunting and some other related issues. He was a colourful and "larger than life" character and he never let a story lack "vigour", shall we say.
Andy, was a controversial figure in western Canada and some revered him while others had other feelings about him and his books, films and presentations. I only met him that once and I respected him as a conservation lobbiest and entertainer "par excellence", as he did fight for Grizzly protection before it bacame "cool".
His son Charlie used to land his 185 on the driveway of a Big Irrigated spread I worked on, just outta' the Crowsnest. Well lubricated with fine Canadian Rye and Suds, we built a nice fire on the owner's patio one night.....His wife was not amused. The Waterton Glacier's hills and Lakes were the weekend destination of choice, I'm glad I saw that country than, as you know, it's changed a LOT.
Fine family, the Russells.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
In Canada at one time it was the Grizzly stomper per excellence because the model 94 and the 30-30 were the rifle and cartridge that most sourdoughs and Indians had in the back forty.
Pure and umitigated Bullchit, Mister.
You've never heard of the SMLE / .303 British ?
Myth, Busted.
GTC
DD,THIS is the comment that 'oops called you on.Seems like our Canadian neighbors agree with him.
And...BTW.. The modern guy with a safe full of rifles very well may shoot a whole lot more than the old timer with one rifle ever did.And burned up powder leads to better shooting,regardless of the cartridge.
I have never shot anything bigger than a Whitetail with the 30-30 and would follow Elmer Keith Advice , Carry Enough Gun. If was going after the Big Bears my choice would start with the 338 cal. Preferably my 338 RUM and I would use the Nosler 250 Partition or Swift 275 GR A-Frame.
A Doe walks out of the woods today and says, that is the last time I'm going to do that for Two Bucks.
Hunting griz with a 30-30 ain't much of a stunt. I'd consider hunting coastal brown bears that are found in the Kodiak/Peninsula region with a 30-30 more of a stunt.
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
Hunting griz with a 30-30 ain't much of a stunt. I'd consider hunting coastal brown bears that are found in the Kodiak/Peninsula region with a 30-30 more of a stunt.
I wouldn't be concerned about killing one with a 30-30...just outrunning him before he croaked.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
I have never shot anything bigger than a Whitetail with the 30-30 and would follow Elmer Keith Advice , Carry Enough Gun. If was going after the Big Bears my choice would start with the 338 cal. Preferably my 338 RUM and I would use the Nosler 250 Partition or Swift 275 GR A-Frame.
actually, the line comes from Robert Ruark's book, Use Enough Gun, a compilation published after his death in 1965. While it wouldn't be my choice for a big bear, I would guess it was probably considered plenty 'nuff gun early in the last century.
Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
yep....which makes one wonder....have we been bamboozled by the hook and bullet press, are animals way tougher than they were a century ago, or were legions of our forefathers consumed by predators after pinking them with puny lever actions? Quien sabe?
Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
I used to know an old Montana outfitter who operated in the Bob Marshall Wilderness for many years. His only rifle for most of those years (he retired from active outfitting about 1980, when he turned 70) was a .30-30--a Savage 99, not a 94 Winchester. He killed five grizzlies for himself with it over the years, and also backed up a few dudes when they wanted a grizzly and couldn't quite get the job totally done by themself. He also killed a bunch of elk with the rifle, including a 6x6 bull he took when 80, during a snowstorm after he'd ridden his horse by himself back into the mountains.
Guess grizzlies and people have changed over the years.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Dang, now I gotta get rid on my reels! What about Heddon "Pal Spook" rods? Don't tell me they don't work anymore or the Pflueger Supreme bait casting reels.
George Orwell was a Prophet, not a novelist. Read 1984 and then look around you!
Old cat turd!
"Some men just need killing." ~ Clay Allison.
I am too old to fight but I can still pull a trigger. ~ Me
I have a ton of respect for the big bears, having hunted ursus arctos on 3 occasions and seen the destruction they're capable of. That said, they do kill even the biggest Brownies with a pointed stick don't they?
Yea, real hunters only need a bow. I've killed a few with mine, alone and no bait or dogs. Weeelll, they were blackies.
Funny, I asked Tim Wells about that grizz and the head shot. He was man enough to admit that was not done on purpose, but his adrenaline was pumping and he was focused on the head to see if the bear saw him before he shot. Instinct put it where he was looking. I probably woulda shot a high limb.
Last edited by eyeball; 02/12/12.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
yep....which makes one wonder....have we been bamboozled by the hook and bullet press, are animals way tougher than they were a century ago, or were legions of our forefathers consumed by predators after pinking them with puny lever actions? Quien sabe?
Most of 'em got a lot closer than most of us do nowadays.But they didn't think so.I remember a few of them old guys talking about killing deer awaaaay off...... maybe a hunnerd yards.But most of 'em never set foot on a football field,and "a hunnerd yards" was not a common measurement for anything they dealt with.
They were just honestly mistaken.
And........ head shooting was a preferred method of dispatch.I knew two old hunters -make it three- who were born around the turn of the century and hunted into the late eighties and they still shot every critter,hog or deer,right in the head.
Miles Preston was born in 1902 or 1903 and he took me huntin' many times in the fifties and sixties in South Jack County where he lived.Only rifles he owned was a single-shot 22 and a '94 Win in 30 30.I saw him hit a running armadillo at around 75 yards with the first shot from the '94.
Oh well, times have changed. You no longer can catch fish with a Zebco either.....
Oh you can hang them on that 33, but as sorry as the metal is now, you just can't crank them in.
A 33 is mighty fancy stuff- I was thinking more along the lines of a minnow scale-encrusted 202.... My 7 year-old daughter keeps reminding me how bad they are, every time she out-fishes me with hers.
I'm kidding Cur. I've related a woodsman of east Texas hitting deer in the head with a 30-30 and it through the timber and ahead of the hounds.
The bear killer Ben Lilly could supposedly empty his on a falling buzzard and never miss a shot. He was the man responsible for cleaning the bear out of La, ark, and Texas and learned to wade in with his hounds and knife the bear. Later he got most the grizz in New Mexico and ran the hounds for TRs infamous bear hunt. There is a very interesting book bout him.
Last edited by eyeball; 02/12/12.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
Many died years ago behind bullets that came apart on men and critter. I've read of a lawmen killed in a prison breakout when the Peters bullet stuck in the prisoners leather belt, etc.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
In WW 1 the Germans never forgave the Jews for supposedly saving money and reducing the powder loads in the rifle cartridges which resulted in many bullets stuck in barrels during battle.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
Well, I always wondered if those 33s I picked up for my son at a gun show years ago might have been counterfeits from china. When they first came out with them I did great with them and that newfangled monofilament the fish couldn't see.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
I'm kidding Cur. I've related a woodsman of east Texas hitting deer in the head with a 30-30 and it through the timber and ahead of the hounds.
The bear killer Ben Lilly could supposedly empty his on a falling buzzard and never miss a shot. He was the man responsible for cleaning the bear out of La, ark, and Texas and learned to wade in with his hounds and knife the bear. Later he got most the grizz in New Mexico and ran the hounds for TRs infamous bear hunt. There is a very interesting book bout him.
I've worked over an '86 in .45-90 that belonged to Lily. Just squared it away to function. The bore was TRASHED. There was some half completed "Engraving" started on it, obviously "Way back When" , cause it was aged, and scarred to match the rest of the Patina,....
Story was that Ben Lily got tired of waiting for the engraver , and paid him for what was done,.....never made it back.
I repeat,....a LETTERED Winchester, in .45-90,....not a "30-30"
Pretty amazing how little that rifle was being bought,....re-sold for, not all that long ago.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
Unreal Cross. I would dearly love to touch that gun.
'
'Jim Clark had it, than sold it with a compendium of other assorted Lilly related plunder,....letters, original first edition books, tools, etc.
as noted, on reflection, this sorta', stuff does NOT bring all that much $$$ jingles.
The '86 discussed had been rode hard, and put away wet,....I'd be pretty sure that it was replaced, and passed into other hands,....
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats -- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
from reading Dobie's book, I think guns were just another tool to Lily. Dogs too, it sounded like.
I think old Ben lived hard and wore stuff out.
IF I had a million dollars to spare, I'd get a Miroku Lightweight 1886, have Turnbull re-barrel it to .33WCF and case-harden it for looks. I'd make sure it had a shotgun butt with a thin (but effective) recoil pad on it.
Don't think I'd want one of Ben Lily's wore out guns. I've got some pretty hard used guns already, but they are family guns, with a lot of family history.
Back in May of 1965, Jack Turner found out that it was just the gun for him to dispatch a charging grizzly that turned out to be the largest on record at that time.
In his story, "Killer Grizzly at Six feet", he recounts that he had moved his family up on the Atnarko River above Lonesome Lake in British Columbia. There were bear in the area and not one to take any chances, he always carried his faithful '94 .30-30 with him when away from the homestead.
He said "You never know when a grizzly will decide to pick a fight, so I rarely venture beyond the cleared fields around our house without hanging the old .30-30 over my shoulder. That precaution has saved my skin, or my family's at least twice."
On that particular day he left his house on a 2 mile walk to repair a fence. It was a fine spring morning. He recalls, "I came to a place where the trail, winding through cedars and cottonwoods, opens into a sunny glade no bigger than a house. I rounded a bend, and there in the center of the glade stood the biggest grizzly I had ever laid eyes on (and I have seen more than 200, in just about every part of British Columbia, in the last 20 years.) He was staring straight at me, and he was just 40 feet away.”
"Our eyes met and locked and he was on his way. I saw him in one instant and he was coming for me in a savage rush, running like a dog after his prey. He was drooling as he came, and a low growl was rumbling in his throat. I whipped the Winchester off my back and, since I carry the rifle loaded in the magazine but none in the chamber, I had to lever in a shell. The bear was almost on me when I slammed my shot into him, and I recall thinking, in that brief flash of time, that I'd only have time for one."
“I was using 170 gr. Soft point factory loads. I hit him dead center between the eyes and that soft point bullet blew his whole brain out through a hole in the back of his skull. He was still running full tilt when I shot, but his head went down between his forelegs, and he fell almost straight down. I backed off a few steps, held the rifle on him, and waited until I was sure there wasn’t a spark of life left in him. He was a buster, by far the biggest grizzly we had ever seen.”
Jack goes on to say that if the skull would have been intact, it would have scored 27 in the Boone and Crockett Clubs book according to them. The largest score on record at the time was 26 10/16.
I have never harvested a animal but I have killed quite a few,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Great post, OS. We need more stories like that. I think im going to start running the range with my near new pre-64 mod 94 on the dash. I dont think i've ever rolled a hog with a 30-30.
Man, i sure miss those threads by eyeball.
Ecc 10:2 The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
next week on 'Trophy Quest', one of a few good hunting shows on the Outdoor Network
Hard to imagine that, within its range, a good 170 grain round from a .30-30, well placed, wouldn't have enough horsepower for the task. Grizzlies aren't made of steel, after all.
It blows my mind how high of a pedestal of invincibility so many place the grizzly bear on. Guys they aren't made of armor! Being an avid bear baiter throughout the 12 years I lived in Alaska one of the things that a guy has to get used to is being up close and personal with grizzlies because at some point one is going to find your bait and give you a show. They are cool to watch and see up close, they got hair, skin, bones and organs in the same places as any other big game animal. Most aren't even that big, meaning they aren't Brown Bear big. I actually carried a 94 30-30 for a few years as a backup gun while bear baiting with a bow. Usually kept it in the boat in a case, I had it in case I had to go looking for a wounded bear. Cmon guys you'll shoot 900 lb elk with 243's and 25's with 85-100 gr bullets but are hesitant to hit a 300-500 lb bear with a 175 gr 30 cal?
next week on 'Trophy Quest', one of a few good hunting shows on the Outdoor Network
Hard to imagine that, within its range, a good 170 grain round from a .30-30, well placed, wouldn't have enough horsepower for the task. Grizzlies aren't made of steel, after all.
I killed a grizzly in 1960. It took 5+ solid shots from about 18 feet (I was in a tree) with a 44 Magnum (Ruger Blackhawk). All the shots were in the head and neck and it took about 10 seconds for the bear to go down. I reloaded and put another 5 shots into the head,neck. If it took 5 shots with a 240 grain 44 Mag from 18 feet, I wouldn't want to use a 30-30 on the ground at 18+ feet. Even well placed shots might leave something to be desired!
It blows my mind how high of a pedestal of invincibility so many place the grizzly bear on. Guys they aren't made of armor! Being an avid bear baiter throughout the 12 years I lived in Alaska one of the things that a guy has to get used to is being up close and personal with grizzlies because at some point one is going to find your bait and give you a show. They are cool to watch and see up close, they got hair, skin, bones and organs in the same places as any other big game animal. Most aren't even that big, meaning they aren't Brown Bear big. I actually carried a 94 30-30 for a few years as a backup gun while bear baiting with a bow. Usually kept it in the boat in a case, I had it in case I had to go looking for a wounded bear. Cmon guys you'll shoot 900 lb elk with 243's and 25's with 85-100 gr bullets but are hesitant to hit a 300-500 lb bear with a 175 gr 30 cal?
One difference between shooting an elk with a 243 and a grizzly with a 30-30 is that the bear can kill you. Both animals have tremendous endurance; an elk will run away until it drops, a grizzly might see, charge and hit you before it drops. The results can be significant.
next week on 'Trophy Quest', one of a few good hunting shows on the Outdoor Network
Hard to imagine that, within its range, a good 170 grain round from a .30-30, well placed, wouldn't have enough horsepower for the task. Grizzlies aren't made of steel, after all.
I killed a grizzly in 1960. It took 5+ solid shots from about 18 feet (I was in a tree) with a 44 Magnum (Ruger Blackhawk). All the shots were in the head and neck and it took about 10 seconds for the bear to go down. I reloaded and put another 5 shots into the head,neck. If it took 5 shots with a 240 grain 44 Mag from 18 feet, I wouldn't want to use a 30-30 on the ground at 18+ feet. Even well placed shots might leave something to be desired!
This is the grizzly bear you shot in Glacier National Park?
next week on 'Trophy Quest', one of a few good hunting shows on the Outdoor Network
Hard to imagine that, within its range, a good 170 grain round from a .30-30, well placed, wouldn't have enough horsepower for the task. Grizzlies aren't made of steel, after all.
I killed a grizzly in 1960. It took 5+ solid shots from about 18 feet (I was in a tree) with a 44 Magnum (Ruger Blackhawk). All the shots were in the head and neck and it took about 10 seconds for the bear to go down. I reloaded and put another 5 shots into the head,neck. If it took 5 shots with a 240 grain 44 Mag from 18 feet, I wouldn't want to use a 30-30 on the ground at 18+ feet. Even well placed shots might leave something to be desired!
This is the grizzly bear you shot in Glacier National Park?
First CNS hit with the 44 in the brain the bear would have expired. All you did was miss your target or not have the right bullet.
I'd take a grizz with a 30-30 and the right bullet and shot choice any old day.
But you'd have to be picky.
Exactly!
I spent many a spring hunting grizzlies in the Brooks Range , in an an area that is bow only. Over the years we would generally get around 1/2 dozen stalks on a griz per trip. I have been inside 70 yards of a bunch of grizzlies and every damn one of them would have been dead if I had a 30-30 I could use. I was never willing to let an arrow fly that I couldn't guarantee a clean shot on past 40 yards. The biggest bear I ever got a stalk on was a bear I actually flung an arrow at and missed at 20 yards due to a malfunction of my drop away rest. I had a frontal quartering shot on him at 55 yards that i was not willing to take, while trying to reposition for a better angle the bear busted us and came in on us to investigate without the wind in his favor. When he began to circle and get the wind on his side and he stepped behind a spruce tree I drew back, when he stepped back into the open I released that arrow with the most confidence in the world. Things got [bleep] real quick when that arrow hit the rocks in front of him and went over his back. He bluff charged us before breaking left and leaving the hillside we were on. Buddy of mine made an amazing 60 yard shot on one up there on camera and a shot I wouldn't have taken. Another buddy killed one that was sleeping with a sow he was courting, that was another very dangerous event. The common denominator was hunting them and being in a position where they could have easily been shot with a 30-30 without them knowing we were there. Hunting bears with a bow isn't for everyone but if you dig it and have the right game plan it's just another hunt. I'd have a dump truck full of grizzlys if I were able to shoot them with a 30-30. Of course you gotta hunt them, using the wind, terrain and situation to dictate if the kill is doable and knowing when to back out and regroup when things get sideways. Every grizzly I've seen killed with a rifle was a "dude there's a griz" blam.....bear dead, that of course excludes the guys that make bad shots because well...........they're just bad shots.
Disclaimer.....hunting the SE,Kodiak and the Peninsula for brown bear and I'd leave the 30-30 at home. Different terrain, and much bigger critter.
I was on a moose hunting trip in Alberta a few years ago and in camp, the outfitter had a battered Marlin 336 in .30-30. Loaded with 170 grain slugs. He said that over 36 years of outfitting for elk/moose and sheep, he had shot 11 grizzlies with that .30-30 that had been in camp or harassing the horses
Great post, OS. We need more stories like that. I think im going to start running the range with my near new pre-64 mod 94 on the dash. I dont think i've ever rolled a hog with a 30-30.
Man, i sure miss those threads by eyeball.
He sure was a good dude. Whatever happened to him? Did he die?
Paul
"I'd rather see a sermon than hear a sermon".... D.A.D.
Trump Won!, Sandmann Won!, Rittenhouse Won!, Suck it Liberal Fuuktards.
I've had one grizzly encounter while in Wyoming I walked upon a sow and cub while hiking. When I first saw her she was about 30 ft peering around a stump. I just froze where I was slowly took aim and let her have it with my Canon 35 mm. I was close enough that it would have been futile to try and get away. They were just wanting to cross the trail so she backed off and went around crossed the trail 30- 40 yds behind me and went on her way. She obviously was use to people and wasn't looking for a fight. I was pretty lucky as it could have gotten ugly but it was quite a sight to see.
The gist on this thread seems to be that griz with a .30-30 is sorta passe.
Pretty sure that griz with a .380 ain't been done yet
Rick Perry used a laser sight on his when he dispatched that coyote.
Birdwatcher (who has never seen a griz that weren't in a zoo.)
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
First CNS hit with the 44 in the brain the bear would have expired. All you did was miss your target or not have the right bullet.
I'd take a grizz with a 30-30 and the right bullet and shot choice any old day.
But you'd have to be picky.
Exactly!
I spent many a spring hunting grizzlies in the Brooks Range , in an an area that is bow only. Over the years we would generally get around 1/2 dozen stalks on a griz per trip. I have been inside 70 yards of a bunch of grizzlies and every damn one of them would have been dead if I had a 30-30 I could use. I was never willing to let an arrow fly that I couldn't guarantee a clean shot on past 40 yards. The biggest bear I ever got a stalk on was a bear I actually flung an arrow at and missed at 20 yards due to a malfunction of my drop away rest. I had a frontal quartering shot on him at 55 yards that i was not willing to take, while trying to reposition for a better angle the bear busted us and came in on us to investigate without the wind in his favor. When he began to circle and get the wind on his side and he stepped behind a spruce tree I drew back, when he stepped back into the open I released that arrow with the most confidence in the world. Things got [bleep] real quick when that arrow hit the rocks in front of him and went over his back. He bluff charged us before breaking left and leaving the hillside we were on. Buddy of mine made an amazing 60 yard shot on one up there on camera and a shot I wouldn't have taken. Another buddy killed one that was sleeping with a sow he was courting, that was another very dangerous event. The common denominator was hunting them and being in a position where they could have easily been shot with a 30-30 without them knowing we were there. Hunting bears with a bow isn't for everyone but if you dig it and have the right game plan it's just another hunt. I'd have a dump truck full of grizzlys if I were able to shoot them with a 30-30. Of course you gotta hunt them, using the wind, terrain and situation to dictate if the kill is doable and knowing when to back out and regroup when things get sideways. Every grizzly I've seen killed with a rifle was a "dude there's a griz" blam.....bear dead, that of course excludes the guys that make bad shots because well...........they're just bad shots.
Totally agree. Interior grizzlies don't get nearly as big as some.
NRA LIFE MEMBER GOD BLESS OUR TROOPS ESPECIALLY THE SNIPERS! "Suppose you were an idiot And suppose you were a member of Congress... But I repeat myself." -Mark Twain
Great post, OS. We need more stories like that. I think im going to start running the range with my near new pre-64 mod 94 on the dash. I dont think i've ever rolled a hog with a 30-30.
Man, i sure miss those threads by eyeball.
He sure was a good dude. Whatever happened to him? Did he die?
No, but i heard some say he smells that way.
Ecc 10:2 The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
Grizzlies can weigh anywhere from 200 to over 1600 pounds. A 200 pound bear doesn't require any larger caliber to reliably kill than a 200 pound deer, while a 1600 pound brown bear is as heavy and dangerous as a 1600 pound cape buffalo ! Sure they can be killed with most any caliber with careful shot placement but a wise hunter would be well advised to carry something using a premium bullet with good SD.
Great post, OS. We need more stories like that. I think im going to start running the range with my near new pre-64 mod 94 on the dash. I dont think i've ever rolled a hog with a 30-30.
Man, i sure miss those threads by eyeball.
He sure was a good dude. Whatever happened to him? Did he die?
No, but i heard some say he smells that way.
Well, that would explain the flies.....
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
Great post, OS. We need more stories like that. I think im going to start running the range with my near new pre-64 mod 94 on the dash. I dont think i've ever rolled a hog with a 30-30.
Man, i sure miss those threads by eyeball.
He sure was a good dude. Whatever happened to him? Did he die?
No, but i heard some say he smells that way.
I heard the same thing........Must be true! besides it was written on the Innanet.
Paul
"I'd rather see a sermon than hear a sermon".... D.A.D.
Trump Won!, Sandmann Won!, Rittenhouse Won!, Suck it Liberal Fuuktards.
That was a .44/40 because Clint said so in the dialog. The script said the bear dies, so it and the knife he delivered a few strategic fissures with, worked.
When truth is ignored, it does not change an untruth from remaining a lie.
if i ever get the chance to hunt one, i would use a stick bow.
God bless Texas----------------------- Old 300 I will remain what i am until the day I die- A HUNTER......Sitting Bull Its not how you pick the booger.. but where you put it !! Roger V Hunter
Use the Partition or Barnes bullet and the 30-30 should work just fine. Most would be surprised just how many Grizzly have been taken with the 30-30 . I would much rather have a 94 Win in 30-30 for Bear Protection in the bush than any pistol most people recommend for Bear Country.
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